Strategy Talk about the makeup of our list (and overall list management)

Remove this Banner Ad

Yoda_

Hall of Famer
May 6, 2007
30,575
15,486
South East Suburbs
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Tottenham Hotspurs, Melbourne Vixen
With where our list currently is, I would have no qualms if we simply went smalls across all drafts.

1. Inside midfielder - well documented
2. Small defender with good skills - the cupboard is getting pretty bare post what we have currently playing
3. Small forward with reasonable defensive pressure - Tippa is 28 this year, Cahill has lots ofquestion marks, Moz coming back from an ACL.
4. Wingmen - players with running power isn't a huge pressing need but more a suggestion from this point onwards for me.


We have a plethora of (young) key position players, a load of (small) role players in the middle parts of the ground and as much as I would like a ruck, waiting till next year and grabbing a raw kid would be much better list management imho.
 

Kyptastic

Norm Smith Medallist
Oct 4, 2010
5,337
4,906
Anywhere but here
AFL Club
Essendon
With where our list currently is, I would have no qualms if we simply went smalls across all drafts.

1. Inside midfielder - well documented
2. Small defender with good skills - the cupboard is getting pretty bare post what we have currently playing
3. Small forward with reasonable defensive pressure - Tippa is 28 this year, Cahill has lots ofquestion marks, Moz coming back from an ACL.
4. Wingmen - players with running power isn't a huge pressing need but more a suggestion from this point onwards for me.


We have a plethora of (young) key position players, a load of (small) role players in the middle parts of the ground and as much as I would like a ruck, waiting till next year and grabbing a raw kid would be much better list management imho.
Depending on how the Davey’s come on this next year might negate the need to draft a small forward this year if you were going to get both in 2022
 

Yoda_

Hall of Famer
May 6, 2007
30,575
15,486
South East Suburbs
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Tottenham Hotspurs, Melbourne Vixen
Depending on how the Davey’s come on this next year might negate the need to draft a small forward this year if you were going to get both in 2022
Im under the impression that they are small midfielders anyways. Probably start fwd but then end up something like Devon Smith/Will Snelling.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
18,199
22,986
AFL Club
Essendon
Does Johnson help fill our small forward hole at all?

Given that he runs about as quickly as I do at the moment I'd say not. It's mind boggling that he is on our list. Literally just written off a list spot at a time when we cut players due to list reductions.
 

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
18,199
22,986
AFL Club
Essendon
There was some "what would you do if you were in charge of North" discussion in the Non-Essendon Thread that really piqued my interest.

Watching the bottom of our list play against Brisbane in the VFL yesterday it struck me that my overall strategy for managing our list would not be that different.

I suspect our injury list has created a largely false impression about the overall health of our list. In reality, we're in a pretty dire situation in which we need to turn over another 10 to 12 spots (which makes for half a list in 2 years - which is as full a rebuild as any side should undergo). That's a very hard thing to do when the starting point is an average 2 picks a year that make it (i.e. your first and second round pick).

In reality we have 2 midfielders who are injured, Shiel and Caldwell. The 3rd injured midfielder, Clarke, was not even playing midfield at AFL level when he last got a look because his kicking is such a liability, has been converted into a pressure forward.

Our other small injured players are Mosquito who is very much borderline as an AFL prospect due to a lack of natural endurance and issues with his professionalism (I might even take to praying this isn't so because the industry deserves to see what this guy could do in full flight but that doesn't change the reality of the situation) and Zaharakis who almost no one on this board wants to see picked in any future AFL side.

That brings me to yesterday in which we saw AFL listed smalls Cahill, Johnson and Hird taking on their counterparts at Brisbane (in no particular order): Ely Smith, Coackatoo, Dev Robertsen, Coleman, Coleman, big powerful, hard running Irishman 1, big powerful, hard running Irishman 2, Mathieson, Harry Sharp and Brock Smith. It's the complete contrast in styles of player let alone quality that is really alarming. The Lions are powerful, well built and/or quick and super hard running.

Even if everything goes according to plan, what exactly are Cahill, Johnson and Hird supposed to become? What version of them are you ever looking at on another list thinking they'd be good in red and black? It really makes the decisions to move on all 3 of Hibberd, Begley and Mutch last year that much more bizarre. Then you look at our Plan A at the draft where we bid on Maurice Rioli Jr (might as well be Mosquito again from what I can tell but not as good) and a lightening quick half back NGA tied to Freo with the picks we ended up using on Eyre and Brand.

We hear a lot of talk about culture as though it is something that can just be transplanted or materialised out of thin air with little regard for how it is that culture reflects the attitudes of the players drafted. You could argue, comprehensively, that we're a bunch of cheats who think we're going to come good ignoring the 2 ways a midfield can be good: a dominant physical, first touch midfield (i.e. the Dogs or Port) or an ultra hard working, hard running set of secondary clearance specialist (i.e. Richmond or Hawthorn 13-15). At no point since the fading of the 2000 era have we been in the top handful of clubs when it comes to the sort of hard-nosed professionalism and work ethic that good sides are renowned for. We do not draft aggressive inside players and have only just started drafting players who can run. We don't really draft hard working players as a rule.

With this in mind, it is very difficult to accept that we should just go to the draft to try to find the sorts of affordable players on the lists of other clubs who we don't ever seem to look at when at the draft table. It's why I continue to have reservations about Dodoro. If you're being ultra critical of him, which I don't think is unreasonable, the 2020 draft seems simply to have thrown up 2 of the coveted flankers to play midfield (i.e. Cox and Perkins) that Dodoro picks 9/10 time and who on sheer weight of numbers look like they will finally work out.

If I was in charge at North, I'd being trying to get as many picks between 35 and 60 as I can in the next 2 years to get my hands on 2nd to 4th year players who have the capacity to play footy the way I'd want it to be played but, who primarily as the result of a lack of opportunity, are not going to cost me more than picks that I'd otherwise be using to speculate on types of players I hope but wont know will be available.

I've put together the below list of players with a focus on price being 3rd round or later and a contract status I could start to leverage tomorrow if I wanted (there are some exceptions). North need an almost complete overhaul which is only 12 months old and which covers every part of the ground. I was trying to put together a 22 but it got a bit hard as I was already reaching on players like Ling (who I've seen almost nothing of in his 4 years in the system) and the forwards aren't really there because they're too expensive. Note that the age is the age the player will turn in 2022.

TALLS
Connor Ballenden (Brisbane)
23 (1999), 200cm/101kg, 2017 pick 43
Tall utility. Very athletic.
Not really getting a look at all (behind a great spine with significant depth). Looked great in defence vs Ess VFL.
Contracted until 2021.
Lewis Young (Bulldogs)
24 (1997), 197cm/96kg, 2016 pick 49
Tall defender.
Beveridge can be stubborn as a mule. Young has shown a lot from what I’ve seen and moves very well.
Not really in best 22 calcs without injury.
Contracted until 2021.
Oscar Clavarino (St Kilda)
23 (1999), 197cm/90 kg, 2017 pick 35
Tall defender – underage AA.
No opportunity. Passed by good players in Howard and Wilkie.
Contracted until 2021.
Fischer McAsey (Adelaide)
21 (2001), 197cm/91kg, 2019 pick 6
Tall defender .
Wants to come back to Melbourne. Possible spooge so that needs to be kept in mind.
Contracted until 2021.
Harrison Petty (Melbourne)
23 (1999), 197cm/90kg, 2017 pick 37
Tall defender.
Lack of opportunity behind a glut of KPDs at Melbourne.
Contracted until 2022.
Lloyd Meek (Fremantle)
24 (1998), 203cm/111kg, 2017 pick 69
Big physical ruckman with good endurance. A bigger, more mobile Pittonet.
D’Arcy is the number 1 and Lobb is the KPF/2nd ruck. Going to struggle to play AFL. Should end up at Geelong.
Contracted until 2021.
Callum Coleman Jones (Richmond)
23 (1999), 2010cm/102kg, 2017 pick 20
Ruck / tall forward.
Going to struggle for opportunity. Has a bit of class. Could hold down KPD2/2nd ruck.
Contracted until 2021.
Sam Hayes (Port)
23 (1999), 203cm/102kgs, 2017 pick 47
Ruckman. Dominant underage AA who has matured (and it was needed by all reports).
Stuck behind 2 guys with a minimum of 4 years left. Possibly gettable but would cost too much at this stage.
Contracted until 2023.
MIDS + WINGS
Ely Smith (Brisbane)
22 (2000), 187cm/90kg, 2018 pick 21
Supposedly psychotic, big inside mid with a bit of explosive power.
Lack of opportunity?
Contracted until 2022.
Xavier O’Halloran (GWS)
22 (2000), 186cm/86kg, 2018 pick 22
Hard running inside mid. Leader.
Opportunity? Likely victim of inevitable Giants squeeze.
Contracted until 2022.
Jay Rantall (Collingwood)
21 (2001), 184cm/82kg, 2019 pick 40
Freak hard running inside mid (5:50 2km).
Likely to continue to struggle for opportunity given 2020 draft and Daicos.
Contracted until 2021.
Jack Ross (Richmond)
22 (2000), 187cm/85kg, 2018 pick 43
Prolific inside mid.
Richmond is stacked and he’s not best 22 at the moment.
Contracted until 2022.
Finn McGinness (Hawthorn)
21 (2001), 187cm/85kg, 2019 pick 29
Freak hard running inside mid (5:50 2km).
Doesn’t seem to fit into team with Mitchell, Worpel and O’Meara.
Contracted until 2021.
Liam Stocker (Carlton)
22 (2000), 184cm/83kg, 2018 pick 19
Inside mid.
Not getting games despite supposedly high level pre-season.
Contracted until 2022.
Charlie Constable (Geelong)
23 (1999), 191cm/ 87kg, 2017 pick 36
Inside mid.
Already told last year he was free to leave for opportunity.
Contracted until 2021.
Deven Robertson (Brisbane)
21 (2001), 182cm/80kg, 2018 pick 22
Hard-nosed pro inside mid and leader.
Seems to be a long way back in hierarchy.
Contracted until 2022.
FLANKERS AND SMALLS
Connor Stone (GWS)
20 (2002), 188cm/85kgs, 2020 pick 15
Powerful flanker/midfielder – see Ryan Griffen.
I really just like as a player and put him on the list because there is still enough of a glut of talent at GWS that a player like him will struggle for opportunity.
Contracted until 2022.
Matthew Ling (Sydney)
23 (1999), 184cm/80kgs, 2017 pick 14
Quick half back.
Not getting a look. Pure speculation on my part as I couldn’t really find another quick flanker in the range I am looking at who would be getable.
Contracted until 2021.
Ben Ronke (Sydney)
25 (1997), 183cm/78kg, 2016 rookie pick 16
Explosive small forward. Pressure player. Bit older than I’d otherwise be looking at but he could be very effective if he can get fit.
Suspect he’s done as anything but depth at Sydney.
Contracted until 2021.
Kane Farrell (Port)
23 (1999), 182cm/74kg, 2017 pick 51
Flanker who kicks missiles.
Port is stacked.
Out of contract 2021.

At Essendon, I'd be trying to turn a player or two / 3 to 4 picks between 35 and 60 over the next 2 years into Smith, O'Halloran, Ross, McGuinness and Rantall. Contemporary wisdom is that you take the picks to the draft but I see no reason not to try to fast track things where the issue is opportunity rather than quality (see Caldwell) and I also see no real reason why we won't just end up with the equivalent of Parish, McGrath, Begley, Mutch, Clarke and Mynott as our next haul of mids.

We have the scope to turn the list over this year but we need to be appropriately realistic about the capabilities of certain players. I just hope Dodoro doesn't sh*t the bed like he did when he signed a clearly struggling Devon Smith to a 2 year deal in April.
 
Last edited:

Red Black and Blue

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 1, 2006
21,943
13,420
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Everton, Storm, Victory
I’d love to have a crack at Fogarty now. He’s finally getting his mobility back since his under 18 year. I still have dreams of him being an inside mid. Was such a beast.
 

Yoda_

Hall of Famer
May 6, 2007
30,575
15,486
South East Suburbs
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Tottenham Hotspurs, Melbourne Vixen
There was some "what would you do if you were in charge of North" discussion in the Non-Essendon Thread that really piqued my interest.

Watching the bottom of our list play against Brisbane in the VFL yesterday it struck me that my overall strategy for managing our list would not be that different.

I suspect our injury list has created a largely false impression about the overall health of our list. In reality, we're in a pretty dire situation in which we need to turn over another 10 to 12 spots (which makes for half a list in 2 years - which is as full a rebuild as any side should undergo). That's a very hard thing to do when the starting point is an average 2 picks a year that make it (i.e. your first and second round pick).

In reality we have 2 midfielders who are injured, Shiel and Caldwell. The 3rd injured midfielder, Clarke, was not even playing midfield at AFL level when he last got a look because his kicking is such a liability, has been converted into a pressure forward.

Our other small injured players are Mosquito who is very much borderline as an AFL prospect due to a lack of natural endurance and issues with his professionalism (I might even take to praying this isn't so because the industry deserves to see what this guy could do in full flight but that doesn't change the reality of the situation) and Zaharakis who almost no one on this board wants to see picked in any future AFL side.

That brings me to yesterday in which we saw AFL listed smalls Cahill, Johnson and Hird taking on their counterparts at Brisbane (in no particular order): Ely Smith, Coackatoo, Dev Robertsen, Coleman, Coleman, big powerful, hard running Irishman 1, big powerful, hard running Irishman 2, Mathieson, Harry Sharp and Brock Smith. It's the complete contrast in styles of player let along quality that is really alarming. The Lions are powerful, well built and/or quick and super hard running.

Even if everything goes according to plan, what exactly are Cahill, Johnson and Hird supposed to become? What version of them are you ever looking at on another list thinking they'd be good in red and black? It really makes the decisions to move on all 3 of Hibberd, Begley and Mutch last year that much more bizarre. Then you look at our Plan A at the draft where we bid on Maurice Rioli Jr (might as well be Mosquito again from what I can tell but not as good) and a lightening quick half back NGA tied to Freo with the picks we ended up using on Eyre and Brand.

We hear a lot of talk about culture as though it is something that can just be transplanted or materialised out of thin air with little regard for how it is that culture reflects the attitudes of the players drafted. You could argue, comprehensively, that we're a bunch of cheats who think we're going to come good ignoring the 2 ways a midfield can be good: a dominant physical, first touch midfield (i.e. the Dogs or Port) or an ultra hard working, hard running set of secondary clearance specialist (i.e. Richmond or Hawthorn 13-15). At no point since the fading of the 2000 era have we been in the top handful of clubs when it comes to the sort of hard-nosed professionalism and work ethic that goods sides are renowned for. We do not draft aggressive inside players and have only just started drafting players who can run. We don't really draft hard working players as a rule.

With this in mind, it is very difficult to accept that we should just go to the draft to try to find the sorts of affordable players on the lists of other clubs who we don't ever seem to look at when at the draft table. It's why I continue to have reservations about Dodoro. If you're being ultra critical of him, which I don't think is unreasonable, the 2020 draft seems simply to have thrown up 2 of the coveted flankers to play midfield (i.e. Cox and Perkins) that Dodoro picks 9/10 time and who on sheer weight of numbers look like they will finally work out.

If I was in charge at North, I'd being trying to get as many picks between 35 and 60 as I can in the next 2 years to get my hands on 2nd to 4th year players who have the capacity to play footy the way I'd want it to be played but, who primarily as the result of a lack of opportunity, are not going to cost me more than picks that I'd otherwise be using to speculate on types of players I wont even know will be available.

I've put together the below list of players with a focus on price being 3rd round or later and a contract status I could start to leverage tomorrow if I wanted (there are some exceptions). North need an almost complete overhaul which is only 12 months old and which covers every part of the ground. I was trying to put together a 22 but it got a bit hard as I was already reaching on players like Ling (who I've seen almost nothing of in his 4 years in the system) and the forwards aren't really there because they're too expensive. Note that the age is the age the player will turn in 2022.

TALLS
Connor Ballenden (Brisbane)
23 (1999), 200cm/101kg, 2017 pick 43
Tall utility. Very athletic.
Not really getting a look at all (behind a great spine with significant depth). Looked great in defence vs Ess VFL.
Contracted until 2021.
Lewis Young (Bulldogs)
24 (1997), 197cm/96kg, 2016 pick 49
Tall defender.
Beveridge can be stubborn as a mule. Young has shown a lot from what I’ve seen and moves very well.
Not really in best 22 calcs without injury.
Contracted until 2021.
Oscar Clavarino (St Kilda)
23 (1999), 197cm/90 kg, 2017 pick 35
Tall defender – underage AA.
No opportunity. Passed by good players in Howard and Wilkie.
Contracted until 2021.
Fischer McAsey (Adelaide)
21 (2001), 197cm/91kg, 2019 pick 6
Tall defender .
Wants to come back to Melbourne. Possible spooge so that needs to be kept in mind.
Contracted until 2021.
Harrison Petty (Melbourne)
23 (1999), 197cm/90kg, 2017 pick 37
Tall defender.
Lack of opportunity behind a glut of KPDs at Melbourne.
Contracted until 2022.
Lloyd Meek (Fremantle)
24 (1998), 203cm/111kg, 2017 pick 69
Big physical ruckman with good endurance. A bigger, more mobile Pittonet.
D’Arcy is the number 1 and Lobb is the KPF/2nd ruck. Going to struggle to play AFL. Should end up at Geelong.
Contracted until 2021.
Callum Coleman Jones (Richmond)
23 (1999), 2010cm/102kg, 2017 pick 20
Ruck / tall forward.
Going to struggle for opportunity. Has a bit of class. Could hold down KPD2/2nd ruck.
Contracted until 2021.
Sam Hayes (Port)
23 (1999), 203cm/102kgs, 2017 pick 47
Ruckman. Dominant underage AA who has matured (and it was needed by all reports).
Stuck behind 2 guys with a minimum of 4 years left. Possibly gettable but would cost too much at this stage.
Contracted until 2023.
MIDS + WINGS
Ely Smith (Brisbane)
22 (2000), 187cm/90kg, 2018 pick 21
Supposedly psychotic, big inside mid with a bit of explosive power.
Lack of opportunity?
Contracted until 2022.
Xavier O’Halloran (GWS)
22 (2000), 186cm/86kg, 2018 pick 22
Hard running inside mid. Leader.
Opportunity? Likely victim of inevitable Giants squeeze.
Contracted until 2022.
Jay Rantall (Collingwood)
21 (2001), 184cm/82kg, 2019 pick 40
Freak hard running inside mid (5:50 2km).
Likely to continue to struggle for opportunity given 2020 draft and Daicos.
Contracted until 2021.
Jack Ross (Richmond)
22 (2000), 187cm/85kg, 2018 pick 43
Prolific inside mid.
Richmond is stacked and he’s not best 22 at the moment.
Contracted until 2022.
Finn McGinness (Hawthorn)
21 (2001), 187cm/85kg, 2019 pick 29
Freak hard running inside mid (5:50 2km).
Doesn’t seem to fit into team with Mitchell, Worpel and O’Meara.
Contracted until 2021.
Liam Stocker (Carlton)
22 (2000), 184cm/83kg, 2018 pick 19
Inside mid.
Not getting games despite supposedly high level pre-season.
Contracted until 2022.
Charlie Constable (Geelong)
23 (1999), 191cm/ 87kg, 2017 pick 36
Inside mid.
Already told last year he was free to leave for opportunity.
Contracted until 2021.
Deven Robertson (Brisbane)
21 (2001), 182cm/80kg, 2018 pick 22
Hard-nosed pro inside mid and leader.
Seems to be a long way back in hierarchy.
Contracted until 2022.
FLANKERS AND SMALLS
Connor Stone (GWS)
20 (2002), 188cm/85kgs, 2020 pick 15
Powerful flanker/midfielder – see Ryan Griffen.
I really just like as a player and put him on the list because there is still enough of a glut of talent at GWS that a player like him will struggle for opportunity.
Contracted until 2022.
Matthew Ling (Sydney)
23 (1999), 184cm/80kgs, 2017 pick 14
Quick half back.
Not getting a look. Pure speculation on my part as I couldn’t really find another quick flanker in the range I am looking at who would be getable.
Contracted until 2021.
Ben Ronke (Sydney)
25 (1997), 183cm/78kg, 2016 rookie pick 16
Explosive small forward. Pressure player. Bit older than I’d otherwise be looking at but he could be very effective if he can get fit.
Suspect he’s done as anything but depth at Sydney.
Contracted until 2021.
Kane Farrell (Port)
23 (1999), 182cm/74kg, 2017 pick 51
Flanker who kicks missiles.
Port is stacked.
Out of contract 2021.

At Essendon, I'd be trying to turn a player or two / 3 to 4 picks between 35 and 60 over the next 2 years into Smith, O'Halloran, Ross, McGuinness and Rantall. Contemporary wisdom is that you take the picks to the draft but I see no reason not to try to fast track things where the issue is opportunity rather than quality (see Caldwell) and I also see no real reason why we won't just end up with the equivalent of Parish, McGrath, Begley, Mutch, Clarke and Mynott as our next haul of mids.

We have the scope to turn the list over this year but we need to be appropriately realistic about the capabilities of certain players. I just hope Dodoro doesn't sh*t the bed like he did when he signed a clearly struggling Devon Smith to a 2 year deal in April.
Furthermore to this, and I have been banging on about this since I first started watching our reserves more actively but there is little to no use a guy like Devon Smith (Fwd at AFL level) going back to VFL level because he will invariably be played on ball, dominate in his non - AFL position and then get a call up sooner than later.

I was a massive advocate with that missed opportunity of guys like Kavanagh, Browne and Nick O’Brien whom dominated on ball but were given very little chance in the same role(s) at AFL level.

I feel our VFL results really covered up how poor our development has been. Even the last three years, Mitch, Gown, Crauford given very little chance and paying a price of our clubs inept ability to develop a young player.

Look at Cahill, Johnson and Hird who is the furthest back of that trip. What are they actually going to end up being at AFL level? Are they going to be half backs/wings? I doubt it. Through desperation they will inadvertently be thrown to the wolves and played on ball.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Zach Package

Kyle Langfourd
Sep 21, 2012
25,695
36,428
Parish, Francis
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Piggy Smith, Heat
The idea that having Tom Hird around is somehow a mistake or detriment is just about the biggest load of nonsense I’ve ever seen.

- Category B rookie free hit
- Comes from European soccer academy where they drum system and structure into kids like they’re the hitler youth
- Is a Hird

I’m excited to see how he progresses
 

eth-dog

Premium Platinum
Jan 11, 2007
94,646
50,561
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Coburg Lions, All Boston sides
Furthermore to this, and I have been banging on about this since I first started watching our reserves more actively but there is little to no use a guy like Devon Smith (Fwd at AFL level) going back to VFL level because he will invariably be played on ball, dominate in his non - AFL position and then get a call up sooner than later.

I was a massive advocate with that missed opportunity of guys like Kavanagh, Browne and Nick O’Brien whom dominated on ball but were given very little chance in the same role(s) at AFL level.

I feel our VFL results really covered up how poor our development has been. Even the last three years, Mitch, Gown, Crauford given very little chance and paying a price of our clubs inept ability to develop a young player.

Look at Cahill, Johnson and Hird who is the furthest back of that trip. What are they actually going to end up being at AFL level? Are they going to be half backs/wings? I doubt it. Through desperation they will inadvertently be thrown to the wolves and played on ball.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Mutch: Pick 42 academy player that went unmatched
Gown: Pick 60-odd with attitude issues
Crauford: SSP player that literally none of us saw play

Not the best examples there mate.
 

Mikevk123

Club Legend
Jun 25, 2019
1,487
1,293
AFL Club
Essendon
Re-Sign
Alec Waterman- 1 Year
Brandon Zerk-Thatcher- 1 Year
Brayden Ham- 2 Years
Darcy Parish- 2 Years
Harrison Jones- 2 Years
Irving Mosquito- 1 Year(Rookie List)
Jake Stringer- 2 Years
Jayden Laverde- 1 Year
Kaine Baldwin- 1 Year
Mason Redman- 2 Years
Matt Guelfi- 1 Year
Ned Cahill- 1 Year(Rookie List)
Nick Hind- 2 Years
Will Snelling- 2 Years
Tom Hird- 1 Year

Delist/Retire/ Trade/Free Agency
Andrew Phillips- Trade
Cale Hooker- Retire
Cian McBridge-Delist
Davis Zaharakis- Retire
Dylan Clarke-Delist
Lachlan Johnson-Delist
Zach Merrett- Free Agency
Martin Gleeson-Delist
Tom Cutler-Delist
Patrick Ambrose-Retire
Ross Mcquillan-Retire
 

citizen-erased

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 11, 2007
22,100
17,123
Victoria
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Tottenham, Bayern, Milan, Celtic
Re-Sign
Alec Waterman- 1 Year
Brandon Zerk-Thatcher- 1 Year
Brayden Ham- 2 Years
Darcy Parish- 2 Years
Harrison Jones- 2 Years
Irving Mosquito- 1 Year(Rookie List)
Jake Stringer- 2 Years
Jayden Laverde- 1 Year
Kaine Baldwin- 1 Year
Mason Redman- 2 Years
Matt Guelfi- 1 Year
Ned Cahill- 1 Year(Rookie List)
Nick Hind- 2 Years
Will Snelling- 2 Years
Tom Hird- 1 Year

Delist/Retire/ Trade/Free Agency
Andrew Phillips- Trade
Cale Hooker- Retire
Cian McBridge-Delist
Davis Zaharakis- Retire
Dylan Clarke-Delist
Lachlan Johnson-Delist
Zach Merrett- Free Agency
Martin Gleeson-Delist
Tom Cutler-Delist
Patrick Ambrose-Retire
Ross Mcquillan-Retire
Made one small change :p
I'd ask Hooker the question on another year if he wants it. we're f'd without him in the fwd line
someone needs to step up this year
 

Mikevk123

Club Legend
Jun 25, 2019
1,487
1,293
AFL Club
Essendon
Made one small change :p
I'd ask Hooker the question on another year if he wants it. we're f'd without him in the fwd line
someone needs to step up this year
Trade/Draft Targets

I reckon we try grab Marshall from port in the deal for Merrett if he intends to leave. Chuck him forward with Jones/Stewart/Eyre/Baldwin
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
18,199
22,986
AFL Club
Essendon
The idea that having Tom Hird around is somehow a mistake or detriment is just about the biggest load of nonsense I’ve ever seen.

- Category B rookie free hit
- Comes from European soccer academy where they drum system and structure into kids like they’re the hitler youth
- Is a Hird

I’m excited to see how he progresses

He's a cat b rookie so I understand he doesn't take up a list spot.

My point was our list of developing smalls of which Hird is one. It's the type of player, etc. It speaks to our recruiting and list management still being a huge problem.

Go and watch the VFL game against Brisbane and tell me that it doesn't leave you wanting to vomit.
 

Zach Package

Kyle Langfourd
Sep 21, 2012
25,695
36,428
Parish, Francis
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Piggy Smith, Heat
He's a cat b rookie so I understand he doesn't take up a list spot.

My point was our list of developing smalls of which Hird is one. It's the type of player, etc. It speaks to our recruiting and list management still being a huge problem.

Go and watch the VFL game against Brisbane and tell me that it doesn't leave you wanting to vomit.
Probably a different kind of vom given Brisbane have an injury list of 2 at the moment and we have VAFA players topped up with a skeleton crew.

I do agree with the sentiment that we’re probably 4 Ely Smith’s short though.

The good thing is that some of these untried talls that we’ve banked in the last couple of years that threw the balance out are starting to really come along which means the focus hopefully shifts a little bit.

Midseason draft I think gets us a 19 year old midfielder and like a young enough state leaguer if we take the extra selection and the expectation is probably that our first round pick in the national draft turns into a midfield stud.

Could change the complexion very radically, very quickly if the picks are in line with Truck’s blue collar methodology.
 

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
18,199
22,986
AFL Club
Essendon
Probably a different kind of vom given Brisbane have an injury list of 2 at the moment and we have VAFA players topped up with a skeleton crew.

I do agree with the sentiment that we’re probably 4 Ely Smith’s short though.

The good thing is that some of these untried talls that we’ve banked in the last couple of years that threw the balance out are starting to really come along which means the focus hopefully shifts a little bit.

Midseason draft I think gets us a 19 year old midfielder and like a young enough state leaguer if we take the extra selection and the expectation is probably that our first round pick in the national draft turns into a midfield stud.

Could change the complexion very radically, very quickly if the picks are in line with Truck’s blue collar methodology.

That's the if.

We have no form line and the most recent off-season compounded the problem.

Edit: by the way we have as many injured mids as Brisbane does.
 
Last edited:

eth-dog

Premium Platinum
Jan 11, 2007
94,646
50,561
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Coburg Lions, All Boston sides
About 1/3 of the way through our season I'm here:

3+ years: Darcy Parish, Jake Stringer
2 years: Jayden Laverde, Harrison Jones, Nick Bryan, Mason Redman, Will Snelling
1 year: Cale Hooker (if he doesn't retire), Ned Cahill, Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Andrew Phillips*, Matthew Guelfi+, Lachlan Johnson, Kaine Baldwin, Cian McBride, Alec Waterman, Tom Hird

Delist/retire: Martin Gleeson, David Zaharakis (ret), Tom Cutler, Irving Mosquito, Patrick Ambrose, Dylan Clarke

Trade/FA:

1. Zach Merrett to Melbourne (gut says he's going,even though I don't want him to).

2. Future 2nd round pick for George Hewett (Dreaming, I know. But perfect for our midfield).

Leaves us with 4 open spots on the list, all of which can be filled in the national draft (taking into account 1 of the SSP and our MSD pick). Just using the current ladder, gives us picks 4, 5 (or 5 and 6 when the Daicos bid comes in), 42 and 54 (before taking other FA's and FS/academy players into account).

Pick 5: Matthew Johnson (191 cm/80 kg inside midfielder, Subiaco)
Pick 6: Josh Sinn (186/72 half back/wing)
Pick 42: Ideally another inside midfielder
Pick 54: Small forward

*Not sure if he gets renewed. Very injury prone
+There were rumours he wanted to go back home last year.

This is assuming list sizes remain the same.
 

andleanback

Premiership Player
Aug 21, 2016
3,994
3,413
AFL Club
Essendon
About 1/3 of the way through our season I'm here:

3+ years: Darcy Parish, Jake Stringer
2 years: Jayden Laverde, Harrison Jones, Nick Bryan, Mason Redman, Will Snelling
1 year: Cale Hooker (if he doesn't retire), Ned Cahill, Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Andrew Phillips*, Matthew Guelfi+, Lachlan Johnson, Kaine Baldwin, Cian McBride, Alec Waterman, Tom Hird

Delist/retire: Martin Gleeson, David Zaharakis (ret), Tom Cutler, Irving Mosquito, Patrick Ambrose, Dylan Clarke

Trade/FA:

1. Zach Merrett to Melbourne (gut says he's going,even though I don't want him to).

2. Future 2nd round pick for George Hewett (Dreaming, I know. But perfect for our midfield).

Leaves us with 4 open spots on the list, all of which can be filled in the national draft (taking into account 1 of the SSP and our MSD pick). Just using the current ladder, gives us picks 4, 5 (or 5 and 6 when the Daicos bid comes in), 42 and 54 (before taking other FA's and FS/academy players into account).

Pick 5: Matthew Johnson (191 cm/80 kg inside midfielder, Subiaco)
Pick 6: Josh Sinn (186/72 half back/wing)
Pick 42: Ideally another inside midfielder
Pick 54: Small forward

*Not sure if he gets renewed. Very injury prone
+There were rumours he wanted to go back home last year

This is assuming list sizes remain the same.
Id also hope we target a couple of guys from top sides who arent getting opportunity, to add to our depth.
 

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
18,199
22,986
AFL Club
Essendon
About 1/3 of the way through our season I'm here:

3+ years: Darcy Parish, Jake Stringer
2 years: Jayden Laverde, Harrison Jones, Nick Bryan, Mason Redman, Will Snelling
1 year: Cale Hooker (if he doesn't retire), Ned Cahill, Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Andrew Phillips*, Matthew Guelfi+, Lachlan Johnson, Kaine Baldwin, Cian McBride, Alec Waterman, Tom Hird

Delist/retire: Martin Gleeson, David Zaharakis (ret), Tom Cutler, Irving Mosquito, Patrick Ambrose, Dylan Clarke

Trade/FA:

1. Zach Merrett to Melbourne (gut says he's going,even though I don't want him to).

2. Future 2nd round pick for George Hewett (Dreaming, I know. But perfect for our midfield).

Leaves us with 4 open spots on the list, all of which can be filled in the national draft (taking into account 1 of the SSP and our MSD pick). Just using the current ladder, gives us picks 4, 5 (or 5 and 6 when the Daicos bid comes in), 42 and 54 (before taking other FA's and FS/academy players into account).

Pick 5: Matthew Johnson (191 cm/80 kg inside midfielder, Subiaco)
Pick 6: Josh Sinn (186/72 half back/wing)
Pick 42: Ideally another inside midfielder
Pick 54: Small forward

*Not sure if he gets renewed. Very injury prone
+There were rumours he wanted to go back home last year.

This is assuming list sizes remain the same.

I struggle to believe Johnson is anything more than wait and see at this point of the year. I'd even go as far as saying he's playing for his spot and that, to date, it's a pretty hard "no".

He's shown almost nothing in the VFL, on par with Tom Wallis as someone I just can't see anything in, and it is a long way from clear what aspect of his game could translate to AFL level.

He's got the season to show something so I wouldn't write him off yet but given the extent of the surgery the list still requires we can't be offering the Johnson of May 2021 a spot on the list in 2022. Particularly not in a year in which we're looking at a draft pool which could be as much as 50% deeper than it would normally be on account of so much uncertainty surrounding last year.
 

Schnitzengruben

Club Legend
Aug 4, 2019
2,231
2,863
AFL Club
Essendon
About 1/3 of the way through our season I'm here:

3+ years: Darcy Parish, Jake Stringer
2 years: Jayden Laverde, Harrison Jones, Nick Bryan, Mason Redman, Will Snelling
1 year: Cale Hooker (if he doesn't retire), Ned Cahill, Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Andrew Phillips*, Matthew Guelfi+, Lachlan Johnson, Kaine Baldwin, Cian McBride, Alec Waterman, Tom Hird

Delist/retire: Martin Gleeson, David Zaharakis (ret), Tom Cutler, Irving Mosquito, Patrick Ambrose, Dylan Clarke

Trade/FA:

1. Zach Merrett to Melbourne (gut says he's going,even though I don't want him to).

2. Future 2nd round pick for George Hewett (Dreaming, I know. But perfect for our midfield).

Leaves us with 4 open spots on the list, all of which can be filled in the national draft (taking into account 1 of the SSP and our MSD pick). Just using the current ladder, gives us picks 4, 5 (or 5 and 6 when the Daicos bid comes in), 42 and 54 (before taking other FA's and FS/academy players into account).

Pick 5: Matthew Johnson (191 cm/80 kg inside midfielder, Subiaco)
Pick 6: Josh Sinn (186/72 half back/wing)
Pick 42: Ideally another inside midfielder
Pick 54: Small forward

*Not sure if he gets renewed. Very injury prone
+There were rumours he wanted to go back home last year.

This is assuming list sizes remain the same.
Other clubs will be coming for Bryan so he'll want (and deserve) longer than a 2 year deal. Would command a similar deal to what Draper got, 3-4 years.

If we gave Cahill 1 year and delisted Mozzie....well, Terry Wallace said it best.
 

eth-dog

Premium Platinum
Jan 11, 2007
94,646
50,561
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Coburg Lions, All Boston sides
Other clubs will be coming for Bryan so he'll want (and deserve) longer than a 2 year deal. Would command a similar deal to what Draper got, 3-4 years.

If we gave Cahill 1 year and delisted Mozzie....well, Terry Wallace said it best.
Nah. Draper legitimately dominated games in the VFL. Bryan is promising but he's not where Draper was.
 

Schnitzengruben

Club Legend
Aug 4, 2019
2,231
2,863
AFL Club
Essendon
Nah. Draper legitimately dominated games in the VFL. Bryan is promising but he's not where Draper was.
Draper had a larger body of work, but plenty of clubs out there are desperate for a ruckman - especially one so young with so much upside.

If Bryan plays more senior footy this year to the quality he did on the weekend, his management would scoff at the idea of a 2 year deal. I know I would.
 

eth-dog

Premium Platinum
Jan 11, 2007
94,646
50,561
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Coburg Lions, All Boston sides
Draper had a larger body of work, but plenty of clubs out there are desperate for a ruckman - especially one so young with so much upside.

If Bryan plays more senior footy this year to the quality he did on the weekend, his management would scoff at the idea of a 2 year deal. I know I would.
He had a TOG of 61%. Only SPS and Dow had a smaller TOG. I agree that he's promising and he showed a bit but a 2 year deal is absolutely right at this stage of his career. Added to that is that we're often conservatie in terms of deal length.
 

Remove this Banner Ad