Tasmania set to apply for a provisional AFL licence (aiming to enter competition by 2025)

Hawkk

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Question then why is it that Jeff Kennett is trying to negotiate a contract beyond 2021 does he not know these things that you do??
Well in the article referenced it did say that Hawthorn is reconsidering it’s commitment in Tasmania subject to the agreement placed before them.

In 2010 Kennett did indicate in a letter to the membership that the financial benefits of playing in tasmania is not to dissimilar to the options available in Melbourne.

Of course Hawthorn has a $110m development it needs to somehow find funding for, the Tasmanian agreement is safe and has been stable for near on 20 years.

No doubt it’s important but it’s important not to over state. That said, it would be nice if Hawthorn could enjoy a similar distribution to the one enjoyed by the Saints
 

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Tasmanian saint

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Well in the article referenced it did say that Hawthorn is reconsidering it’s commitment in Tasmania subject to the agreement placed before them.

In 2010 Kennett did indicate in a letter to the membership that the financial benefits of playing in tasmania is not to dissimilar to the options available in Melbourne.

Of course Hawthorn has a $110m development it needs to somehow find funding for, the Tasmanian agreement is safe and has been stable for near on 20 years.

No doubt it’s important but it’s important not to over state. That said, it would be nice if Hawthorn could enjoy a similar distribution to the one enjoyed by the Saints
Yeah that was my point there is chance you could make similar or more playing the games In Melbourne but that’s dependent on your opposition and how your travelling form wise which can change season to season where the Tasmanian money is guaranteed in the bank and there is also the close to 10,000 members that you would imagined the majority signed to get cheaper access to your games down here if you left I imagine you would lose the large majority off which would be a a large amount of members to lose in one go
 

Walshawk

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Stifling your growth 😂 ok please leave then and play those 4 games against interstate teams in Melbourne that you will be lucky to break even on instead of making 3 million a year on like you currently do and kiss good buy the to the measly 10,000 members that you have down here yeah I can see why you really want out 😂
Half the Tassie games are v traditional VFL clubs. We have played Richmond and Geelong there. There is a massive costs for our 70k non Tas members to get access to four replacement games - club has to pay the opposition for each member that attends those games. Melbourne membership and especially reserve seating would increase if we had 11 games here rather than seven. These are lots of arguments each way.
 

Tasmanian saint

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Half the Tassie games are v traditional VFL clubs. We have played Richmond and Geelong there. There is a massive costs for our 70k non Tas members to get access to four replacement games - club has to pay the opposition for each member that attends those games. Melbourne membership and especially reserve seating would increase if we had 11 games here rather than seven. These are lots of arguments each way.
Yeah I understand you’re points but Jeff Kennett is a very shrewd operator why is he trying to negotiate a new contract beyond 2021 unless your club was going to benefit from it ? If you guys could make more money in Melbourne you would already be back there
 

Professor Knowall

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Now the Federal Sport Minister is weighing into the Tasmanian AFL bid debate. Will he back this up by promising money for the proposed new Macquarie Point stadium? -

The pledge number has climbed past 32,000 -
 

madmug

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Now the Federal Sport Minister is weighing into the Tasmanian AFL bid debate. Will he back this up by promising money for the proposed new Macquarie Point stadium? -

The pledge number has climbed past 32,000 -
I doubt it. Fed money is nearly all going to the north of the state where they did so well with their divisive behaviours & parochial promises
 

Professor Knowall

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I doubt it. Fed money is nearly all going to the north of the state where they did so well with their divisive behaviours & parochial promises
So now is their chance to make a popular parochial promise to the South. The article includes this - "...Tasmania’s most senior member of the Morrison government says ... there would be opportunities for the Commonwealth to invest in major infrastructure linked to a new club". A new stadium fits the description of "major infrastructure" and would surely be politically popular. Anyway, it's speculative at this stage, but for the first time, I actually think this bid is looking more likely than not to succeed.
 

BringBackTorps

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"...Tasmania’s most senior member of the Morrison government says ... there would be opportunities for the Commonwealth to invest in major infrastructure[Big jungle drums] linked to a new club". A new stadium [or stadia upgrades?] fits the description of "major infrastructure"[Absolutely!] and would surely be politically popular.[Yes]
1. Tasmania's Federal 5 marginal seats in the Federal Lower house (where LNP has a tiny majority), & its 12 Senate seats (LNP in minority), make it increasingly likely the Federal LNP govt. will provide Federal funds for Tas. stadia upgrades- but only if Tasmania becomes the 19th team (which is becoming more likely, & probably c. 2025).

It cant be assumed, however, the Fed. govt. will provide full funding for an expensive, new stadium at Hobart's Macquarie Point- c. $300,000,000 for a 28,000 seater? (Bankwest, 30,000 capacity, cost $360,000,000!).
Less expensive upgrades (to 28,000 capacity each) at York Park & Bellarive are more likely, a more efficient Return On Investment.
(Unless a Business Case confirms new MP = net $ gains: by major rejuventation/tourist & commercial boom for the "unused" Hobart waterfront area).

2. As it appears the Fed. Govt. is NOW willing to offer VERY large funding for a new Tas. team stadia upgrades (or a new stadium), it will become increasingly untenable for the AFL to deny the team's entry. The AFL would attract, justifiably, considerable, ongoing anger & scorn; &, perhaps, increase the chances that other sports in Tasmania obtain additional, "redirected" Federal & State funding (unlike male GR AF, Tas. soccer & basketball are having good long termGR growth).

3. Due to the VFL/AFL carpetbagging & neglect of Tasmanian State League & GR AF, more evidence in The Examiner link of the severe problems.

As Tasmania has "...one of its most barren Draft decades in recent memory...", former Launceston & Tassie Mariners coach, A. Sanders, says "...more resources are needed at a youth level to make the state's player-pathway AFL-ready...".


4. Can anyone advise:-
. how widely publicised has been the petition in Tasmania?
. How does the current c. 32, 000 signatories- in only c. 26 days- compare with other "popular" MSM campaigns in Tasmania?


EDIT:

5. Nthn. Tas. Radio Brian Carlton program podcast 2.9.19 Re the Tas. team bid. Errol (good Tas. name) Stewart, Task Force member says

"...if we can convince the AFL we we can ADD (my emphasis) to the pie of people coming into the competition, who are good enough to play at the senior level (AFL- my words), both male and female...we can encourage young kids to join the footy...to put more into football...more encouragement, so young kids play Aussie football..." 4mins. 50 seconds mark.
(Crucially, restoration of the once fabled Tas. RECRUITMENT goldmine into the AFL is a MAJOR part of this bid: of near equal importance to the bid's financial sustainability)

 
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madmug

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Tasmania's Federal Lower House 5 marginal seats, & its 12 Senate seats, make it increasingly likely the Federal LNP govt. will provide Federal funds for AFL stadia upgrades- if Tas.,by c. 2025, becomes the 19th team (which is becoming more likely).

It cant be assumed the Fed. govt. will provide funding for an expensive, new stadium at Macquarie Point- c. $250,000,000 for a 28,000 seater?
Much less expensive upgrades at York Park & Bellarive are more likely, a more efficient Return On Investment.
If anything gets built (or should I say spent), by the Fed or State Governments, it'll be in the north.

The during the last State election the Government ran the line that the Labor promise of $50million for an AFL team was a team for Hobart. A lie.

During the last Federal election Scomo visited the northern electorates a number of times. Then again after the election. he's never been to Hobart in his capacities as liberal leader, or PM.

That's actually how 'parochialism' is generated 7 used by politicians.

Hobart & surrounds may have over 50% of the states population. That percentage is growing. Its pretty well driving state population growth. That matters not when it comes to political decisions.

So once again I expect our politicians to use football for their own benefit.

I've said we should play games in both Hobart & Launceston. However it should be based in Hobart. Facilities such as the states only tertiary level hospital, the states only sports medicine specialists to start. Hobart is much more cosmopolitan with a growing café/restaurant culture. Launceston is a pretty town but no where near the lifestyle choices as in Hobart.

One could argue player retention would be an issue for Hobart. Its pretty obvious that would be the case if they base the team in Launceston.
 

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Walshawk

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1. Tasmania's Federal 5 marginal seats in the Federal Lower house (where LNP has a tiny majority), & its 12 Senate seats (LNP minority), make it increasingly likely the Federal LNP govt. will provide Federal funds for Tas. stadia upgrades- but only if Tasmania becomes the 19th team (which is becoming more likely, & probably c. 2025).

It cant be assumed, however, the Fed. govt. will provide full funding for an expensive, new stadium at Hobart's Macquarie Point- c. $300,000,000 for a 28,000 seater? (Bankwest, 30,000 capacity, cost $360,000,000!).
Less expensive upgrades (to 28,000 capacity each) at York Park & Bellarive are more likely, a more efficient Return On Investment.
(Unless a Business Case confirms a new, waterfront stadium will cause a major rejuventation/ tourist & retail boom for the "unused" Hobart waterfront area).

2. As it appears the Fed. Govt. is NOW willing to offer VERY large funding for AFL Tas. stadia upgrades (or a new stadium), it will become increasingly untenable for the AFL to deny the team's entry. The AFL would attract, justifiably, considerable scorn; &, perhaps, increase the chances that other sports in Tasmania obtain additional, Federal & State funding (unlike male GR AF, Tas. soccer & basketball are having good GR growth).

3. Due to the VFL/AFL carpetbagging & neglect of Tasmanian State & GR AF, more evidence here in The Examiner of the severe problems.

As Tasmania has "...one of its most barren Draft decades in recent memory...", former Launceston & Tassie Mariners coach, A. Sanders, says "...more resources are needed at a youth level to make the state's player-pathway AFL-ready...".


4. Can anyone advise:-
. how widely publicised has been the petition in Tasmania?
. How does the current c. 32, 000 signatories- in only c. 26 days- compare with other "popular" MSM campaigns in Tasmania?


EDIT:

5. Nthn. Tas. Radio Brian Carlton program podcast 2.9.19 Re the Tas. team bid. Errol (good Tas. name) Stewart, Task Force member says

"...if we can convince the AFL we we can add to the pie of people coming into the competition, who are good enough to play at the senior level (AFL- my words), both male and female...we can encourage young kids to join the footy...to put more into football...more encouragement, so young kids play Aussie football..." 4mins. 50 seconds mark.
(Crucially, restoration of the once fabled Tas. RECRUITMENT goldmine into the AFL is a MAJOR part of this bid: of equal importance to the bid's financial sustainability)

They won’t expand Bellerive. No space, very poor access. It is in a suburban street surrounded by houses.
York Park is right in town and has plenty of space. If they can’t get funding for a new Hobart stadium, reckon YP will get a make over and maybe a small increase. They will need to spend money somewhere in Hobart for HQ/training facilities.
 

Walshawk

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Yeah I understand you’re points but Jeff Kennett is a very shrewd operator why is he trying to negotiate a new contract beyond 2021 unless your club was going to benefit from it ? If you guys could make more money in Melbourne you would already be back there
Well it depends who is in charge. Kennett is very pro Tassie, but not all board members are. Before JK returned as president there was talk we were looking at pulling out of Tassie.
 

Mr Taswegian

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They won’t expand Bellerive. No space, very poor access. It is in a suburban street surrounded by houses.
York Park is right in town and has plenty of space. If they can’t get funding for a new Hobart stadium, reckon YP will get a make over and maybe a small increase. They will need to spend money somewhere in Hobart for HQ/training facilities.
Im sure they will expand Bellerive if it's needed to get a team,the chances of them building a stadium at Macquarie are remote at best.The master plan for Macquarie point does not include a stadium,so I can't see them making a big change to it,allthough I believe a stadium in a place like that would be ideal for Hobart.
 

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Yeah I understand you’re points but Jeff Kennett is a very shrewd operator why is he trying to negotiate a new contract beyond 2021 unless your club was going to benefit from it ? If you guys could make more money in Melbourne you would already be back there
The Hawks are as strong financially as any Melbourne club & the Tas deal has been a cornerstone of building that strength, no ifs or whatabout or maybe. They will not simply replace that deal, is there even anything comparable out there?
Its been win/win IMHO.
 

The_Reaper

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Didn't the federal government spash some cash towards bellerive before the cricket world cup?

It makes no sense whatsoever to sink money into a new stadium for 6 games a year when Bellerive is AFL standard.
 

Blackhawk42

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If they want a surge in numbers they need a 30 sec ad during grand final on saturday. After first goal scored. Will cost $$$$ but maybe chance to double that pledge amount overnight
There is a full page in the grand final footy record.
 

Kwality

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Didn't the federal government spash some cash towards bellerive before the cricket world cup?

It makes no sense whatsoever to sink money into a new stadium for 6 games a year when Bellerive is AFL standard.
I'd do up North Hobart Oval & sell the joint out for the season, boutique it'd be .... wont happen but!!
 

Professor Knowall

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Im sure they will expand Bellerive if it's needed to get a team, the chances of them building a stadium at Macquarie are remote at best.The master plan for Macquarie point does not include a stadium,so I can't see them making a big change to it, although I believe a stadium in a place like that would be ideal for Hobart.
You may be right but it would be a lost opportunity. Bellerive was built in pretty much the worst possible location in all of Hobart for a major stadium, with poor access and very limited scope for expansion. Conversely, Macquarie Point would be the best possible location.
 

Mr Taswegian

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You may be right but it would be a lost opportunity. Bellerive was built in pretty much the worst possible location in all of Hobart for a major stadium, with poor access and very limited scope for expansion. Conversely, Macquarie Point would be the best possible location.
I agree that the ground was built in a poor area,but they have put all that money into it now,so they can't just stop using it.I would love to see a roofed stadium built at Macquarie point but just don't see it happening,it has been shown around the world that roofed stadiums in cold climate cities have increased crowds by 30 percent,so it would also be great for that reason.
 

madmug

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They won’t expand Bellerive. No space, very poor access. It is in a suburban street surrounded by houses.
York Park is right in town and has plenty of space. If they can’t get funding for a new Hobart stadium, reckon YP will get a make over and maybe a small increase. They will need to spend money somewhere in Hobart for HQ/training facilities.
Its been noted on BF before, that as pretty a stadium as it is, it was pure pig headed stupidity & lunacy to build in on the beach in what is a narrow street 'village' area.

It can be expanded but it won't handle the crowds that will want to get to the games. Even with 13-14k for BBL games, its a nightmare to get in & out of the area. I know people now who vote with their feet & avoid the place.

The only answer I see is that when/if the northern suburbs light rain is ever acted on, the KGV ground would easily be expanded. It has lots of access & close by parking. To me & others, its the easiest/simplest/cheapest answer.
 

BringBackTorps

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Pretty Bellerive stadium is very close to the CBD, & has the whole eastern, hill side that could be developed into a very large stand.
It is puzzling that some say there is insufficient room to build a further, large stand (if part of the street needs to be reclaimed/forcible house requisition, so be it); or that it is difficult to get to.

(then click on the right hand side -"SEE PHOTOS" Blundstone Arena- for 40+ excellent photos of the stadium & its outside surrounds)

Hobart, pop. 240,000, is not a country town- don't expect to simply drive there to an AFL stadium (capacity 28,000) with a short walk.

Even though the Fed. LNP govt. may agree to fund Tas. AFL stadia infrastructure (which, in a game-changer for an imminent Tas. 19th team, the Fed. LNP has this week indicated willingness), I doubt they would fund the whole cost ie $360,000,000 for a 30,000 stadium. It would only be used for c. 6 AFL games pa (does BBL require more than the current c.20,000 capacity?)

The Fed. govt. hasn't fully funded the new, rectangular 25,000 Townsville NRL stadium. Qld. govt. $140,000,000, Fed. govt. $100,000,000; & local Council paid for the infrastructure & provided all the land, free. Townsville pop. is c. 192,000 in June 2019. Interestingly (for the Macquarie Point proponents), however, it was also heavily promoted as a waterfront rejuvenation project.

 
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madmug

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Pretty Bellerive stadium is very close to the CBD, & has the whole eastern, hill side that could be developed into a very large stand.
It is puzzling that some say there is insufficient room to build a further, large stand, (if part of the street needs to be reclaimed, so be it): or that it is difficult to get to.

(then click on the right hand side -"SEE PHOTOS" Blundstone Arena- for 40+ excellent photos of the stadium & its outside surrounds)


Hobart, pop. 240,000, is not a country town- don't expect to simply drive there to an AFL stadium, with a short walk.
What hillside are you thinking could be developed?

You clearly haven't been to BO, have you?

Also its close to the CBD if you forget the river in between.
 

BringBackTorps

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What hillside are you thinking could be developed?
Also its close to the CBD if you forget the river in between.
Excluding the major, modern grandstand, there are ample areas around the ground that could be redeveloped into large stands. The Tas. govt. may have to permanently close part of the adjoining road, & legally acquire, compulsorily the adjoining houses (at fair, Sworn Value prices). On match days, make more nearby streets "Bus Parking Only".

Bellerive is a good stadium, with a current capacity (according to Wikipedia) of 19,500. Fans should not expect to be able to drive to AFL matches (crowds c. 28,000, hopefully) with fan parking within a short walk. The bus system already goes to Bellerive, & ferries go to the Bellerive wharf- why not simply add more buses on game days (as was the practice with VFL Park, at Waverley, which worked very well- no trains or trams went there).

As Bellerive is now such a large, good stadium close to the Hobart CBD, do you, AND also the majority of Tasmanians (including those in the north), agree

1. taxpayers should pay c. $320,000,000 for a new, 28,000 stadium at MP? (This does not include infrastructure, bus terminals/roads etc.- cost?)
Would the AFL, after abandoning Bellerive, be happy if the FFA (Tas. govt. wants its good stadium used, so made a great offer!) put an A League team there?

2. many $ millions need to be expended on Tas. elite GR AF, elite U18 (join NAB League) & adult State comp. (join VFL), to rebuild them/raise standards (due to the long carpetbagging & neglect by the VFL/AFL of Tasmania AF)?

3. spending many $ millions (over decades), on the necessity to raise standards of GR & elite Tas. AF, is a much more EFFICIENT/effective plan to promote the long term interests of Tas. AF- cf. spending c. $320,000,000 (+ infrastructure) on a new stadium at Macquarie Point, used for SIX AFL games pa?

4. there is now, probably, no single Tas. based private sponsor in Tas. who would be willing to provide the major, annual funding for the Tas. 19th team?
And at least $40,000,000 (in 2019 $) annual revenues pa are required for a reasonably competitive Tas. 19th AFL team?

5. significant public funding is likely to be required for the 19th Tas. team, on a long term basis? And "taxpayer $ waste might cause future political problems?

6. if the AFL receives c. $320,000,000+ public funding for a new Tas. stadium (& elite AF funding), many other Tas./other states' NON-AF sports are also entitled to request/demand similar public funding? And such funding, if granted to other sports, may be against the medium & long term interests of AF & the AFL?

7. fans should expect that they can drive to capital city AFL games (with crowds c. 28,000), park, & have a short walk (under 20 minutes) to the ground?

8. the "low cost" Bellarive stadium (cf a 28,000 capacity, $320,000,000 new stadium), after it has an additional 10,000 capacity new stand, is far more likely to be profitable, & be able to offer the maximum no. of cheap ($20-$25) adult tickets?

And, if a big majority of tickets in Hobart & Launny H & A matches are cheap, this will maximise AFL attendances and/or attract close to full houses, at both?

And that the atmosphere regularly playing in heaving, packed, 28,000 Tas. stadia is likely to be a plus for the Tas. AFL team retaining its out-of-contract players? Ditto out of contract players at other clubs- they would regard it as a plus, so more likely to transfer to Tas.?

And that the "optics" & prestige of Tas. AF will be enhanced, around Aust., if its Tas. AFL matches regularly attract full houses (encouraged by cheap ticket prices)?
 
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