Tasmania Congratulations on Tassie License. Mens team to enter 2028. Womens team TBA. Other details TBA 3/5

[Chief]

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GO TO PART 2 of this thread:

Tasmania - Tasmania Devils, welcome to the AFL. Mens team to enter 2028. Womens team TBA. Other details TBA 3/5 (Part 2)

Continued from Part 1: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/congratulations-on-tassie-license-mens-team-to-enter-2028-womens-team-tba-other-details-tba-3-5.1226653/ Was going to draft up a Summary but this is pretty good...

www.bigfooty.com

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[Verdun]

Tas govt have not said that a stadium will not be built at Macquarie Point......have seen the plans

 

[madmug]

1.

Be careful with this reasoning.
If purely decided on the basis of maximum revenue directly generated by a potential expansion club, then Tasmania will never get a licence to join the AFL. It is likely to have a very small economy for many decades, or forever.

Also, WC & Freo would mount fierce opposition against entry for a 3rd WA club.
There is also miniscule fan demand emanating from WA for a 3rd club; but there is demand from WC fans to increase the PS capacity to 70,000- which the foundations allowed for.
Adding a 3rd WA club does not increase the popularity of AF, nor does it create higher Draft nos. for the AFL: Sydney, with an ABS-estimated population of 9m in 2050, certainly does.

My reasoning was about their large surplus, derived from their large revenue. NOT just about revenue. I've made this point about the use of revenue numbers alone.

All clubs have different revenue & cost models. In the end its about the surplus or loss they make.

Looking at WA, its footy culture, Perth, the new stadium, the published finances of Freo & WCE, I find it incredulous that people oppose the idea of having 3 teams. My thoughts are as an outsider, not as a Freo or WCE supporter. I have no self interest in this.

I'd have thought their would be good economic gains to be made for footy in WA. As well as playing opportunities for more WA players to stay in WA. IMHO

 

[Mr Taswegian]

The chance of a Tassie team has taken a further hit with over 60 percent of club presidents voting against Tassie having a team,It looks like Tasmania has a lot of work to do before getting a team.

 

[Verdun]

The chance of a Tassie team has taken a further hit with over 60 percent of club presidents voting against Tassie having a team,It looks like Tasmania has a lot of work to do before getting a team.

Where the club presidents asked if Tasmania should continue to fund North Melbourne .....and Hawthorn??

 

[Mr Taswegian]

Where the club presidents asked if Tasmania should continue to fund North Melbourne .....and Hawthorn??

No,they were asked if they supported an extra team in Tassie coming into the league,we required 12 out 18 presidents to vote in support of it.

 

[fargothegreat]

No,they were asked if they supported an extra team in Tassie coming into the league,we required 12 out 18 presidents to vote in support of it.

Shiiiit. So only 7 clubs supported it? I knew Hawthorn and Norf wouldn't support a Tassie team for selfish reasons, but why should the other clubs even care?

 

[The_Reaper]

Shiiiit. So only 7 clubs supported it? I knew Hawthorn and Norf wouldn't support a Tassie team for selfish reasons, but why should the other clubs even care?

Another mendicant club sharing the same pie.

 

[Kwality]

My reasoning was about their large surplus, derived from their large revenue. NOT just about revenue. I've made this point about the use of revenue numbers alone.

All clubs have different revenue & cost models. In the end its about the surplus or loss they make.

Looking at WA, its footy culture, Perth, the new stadium, the published finances of Freo & WCE, I find it incredulous that people oppose the idea of having 3 teams. My thoughts are as an outsider, not as a Freo or WCE supporter. I have no self interest in this.

I'd have thought their would be good economic gains to be made for footy in WA. As well as playing opportunities for more WA players to stay in WA. IMHO

Believe it or not self interest is not a big factor, its whether or not a 3rd club would be successful on & off field & the effect on the game.
I for one am dubious, WA footy fans are committed & went through a mighty upheaval with the national comp - it took the Eagles time to be successful off the field & that was when playing in the 1991,92, & 94 GFs, a flying start.
Freo was always seen as the logical place for a 2nd side, a very strong footy culture going back to the 1800s. Its taken time & with a bit of luck might have had a flag by now - the 2013 GF appearance the high water mark to date.
I'd suggest the ready take up for a 3rd side is missing, less likely in Perth than anywhere else in the country other than heartland Tas

People see the success of the Eagles but forget the quality & expertise that has gone into it - Brian Cook came to the Eagles from the WAFC in 1990 and set the template for the future of the Eagles over his 9 year tenure, quadrupling the membership. Trevor Nisbett replaced Cook & is there today (he joined West Coast as Football Manager in 1989). Most of the Chairmen are unknown to ordinary footy fan, substantial businessmen nonetheless.

The WA model for the clubs owned by the WAFC is different to any other, it funds WA footy through royalties from the AFL clubs, thats WA footy not just the WAFL. Not seen anyone try to seriously address that structural problem for our game. The AFL kicks in too 9$s), WA does not stand alone.

Already WA produces enough footballers for 3 AFL squads, a 3rd club is unlikely to produce more AFL footballers. I cant see a new club pulling its weight & there are plenty of ordinary performers right now.

It wasnt meant to be a history lesson, a 3rd Perth based club should be some time off imho, my WAFL club Subi is a standout local club, it wasnt the club for the national club after winning the 1986 WAFL flag & its not the club now - those proffering a WAFL club are misty eyed imho.

 

[fargothegreat]

Another mendicant club sharing the same pie.

This isn't another North or St Kilda or Gold Coast though. This is a club with a business case that stands up on its own.

 

[Kwality]

Another mendicant club sharing the same pie.

The Hawks & North should not get a vote, hang on, conflict of interest is a state of mind in our game.

 

[telsor]

This isn't another North or St Kilda or Gold Coast though. This is a club with a business case that stands up on its own.

Stands on it's own only when large, regular sums from AFL and state government are injected.

Both of those groups wont have a lot spare for the next few years at least.

 

[madmug]

Stands on it's own only when large, regular sums from AFL and state government are injected.

Both of those groups wont have a lot spare for the next few years at least.

Yes. It appears the unfolding economics of this situation has overwhelmed the AFL, indeed the whole country.

Some sports are already in deep shyte, so are a lot of businesses & thus sponsors. Even Ch7 is in apparent bother. So moving forward the AFL may find it hard to support so many of its current marginal clubs.

2 or 3 in Melbourne & the 'generational' expansion clubs could come under huge, if not existential pressure.

I hope our state government boots NM & Hawthorn ASAP, they will bring nothing this year. having lobbied against the best interests of footy in this state, they really should show some decent morals & leave.

I fear for local footy comps which are under pressure already. Not just here but everywhere. The TAC U18's may be a big victim.

Things will come back, but many things may change. Big & community sports, Businesses & the health of people & players may be taken more seriously.

 

[telsor]

Yes. It appears the unfolding economics of this situation has overwhelmed the AFL, indeed the whole country.

Some sports are already in deep shyte, so are a lot of businesses & thus sponsors. Even Ch7 is in apparent bother. So moving forward the AFL may find it hard to support so many of its current marginal clubs.

2 or 3 in Melbourne & the 'generational' expansion clubs could come under huge, if not existential pressure.

I hope our state government boots NM & Hawthorn ASAP, they will bring nothing this year. having lobbied against the best interests of footy in this state, they really should show some decent morals & leave.

I fear for local footy comps which are under pressure already. Not just here but everywhere. The TAC U18's may be a big victim.

Things will come back, but many things may change. Big & community sports, Businesses & the health of people & players may be taken more seriously.

I got told I don't care about people dying for saying this before, but I think the economic and social ramifications of all this will probably do more damage, and for a longer time, that the virus itself and we (people & government) really need to keep a clear eye on that side of things too and keep any response balanced.

As you say, things will come back, but there will be a lot shaken up in the meantime, and a lot of damage as a result. Sport, in all forms and levels, just being one example.

In AFL, it could easily mean hundreds of millions in lost revenue, and even though it's probably in a better state than most comps, that's still bound to have a major effect, both in clubs potentially closing, and the door closing to any further expansion (unless the new club can show it would bring MASSIVE and immediate benefits to the league, which seems unlikely).

 

[madmug]

I got told I don't care about people dying for saying this before, but I think the economic and social ramifications of all this will probably do more damage, and for a longer time, that the virus itself and we (people & government) really need to keep a clear eye on that side of things too and keep any response balanced.

As you say, things will come back, but there will be a lot shaken up in the meantime, and a lot of damage as a result. Sport, in all forms and levels, just being one example.

In AFL, it could easily mean hundreds of millions in lost revenue, and even though it's probably in a better state than most comps, that's still bound to have a major effect, both in clubs potentially closing, and the door closing to any further expansion (unless the new club can show it would bring MASSIVE and immediate benefits to the league, which seems unlikely).
[/QUOTE

I very much agree. For some sports & certainly clubs, this is an existential threat.

The AFL is really exposed, perhaps not as much as AL, NRL, RU etc. However, looking at club finances, the income types they rely on, some could be in real strife. Certainly those relying on AFL handouts could be in real bother.

I fear for rural & regional leagues. many were skating on thin ice as it was. Drought, fires, job losses have hurt. We just lost 2 more country clubs here.

The heart & soul of the game is under huge stress. Who knows what & how it will change.

At the professional end, the AFL will need to restructure its top heavy office, maintain its core assets, its players, even its structure in future? The AFL needs to survive/continue so as to build at the other end of this, whenever that may be. The virus will go. The economic carnage may take years to settle. That will hurt the vulnerable clubs, in & outside the AFL.

Should they take this situation to change the game? Is it time for 16 players a side? Circumstance may see a cut back to 16 clubs? All this should be looked at & is very possible.

Stay safe.

 

[madmug]

Oops, as above

 

[telsor]

Just to add, while I have disagreed with a lot of people on this thread, and been bumping heads with many of you on similar threads for years now, I genuinely wish all of you, and your loved ones, all the best for the months ahead.

No doubt it'll be tough at times as we go through the effects of this, but I look forward to telling you ALL how wrong you are long after this has passed

As madmug said...Stay safe.

 

[madmug]

Just to add, while I have disagreed with a lot of people on this thread, and been bumping heads with many of you on similar threads for years now, I genuinely wish all of you, and your loved ones, all the best for the months ahead.

No doubt it'll be tough at times as we go through the effects of this, but I look forward to telling you ALL how wrong you are long after this has passed

As madmug said...Stay safe.

I think it clear that we must be personally vigilant & sensible. I hope we all stay fit & healthy.

I will leave you with one 'thought', a reliance of Government to help sustain a local team would be more reliable now than a lot of sponsors who may soon be in a heap of trouble & will rely very much on that same public purse. I hope people keep their jobs & businesses get through. Those that do will most likely be struggling for at least a year or two & footy will be a very low priority. For AFL & community footy I'm afraid.

Just sayin'

 

[Mr Taswegian]

The coronavirus will most likely mean a Tassie team will be delayed even longer.The AFL will need a long time to rebuild,so they definitly won't be considering expansion for a long time,many expects believe this will probaly mean a team in Tas won't come on line for another 10 years,the virus couldn't of come along at a worse time.

 

[magpienato]

Yeah the only way I'm seeing a Tassie team in the next 20 years is if there is some kind of relocation there but I don't see that happening either unless this corona crisis puts such a burden on a club that it becomes a viable option. Such a shame.

 

[Billy ray]

Yep its all over for the medium term.
shame


this virus can go EAD

 

[madmug]

Yeah the only way I'm seeing a Tassie team in the next 20 years is if there is some kind of relocation there but I don't see that happening either unless this corona crisis puts such a burden on a club that it becomes a viable option. Such a shame.

Never relocation. We don't need anyone's castoffs. We've had enough of rental teams as it is.

Besides the fun watching, It'd be WW3 with Victorian supporters backstabbing other sides to be kicked out of the promised land.

Anyway Its a disappointing state of affairs to be sure, but it is what it is. The AFL & clubs, some more than others, are facing an existential threat. Just having a professional league survive is the priority for footy at the moment.

At least Norf & the Awks will get the arse from here, finally. They can join the shyte fight for survival somewhere else.

Given the envisioned state of the economy, will the 10 Vic clubs make it through? It really appears that serious.

 

[magpienato]

Given the envisioned state of the economy, will the 10 Vic clubs make it through? It really appears that serious.

I don't think the AFL will let a club fall through the cracks. They will do anything to keep the team afloat, just look at Gold Coast.

Having said that though, teams will be finding it rough for the years to come. If a team finds itself on the chopping block, relocation may be the only option to keep them alive if the AFL is desperate enough.

At this point it the options might be having a 'rent-a-team' in Tasmania or a full-time team via relocation. While I understand Tasmanians aspire to have their own team, it won't be viable for a long time now. Unless you guys are happy to wait, in that case I admire your patience.

 

[madmug]

I don't think the AFL will let a club fall through the cracks. They will do anything to keep the team afloat, just look at Gold Coast.

Having said that though, teams will be finding it rough for the years to come. If a team finds itself on the chopping block, relocation may be the only option to keep them alive if the AFL is desperate enough.

At this point it the options might be having a 'rent-a-team' in Tasmania or a full-time team via relocation. While I understand Tasmanians aspire to have their own team, it won't be viable for a long time now. Unless you guys are happy to wait, in that case I admire your patience.

The AFL might not have a choice given the finances of some clubs. Or the choice may yet be either the VFL or the expansion clubs.

Look at the incomes from crowds, sponsors, pokies, investments, tv money, & whatever the AFL has thrown in to keep some alive. They may not be able to resist the major downturns in these finance sources for some clubs.

First & foremost he AFL will want head office to survive so as to rebuild/ pick up the pieces, as necessary.

 

[magpienato]

The AFL might not have a choice given the finances of some clubs. Or the choice may yet be either the VFL or the expansion clubs.

Look at the incomes from crowds, sponsors, pokies, investments, tv money, & whatever the AFL has thrown in to keep some alive. They may not be able to resist the major downturns in these finance sources for some clubs.

First & foremost he AFL will want head office to survive so as to rebuild/ pick up the pieces, as necessary.

This sounds a bit off-topic but I honestly think expansion via state leagues should (or should've) been the way the AFL should have conducted expansion and the future Tasmanian expansion. Grooming and building up state clubs to eventually become AFL teams. Look at Gold Coast for example, missed out on a huge opportunity to use the Southport Sharks in the NEAFL as a springboard to launch the Gold Coast team. Bring them into the VFL for a few years to get experience, build up the list, call em the Gold Coast Sharks, get the stadium and the sponsorship deals and there you have a club with some actual history, purpose and a destiny in the AFL.
Could say the same about the expansion into Western Sydney but I think that was handled a lot better than how Gold Coast was. If Tassie is to get it's own team then this would be the procedure I'd take. I couldn't help to see the AFL make another soulless team in a state which has given so much to the game.

But anyway, this is well and truly off topic now so I'll end it here.

 

[Colonial]

Could say the same about the expansion into Western Sydney but I think that was handled a lot better than how Gold Coast was..

What used the Penrith Rams or Parramatta Goannas?


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