Tasmania Congratulations on Tassie License. Mens team to enter 2028. Womens team TBA. Other details TBA 3/5

[Chief]

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GO TO PART 2 of this thread:

Tasmania - Tasmania Devils, welcome to the AFL. Mens team to enter 2028. Womens team TBA. Other details TBA 3/5 (Part 2)

Continued from Part 1: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/congratulations-on-tassie-license-mens-team-to-enter-2028-womens-team-tba-other-details-tba-3-5.1226653/ Was going to draft up a Summary but this is pretty good...

www.bigfooty.com

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[madmug]

It won't happen.



Of course they would. Just another topic to speculate on to fill air time and column inches.



Lucky the AFL commission doesn't make the final decision. 75%+ of the 18 clubs do. A minimum of 14 clubs need to agree to any change to the structure of the competition including admissin, ejection and merging of clubs. Added to that the merging clubs also need to agree.

How does it work if the club become bankrupt & wound up by creditors?

If the the AFL take control of a more of the clubs &/or control their financial destiny?

Would that change the balance of control between the clubs & the Commission?

All supposition I know. We do need to wait until the dust settles on all this.

I'm hoping all clubs get through, & that club spending is brought back to reality.

 

[Kwality]

How does it work if the club become bankrupt & wound up by creditors?

If the the AFL take control of a more of the clubs &/or control their financial destiny?

Would that change the balance of control between the clubs & the Commission?

All supposition I know. We do need to wait until the dust settles on all this.

I'm hoping all clubs get through, & that club spending is brought back to reality.

Probably the directors of the company controlling the club would be banned for a time. Last time I looked into the Saints in the Lindsay Fox era, most references had been deleted so that is probably a waste of time. Think they just didnt pay, were delisted, a new structure incorporated & on they go. Things are tighter in a corporate sense nowadays, not sure of the not for profit sector though.

 

[Roylion]

How does it work if the club become bankrupt & wound up by creditors?
I'm hoping all clubs get through, & that club spending is brought back to reality.

They can have their AFL licence removed by recommendation of the AFL commission or by its surrender to the commission by that club's administration and agreed to by the clubs. That's what happened to Fitzroy, whose administrator agreed to surrender their licence in return for funding to pay Fitzroy's creditors.

"Fitzroy will cease its Fitzroy Operations, terminate the membership of its Appointee of AFL (appointed pursuant to AFL's constitutent documents and surrender its AFL Licence and release AFL from all claims connected with its AFL Licence and such termniation and surrender;"

If the the AFL take control of a more of the clubs &/or control their financial destiny?

Most Victorian clubs are ultimately member owned, ordinary financial members elect the board and have the final say on major changes such as relocation or constituonal matters. An administrator appointed by the AFL pursuant to the terms of the AFL Licence Agreement can be entitled to dismiss the directors and to have full conduct and control of the Club during the term of such appointment. Usually they may arrange for the election of new Directors of the Club prior to retiring as administrator depending on the terms of the consititution.

Some Victorian clubs have differing degree of involvement by the AFL linked to cash injections and other assistance from the AFL. Some clubs have in their consititutions that they must not enter into any transaction involving a merger, amalgamation or similar agreement between the Club and any other member club of the AFL, unless the transaction is approved by a Special Resolution of the Members".

Fitzroy did not have this. Fitzroy was a company limited by guarantee which simply put meant that the club was owned by the shareholders who elected the directors of the club. Hence the directors of Fitzroy had the power to enter into a merger without the consent of the members.

 

[BringBackTorps]

The Australian 30.3

"The AFL has secured the cash that it hopes will help it survive...".

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

Tasmania's bid, to join c.2025, is still viable. The business case says the extra 11 games pa (198-209 H & A pa) is worth an extra $19m pa in broadcast Rights (if the current terms are extended).

It is almost certain that the c. $200m pa (not including player wages) bloated club Football Depts. will be slashed HEAVILY (with equal reduction in AFL grants to Clubs).This change helps smaller clubs to be more financially viable- & also helps Tasmania.

 

[Mr Taswegian]

The Australian 30.3

"The AFL has secured the cash that it hopes will help it survive...".

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

Tasmania's bid, to join c.2025, is still viable. The business case says the extra 11 games pa (198-209 H & A pa) is worth an extra $19m pa in broadcast Rights (if the current terms are extended).

It is almost certain that the c. $200m pa (not including player wages) bloated club Football Depts. will be slashed HEAVILY (with equal reduction in AFL grants to Clubs).This change helps smaller clubs to be more financially viable- & also helps Tasmania.

I believe 2030 is the soonest we will see a Tassie team now,the AFL will need years to recover,so expansion will be the last thing on their mind.

 

[Kwality]

The Australian 30.3

"The AFL has secured the cash that it hopes will help it survive...".

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

Tasmania's bid, to join c.2025, is still viable. The business case says the extra 11 games pa (198-209 H & A pa) is worth an extra $19m pa in broadcast Rights (if the current terms are extended).

It is almost certain that the c. $200m pa (not including player wages) bloated club Football Depts. will be slashed HEAVILY (with equal reduction in AFL grants to Clubs).This change helps smaller clubs to be more financially viable- & also helps Tasmania.

Optimistic.

 

[Matchu]

 

[Walshawk]

The AFL would love a team to go to the Gold Coast. If one of the struggling Melbourne clubs went it would solve two problems. Could a club be tempted by Anderson, Rowell, King and more draft pick and clearing debt. They could keep their jumper, song, history like the swans have. The reverse of the Brisbane takeover of Fitzroy.
If they keep shorter quarters, they can expand the season to 26 games, allowing for 10 on GC and 10 in Melbourne. 26 games allows for a two year rolling fixture where each team plays each other three times plus one extra derby/showdown, etc.
Tassie could have a team in 2022.
If they also reduce list sizes this year and again next, it will allow Tassie to build up a decent list pretty quickly.

 

[Established1870]

The AFL would love a team to go to the Gold Coast.

Still think, even after 12 years, that Southport should have been given the team for GC.

 

[BringBackTorps]

1. FoxSports 31.3

AFL clubs are still keen to have a team in Tasmania.

The slashing of Footbal Department expenditures (& other AFL & Club expenditures), which, according to MSM AF experts, will be permanent from 2021, will greatly help the economics of a 19th Tas. team (& all other small teams).

LIVE: North’s stoush with Caro heats up, Lyon buries Suns boss in brutal takedown

LIVE: North’s stoush with Caro heats up, Lyon buries Suns boss in brutal takedown

www.foxsports.com.au

NMFC is currently in a healthy financial position- & its members are extremely unlikely to agree to relocate to Tas. In 2008, NMFC was broke- but the members still voted overwhelmingly against relocation to the GC (despite, IIRC, c. $6m offered to them by the AFL if they moved to the GC).
Th ABS predicts Melb. will have a pop. of c.9m in 2050-& the N & NW suburbs of Melb. are having, possibly, the biggest pop. growth.


2. The financial position of the 18 AFL Clubs & the AFL are also helped by the new, massive Federal JobKeeper wage subsidy program.
This may also be a positive in the AFL & Clubs in agreeing to a Tas. 19th team.

AFL and club staff eligible for government bailout money

The mass of laid-off and stood down employees at AFL clubs will be able to claim the Morrison government's fortnightly support of $1500 per worker

www.theage.com.au

 

[madmug]

1. FoxSports 31.3

AFL clubs are still keen to have a team in Tasmania.

The slashing of Footbal Department expenditures (& other AFL & Club expenditures), which, according to MSM AF experts, will be permanent from 2021, will greatly help the economics of a 19th Tas. team (& all other small teams).

LIVE: North’s stoush with Caro heats up, Lyon buries Suns boss in brutal takedown

LIVE: North’s stoush with Caro heats up, Lyon buries Suns boss in brutal takedown

www.foxsports.com.au

NMFC is currently in a healthy financial position- & its members are extremely unlikely to agree to relocate to Tas.IN 2008, NMFC was broke- but the members still voted overwhelmingly against relocation to the GC.


2. The financial position of the 18 AFL Clubs & the AFL are also helped by the new, massive Federal JobKeeper wage subsidy program.
This may also be a positive in the AFL & Clubs in agreeing to a Tas. 19th team.

AFL and club staff eligible for government bailout money

The mass of laid-off and stood down employees at AFL clubs will be able to claim the Morrison government's fortnightly support of $1500 per worker

www.theage.com.au

Once again we don't know where this health/economic disaster is taking us. Hopefully the trendline is down. Even so it'll be months before we can return to (the new) normal, whatever that is.

I saw one 'pundit' grizzling that 16 minute qts will change the game & make comparisons with past footy hard ie it'll affect the history of the game.

I mean FFS, what did moving from 19th/20th men replacements to 4 I/C do? ie Changed the *ing game!!!!!!!!

We WILL have change, so the idiots need to get use to that.

We'll be lucky if all clubs survive or the AFL can sustain some of them.

What changes? we don't know.

However I see the likelihood of reduced footy dept 'waste'? smaller lists, shorter qtrs.? less salary cap (for a year or three at least)

Given the reduced costs then expansion is still possible. Better to go where the costs are less & the chance of bums on seats is the highest.

So once again, again, WA3 & Tas1,

Other places can stake a claim on another thread.

 

[Kwality]

The AFL would love a team to go to the Gold Coast. If one of the struggling Melbourne clubs went it would solve two problems. Could a club be tempted by Anderson, Rowell, King and more draft pick and clearing debt. They could keep their jumper, song, history like the swans have. The reverse of the Brisbane takeover of Fitzroy.
If they keep shorter quarters, they can expand the season to 26 games, allowing for 10 on GC and 10 in Melbourne. 26 games allows for a two year rolling fixture where each team plays each other three times plus one extra derby/showdown, etc.
Tassie could have a team in 2022.
If they also reduce list sizes this year and again next, it will allow Tassie to build up a decent list pretty quickly.

Two teams out of Melbourne is likely to be very attractive to the AFL, would it be enough when the game stays paying back
$millions of dollars every year for 20 years plus.

 

[footyfan1978]

The Australian 30.3

"The AFL has secured the cash that it hopes will help it survive...".

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

Tasmania's bid, to join c.2025, is still viable. The business case says the extra 11 games pa (198-209 H & A pa) is worth an extra $19m pa in broadcast Rights (if the current terms are extended).

It is almost certain that the c. $200m pa (not including player wages) bloated club Football Depts. will be slashed HEAVILY (with equal reduction in AFL grants to Clubs).This change helps smaller clubs to be more financially viable- & also helps Tasmania.

I've also thought this situation of reducing club staff helps a Tasmaina bid become closer to reality.
The number of staff clubs have had has got crazy so one of the good things of this terrible situation is the excesses clubs have run with that not essential, will go now. Do not need a zillion coaches and a zillion marketing staff to have a football club.

 

[Kwality]

I've also thought this situation of reducing club staff helps a Tasmanian bid become closer to reality.
The number of staff clubs have had has got crazy so one of the good things of this terrible situation is the excesses clubs have run with that not essential, will go now. do not need a zillion coaches and a zillion marketing staff.

Its a plus imho, the overhead $s have ballooned with clubs 'keeping up with the Joneses', afraid of being left behind & increasing the cost far in excess of anything gained.

Good to see the CEOs looking at this sort of thing:
A consortium of the AFL’s most experienced brains has been formed to conduct an unprecedented, comprehensive audit of club football departments.
Geelong’s Brian Cook, West Coast’s Trevor Nisbett, Brisbane’s Greg Swann, Gold Coast’s Mark Evans and Essendon’s Xavier Campbell have formed a chief executive taskforce to examine what football departments will look like after the global virus.

The football subcommittee is one of four sub-committees made up of club chief executives.

The others are finance, membership/marketing and health.

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

 

[Kwality]

Once again we don't know where this health/economic disaster is taking us. Hopefully the trendline is down. Even so it'll be months before we can return to (the new) normal, whatever that is.

I saw one 'pundit' grizzling that 16 minute qts will change the game & make comparisons with past footy hard ie it'll affect the history of the game.

I mean FFS, what did moving from 19th/20th men replacements to 4 I/C do? ie Changed the f*n game!!!!!!!!

We WILL have change, so the idiots need to get use to that.

We'll be lucky if all clubs survive or the AFL can sustain some of them.

What changes? we don't know.

However I see the likelihood of reduced footy dept 'waste'? smaller lists, shorter qtrs.? less salary cap (for a year or three at least)

Given the reduced costs then expansion is still possible. Better to go where the costs are less & the chance of bums on seats is the highest.

So once again, again, WA3 & Tas1,

Other places can stake a claim on another thread.

WHY expand for expansions sake? The Tas team is necessity, a must imho, but beyond that now? WHY even consider it?

 

[madmug]

Its a plus imho, the overhead $s have ballooned with clubs 'keeping up with the Joneses', afraid of being left behind & increasing the cost far in excess of anything gained.

Good to see the CEOs looking at this sort of thing:
A consortium of the AFL’s most experienced brains has been formed to conduct an unprecedented, comprehensive audit of club football departments.
Geelong’s Brian Cook, West Coast’s Trevor Nisbett, Brisbane’s Greg Swann, Gold Coast’s Mark Evans and Essendon’s Xavier Campbell have formed a chief executive taskforce to examine what football departments will look like after the global virus.

The football subcommittee is one of four sub-committees made up of club chief executives.

The others are finance, membership/marketing and health.

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

Its such a pity the AFL couldn't address the footy 'arms race' that had ballooned costs over the last decade or so, on its own. It took this disaster to do that?

It will be interesting to see what comes of it.

As said, they can't rely on ever upwards media rights deals. Sponsorships too will take a knock.

Maybe they'll just have to rely on the games real supporters again?

 

[footyfan1978]

Its a plus imho, the overhead $s have ballooned with clubs 'keeping up with the Joneses', afraid of being left behind & increasing the cost far in excess of anything gained.

Good to see the CEOs looking at this sort of thing:
A consortium of the AFL’s most experienced brains has been formed to conduct an unprecedented, comprehensive audit of club football departments.
Geelong’s Brian Cook, West Coast’s Trevor Nisbett, Brisbane’s Greg Swann, Gold Coast’s Mark Evans and Essendon’s Xavier Campbell have formed a chief executive taskforce to examine what football departments will look like after the global virus.

The football subcommittee is one of four sub-committees made up of club chief executives.

The others are finance, membership/marketing and health.

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

They should be thankful Brian Cook has not gone in retirement. He will help the less-experienced get through this.

 

[Roylion]

Two teams out of Melbourne is likely to be very attractive to the AFL, would it be enough when the game stays paying back

How would the AFL bring this about?

 

[Rob]

I've also thought this situation of reducing club staff helps a Tasmaina bid become closer to reality.
The number of staff clubs have had has got crazy so one of the good things of this terrible situation is the excesses clubs have run with that not essential, will go now. Do not need a zillion coaches and a zillion marketing staff to have a football club.

That comes back to the AFL policy of handing out cash to clubs like confetti. Clubs that couldn't afford to hire a zillion coaches were given the cash to make that possible, so they became addicted to spending other people's money. It became an arms race, all encouraged by the league.

In the new world there will still be clubs that can afford to spend. The question is whether the AFL will let all clubs do it.

 

[Established1870]

I've also thought this situation of reducing club staff helps a Tasmaina bid become closer to reality.
The number of staff clubs have had has got crazy so one of the good things of this terrible situation is the excesses clubs have run with that not essential, will go now. Do not need a zillion coaches and a zillion marketing staff to have a football club.

Gill directly quoted $45 million a season as the bare minimum for costs of an AFL team (even though several clubs then and now can't afford it) when explaining why Tasmania can't afford a team. The proposed slashing of footy department staff and spending should see that monetary figure fall big time so the cost of a Tasmanian AFL side becomes a whole lot less.

 

[footyfan1978]

That comes back to the AFL policy of handing out cash to clubs like confetti. Clubs that couldn't afford to hire a zillion coaches were given the cash to make that possible, so they became addicted to spending other people's money. It became an arms race, all encouraged by the league.

In the new world there will still be clubs that can afford to spend. The question is whether the AFL will let all clubs do it.

I'd be very content if clubs had a cap on coaching staff on match day etc etc. Main coach with two others with him should be maximum.
Cap on football departments etc. happy with too.
But clubs should be able to spend as much as they want on club facilities for members and supporters.
If you want to grow your supporter bases to a point where you can actually build your own ground holding well over 60,000 a club should be able to grow to as big as they want and play home games there. That type of club vision should always be possible. But the actual club staff and playing lists for direct football playing should be capped to equalise and financially cap as much as possible. The excesses are just not needed at all and add nothing to the game in it's pure sporting form.

 

[Rob]

I'd be very content if clubs had a cap on coaching staff on match day etc etc. Main coach with two others with him should be maximum.
Cap on football departments etc. happy with too.
But clubs should be able to spend as much as they want on club facilities for members and supporters.
If you want to grow your supporter bases to a point where you can actually build your own ground holding well over 60,000 a club should be able to grow to as big as they want and play home games there. That type of club vision should always be possible. But the actual club staff and playing lists for direct football playing should be capped to equalise and financially cap as much as possible. The excesses are just not needed at all and add nothing to the game in it's pure sporting form.

Ok, but it's not that simple. You'll have clubs making mega profits, which will have the AFLPA licking their lips for a slice. So you risk industrial action because of an obsession with smaller clubs not overspending?

 

[madmug]

I'd be very content if clubs had a cap on coaching staff on match day etc etc. Main coach with two others with him should be maximum.
Cap on football departments etc. happy with too.
But clubs should be able to spend as much as they want on club facilities for members and supporters.
If you want to grow your supporter bases to a point where you can actually build your own ground holding well over 60,000 a club should be able to grow to as big as they want and play home games there. That type of club vision should always be possible. But the actual club staff and playing lists for direct football playing should be capped to equalise and financially cap as much as possible. The excesses are just not needed at all and add nothing to the game in it's pure sporting form.

Clubs haven't ever been able to afford the cost of building their own footy grounds. Most need to get the AFL to fund their training facilities.

How do you see them doing that in the brave & frugal new footy world?

 

[Saucery]

WHY expand for expansions sake? The Tas team is necessity, a must imho, but beyond that now? WHY even consider it?

To be completely honest no one in Tasmania is talking about AFL now. It's just a part of a world order that has passed, the current contracts will expire. Hawthorn and North will be let go. Tasmania will concentrate on facilities that attract international visitors (it's never been proven beyond modeling that the AFL ever added anything to the states economy beyond the money invested by us).

Eco tourism, bike paths, hiking trails, farm gate food experiences, wine tours etc will be the way forward for us. Many local AFL clubs will fold as they were on the brink of doing so anyways. The kids play Futsal, Netball, Basketball, Association football now. Claiming Tasmania as a heartland AFL state is so 20th century.

Don't bother relocating a side or creating a new license, it will be a money pit for a code which will be in decline, even in the traditional states, for many decades to come.

 

[footyfan1978]

Ok, but it's not that simple. You'll have clubs making mega profits,

When clubs start making regular MEGA profits your speculation, might have some relevance.
Simply put, it does not any time soon or short to medium term and that is all we can work towards for now. It is virtually as simple as I put it.