Team of the Century 1960- now

[Robroy22]

I don’t think Daicos could kick 65 meter goals on his left. Very good at the pocket dribble though. I think I’d rather lead to Akermanis more a master of the drop punt , Daicos better at the snaps and dribbles.

Ok....now I know you're joking.

 

[Lingsface]

Flower was WAY better than Greig. But then so were a lot of other wingmen.
How Gavin Brown doesn't get a mention is beyond me.

Hahaha Gavin Brown!

 

[Ginnieboy]

B: C. Johnson Scarlett Rance
HB: McLeod Ayres Enright
C: Buckley G. Williams Martin
HF: Hird Carey Ablett
F: Daicos Lockett Matthews
Foll: Cox Skilton Ablett J
Bench Judd Voss Gawn Matera

Obviously a futile exercise, picked Clement over SOS due to Clements foot skills but will obviously get laughed at.

Couldn’t find room for Franklin/Kouta due to team balance, can’t fit em all in, special mention to Brad Johnson too.

 

[Lingsface]

B: C. Johnson Scarlett Clement/Archer
HB: McLeod Rance Enright
C: Buckley G. Williams Martin
HF: Hird Carey Daicos
F: Ablett Lockett Matthews
Foll: Cox Skilton Ablett J
Bench Judd Voss Gawn Matera

Obviously a futile exercise, picked Clement over SOS due to Clements foot skills but will obviously get laughed at.

Franklin?

It’s a very nice side though.

 

[Ginnieboy]

Franklin?

It’s a very nice side though.

Yeah I know, but how many KFs can you pick? He isn’t getting picked ahead of Plugger / Ablett or Carey, could easily put him on a wing but I’d prefer Buckley in that role and he isn’t getting Dusty’s spot.

Bench should be for a second ruck and runners IMO.

 

[Simche]

B: C. Johnson Scarlett Clement/Archer
HB: McLeod Rance Enright
C: Buckley G. Williams Martin
HF: Hird Carey Ablett
F: Daicos Lockett Matthews
Foll: Cox Skilton Ablett J
Bench Judd Voss Gawn Matera

Obviously a futile exercise, picked Clement over SOS due to Clements foot skills but will obviously get laughed at.

Couldn’t find room for Franklin/Kouta due to team balance, can’t fit em all in

You are right, you will get laughed at. James Clement wouldn't be in the top 30 backmen of his era let alone in contention for this side......

 

[Ginnieboy]

You are right, you will get laughed at. James Clement wouldn't be in the top 30 backmen of his era let alone in contention for this side......

Lol, you obviously never seen the man play, they had to change the rules to stop him, and still couldn’t, retired not long after his peak to care for his sick wife, could play big and small, was a sensational kick, he demolished forwards

 

[glengowan]

VFL Team of the Anthropocene from 1960-now.

 

[Simche]

Lol, you obviously never seen the man play, they had to change the rules to stop him, and still couldn’t, retired not long after his peak to care for his sick wife, could play big and small, was a sensational kick, he demolished forwards

I saw plenty of him and saw him close up the day Nathan Brown made him look silly kicking 5 in the last quarter one out on him.

Wouldn't have Clement ahead of any of the following that I'm listing off the top of my head from his debut in 96 to his retirement in 07 let alone in the conversation with some of the all time greats:
Wanganeen, McLeod, Johnson, Fletcher, SOS, Archer, Jackovich, Hart, Glass, Leppitsch Scarlett, Nigel Lappin, McKay.

Wouldn't even have him ahead of blokes like Bowden, Harley etc. The list goes on.

When you look at the defenders in the early 90s like Harvey, McKenna, Woosha, Sexton, Mansfield, Langford, Smart he's not even vaguely in the conversation let alone when you start looking at the 80s and 70s.

 

[Ginnieboy]

I saw plenty of him and saw him close up the day Nathan Brown made him look silly kicking 5 in the last quarter one out on him.

Wouldn't have Clement ahead of any of the following that I'm listing off the top of my head from his debut in 96 to his retirement in 07 let alone in the conversation with some of the all time greats:
Wanganeen, McLeod, Johnson, Fletcher, SOS, Archer, Jackovich, Hart, Glass, Leppitsch Scarlett, Nigel Lappin, McKay.

Wouldn't even have him ahead of blokes like Bowden, Harley etc. The list goes on.

When you look at the defenders in the early 90s like Harvey, McKenna, Woosha, Sexton, Mansfield, Langford, Smart he's not even vaguely in the conversation let alone when you start looking at the 80s and 70s.

All those players were made to look silly at one point or another mate.

 

[Ginnieboy]

I saw plenty of him and saw him close up the day Nathan Brown made him look silly kicking 5 in the last quarter one out on him.

Wouldn't have Clement ahead of any of the following that I'm listing off the top of my head from his debut in 96 to his retirement in 07 let alone in the conversation with some of the all time greats:
Wanganeen, McLeod, Johnson, Fletcher, SOS, Archer, Jackovich, Hart, Glass, Leppitsch Scarlett, Nigel Lappin, McKay.

Wouldn't even have him ahead of blokes like Bowden, Harley etc. The list goes on.

When you look at the defenders in the early 90s like Harvey, McKenna, Woosha, Sexton, Mansfield, Langford, Smart he's not even vaguely in the conversation let alone when you start looking at the 80s and 70s.

Changed it, forgot about Gary Ayres lol

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Archer has Hodge covered Lingy....Hodge was a spare midfielder playing in defence, he got heaps of ball because he was in a great side and could back his judgement knowing that he had coverage.

Archer played in a couple of great sides but he also held up his end when the Kangas were awful. He was totally fearless (I can only name a few that have been truly fearless...Archer, Gavin Brown, Millane, Matthews and Robert Flower) and his ability to win out against the odds made him a revered player. Far moreso than Hodgy who was just a bit smoother than Jordan Lewis.

The idea that Hodge was only good/got heaps of ball cos he played in a great side is forgetfully odd at best. His first emergence as an elite player, when he averaged over 28 touches as a full time mid, won his first best and fairest, his first AA jacket and was genuinely 'up there' in all the league wide awards was in 2005. Hawthorn won just 5 games that season and were completely carried by him - they finished 2 points clear of the spoon. It remains the 2nd best season of his career when we were at our worst.

The best season of Hodge's career came in 2010 - when Hawthorn won 1 game in the first 7 weeks of the year and scraped their way to a high of 7th. That's the year it was between him and Swan as the best player in the league and he finished runner up in the coaches award (leading before a late season injury), runner up in the MVP, was named centre and captain of the All Australian team, was favourite for the Brownlow, dominated the B&F by a record margin and carried a poorly performing team into finals.

Even the idea that he was a prolific cheap ball winner (cos he had coverage) in a dominant side is almost the antithesis of how he actually played. He won a Norm Smith with 3 votes from every voter in a game where he was not one of the top 7 possession winners. He won unanimously won it by doing the hard things, putting his body on the line, dropping into the hole and being clobbered all day. He had 8 spoils, 3 contested one on one marks and 11 contested possessions in an under siege backline in a team that was rank underdogs.

Archer was indeed a great player too but the idea that he was much better in worse teams is simply not true. In fact, Archer didn't win a single individual accolade when his team did not make finals. Not one AA, not one B&F his best years by far were 1996 and 1998, the years where North were THE dominant side. As the above illustrates, Hodge's best years were when Hawthorn were not a contender and he put them on his back so you've got that entirely the wrong way around.

 

[Ginnieboy]

Hahaha Gavin Brown!

Regarded by many to be the pound for pound best mark in the game in his prime, he could play.

State captain, 2 Whitten medals, not sure what’s funny TBH.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Flower was WAY better than Greig. But then so were a lot of other wingmen.
How Gavin Brown doesn't get a mention is beyond me.

Gavin Brown remains a little underrated in the collective memory, no doubt.

But if I am taking any Collingwood winger you can throw at me: Brown, Barham, Buckley, Sidebottom, Daisy - I am still taking peak Darren Millane. Sad thing is his best football was probably still ahead of him. Genuine match-winner/game-breaker type. He was awesome to watch.

 

[Cursed Cat]

The idea that Hodge was only good/got heaps of ball cos he played in a great side is forgetfully odd at best. His first emergence as an elite player, when he averaged over 28 touches as a full time mid, won his first best and fairest, his first AA jacket and was genuinely 'up there' in all the league wide awards was in 2005. Hawthorn won just 5 games that season and were completely carried by him - they finished 2 points clear of the spoon. It remains the 2nd best season of his career when we were at our worst.

The best season of Hodge's career came in 2010 - when Hawthorn won 1 game in the first 7 weeks of the year and scraped their way to a high of 7th. That's the year it was between him and Swan as the best player in the league and he finished runner up in the coaches award (leading before a late season injury), runner up in the MVP, was named centre and captain of the All Australian team, was favourite for the Brownlow, dominated the B&F by a record margin and carried a poorly performing team into finals.

Even the idea that he was a prolific cheap ball winner (cos he had coverage) in a dominant side is almost the antithesis of how he actually played. He won a Norm Smith with 3 votes from every voter in a game where he was not one of the top 7 possession winners. He won unanimously won it by doing the hard things, putting his body on the line, dropping into the hole and being clobbered all day. He had 8 spoils, 3 contested one on one marks and 11 contested possessions in an under siege backline in a team that was rank underdogs.

Archer was indeed a great player too but the idea that he was much better in worse teams is simply not true. In fact, Archer didn't win a single individual accolade when his team did not make finals. Not one AA, not one B&F his best years by far were 1996 and 1998, the years where North were THE dominant side. As the above illustrates, Hodge's best years were when Hawthorn were not a contender and he put them on his back so you've got that entirely the wrong way around.

Hodge v Archer is a very good comparison imo

 

[Strange Cat]

Hodge v Archer is a very good comparison imo

Hodge for me easily

 

[Fadge]

Hodge for me easily

Hodge over Archer comfortably... it isn't even a contest.

 

[Oliver09]

Regarded by many to be the pound for pound best mark in the game in his prime, he could play.

State captain, 2 Whitten medals, not sure what’s funny TBH.

Brown was a bit of a media darling/beat up in the early to mid 90s. Was a decent player but the hype rarely matched the output. Did kick a bag of 5 v Essendon in the 2nd semi in 1990, probably his best or most important effort.

 

[Cdog71]

The game changes that much they should do one every decade.

 

[PhatBoy]

Leigh Matthews is widely seen as the best ever by most old-timers. Royce Heart is widely seen as the best ever by old-timers, but I have Carey as the best ever personally so I agree there.

From an Essendon perspective, I'd have Hird before Voss just because he was equally influential around the ground but could also play CHF. I also think football fans criminally underate Fletcher. Rance and Scarlett are not as good modern tall backs with their closing speed and length of arms and neither have 20% of his offensive capabilities. He can't compete with Silvagni et all with the gorillas though. However, because he played across both eras people see his weakness against a beast like the big Sav. Just ask Matthew Scarlett who was better, him or Fletcher. Also, that 1999-2001 team was perhaps the best team ever and certainly was in 2000. Unlike the great Hawthorn of the 80s and every great team since it was reliant on its stars. A statistical correlation between a player's availability and Essendon winning and losing shows that Fletcher was the most important player in that team.

I mean, how the eff can a fullback win B&F in a team that finishes with a percentage of 160? ... and can still perform at an AFL level when his body has a 40-year-old's wear and tear.?

For mine, the best possible combination of KPPs would be Silvagni (if the umpires remain "relaxed" on holding) and the strength of Jackovith with the intercepting and kicking of Fletcher.

Everyone is entitled to opinion but the Scarlett fletcher comparison is simply a lie.

Scarlett didn’t ‘have 20 per cent of fletcher’s attacking capability.’

He had more than Fletcher was a thumping kick, no doubt there: Scarlett was so good for the precise reason that he would have 20 touches and keep his opponent goalless and all his touches were quality. He was the definition of a role changing player who made defenders more accountable to actually drive their team’s attack.

Whatever you think of the respective players and their effectiveness, a deficit in attacking ability is not reality.

 

[Ginnieboy]

Gavin Brown remains a little underrated in the collective memory, no doubt.

But if I am taking any Collingwood winger you can throw at me: Brown, Barham, Buckley, Sidebottom, Daisy - I am still taking peak Darren Millane. Sad thing is his best football was probably still ahead of him. Genuine match-winner/game-breaker type. He was awesome to watch.

I remember a HUN article comparing him to Nathan Buckley, “Millane was a stallion of a man who broke open packs with his knees and hurt when he hit” always stuck in my head, beast of a player.

 

[Ginnieboy]

Alastair Lynch was as good a FB as I’ve seen, right up there with Scarlett and Silvani, Ben Hart deserves a mention too.

 

[Jack The Godfather]

Regarded by many to be the pound for pound best mark in the game in his prime, he could play.

State captain, 2 Whitten medals, not sure what’s funny TBH.

Rowdy was a great player.

 

[lumpinee]

i'll have a stab

B. ayres dench wanganeen

HB: doull jakovich jesaulenko

C: greig stewart schimmelbusch

HF: ablett sr. carey blight

F: matthews(c) lockett bartlett

R: farmer(vc) martin cable

inter: P. knights s.madden goodes quinlan

 

[Cursed Cat]

Alastair Lynch was as good a FB as I’ve seen, right up there with Scarlett and Silvani, Ben Hart deserves a mention too.

Ben Hart more in the conversation against Enright, McKenna, McKay, that size, imo. I have a great respect for James Clement too, fwiw, he had a great career, defender's defender.

Alastair Lynch at FB is an interesting call; probably didn't quite play there enough to genuinely stake a claim though, surely. Too valuable as a forward.

I'm still sticking fat with Bernie Smith as my back pocket. Gary Ayres, Bomber Thompson and Chris Johnson can raffle the other BP.