Likeamystery

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Aug 11, 2019
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The quality of juries has been debated ever since they were first derived in the 11th century, when neighbourhood witnesses were called upon - sure, some of the modern day criticisms are often valid, but I'm not sure what would/should replace this form of perceived justice with a group of your 'peers' judging your guilt or innocence.

I was called once and on the way out the door to the preliminary selection I got a surprising call from an old family friend 'a former barrister' who had been told of this. "What are wearing" he asks. "Oh, do you want to be on this jury?" "No, not really", I respond. "OK, get back inside and change into your best suit, something you'd wear at a wedding or funeral and set your phone with alarm reminders every 15 minutes", he advises...
I was one of the first excluded in the selection process.
At jury duty I noticed people dressed-up were challenged, yet, older people wearing casual jumpers were readily accepted. There was a certain type of person they were looking for.
 
The quality of juries has been debated ever since they were first derived in the 11th century, when neighbourhood witnesses were called upon - sure, some of the modern day criticisms are often valid, but I'm not sure what would/should replace this form of perceived justice with a group of your 'peers' judging your guilt or innocence.

I was called once and on the way out the door to the preliminary selection I got a surprising call from an old family friend 'a former barrister' who had been told of this. "What are wearing" he asks. "Oh, do you want to be on this jury?" "No, not really", I respond. "OK, get back inside and change into your best suit, something you'd wear at a wedding or funeral and set your phone with alarm reminders every 15 minutes", he advises...
I was one of the first excluded in the selection process.
These days there's almost no chance of finding 12 people who have never heard of the case, never seen the tv reports, read the news, formed opinions. Even if people think they are capable of reaching "informed" opinion based on evidence, can consider reasonable doubt, and are impartial when it comes to race, will have preconceived ideas that they may not even be consciously aware of.
 

JWS2019

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Nov 30, 2019
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These days there's almost no chance of finding 12 people who have never heard of the case, never seen the tv reports, read the news, formed opinions. Even if people think they are capable of reaching "informed" opinion based on evidence, can consider reasonable doubt, and are impartial when it comes to race, will have preconceived ideas that they may not even be consciously aware of.
Layman’s terms to me is that the judge even if they think you are guilty must apply the law at all times which can a benefit or a hinderance depending on the situation.

Jury should take everything onboard and question legal terms they don’t understand but ultimately it’s there decision based on the evidence and opinion?, benefit or hinderance being they only have a slight understanding of the law and opportunity to ask questions.
 

austcrime

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Oct 22, 2021
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Like most of us, I've been called up for jury duty a couple of times, I noticed there were a lot of aged pensioners who attended. One of the jurors giggled when embarrassing matters were discussed. Another juror kept mentioning a different case where three men had been charged with rape and proven not guilty and when it came time to deliberate someone else sat on the fence, because he didn't have the courage to make a decision. When you think about it, it's probably mainly unemployed people who make up the majority of jurors which is not good for the public. I think much better with a judge only.
My standard response if called onto Jury Duty...

"You really want to pick me? ??"

"Just warning you - may not be a wise decision; ...because my belief is that if the defendant has already made it through the Committal; then they are already "guilty as" ... Not to mention the DPP taking it to court in the first place"

Then if the selectors really insist - I will warn them again...

"I'm telling ya; not a good idea ... (see above) ... and even if the majority of my fellow jury members think the defendant naybe 'innocent' ... I will argue them down into a 'Guilty your Honour' verdict" ....

Na, ...best leave me to my coffee and donuts... I'm not what you are looking for ....

aka no DD for me ...

haha ... true ...

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austcrime

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Oct 22, 2021
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... and while we are all Off Topic for a bit....

This posted by someone made my blood run cold....
#### Another juror kept mentioning a different case where three men had been charged with rape and proven not guilty and when it came time to deliberate #####

Who the Freak was your Jury Foreman on your trail ???

The thing should have been aborted right then and there....

Did tbe Foreman notify the judge about this matter?

My understanding is that a jury can and must only weigh up; discuss and consider the evidence and facts that have been presented to them in the courtroom pertaining to the case that they have been sworn in for ... OMG !!!

Not some 'facts' or otherwise; that may have been part of some other defendant's trial. ... be that "as seen on TV" or anything else; in the courtroom next door - or what happened on Ch9 ACA.....

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metic

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Nov 20, 2017
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Like most of us, I've been called up for jury duty a couple of times, I noticed there were a lot of aged pensioners who attended. One of the jurors giggled when embarrassing matters were discussed. Another juror kept mentioning a different case where three men had been charged with rape and proven not guilty and when it came time to deliberate someone else sat on the fence, because he didn't have the courage to make a decision. When you think about it, it's probably mainly unemployed people who make up the majority of jurors which is not good for the public. I think much better with a judge only.

"When you think about it, it's probably mainly unemployed people who make up the majority of jurors which is not good for the public."

Hmm not sure about that.
Surely the chosen ones are employed!?


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Oct 29, 2007
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I only know one person who has been called up for jury duty in the last new years. He was a director of a small consultancy. Highly educated and extremely intelligent.

I am not sure of where the idea is that un employed people would be the key target... I mean you need some reliable to show up on time and actually be there lol
 

Likeamystery

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Aug 11, 2019
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"When you think about it, it's probably mainly unemployed people who make up the majority of jurors which is not good for the public."

Hmm not sure about that.
Surely the chosen ones are employed!?


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Jurors get selected from the Electoral Role.
 
Dec 22, 2009
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I wonder what evidence they have that he actually took Cleo…
Could it be possible that Cleo was brought to his house?

He's not a bright spark. DNA evidence from the girl inside his vehicle. Mobile phone records from the night of the disappearance. And likely an admission from himself.
 
Mar 5, 2017
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Once in a while there is a feel good article in the Bigfooty crime threads.

 

Awakening

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Oct 23, 2021
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Once in a while there is a feel good article in the Bigfooty crime threads.


Still cannot believe this little girl was found alive 18 days later. I really feared the worst.
 
Aug 19, 2013
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That is nice, and it is nice that the media seem to be showing the family some respect and letting them get on with their lives. Might be a different story when Kelly is in court, but hopefully they can get back some sort of normal to their lives. Kids are resilient, so hopefully with lots of love Cleo will move on too.
 

deanc

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Jun 13, 2014
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That is nice, and it is nice that the media seem to be showing the family some respect and letting them get on with their lives. Might be a different story when Kelly is in court, but hopefully they can get back some sort of normal to their lives. Kids are resilient, so hopefully with lots of love Cleo will move on too.

This is the calm before the storm I suspect, as the media will already have their 'Monster in Court' headlines in draft and ready to publish..!

The real test for Cleo's phycology may come in a few years time, when she is around 7 or 8 and starts to realize/comprehend the actual gravity of the situation she was in..! That's when I think she'll really need the support of professional counselling.
At this moment in time if she believes it was all just a 'strange adventure', that's good for now, but that won't always be the case...
 
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Aug 19, 2013
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This is the calm before the storm I suspect, as the media will already have their "Monster in Court' headlines in draft and ready to publish..!

The real test for Cleo's phycology may come in a few years time, when she is around 7 or 8 and starts to realize/comprehend the actual gravity of the situation she was in..! That's when I think she'll really need the support of professional counselling.
At this moment in time if she believes it was all just a 'strange adventure', that's good for now, but that won't always be the case...
Yeah I am no child psychologist, I'm just hoping for the best for her and wish them all the best. Let's hope she is still young enough that she won't be affected too much.
 
Mar 5, 2017
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Kelly appeared before the Carnarvon Magistrates Court and did not apply for bail. The matter will return to court on 6 December 2021.
6 December is tomorrow.
Kelly is scheduled to appear via video Link from his Casuarina Castle.
Below is a Screenshot of what appears this evening in the Court Listing for tomorrow.

They'd better be careful not to get the 2 Kelly's appearing at the same time in the same Court House in the same Court Room 2, via video link, mixed up.

I assume that the other Kelly (Grant Steven Lee Kelly) is not related to Terence Darrell Kelly,
and has nothing to do with the crimes Terence Darrell Kelly has been charged with?


Screen Shot 2021-12-05 at 9.57.47 pm.png
 
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