Test Squad - 2016

[Phyllis Stein]

For Sri Lanka I'd go with this squad:

Batsmen: Burns, Warner, Khawaja, Smith, Voges, S Marsh, Handscomb
All-Rounders: Nevill, M Marsh, Maxwell
Bowlers: Starc, Bird, Pattinson, Hazlewood, Lyon, O'Keefe

Not a fan of O'Keefe, but beggars can't be choosers. He's comfortably the second best spinner in the country right now. However I'd still go with the 4 quicks/allrounders as I don't think either O'Keefe or Maxwell are test match standard.

Burns
Warner
Khawaja
Smith
Voges
Nevill (+)
M Marsh
Pattinson
Starc
Hazlewood
Lyon

Fawad Ahmed?

 

[eth-dog]

Fawad Ahmed?

Is shit.

 

[Choomah]

Still waiting...

Pattinson Starc Cummins marsh Faulkner Hastings Richardson mennie Sayers Paris behrendorff coulter-Nile hogan hazlewood Siddle are all superior bowlers

 

[Sketi]

Trent Copeland Mk II?

oh god, there's a name i haven't heard for a while. this guy can get picked in the test XI for all I care, as long as he never goes near a radio commentary box for the rest of eternity.

 

[The Falcon Strike]

Which is why I picked him

For Sri Lanka?

Being close to 10th doesn't put you on the list of a touring party

Hazelwood, Patto, Bird, Sayers, Marsh, Mennie and I'd take a punt on Paris all before Boland

Fekete also a bit of an engima - seems prone to massive form swings.

 

[Phyllis Stein]

.

Pattinson- sure, if he's fit
Starc- sure, if he's fit
Cummins- sure, if he's fit
marsh- debatable
Faulkner- debatable, but I'll concede that, if he's fit
Hastings- debatable
Richardson - based on what? surely not FC cricket?
mennie- debatable
Sayers- debatable
Paris- 4 FC games
behrendorff- maybe
coulter-Nile- injured for ages
hogan- nearly 35 and has done very little in the SS this season
hazlewood- sure
Siddle- sure, but I think he's finished.


Hardly 15 clearly ahead of him

 

[Phyllis Stein]

Is shit.

Wrong.

 

[Damon_3388]

Agar has stopped taking wickets... when he was selected he was taking them for fun.

Agar's FC record at the time of his Test selection - 10 matches, 286.2 overs, 29.39 average, 55.42 strike rate, 3.18 economy rate
Agar's Tests - 2 matches, 84 overs, 124.00 average, 252.00 strike rate, 2.95 economy rate
Agar's FC record since those two Tests - 27 matches, 919 overs, 43.98 average, 84.83 strike rate, 3.11 economy rate

Is the latter record the "real" Agar, given that there's a far greater sample size to draw from? Is he just an economical dart bowler these days, more suited to the limited overs stuff? Who knows.

I don't think we should write him off at age 22, but I don't think he really doing anything to deserve being near the Test squad right now, either.

If the selectors are totally "off" Lyon already in the short formats (really was never given much of a go, but anyway), then I'd like to see Agar given a go as the ODI spinner in the near future. I don't think it will "ruin" him. It might just be his niche and what he's best suited to. If he's a good enough bowler, he'll excel and it'll be a learning and growing experience too.

 

[Choomah]

Pattinson- sure, if he's fit
Starc- sure, if he's fit
Cummins- sure, if he's fit
marsh- debatable
Faulkner- debatable, but I'll concede that, if he's fit
Hastings- debatable
Richardson - based on what? surely not FC cricket?
mennie- debatable
Sayers- debatable
Paris- 4 FC games
behrendorff- maybe
coulter-Nile- injured for ages
hogan- nearly 35 and has done very little in the SS this season
hazlewood- sure
Siddle- sure, but I think he's finished.


Hardly 15 clearly ahead of him

He's not international standard and shouldn't be near the test squad, not really debatable that when everyone's fit he wouldn't even be in the picture

 

[Damon_3388]

oh god, there's a name i haven't heard for a while. this guy can get picked in the test XI for all I care, as long as he never goes near a radio commentary box for the rest of eternity.

Just took a 5-fer against SA in the Shield

 

[Phyllis Stein]

He's not international standard and shouldn't be near the test squad, not really debatable that when everyone's fit he wouldn't even be in the picture

I'm not saying he's great. I'm saying that it's rare that everyone is fit….clearly if Starc, Pattinson, Cummins, Bird, NCN and Hazelwood are all fit he won't every tour, but surprisingly that doesn't happen.

 

[Phyllis Stein]

Agar's FC record at the time of his Test selection - 10 matches, 286.2 overs, 29.39 average, 55.42 strike rate, 3.18 economy rate
Agar's Tests - 2 matches, 84 overs, 124.00 average, 252.00 strike rate, 2.95 economy rate
Agar's FC record since those two Tests - 27 matches, 919 overs, 43.98 average, 84.83 strike rate, 3.11 economy rate

Is the latter record the "real" Agar, given that there's a far greater sample size to draw from? Is he just an economical dart bowler these days, more suited to the limited overs stuff? Who knows.

I don't think we should write him off at age 22, but I don't think he really doing anything to deserve being near the Test squad right now, either.

If the selectors are totally "off" Lyon already in the short formats (really was never given much of a go, but anyway), then I'd like to see Agar given a go as the ODI spinner in the near future. I don't think it will "ruin" him. It might just be his niche and what he's best suited to. If he's a good enough bowler, he'll excel and it'll be a learning and growing experience too.

He took 6 wickets in 6 games in the Matador Cup, at 45. No reason for him to play ahead of Holland or O'Keefe other than CA marketing.

And anyway, Maxwell is holding down the spinner's role fine, which balances our team better most of the time anyway.

 

[JackOutback]

Agar's FC record at the time of his Test selection - 10 matches, 286.2 overs, 29.39 average, 55.42 strike rate, 3.18 economy rate
Agar's Tests - 2 matches, 84 overs, 124.00 average, 252.00 strike rate, 2.95 economy rate
Agar's FC record since those two Tests - 27 matches, 919 overs, 43.98 average, 84.83 strike rate, 3.11 economy rate

Is the latter record the "real" Agar, given that there's a far greater sample size to draw from? Is he just an economical dart bowler these days, more suited to the limited overs stuff? Who knows.

I don't think we should write him off at age 22, but I don't think he really doing anything to deserve being near the Test squad right now, either.

If the selectors are totally "off" Lyon already in the short formats (really was never given much of a go, but anyway), then I'd like to see Agar given a go as the ODI spinner in the near future. I don't think it will "ruin" him. It might just be his niche and what he's best suited to. If he's a good enough bowler, he'll excel and it'll be a learning and growing experience too.

Those stats could also make an argument for not picking someone when they are clearly not ready. Do the stats suggest that his confidence was shaken by being belted at international level? The only good thing is, he's young, he's got time to recover.

 

[The_Reaper]

Wrong.

Nah he's right. Ahmed isn't good enough against players who can actually play spin (who are very rare in Australian cricket)

 

[Damon_3388]

Those stats could also make an argument for not picking someone when they are clearly not ready. Do the stats suggest that his confidence was shaken by being belted at international level? The only good thing is, he's young, he's got time to recover.

He didn't really get belted during his Tests though (economy rate was under 3, gave up 30 boundaries in 84 overs), just didn't take wickets.

I do think he got picked too early, though. We were really just trying to be too cute with selections there. Lyon really hadn't done anything especially wrong to get dropped, and there was no need to throw Agar into a must-win away Ashes like that.

Personally, if we assume that bowlers will bowl 300-400 overs each Shield season (15-20 overs an innings), then I think we shouldn't really be selecting anyone until they've bowled at least 1,000 overs at Shield level. It's hard to do considering how little FC cricket we play in Australia, and how frequently every bowler seems to get injured, but this would gives a good sample size of what these guys are about, and eliminates hot streaks or wonder seasons from the selection process. The Test team shouldn't be a development squad.

Nah he's right. Ahmed isn't good enough against players who can actually play spin (who are very rare in Australian cricket)

If we gave him a go, I feel like he'd be a worse version of Imran Tahir at Test level. As in, he'd get clubbed severely.

 

[Phyllis Stein]

Nah he's right. Ahmed isn't good enough against players who can actually play spin (who are very rare in Australian cricket)

So our best domestic spinner is no good against players who can play spin? But I'm guessing there's a worse domestic spinner who is better against players who can play spin?

 

[The_Reaper]

So our best domestic spinner is no good against players who can play spin? But I'm guessing there's a worse domestic spinner who is better against players who can play spin?

No there isn't.

There isn't a single domestic spin bowler who won't be a dead weight if we brought them to Sri Lanka or India.

 

[Kram]

Ahmed would end up being McGain mk2.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

Ahmed would end up being McGain mk2.

I don't think Ahmed would disgrace himself.

 

[Cleavy]

read somewhere that they're concerned about Pattinson's shins. Possibly of being out for 4 months if serious.

 

[corbies]

No there isn't.

There isn't a single domestic spin bowler who won't be a dead weight if we brought them to Sri Lanka or India.

Very harsh on Steve O'Keefe IMO.

 

[bird_man]

read somewhere that they're concerned about Pattinson's shins. Possibly of being out for 4 months if serious.

Where did you read that Cleavy?

Edit: Found it, I knew he was having troubles with his shins earlier in the year, hopefully nothing comes up in the scan, the bloke is having no luck.

 

[Damon_3388]

IMO, if everyone is 100% fit (no injuries, match fit), and we're just picking our best sides for neutral conditions:

Australia
1. Joe Burns
2. David Warner (VC)
3. Usman Khawaja
4. Steve Smith (C)
5. Adam Voges
6. Mitch Marsh
7. Peter Nevill (+)
8. Mitchell Starc
9. James Pattinson
10. Josh Hazlewood
11. Nathan Lyon

Australia A
1. Cameron Bancroft
2. Ed Cowan
3. Shaun Marsh
4. George Bailey (C)
5. Peter Handscomb
6. Moises Henriques (VC)
7. Matthew Wade (+)
8. Steve O'Keefe
9. John Hastings
10. Peter Siddle
11. Jackson Bird

 

[Van_Dyke]

IMO, if everyone is 100% fit (no injuries, match fit), and we're just picking our best sides for neutral conditions:

Australia
1. Joe Burns
2. David Warner (VC)
3. Usman Khawaja
4. Steve Smith (C)
5. Adam Voges
6. Mitch Marsh
7. Peter Nevill (+)
8. Mitchell Starc
9. James Pattinson
10. Josh Hazlewood
11. Nathan Lyon

Australia A
1. Cameron Bancroft
2. Ed Cowan
3. Shaun Marsh
4. George Bailey (C)
5. Peter Handscomb
6. Moises Henriques (VC)
7. Matthew Wade (+)
8. Steve O'Keefe
9. John Hastings
10. Peter Siddle
11. Jackson Bird

I'd take NCN or Dorff over Hastings personally, would put SMarsh down the order, but aside from that, no faults in those two

 

[Damon_3388]

I'd take NCN or Dorff over Hastings personally, would put SMarsh down the order, but aside from that, no faults in those two

Yeah I'd probably be happy with NCN ahead of Hastings in that A side too, given that he brings point of difference with his pace.

Also, correct me if I'm mistaken, but didn't Hastings used to bowl a lot fast than he does right now? I swear during his initial run in the Australian side, he was pushing 150km/h on occassion. He's like Siddle in losing his pace, without the weight loss (something he could actually do with, by cricketing standards, and given how much he sweats as well).