Mega Thread The 2016 Buckley Coaching Discussion

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BPikkers

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A few answers. Fwd line has been the least cohesive unit this season.Without Moore and Fasolo we are simply not threatening enough or create contests to exploit. With both of them out, others need to lift and they didn't.
Structural. Can't think of many selections failures with the limited selection options that we had. Cloke has been given chances and taken one before dropping off. Gault never got even in the frame. Med fwds only Fasolo did well. Blair has been passable at times.
After Friday I don't expect Blair and Cloke to come back next year.
Blair for his uncharacteristically low output, Cloke for the usual reason.
Cox I want to see what his next game brings before commenting White was down too but i have come to expect his mediocrity and he gets dragged with the teams performance quite often.
Crocker is in his 1st yr. Can't and won't blame him.
What has been done. Friday it was Williams to the fwd line. Not the first time Bucks switches players from defense to offense to inject a game changer. Not much result. Maybe Reid next time?
I would have thrown Reid or Howe down there. Sidebottom? I think DeGoey should have played. I don't get why Williams would have been down there. For his tackling? Our 3 talls are not that mobile and we just haven't had a crumber. Maybe play a small forward line with just one tall who simply tagged Rance to get him out of the game? I don't know the answer but it has been an issue all year for us. I haven't seen anything different in place. Same old, same old.
 

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noideaatall

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Beating us is your yardstick? Think he was on the right track though, don't forget the team he had and lack of support from AFL/Club.
Four players left from that big loss to Geelong in 2011.
Someone mentioned Watts, it has taken him 8 years to show some consistency.
Bailey started with a winning percentage of 13.64% and in his last year had them at 44.12%
Roos has a team of 1st rounders and his current coaching record for this year is 47.37%.

I take a bit of interest in Melbourne as it is my most disliked team, obnoxious supporters so revel in their loses.
I mentioned Watts. He has developed that consistency under Roos. That was the point.
 

PieBeast

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What is to say another coach wouldn't have achieved the same under the same circumstances?
Utterly laughable to put it down to Roos.
This is what you said "I don't think that Roos has done better than when Bailey was there"
Well, unfortunately for you the cold hard facts say he has.

And if I was to post that pearler of yours on Melbourne's board lots of hilarity would ensue :D:thumbsu:
 

Maggie5

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This is what you said "I don't think that Roos has done better than when Bailey was there"
Well, unfortunately for you the cold hard facts say he has.

And if I was to post that pearler of yours on Melbourne's board lots of hilarity would ensue :D:thumbsu:
I don't think that the rules would allow you but wouldn't put it past you.
But do try and compare apples with apples and not apples with oranges.
 

PieBeast

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I agree they have improved under him but you'd think any half decent coach could get a team of high draft picks up and around the finals. How much of their current 'success' you can attribute to Roos is entirely debatable. I sense even I could have made them start winning. Even a basket case like Melbourne eventually will come good given the benefits you receive for constantly finishing down the bottom.
Those nutters would probably be top 4 under Clarkson!
Yes of course you're right but that's not what I'm disputing and funnily enough yours truly has called this would happen couple of years ago and suggested Dogs and Saints will leapfrog us too in regards to Bucks trading away half of our side and stockpiling reasonably high draft picks.
The high picks that don't look much chop now...
 

BPikkers

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This apparant obsession by a lot of posters with Ratten and Dew puzzles me. Could not stand either of them as players and would absolutely be gutted if they were the future coaching face of the Pies. I dont know the answer going forward only that I dont want either of them in a front position at the club
Did u like Clarkson as a player? He was a little prick.
 

PicaBoo

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I would have thrown Reid or Howe down there. Sidebottom? I think DeGoey should have played. I don't get why Williams would have been down there. For his tackling? Our 3 talls are not that mobile and we just haven't had a crumber. Maybe play a small forward line with just one tall who simply tagged Rance to get him out of the game? I don't know the answer but it has been an issue all year for us. I haven't seen anything different in place. Same old, same old.
Last year we didn't have Reid most of the time . Agreed Howe should be thrown more fwd. But there is something to be said for giving game time to the same lot as much as possible. 2 best 10 players in our fwd line injured and Cloke ineffictive is not a same old same old imho but yet again not enough firepower fwd when we want to.
"Life is like a poem. It never repeats but it often rhymes"
 

DWil6

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Yes of course you're right but that's not what I'm disputing and funnily enough yours truly has called this would happen couple of years ago and suggested Dogs and Saints will leapfrog us too in regards to Bucks trading away half of our side and stockpiling reasonably high draft picks.
The high picks that don't look much chop now...
We got burned on two of the best draft picks we have had. Scharanberg and Freeman needed to be stars for us. Unfortunately that didn't / may not pan out. Those drafts are killers given how few high picks we have had of late in comparison to clubs like Melbourne and StKilda.
Broomhead looks to also potentially be a miss and he was a 'relatively' high pick. As was Ben Kennedy. That's possibly 2 busts. Only Grundy has worked out from those 3 picks.
DeGoey is a high pick and may well work out.
Sier is yet to be proven but if he's also a miss you can understand how we could be set back.
(Having said that, he was a pick in the 30's anyway). Treloar is a gun as will be Moore. That's about it from our first round picks and highish draft picks
since 2008 with Steele and Beams.
Fair to say we haven't bottomed out as much as might have been beneficial.
Melbournes high draft picks since 2008 -
1, 17, 19, 1, 2, 12, 2, 4, 9, 2, 3, 4, 9.
Collingwood's high draft picks since 2008 -
11, 18, 19, 20, 6, 10, 5, 9.
 
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mike123

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We got burned on two of the best draft picks we have had. Scharanberg and Freeman needed to be stars for us. Unfortunately that didn't / may not pan out. Those drafts are killers given how few high picks we have had of late in comparison to clubs like Melbourne and StKilda. Broomhead looks to also potentially be a miss and he was a 'relatively' high pick. Sier is yet to be proven but if he's also a miss you can understand how we could be set back.
We didn't need to recruit Freeman in the first place. Should have just used his pick to get Adams and keep Shaw.
 

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Matt_352

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This apparant obsession by a lot of posters with Ratten and Dew puzzles me. Could not stand either of them as players and would absolutely be gutted if they were the future coaching face of the Pies. I dont know the answer going forward only that I dont want either of them in a front position at the club
Maybe because they are most qualified assitants in waiting
 

noideaatall

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List turnover, bouncing out of the T. Shaw thread. It appears to be at a high level and looks likely to take the same tack this year.

When Bucks first took the reigns, noting there had been few youth blooded or the list depth tested during 2011 I believed it a strength that he gave games to youth, made decisive choices over the list and was willing to make changes. I still see it as a reflection of this strength in the sense that our list depth has improved considerably, as demonstrated in VFL results. Nevertheless I would have expected that level of turnover to reduce over time to around that rate the AFl demands.

Is this a reasonable level of turnover? If not, then do we blame recruiting, development, not giving players enough time to develop or poor choice of who to develop? Letting Ceglar go but putting years into Gault is possibly an example of the latter. I post this without having the answers but rather to suggest this one of the signs that the FD at Collingwood is not getting right. How much that has to do with Bucks I don't know.
 

DrDavoren

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We got burned on two of the best draft picks we have had. Scharanberg and Freeman needed to be stars for us. Unfortunately that didn't / may not pan out. Those drafts are killers given how few high picks we have had of late in comparison to clubs like Melbourne and StKilda. Broomhead looks to also potentially be a miss and he was a 'relatively' high pick. Sier is yet to be proven but if he's also a miss you can understand how we could be set back.
Spot on we have stuffed up at recent drafts and lucky we got Moore as a father son.
Worst bit is the timing of this to occur when the AFL are trying to establish the new teams.

Will be a long time down for us and the club's like Brisbane, Richmond, Essendon and co.

The club obviously thought we were close and could top up with a few senior cast offs from other club's.
In hindsight we may have been better off going the StKilda and Bulldogs route and going via draft.

Time will tell.
 

Saintly Viewed

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Making finals is one measure of improvement but not necessarily the best one. Look at where Melbourne was when Roos took over, look at where they are now. I can see definite improvement. I am more impressed with Roos as a coach and as a professional now than I was when he left Sydney. He has come in, pretty much done what he said he would and the improvement is discernible. Can we say the same about Bucks? I can't.

I agree with you that we need the cattle. We don't need to wait until we have the cattle to assess the performance of our coach relative to the possible alternatives though.
I think Roos just does better press interviews, is more articulate than what went before.
Improvement? Some, yes sure.... But nothing overwhelming.
I'm a rap for Roos absolutely.
But he's like many many many coaches who did basic stuff with basic players.

Allan jeans a colossus still won a spoon with Richmond.
Ron Barassi the Coach! Of his time, Melbourne poor over numerous years.
Happens just about all the time.

Not to worry, whoever coaches us, if we lack the cattle we can at least get stuck into the coach. That's football (and most sports for that matter).
 
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PieBeast

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We got burned on two of the best draft picks we have had. Scharanberg and Freeman needed to be stars for us. Unfortunately that didn't / may not pan out. Those drafts are killers given how few high picks we have had of late in comparison to clubs like Melbourne and StKilda. Broomhead looks to also potentially be a miss and he was a 'relatively' high pick. Sier is yet to be proven but if he's also a miss you can understand how we could be set back.
Yes but to me the path Bucks chose in the name of the culture change and apparently in order of being able to compete against newly established franchises was always going to be futile. As quite a few young sides would be ahead of us due to having a massive head start and high draft picks being far from a certainty to make it. As it stands it looks like we've put Cloke's, Swanny's and Pendles' best years to waste.

My biggest gripe here is people using every conceivable excuse to suggest Bolton, Roos, Richo and Bevvo have bugger all to do with their corresponding sides revivals while at the same time literally scrapping the bottom of the barrel for reasons to absolve Bucks of any blame for our current situation.....

This thread has gone full ******
 

Saintly Viewed

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Did u like Clarkson as a player? He was a little prick.
That he was.
And went cactus at a children's game of football.
Doubt he's a nice guy at all, but gets results which papers over his flaws I suspect.
Don't need to be nice if you win flags.
Ha he'd put a few people in their place if he was at Collingwood.
the return of micks charm I suspect ;)
 

No SPIN

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So fewer wins for the year (maybe) with a much poorer percentage means we've improved does it?

Umm...OK :drunk:
so if we get more wins than last year you'll be happy - good for you.
personally i'll settle for closing the gap against the best - a far more important benchmark for a young developing team, because maturity and experience inevitably bring more wins if you have the talent demonstrated by competitiveness against the best.
 

Saintly Viewed

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Yes but to me the path Bucks chose in the name of the culture change and apparently in order of being able to compete against newly established franchises was always going to be futile. As quite a few young sides would be ahead of us due to having a massive head start and high draft picks being far from a certainty to make it. As it stands it looks like we've put Cloke's, Swanny's and Pendles' best years to waste.

My biggest gripe here is people using every conceivable excuse to suggest Bolton, Roos, Richo and Bevvo have bugger all to do with their corresponding sides revivals while at the same time literally scrapping the bottom of the barrel for reasons to absolve Bucks of any blame for our current situation.....

This thread has gone full ******
So kindly let us know which of Beverage, Bolton, Richardson is going to win a flag (the only measure when it gets down to brass tacks) with their teams?
 

Saintly Viewed

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so if we get more wins than last year you'll be happy - good for you.
personally i'll settle for closing the gap against the best - a far more important benchmark for a young developing team, because maturity and experience inevitably bring more wins if you have the talent demonstrated by competitiveness against the best.
I'm with you.
If only it was as simple as big footy.....
Every side would win the flag every year if we just listened to big footy
 

No SPIN

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You are on the money No Spin....last year we beat the teams we should have but could not beat the top teams. This year we beat some of the teams in the eight but couldn't come close to the teams we should have beat. So if we can't beat the teams that we should, we have in fact gone backwards
if closing the gaps against the top teams is not progress then that's your problem - inconsistency of a young list is the bane of all developing teams typified by losing the ones you should win.
 
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