Training The 2017 Pre Season (thread closed - the 2017 H & A season is here!)

[SApies]

"omggggg it's just training! LOLLL people getting sooo angry at a training session"

Sorry but I'd like our best players to train in their best positions. I couldn't care if its one training session.
Fasolo up forward is a serious key to a successful year. He topped our goal scoring from 12 games IIRC for christ sake.

I'm not salty, but I'd rather train the way we're going to play.

 

[PicaBoo]

Yu speld when wong.

 

[Soups]

"omggggg it's just training! LOLLL people getting sooo angry at a training session"

Sorry but I'd like our best players to train in their best positions. I couldn't care if its one training session.
Fasolo up forward is a serious key to a successful year. He topped our goal scoring from 12 games IIRC for christ sake.

I'm not salty, but I'd rather train the way we're going to play.

I know what you're saying but we know Fasolo can dominate up forward. I don't really see the problem of him training in defence every once in a while. He is someone that needs the ball in his hands, he's not going to get it 20+ times up forward but he can achieve that down back. Good for his forward pressure too, which is something he still needs to work on IMO.

If he trains the rest of preseason down there, then I think we have a problem. But I'll reserve judgment until round 1 to see where he lines up.

 

[Tippa#22]

Was wells out on the track anyone?
And how'd did schranberg go?

 

[Ketchup]

Not really a surprise for me to see Fasolo training in the defense. I did raise the prospect of trading Fasolo in the off season because I didn't see a spot for him with a fit Elliot. Interesting times ahead.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Not really a surprise for me to see Fasolo training in the defense. I did raise the prospect of trading Fasolo in the off season because I didn't see a spot for him with a fit Elliot. Interesting times ahead.

You can't see a spot for Fasolo?!!! After Elliott, who in the forward line would get a spot ahead of him? He is arguably our best forward.

 

[PieBeast]

Not really a surprise for me to see Fasolo training in the defense. I did raise the prospect of trading Fasolo in the off season because I didn't see a spot for him with a fit Elliot. Interesting times ahead.

That's cause you're too weak to admit Fas made you look like an utter muppet for most of last year.

Actually surprised you didn't suggest we simply delist him.

 

[jackcass]

It's a really interesting one, if Elliott is back to full fitness and and WHE and Broomy perform to the expected standard than I suppose we do have the luxury of playing Fas down back, from memory he played the role quite well offensively last time.

Thought he was very good for in defense in the game against the Kangas which surprised me. I'm not opposed to players training for a variety of positions. Need to improve the flexibility of the squad.

 

[magpies42]

"omggggg it's just training! LOLLL people getting sooo angry at a training session"

Sorry but I'd like our best players to train in their best positions. I couldn't care if its one training session.
Fasolo up forward is a serious key to a successful year. He topped our goal scoring from 12 games IIRC for christ sake.

I'm not salty, but I'd rather train the way we're going to play.

The way the game goes these days and injuries etc, players need to be multi-positional. That's not to say he won't play mainly forward, it might be that if the game necessitates that he plays back or in the middle. It's also good for his development to learn another position but mainly to understand how annoying it is when the players up the field don't play team defence!!! Might make him run hard to tackle and impact opposition disposal

 

[Aishole]

Not really a surprise for me to see Fasolo training in the defense. I did raise the prospect of trading Fasolo in the off season because I didn't see a spot for him with a fit Elliot. Interesting times ahead.

Lol. Go back and watch the games against richmond and Gws this year, and tell me he doesn't get a spot. You've got literally no idea.

 

[DERKADERRR]

Not really a surprise for me to see Fasolo training in the defense. I did raise the prospect of trading Fasolo in the off season because I didn't see a spot for him with a fit Elliot. Interesting times ahead.

Really? Elliott pushes out our leading goal kicker rather than someone on the fringe? I mean the guy averaged 2 goals per game before an unlucky impact injury ruined his season.

 

[Ketchup]

That's cause you're too weak to admit Fas made you look like an utter muppet for most of last year.

Actually surprised you didn't suggest we simply delist him.

Actually no. Fas definitely surpassed my expectations last year. But in modern football a forward line of fas, Elliot, Moore, Cox/white simply won't cut it. 3 of them are great goal kickers, 2 of them may aswell not be mentioned. None of them will provide anything defensively.

As for the whole "leading goal kicker" that just proves how poor our forwards already are that a bloke who played 12 games can win it. And let's not forget Hawthorn traded it's best player for peanuts last year. No one on our list is untradeable except for Pendles, Moore, Treloar and Grundy for the right price.

 

[Scodog10]

Actually no. Fas definitely surpassed my expectations last year. But in modern football a forward line of fas, Elliot, Moore, Cox/white simply won't cut it. 3 of them are great goal kickers, 2 of them may aswell not be mentioned. None of them will provide anything defensively.

As for the whole "leading goal kicker" that just proves how poor our forwards already are that a bloke who played 12 games can win it. And let's not forget Hawthorn traded it's best player for peanuts last year. No one on our list is untradeable except for Pendles, Moore, Treloar and Grundy for the right price.

Look I think you're wrong trading Fasolo last year would have been a bad call given our other senior departures, but I don't think you're much more wrong than most others to comment since yesterday evening.

A couple of points it was match simulation not a training session what its designed for is to bring together the training sessions of the past few months. If we're using it properly Fasolo will spending more time further up the field in 2017 as a minimum.

The second is the "well you can't throw our leading goalkicker down back rabble rabble rabble" of course you can! Analyse his 2016 and its clear that he still lacks consistency with 14 of his 25 goals coming from three matches against weak opposition (Carlton, Essendon and Richmond). He's a lock to be best 22, but if he can offer something different down back with the recruitment of Mayne, WHE and Wells who can all play within 70 metres of goal this role change could be on the cards. It isn't locked in because the Collingwood coaching staff change their minds on strategy as often as the Kardashian's change clothes, but I would keep an open mind.

 

[doodles98]

Terrible of the coaches. Trying to get more flexibility in the list. Who needs flexibility.

But I do have a problem with this actually.. it's in the choice of Faz as the swingman. Nice disposal is one thing but call me old fashioned, I like my defenders to be good at defending first and foremost. Not a strength for the Fazzy.

And come to think of it I thought the same in 2011 when I first heard Davis was playing back. So yeah... I got nothing on this.

 

[Anzacday]

Look I think you're wrong trading Fasolo last year would have been a bad call given our other senior departures, but I don't think you're much more wrong than most others to comment since yesterday evening.

A couple of points it was match simulation not a training session what its designed for is to bring together the training sessions of the past few months. If we're using it properly Fasolo will spending more time further up the field in 2017 as a minimum.

The second is the "well you can't throw our leading goalkicker down back rabble rabble rabble" of course you can! Analyse his 2016 and its clear that he still lacks consistency with 14 of his 25 goals coming from three matches against weak opposition (Carlton, Essendon and Richmond). He's a lock to be best 22, but if he can offer something different down back with the recruitment of Mayne, WHE and Wells who can all play within 70 metres of goal this role change could be on the cards. It isn't locked in because the Collingwood coaching staff change their minds on strategy as often as the Kardashian's change clothes, but I would keep an open mind.

Well said.
Imagine the shock if a side like the Hawks decided to play Breust, Roughead, Rioli etc in the midfield instead up the forward line.
Or heaven forbid take Burgoyne/Hodge/Mitchell from the midfield to half back.
I don't think their BF board would cope

 

[Scodog10]

Well said.
Imagine the shock if a side like the Hawks decided to play Breust, Roughead, Rioli etc in the midfield instead up the forward line.
Or heaven forbid take Burgoyne/Hodge/Mitchell from the midfield to half back.
I don't think their BF board would cope

Imagine a relatively inexperienced coach like Simpson throwing a second string midfielder (a premiership player at that with the Pies) behind the ball

It can work it just needs other dominoes to fall. For instance it releases Adams onto the ball simultaneously giving us a harder edge at the clearances and more reliable skills off half back, but Fasolo is still strong enough at ground level in 1 v 1's.

A better contest at the stoppages means more forward momentum and more opportunities in the front half lessening the opportunities for our defenders to be isolated. Others would need to step up, but that's what good teams do they have lesser lights go to the next level. Picken at the dogs, Greene at the Giants and Rampe at the Swans from 2016.

I've been excited by what the coaching group has hinted at previously so I don't want to get my hopes up I just see no issue with it!

 

[MagpieJoel]

Oh yes again. I have seen 3 tweets today from CollingwoodFC that Fasolo was playing in the backline.
Forget yesteryear tactics of traditional role players. This year Bucks is going out swinging .

The Collingwood media department has little insight into our tactics. Not only that, they are just like the normal media now - much of this stuff is click bait.

 

[Yearofthe]

I just thought it was a strange first post to come out and have a bit of a go at TD. I don't think it's an issue. A lot of people add a lot of good insight on here as well as TD.

Yup point taken and moving on.

Given that Fas and Elliot were moved to defense on Mondays games sim, did they play any new recruits (Daicos, KK, etc..) in the forward line and if so, how did they fare?

 

[DaVe86]

Geez, we must be desperate for some news.

Coaches are just throwing some things around. Fasolo will be a forward in 2017. However, this may be a small sign that if he is having a bad game, that the coaches are experimenting with a Plan B.

A big criticism of Buckley's coaching over the years has been his failure to have a plan B.

With guys like Reid, Howe, Fasolo, Goldsack, Keeffe and White, we may be developing a more flexible structure. I've read reports particularly about Keeffe also training forward and back so far this pre-season.

 

[DERKADERRR]

Actually no. Fas definitely surpassed my expectations last year. But in modern football a forward line of fas, Elliot, Moore, Cox/white simply won't cut it. 3 of them are great goal kickers, 2 of them may aswell not be mentioned. None of them will provide anything defensively.

As for the whole "leading goal kicker" that just proves how poor our forwards already are that a bloke who played 12 games can win it. And let's not forget Hawthorn traded it's best player for peanuts last year. No one on our list is untradeable except for Pendles, Moore, Treloar and Grundy for the right price.

I think you're understating Fasolo's pressure game, recently it has been quite decent but Elliott has been relatively poor in that area since his first year. In regards to the players you mentioned, that's four out of forward line of six (seeing as you mentioned Cox/White which I assume means it's one out of the two), with the addition of Mayne as a defensive forward why should we sacrifice a player with the ability to score and with a high level of score involvements for another more defensive forward, and who replaces him?

 

[DWil6]

On Fas, he would have been in the frame for an AA gig as a small fwd last season before injury.

25 goals, 6 behinds in 11 and a bit games.
36 tackles in the same time, so not too shabby.
Had a season low 10 possessions (though he kicked 2 goals) and a season high 22 possessions (4 goals).
Only went goalless once.
Kicked 6 straight v the Tigers.
44 marks including 9 contested and 10 goal assists.
Probably quite a few more score assists also.
72 contested possessions and 102 uncontested.
His efficiency with the ball is top grade also as he consistently scored above 80%.

The two best small forwards in terms of goal output last season were Betts with 75 goals from 24 games and Rioli with 47 from 21.

 

[Yearofthe]

Betts with 75 goals from 24 games.

Wow! that's incredible output for a small forward.

I wonder than if it would be successful to build a forward line around small forwards. Have Moore CHF passing to the likes of Sidebottom, Fasolo and Eliiot in the forward line.

I just hope we dont continue bombing the ball in like we have for the past 4-5 years. So predictable and defendable.

 

[DWil6]

Betts had an incredible year, no question. He also scored 63 in 2015 and 51 in 2014.

 

[sr36]

I think you're understating Fasolo's pressure game, recently it has been quite decent but Elliott has been relatively poor in that area since his first year. In regards to the players you mentioned, that's four out of forward line of six (seeing as you mentioned Cox/White which I assume means it's one out of the two), with the addition of Mayne as a defensive forward why should we sacrifice a player with the ability to score and with a high level of score involvements for another more defensive forward, and who replaces him?

Teams rarely play with 6 forwards - often it's only 4, with a couple of high half forwards (mids who occasionally get slightly ahead of the ball)

 

[PieBeast]

Actually no. Fas definitely surpassed my expectations last year. But in modern football a forward line of fas, Elliot, Moore, Cox/white simply won't cut it. 3 of them are great goal kickers, 2 of them may aswell not be mentioned. None of them will provide anything defensively.

As for the whole "leading goal kicker" that just proves how poor our forwards already are that a bloke who played 12 games can win it. And let's not forget Hawthorn traded it's best player for peanuts last year. No one on our list is untradeable except for Pendles, Moore, Treloar and Grundy for the right price.

lulz, wasn't hard to surpass your expectations given you had him pegged as struggling to get 5 touches a game.

And it would be sheer lunacy to trade someone as talented and potent up forward as Fas given our lack of depth in both departments.
Especially knowing that Darcy will need all the help he can get in the next couple of years, White' limited output and strong questions marks on Cox even making it.