The 457 visa debacle

[pazza]

If there is one issue that affects many people in Australia it is the 457 working visas.

For those who have them, they can work cheaply and comfortably.

For the many who don't, it makes the task of finding work much harder.

Across a number of industries, people cannot get jobs seemingly because of 457 working visas.

 

[Lebbo73]

If there is one issue that affects many people in Australia it is the 457 working visas.

For those who have them, they can work cheaply and comfortably.

For the many who don't, it makes the task of finding work much harder.

Across a number of industries, people cannot get jobs seemingly because of 457 working visas.

Since I don't know enough about 457's, I have some questions:
How are they paid or allowed to be paid lower than the minimum wage?
What about some jobs like fruit pickers where there is not enough workers?

 

[madmug]

Since I don't know enough about 457's, I have some questions:
How are they paid or allowed to be paid lower than the minimum wage?
What about some jobs like fruit pickers where there is not enough workers?

It aint rocket science to figure it out. Some business owners bully & threaten workers to say nothing & accept slave wage rates. The Gument dont care about such behavior. Its the unions who point all this out. You of course wouldn't see that. Its not front page on the LNP websites.

Their are not enough fruit pickers because the pay is often shyte (see above), the work is well away from where people live, transport & accommodation is shyte. Your silly mate Eric Abetz made a fool of himself trying to promote a fruitpicking led job recovery for Tasmania just last year. You really should keep up with such things, it was front page news, but off course you wouldnt see it because of the glare from the sun which shines out of the LNP arses in your opinion

Would you like to have a go at it? Just ring Eric the Idiot & I'm sure he'll find a strawberry patch for you to tackle.

 

[Lester Burnham]

It aint rocket science to figure it out. Some business owners bully & threaten workers to say nothing & accept slave wage rates. The Gument dont care about such behavior. Its the unions who point all this out. You of course wouldn't see that. Its not front page on the LNP websites.

Their are not enough fruit pickers because the pay is often shyte (see above), the work is well away from where people live, transport & accommodation is shyte. Your silly mate Eric Abetz made a fool of himself trying to promote a fruitpicking led job recovery for Tasmania just last year. You really should keep up with such things, it was front page news, but off course you wouldnt see it because of the glare from the sun which shines out of the LNP arses in your opinion

Would you like to have a go at it? Just ring Eric the Idiot & I'm sure he'll find a strawberry patch for you to tackle.

Fruit pickers are more likely to be on 417 working holiday visas and more likely to be exploited than 457 visa holders.

 

[Lebbo73]

It aint rocket science to figure it out. Some business owners bully & threaten workers to say nothing & accept slave wage rates. The Gument dont care about such behavior. Its the unions who point all this out. You of course wouldn't see that. Its not front page on the LNP websites.

Their are not enough fruit pickers because the pay is often shyte (see above), the work is well away from where people live, transport & accommodation is shyte. Your silly mate Eric Abetz made a fool of himself trying to promote a fruitpicking led job recovery for Tasmania just last year. You really should keep up with such things, it was front page news, but off course you wouldnt see it because of the glare from the sun which shines out of the LNP arses in your opinion

Would you like to have a go at it? Just ring Eric the Idiot & I'm sure he'll find a strawberry patch for you to tackle.

So you have no proof then that 457 visa's are abused. Btw, I am highly critical of the LNP for increasing taxes and proposing to increase spending. I hate how they plan to boost funding for working parents in regards to childcare. Why should taxpayers have to fund your pups Madmug?

 

[AM]

Those visas were supposedly introduced to hire people with skills we don't have here. They've turned into mechanisms used by the oligarchy to depress wages. Shameful!

 

[Xsess]

Mass immigration and the use of 457 visa's is the biggest sell out of Australians by vested interests and weak indictable politicians imaginable. So obviously against the interests of everyday working Australians and yet both sides of Australian politics bury the hatchet on this one crucial issue and go bipartisan - depriving people the opportunity to vote on the issue. Sack the f***king lot of them and start again I reckon.

 

[madmug]

So you have no proof then that 457 visa's are abused. Btw, I am highly critical of the LNP for increasing taxes and proposing to increase spending. I hate how they plan to boost funding for working parents in regards to childcare. Why should taxpayers have to fund your pups Madmug?

Are you a fruitcake? I never said they were. You asked how underpayments could happen. I answered you in relation to your fruit picking query. Read your own posts FFS.

They dont you goose, theirs been no pups in this kennel for the taxpayer to worry about for many years..

So what about yourself? How much do you suck out of the public purse?

 

[Lebbo73]

Are you a fruitcake? I never said they were. You asked how underpayments could happen. I answered you in relation to your fruit picking query. Read your own posts FFS.

They dont you goose, theirs been no pups in this kennel for the taxpayer to worry about for many years..

So what about yourself? How much do you suck out of the public purse?

My wife earns too much. No leeching here unlike yourself!

 

[madmug]

My wife earns too much. No leeching here unlike yourself!

So you're a Mr Mum then.

Anyway, apart from being an idiot, why do you insist on saying such shyte?

You dont know anything.

I work, I pay tax, I get no government assistance what so ever. So whats your bag? Apart from being vacuous.

If you are just a troll, you're bloody poor at it.

 

[Lester Burnham]

Those visas were supposedly introduced to hire people with skills we don't have here. They've turned into mechanisms used by the oligarchy to depress wages. Shameful!

Mass immigration and the use of 457 visa's is the biggest sell out of Australians by vested interests and weak indictable politicians imaginable. So obviously against the interests of everyday working Australians and yet both sides of Australian politics bury the hatchet on this one crucial issue and go bipartisan - depriving people the opportunity to vote on the issue. Sack the f***king lot of them and start again I reckon.

It's rare that we get agreement across the political divide. But what's to be done about it?

Every electorate would have significant youth unemployment. We can each go to our local MP and state our concerns about 457 and 417 visas - but what are some pertinent facts that we can present?

 

[midorigreenwood]

Those visas were supposedly introduced to hire people with skills we don't have here. They've turned into mechanisms used by the oligarchy to depress wages. Shameful!

Thats why the recent debate of "visa for cash" may have some merit.

I've argued in a different thread that to encourage employers to embrace more potential migrants from wartorn countries like Syria and Iraq, a tarriff could be placed on temporary workers from stable countries like Europe/South east asia etc. It takes into account the added cost of upskilling refugees to be job ready eg: language skills, accommodation. It'll also reduce the the incentive for employers to simply get some cheap and compliant foreign workers rather than training young australians.

This also ensures that the number of refugees we take are tied to job prospects which will improve long term integration into society.

At least the public purse will get some much needed revenue rather than fueling the boom for mickey mouse degrees and diplomas to gain residency and devaluing education as has happened in the past

 

[medusala]

If there is one issue that affects many people in Australia it is the 457 working visas.

Well done Pazz. One of the few union sorts who get it. Mass immigration is an absolute disaster for the working man

Your party sold you out to chase the ethnic vote, making the gamble you would never vote Liberal. You are nothing to them.

Those visas were supposedly introduced to hire people with skills we don't have here. They've turned into mechanisms used by the oligarchy to depress wages. Shameful!

Agreeing with AM. Might go down to Ladbrokes and put £100 on the pope apologising and resigning over paedo issues.

Stuff up, doubling that in to KP coming back for the 1st Ashes test.

 

[CM86]

My wife earns too much. No leeching here unlike yourself!

Are you rich, or poor?

I asked if you were rich, because I thought I remembered you saying that you were well off... But I'm sure you said that you were far from being rich...

Could you quash this, once and for all? What's the dealio?

 

[Lebbo73]

Are you rich, or poor?

I asked if you were rich, because I thought I remembered you saying that you were well off... But I'm sure you said that you were far from being rich...

Could you quash this, once and for all? What's the dealio?

Middle class.

 

[madmug]

Middle class.

What, a middle class lifter or a middle class leaner?

 

[Lebbo73]

What, a middle class lifter or a middle class leaner?

A leaner takes money off the govt. That is your job Madmug!

 

[madmug]

A leaner takes money off the govt. That is your job Madmug!

A leaner doesnt provide for him/herself. So that covers you, not me.

Two can play the troll game, its just you that has no point.

 

[pazza]

It's rare that we get agreement across the political divide. But what's to be done about it?

Every electorate would have significant youth unemployment. We can each go to our local MP and state our concerns about 457 and 417 visas - but what are some pertinent facts that we can present?

I look at the security industry.

Back when first started in the industry in 2005/2006, the minimum requirement was to have done a 2-3 week course in Security Operations, then to get character references etc, just to get your licence, let alone to work.

A decade on, those course are now done over 1-2 days, no character references and so on. And most of those who are getting positions now are those possessing working visas and basically working for a pittance (and on my observations, the standards of work practice have dropped dramatically).

As I now try to get back into the industry, my experience seemingly counts for not too much, as I would be considered by some as too expensive to hire...wtf?

This is also reflected in the attitude of some security companies on some prestigious worksites. Imagine having to work for a company having copped a $6000 per year paycut (keeping in mind the average security guard makes between $35000-$40000 a year) and when working on weekends it is a flat rate of $22 an hour (no shift penalties whatsoever).

 

[Lester Burnham]

I look at the security industry.

Back when first started in the industry in 2005/2006, the minimum requirement was to have done a 2-3 week course in Security Operations, then to get character references etc, just to get your licence, let alone to work.

A decade on, those course are now done over 1-2 days, no character references and so on. And most of those who are getting positions now are those possessing working visas and basically working for a pittance (and on my observations, the standards of work practice have dropped dramatically).

As I now try to get back into the industry, my experience seemingly counts for not too much, as I would be considered by some as too expensive to hire...wtf?

This is also reflected in the attitude of some security companies on some prestigious worksites. Imagine having to work for a company having copped a $6000 per year paycut (keeping in mind the average security guard makes between $35000-$40000 a year) and when working on weekends it is a flat rate of $22 an hour (no shift penalties whatsoever).

I work in Melbourne CBD. I see quite a lot of Chinese construction workers. Now allowed due to the free trade agreement and being paid peanuts while skilled Australian workers can't find jobs.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...n-right-of-entry/story-fnpebfcn-1227126256258

 

[Lebbo73]

I look at the security industry.

Back when first started in the industry in 2005/2006, the minimum requirement was to have done a 2-3 week course in Security Operations, then to get character references etc, just to get your licence, let alone to work.

A decade on, those course are now done over 1-2 days, no character references and so on. And most of those who are getting positions now are those possessing working visas and basically working for a pittance (and on my observations, the standards of work practice have dropped dramatically).

As I now try to get back into the industry, my experience seemingly counts for not too much, as I would be considered by some as too expensive to hire...wtf?

This is also reflected in the attitude of some security companies on some prestigious worksites. Imagine having to work for a company having copped a $6000 per year paycut (keeping in mind the average security guard makes between $35000-$40000 a year) and when working on weekends it is a flat rate of $22 an hour (no shift penalties whatsoever).

No wonder you guys are happy to let armed robbers and psychos do what they want. I wouldn't be risking my life for s**t pay like that!

 

[madmug]

No wonder you guys are happy to let armed robbers and psychos do what they want. I wouldn't be risking my life for s**t pay like that!

You dont have to, your missus looks after you. You told us that. Its only the lifters that have to work.

Its your nazi mate Eric the Idiot that supports this sort of shyte.

But you knew that, you voted for them & their American style policy of developing a working poor class.

That policy is being implemented so that fat arsed bitches that own our mining raw materials can earn even more & get even fatter.

I mean who can live on $19billion?

 

[Lebbo73]

A leaner doesnt provide for him/herself. So that covers you, not me.

Two can play the troll game, its just you that has no point.

I don't leech off the government. That is your job!

 

[Lebbo73]

You dont have to, your missus looks after you. You told us that. Its only the lifters that have to work.

Its your nazi mate Eric the Idiot that supports this sort of shyte.

But you knew that, you voted for them & their American style policy of developing a working poor class.

That policy is being implemented so that fat arsed bitches that own our mining raw materials can earn even more & get even fatter.

I mean who can live on $19billion?

Wrong again. I have a job and I save your tax dollars and my money as well by not milking the childcare industry dry.

 

[madmug]

Wrong again. I have a job and I save your tax dollars and my money as well by not milking the childcare industry dry.

I don't leech off the government. That is your job!

What are you on about?

ETOH abuse obviously

Actually its about that time. I'm going to pop into the New Sydney (Pale Ale on tap), then out to the Talbot for a night cap (same). Then up the frog & toad to home & watch the footy.

I have some Boags Wizard Smiths Ale in the fridge. Its like an English Brown Ale, a very good drop to try if you're down this way. My mate brings that XXXXgold shyte around, honestly how can people drink that crap? (cats piss)