Scape Goat The Age's article on Fremantle's official licence granting, 25 years ago this weekend

[stax on the mull]

Great thing about those derbies from that late 70's era were the classic wing battles. South had Vigona and Morley (who blitzed the Vics in the first ever State of Origin match) and East Fremantle had the silky skilled Rod Lester-Smith and blokes like Graham Kickett, Jez and Simms.
When one bloke was winning his wing battle the coaches would often switch the wingers to the opposite side and another battle would ensue.

 

[anchor man]

Hmmm... If you are who I think you are based on that info, then your niece has been mates with my sister for 40 years since they were in kindy together; your nephew and I won dance choreography competitions together when we were in primary school; and another nephew was once married to the sister of a former Freo assistant. Amirite?

Right on all counts.

Genuine question for anyone involved in Freo footy at the time: was that because Souths and Easts didn't want to work together? Or were both clubs frozen out by WAFC?

I think it was a bit of both.I know both clubs tried to work it out but couldn't get it right.But I am not sure that they were ever going to be allowed into the equation.
As most know, we were not wanted by the WAFL, WAFC,the AFL and the Eagles.
The AFL only allowed our licence to try to stop the dominance of the Eagles.We were given the same conditions and grants that the Eagles had been given, but when the Eagles won the flag in 1994, they halved our concessions.That was a killer.The WAFL was half as good in 1994 as as it was in 1986.The drain from the WAFL was enormous.
Both the Eagles and the WAFC saw the Dockers as taking money from the Golden Goose.
Our admin was second class to say the least.
I had a few run ins with some of the Fremantle football people, when they were stationed in Market street.I told them we were very very second rate in the way we approached the training.I saw a whole lot of the Eagles training while working at Subi.They were miles ahead of us in their attitude.We didn't learn from them.
I remember seeing a game at the WACA against Hawthorn. Greg Madigan had his guernsey torn the week before and had to have another made for the game.The red and green were on the wrong sides of the guernsey.I rang the club to tell them.They said it wouldn't be able to happen.I went in and told them, but they still would not believe it.But Madigan wore a new and proper guernsey next week.
One thing I am ever so proud of that our club has done, is that we have never once put our hand out for financial assistance from the AFL.Yet there is a club down the road who were between $12/15 mill in the red and bailed out by the State Government.Not sure if it has ever been repaid.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

Right on all counts.

I think it was a bit of both.I know both clubs tried to work it out but couldn't get it right.But I am not sure that they were ever going to be allowed into the equation.
As most know, we were not wanted by the WAFL, WAFC,the AFL and the Eagles.
The AFL only allowed our licence to try to stop the dominance of the Eagles.We were given the same conditions and grants that the Eagles had been given, but when the Eagles won the flag in 1994, they halved our concessions.That was a killer.The WAFL was half as good in 1994 as as it was in 1986.The drain from the WAFL was enormous.
Both the Eagles and the WAFC saw the Dockers as taking money from the Golden Goose.
Our admin was second class to say the least.
I had a few run ins with some of the Fremantle football people, when they were stationed in Market street.I told them we were very very second rate in the way we approached the training.I saw a whole lot of the Eagles training while working at Subi.They were miles ahead of us in their attitude.We didn't learn from them.
I remember seeing a game at the WACA against Hawthorn. Greg Madigan had his guernsey torn the week before and had to have another made for the game.The red and green were on the wrong sides of the guernsey.I rang the club to tell them.They said it wouldn't be able to happen.I went in and told them, but they still would not believe it.But Madigan wore a new and proper guernsey next week.
One thing I am ever so proud of that our club has done, is that we have never once put our hand out for financial assistance from the AFL.Yet there is a club down the road who were between $12/15 mill in the red and bailed out by the State Government.Not sure if it has ever been repaid.

They were bailed out by the WA Footy Commission and not the Government from my recollection.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

Great thing about those derbies from that late 70's era were the classic wing battles. South had Vigona and Morley (who blitzed the Vics in the first ever State of Origin match) and East Fremantle had the silky skilled Rod Lester-Smith and blokes like Graham Kickett, Jez and Simms.
When one bloke was winning his wing battle the coaches would often switch the wingers to the opposite side and another battle would ensue.

Tony Morley with his silky skills beat everyone that they could throw at him every time Soufs played the dead heads from Moss St.

 

[anchor man]

They were bailed out by the WA Footy Commission and not the Government from my recollection.

The Government was and still is the WAFC.It is a Government
organisation.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

The Government was and still is the WAFC.It is a Government
organisation.

Unless an organisation has to present an Annual Report to Parliament then it is not a Government Organisation from my recollection as a 43 year career Public Servant but I could well be wrong.

Why were the WAFC holding out for the $10M handout from Govt as before they had agreement the Weegs and the Dockers weren't going to play at Optus that's what held up the final signing of the stadium use agreements so just that example alone makes them non-government".

Further research from the WAFC website indicates that:

"The West Australian Football Commission (WAFC) is the caretaker of football throughout the State and is responsible for the overall development of the game.

The WAFC’s role includes ownership of the State’s two AFL teams – the West Coast Eagles and Fremantle Football Club, guiding the West Australian Football League (WAFL), overseeing community football, managing umpiring, and driving participation through game development and the talent pathway.

The WAFC is a not for profit sports association. It is incorporated under the Associations Incorporation Act and governed by a voluntary Board of Commissioners that oversees the operation of all football activities throughout the State. The WAFC features more than 100 employees spread across the State".

That is hardly a Government organisation but don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

 

[fnerd]

I was working at the function at the Passenger terminal when our guernsey was displayed for the first time.A great night.
Michael was, and still is the best footballer I have seen.He would be a sensation in the game today if he was playing.
Peake was an absolutely superb player for East Fremantle.Not as good as Michael but a bloody champion.
As far as Souths go, it was Michael then Rioli. But a sleeper there at the time was Benny Vigona.If Benny had the desire and hunger that TI and Maurice had , he would have been better than both.Benny was a real jet.
I saw many better than average players at Souths over the years, my brother included.He played 219 games for Souths.
The sad part about the forming of the Dockers was that there was no involvement from either club at the formation. Fremantle was the hub of football in WA,Fremantle oval was the home of WA football.There was so much history and culture at both Fremantle clubs to enforce the Fremantle tradition, but it was not taken.Instead we had hockey players running the club.Other than Ross Kelly, we had no actual football people at admin level.A very sad situation.

Yep ,so much this

 

[anchor man]

Unless an organisation has to present an Annual Report to Parliament then it is not a Government Organisation from my recollection as a 43 year career Public Servant but I could well be wrong.

Why were the WAFC holding out for the $10M handout from Govt as before they had agreement the Weegs and the Dockers weren't going to play at Optus that's what held up the final signing of the stadium use agreements so just that example alone makes them non-government".

Further research from the WAFC website indicates that:

"The West Australian Football Commission (WAFC) is the caretaker of football throughout the State and is responsible for the overall development of the game.

The WAFC’s role includes ownership of the State’s two AFL teams – the West Coast Eagles and Fremantle Football Club, guiding the West Australian Football League (WAFL), overseeing community football, managing umpiring, and driving participation through game development and the talent pathway.

The WAFC is a not for profit sports association. It is incorporated under the Associations Incorporation Act and governed by a voluntary Board of Commissioners that oversees the operation of all football activities throughout the State. The WAFC features more than 100 employees spread across the State".

That is hardly a Government organisation but don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

DTD, you may well be correct, but it was at that time that football in genearl all round Australia was going bad.As I said the Eagles were $12/15 mil in the red.Almost all our WAFL sides were bankrupt.The AFL was playing with at least seven teams basically trading insolvently.
The WA Government at the time stepped in to form the WaFC, to run football in WA.It was and as far as I know, still funded by the Government.
I will accept it if I am wrong though.

 

[Purpletown]

Right on all counts.

I think it was a bit of both.I know both clubs tried to work it out but couldn't get it right.But I am not sure that they were ever going to be allowed into the equation.
As most know, we were not wanted by the WAFL, WAFC,the AFL and the Eagles.
The AFL only allowed our licence to try to stop the dominance of the Eagles.We were given the same conditions and grants that the Eagles had been given, but when the Eagles won the flag in 1994, they halved our concessions.That was a killer.The WAFL was half as good in 1994 as as it was in 1986.The drain from the WAFL was enormous.
Both the Eagles and the WAFC saw the Dockers as taking money from the Golden Goose.
Our admin was second class to say the least.
I had a few run ins with some of the Fremantle football people, when they were stationed in Market street.I told them we were very very second rate in the way we approached the training.I saw a whole lot of the Eagles training while working at Subi.They were miles ahead of us in their attitude.We didn't learn from them.
I remember seeing a game at the WACA against Hawthorn. Greg Madigan had his guernsey torn the week before and had to have another made for the game.The red and green were on the wrong sides of the guernsey.I rang the club to tell them.They said it wouldn't be able to happen.I went in and told them, but they still would not believe it.But Madigan wore a new and proper guernsey next week.
One thing I am ever so proud of that our club has done, is that we have never once put our hand out for financial assistance from the AFL.Yet there is a club down the road who were between $12/15 mill in the red and bailed out by the State Government.Not sure if it has ever been repaid.

Well put anchor man.

I 100% agree with your assessment of our inaugural administration as from my first hand experience it was very amatuer to say the least. I was a member of the first Harbour Master committee and when we asked for a list of Harbour Masters we were told there was no records as such, just a box with some receipts but definitely not from all who had joined as it turned out.

June McDonald was Secretary of the committee and spent months of her own time trying to sort out the mess and to her credit managed to do a wonderful job.

David Hatt was the CEO and Freo had no chance while he was there.

FFC should be very proud of the club they have been able to build on the poor deal they received and the early unprofessional administration.

 

[arsesmart]

Didn't Easts and Souths bandy together to put forward a proposal to join the VFL in 1986, only to be blocked by the WC's exclusivity veto clause they had on WA, which expired in 1994 or thereabouts?

When the AFL finally could grant a licence without the WC's veto, the WAFC stepped in and kept the two clubs out of the driver's seat in setting-up the Freo side (all the while trying to dilute the Freo-ness as much as possible).

 

[Silent Alarm]

Didn't Easts and Souths bandy together to put forward a proposal to join the VFL in 1986, only to be blocked by the WC's exclusivity veto clause they had on WA, which expired in 1994 or thereabouts?

When the AFL finally could grant a licence without the WC's veto, the WAFC stepped in and kept the two clubs out of the driver's seat in setting-up the Freo side (all the while trying to dilute the Freo-ness as much as possible).

The only source for this is a Herald or Sun article (re: a Melbourne paper) in 1986 but it's not online anymore. Just a few references now that stem from a wiki article: Fremantle Sharks playing at Freo Oval.

East Perth pushed in the 80s.

But the big one was Norwood. They pressed the VFL once every three or four years. Port of course got jealous and put their own proposal in toward the 90s. 'Port Adelaide Crows' was the name. Sounds enough to get a Poort fan in a tiff these days but that was the proposal – the provincial Port Adelaide Magpies representing the state of South Australia and adopting its own emblem, the Crow. Kind of a smart nickname.

It's sort of interesting WA never had a club step up but it's mostly because there's no bonafide biggest club. Or second biggest. In South Australia, one side won the most flags and had the most supporters. In WA, it was a lot more even. East and West Perth and then Souths and Old Easts were the big four with Swans pretty popular and with some good eras too. Perth, Subi, and Claremont were shitkickers with a lot lot less fans and nowhere near as many premierships.

 

[its free real estate]

Lmao, doubts about that green jumper since the beginning.

 

[its free real estate]

Brian Peake was the Leigh Matthews of the west IMO.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Brian Peake was the Leigh Matthews of the west IMO.

He's not a pest who puts his beak in everything, talks in complete riddles, and as far as I know he never smacked a bloke who didn't see it coming and somehow still won't apologise.

I'm South Fremantle but don't disrespect Peaky!

 

[sjohnson]

I feel like a big opportunity was missed to capitalise on the history of Souths and Easts and establish the FFC as a club with an (indirect) rich history - could have been a bit like what Port have done, depending whether you believe they're the same club as the Magpies. As someone said earlier, this was probably the fault of the WAFC; I also read somewhere earlier this year that the club was to look to American sport for branding inspiration, although this may not be completely true.

 

[Silent Alarm]

I feel like a big opportunity was missed to capitalise on the history of Souths and Easts and establish the FFC as a club with an (indirect) rich history - could have been a bit like what Port have done, depending whether you believe they're the same club as the Magpies. As someone said earlier, this was probably the fault of the WAFC; I also read somewhere earlier this year that the club was to look to American sport for branding inspiration, although this may not be completely true.

It was definitely the start of the marketing 'guru' era for football.

The first inkling was 'West Coast' but you had the Perth Football Club so what could you do? Yellow and blue looks like s**t but they're basic colours. The Crows wrote themselves. But us with the anchor, the emphasis on nickname, the non-animal mascot... purple was chosen because it was apparently the next big thing in US sport and the Lakers had become a huge name. People'll say it's a binding of Souths and Old Easts but that's a lucky coincidence. I'd love to know their rationale for red, white, and green but the port and starboard thing – well it sounds nifty, so too does the Italian thing – but the Adobe brain's trust didn't do it on purpose.

At least we escaped without teal... that was becoming big in America. Awful.

In a way, our branding and shitty song really summarised our ****ed up entry to the league.

I think purple is a cool colour and the modern jumper is a corker (the OG green away, or our proper first ever jumper, is loved by all though) but yeah, it's tough to take. Fremantle is a tough town built on resilience and shutting up and doing it (well it was...) and we had two massive clubs: one very successful with a heap of fans and one the most successful with a fair amount of fans. The fact couldn't bind that is insane. Those clubs were tough and feared and a combined effort would have been a shock, shaken the VFL up.

Combine the colour and be purple, be the Fremantle Football Club with no nickname (we're the only club with our proper name on a scarf – 'Freo' is as good as 'Pies' or 'Tiges'). The song should have been the Bulldogs one as it was never used by a VFL side (I still think we should've used the main chorus for a brand new song – 'with three Vees, which stands for vic-tor-ee'). And we should have petitioned hard and harder to play a few games at Fremantle Oval. Imagine if we had a ground of 25,000 for GWS and Port games? Unreal...

 

[dropbear101]

Purple is also the colour of royalty.

 

[wild side]

Brian Peake used to drop in when surfing with him.
Gerard Neesham was looking to fight you at the pool comp!
South boys much better behaved, unless aggrieved!! Long live Basil Campbell

 

[masai]

Brian Peake used to drop in when surfing with him.
Gerard Neesham was looking to fight you at the pool comp!
South boys much better behaved, unless aggrieved!! Long live Basil Campbell

Basil was ok, until someone called him “ helmet head “.

 

[Spirit Level]

Looking back, "sharks" probably would've been a better nickname

 

[anchor man]

Silent alarm, I think that the Eagles had by the time the Dockers came into the AFL, most South and East Fremantle supporters had thrown their hat into the ring for the Yellas.So many players from both clubs were playing for them.
But we did miss the boat by not using the Fremantle heritage when the club was born.So much history went down the drain.Had the two WAFL clubs been able to have some involvment, maybe the name could have been "Bullsharks".

 

[salim malik]

Silent alarm, I think that the Eagles had by the time the Dockers came into the AFL, most South and East Fremantle supporters had thrown their hat into the ring for the Yellas.So many players from both clubs were playing for them.
But we did miss the boat by not using the Fremantle heritage when the club was born.So much history went down the drain.Had the two WAFL clubs been able to have some involvment, maybe the name could have been "Bullsharks".

South and East could not come to any sort of agreement, Easts were pee,ed of that Freo oval was prefered to Moss st even though Moss st was a dump. There was know way the 2 clubs were going to work together.

 

[anchor man]

DTD, you may well be correct, but it was at that time that football in genearl all round Australia was going bad.As I said the Eagles were $12/15 mil in the red.Almost all our WAFL sides were bankrupt.The AFL was playing with at least seven teams basically trading insolvently.
The WA Government at the time stepped in to form the WaFC, to run football in WA.It was and as far as I know, still funded by the Government.
I will accept it if I am wrong though.

DTD, I spoke to the only real sports journalist in WA ,he said that it is not a Government run organisation.But I was correct in saying the Government helped set up the WAFC.

 

[basashi]

Unless an organisation has to present an Annual Report to Parliament then it is not a Government Organisation from my recollection as a 43 year career Public Servant but I could well be wrong.

Why were the WAFC holding out for the $10M handout from Govt as before they had agreement the Weegs and the Dockers weren't going to play at Optus that's what held up the final signing of the stadium use agreements so just that example alone makes them non-government".

Further research from the WAFC website indicates that:

"The West Australian Football Commission (WAFC) is the caretaker of football throughout the State and is responsible for the overall development of the game.

The WAFC’s role includes ownership of the State’s two AFL teams – the West Coast Eagles and Fremantle Football Club, guiding the West Australian Football League (WAFL), overseeing community football, managing umpiring, and driving participation through game development and the talent pathway.

The WAFC is a not for profit sports association. It is incorporated under the Associations Incorporation Act and governed by a voluntary Board of Commissioners that oversees the operation of all football activities throughout the State. The WAFC features more than 100 employees spread across the State".

That is hardly a Government organisation but don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

are you a baseball fan?

 

[imperial_oz]

The 1979 Grand Final between South and East Freo had 52,781 spectators.

It actually had more than that. The 52,781 was the official figure but I was working Main Gate and we had people come in who weren't part of the count.

Part of the cyclone wire fence was torn down because the ground was closed around an hour before the game and a lot of people had travelled in from the country and couldn't get. Some we were able to sneak in and some helped themselves, so to speak. We had a father and son who had driven down from Canarvon and couldn't get a ticket, so we slipped them up to the 3 Tier Stand where they had to keep moving because there were no seats but they got to see the game.

I'm really not sure exactly how many extra 'got in' but there were quite a few from memory