The Big Footy Liverpool Army Part 2

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bus24

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...

MEETING WITH GEORGE GILLETT


THE ACADEMY


26 SEPTEMBER 2009




As I dint think one half of our custodianship would invite me in for a talk please understand I went into the meeting with nothing prepared.


The discussion started about the current financial situation that the club is reportedly in and I started off by asking GG about what happened to the £60m borrowed from the bank as working capital and reported to get the construction on the new stadium started GG said he wasn’t aware of any £60m that had been reported.


GG} "If we tried to correct all the mistakes that had been printed we’d have a full time job doing it".


MC} "So there wasn’t £60m borrowed as a start up fund?"


GG} "I think what we did was paid it down".


I repeated the question.


GG} "I don’t think so I can’t recall it. The only money we have been involved in, we certainly haven’t

Seen any money let’s put it that way".


I was then asked by GG to "try and take my attitude out of the questions".


GG} "When we bought the club we bought it with our own money" "CASH"

MC} "Your saying you bought the club with your own money".

GG} "When a year and a half later the credit crunch, we each put our portion of the club and refinanced

the business.

"Today the club has the lowest debt to each dollar of profit of any of the major clubs in the sport".


GG} "The club is in extraordinarily good condition, far better than Man U, Arsenal or Chelsea".

MC} "When you and Tom bought the club from Moores, how much debt was it in ".

GG} "The club had" (He then paused)

MC} "£40m"

GG} "Between 40 and £80m but it had no earnings"

GG} "Don’t you think we have invested massively" and said they had "put more money in other than

City".

MC } "I would like to know where the money came from"

GG} "The vast majority of it came from Tom and mine, our personal cash, not from the club or anything

it came from us.

MC} "How much debt is the club in now"

GG} "That’s not the question the question is how the debt is relative to the earnings. The debt on the club today is very sound".

MC} "That’s not how the fans see it"

GG } "That’s bullshit the way the media writes it, they don’t understand how to write about cash flow and profit and loss"

MC } "Why don’t you make a public statement instead of us being drip fed information by the media as the media is often unreliable and like to sensationalise things. Why don’t the two of you make a public statement and explain where the club is at".

GG} "That’s a good idea".

MC} "We are being drip fed information".

GG} "Not by me I try to support our manager and let him have the freedom to spend it his way wisely, to do with scouting to go get the best young men available. That’s what we try to do I don’t get into strategy or individual players"


MC} "At the minute the earnings might be three because we have the fan base"

GG} "Our budgets are based on the last six years earnings of the club. We don’t put it on going to the finals or anything of that sort. The budgets are done conservatively".

MC} "A lot of it is based on champions league football".

GG} "It is based on a relatively limited success in the CL"

MC} "What if we went two or three seasons without CL football what would happen to the debt related to the clubs earnings".

GG} "The debt wouldn’t go up we have enough cash flow to pay the minimum interest that we have which is not very high and enough to give to Rafa to be competitive".

MC} "That where we are at loggerheads with your idea of capital for Rafa and ours".

GG} "Arsenal by law can’t spend as much per year as we spend. Man U can’t out spend us. Based on UTD and Arsenal do you think we under spend".

MC} "Looking at this years transfers yes. What happened to the £30m from the Xabi Alonso sale"?

GG} "We put that back in, we didn’t take it out, we didn’t do like Man U did. They took all the money they got from player sales and they owed so much money they had to use it to pay down the debt. We didn’t do that. In keeping with the history of the club we have invested more money than our competitors, which should mean it should be getting better. If its not getting better it’s not because of Gillett and Hicks, it’s the manager it the scouting and so forth. So make sure you guys balance out your analysis.

MC} "Us as Liverpool fans were use to seeing a policy of money recouped on player sales being reinvested back into the squad".

GG} Rafa had the money from Xabi plus another £22-£23m and all the money that came plus the money budgeted was made available to Rafa".


GG denied that there was a £20m price cap for player signings and said


GG} "Rafa had more than was in the budget and the money from the sales. Hicks and I didn’t take any money out or use it to pay down debt.


We then talked about the stadium and the sixty day quote. GG denied it was him who made the spades in the ground in sixty days quote and went on to say.


GG} "Any comments on the stadium came from hicks. I think what happened was Hicks was absolutely convinced that we were going to start to move dirt to make for the foundations. In the period of time between Hicks saying that and the sixty day , the entire world credit market fell apart and I believe that he ended up with big egg on his face, making it look like he’d said something and then not living up to what he’d said and that was a mistake on his part".

MC} "It’s our belief that one of the main selling issues for David Moores was that you were going to build a stadium. We should be on a par with Barca and Real Madrid. All the 2005 CL success had not been built o

GG } "Do you think GG doesn’t want to build a stadium".

MC } "It wouldn’t be the first time that Tom Hicks has been involved with a football club, promised them a new stadium and it never happened".

George Gillett pauses.

MC } "Corinthians"


I reminded GG again about Tom Hicks past dealings with Corinthians.


GG} "Michael that’s not George Gillett. I own 50% of the club and nothing is going to happen to the club good or bad that ultimately Tom or I don’t take credit for".


GG then asked me.


GG} "Did I believe after our conversation if I thought he wouldn’t love to build a new stadium"


MC } "I’m curious as to why with the wealth that you and Hicks have got they cant come together and start to build the stadium out of their own capital".

GG } "That’s a totally different issue and I’m not going to go there"

MC} "Why not build the stadium with your own money and get it back from the extra money it generates".

GG} "What’s symbolic about the stadium".

MC} "We need the new stadium George, we are falling behind


George losses his temper and raises his voice.

GG} "We are not falling behind that’s horseshit. If we could figure out how to build a stadium I would have done it yesterday".

MC} "I’ve just told you how you can do it. You and Hicks could use your own capital"

GG} "Michael that’s not what we’re going to do".

MC} "Why".

GG} "Because that’s not the way smart investment occurs".

MC} "Well why not, you have the money why not do it".

GG } "Abramavic he didn’t use his own money he used borrowed money".


MC} "Your saying that Abramovic didn’t use his own money to buy Chelsea and bankroll the squad".

GG } "There’s a difference between lateral wealth and personal wealth".

MC } "Where did he get the money from then".

GG } "From his banks in Russia".


I then asked GG about his and Hicks reported and what seemed frivolous expenses claims and used the reported £1m as a ballpark figure.


GG} "We don’t charge or take salaries from the club. We charge the club for our travel expenses for our travel expenses and our legal fees"

GG seemed surprised at the amounts of money that had been reported.


MC} "Surely you must have a press officer who reports back to you what is being said about you in the British press".

GG} "What’s being reported about me".

MC} "About your expenses claims".

GG} "All expenses was for legitimate reasons, legal people, auditors etc. Hicks put his bill directly through the club. I ran mine through my own accountant, used my own money and I was reimbursed for legal and accounting fees. There was no money taken by me. I have never taken a cent from this club, I get no salaries no compensation, the money that I got reimbursed was money that I paid out because of the way we do it is actually for the benefit of the club. The club didn’t reimburse me for over a year after I ran up the expenses, and then a year later reimbursed me for the expenses. That’s for the benefit of the club not for the detriment of it.

MC] "Its all about what’s believable George and the facts are.

GG} "The one fact that you’ve levelled at me today was that, Tom Hicks promised a spade in the ground in sixty days and it hasn’t happened. It’s the one fact that you’ve laid out. The free cash flow the amount of money reinvested in the players, every one of the other facts that you’ve raised that primarily came from the media was wrong".

MC} "I suggest to you George that you keep a closer eye on what’s being reported in the British media and rather than a wall of silence, respond to things because we are being drip fed information, rumour and Chinese whispers. Whether you decide to act upon that is totally up to yourself but, us as Liverpool supporters do not see the club moving in the right direction".


Frank McParland enters the room


GG} "Michael is involved with a group called SOS. This has been a dumping on me of vitriol of hatred of suspicion of calling me a liar on half dozen different comments. The one I plead guilty to is that I have a partner who promised put a spade in the ground in sixty days in the midst of the credit market and the stadium hasn’t and the stadium hasn’t been built. That’s the one thing, there’s no way I can deny that. That was said and it was fact, but with regard to the rest of the things, he and his group have gotten very angry at Tom and I because of things reported in the media that were inaccurate. For example he was just charging me that I had taken money out the club. The fact is that I take nothing out the club other than being reimbursed for accounting fees.




MC} I don’t think I charged you with taking money out the club".

I repeated to FMc the issue about the concerns about the money from the sale of Xabi Alonso and that the money recouped from his sale went towards paying off debt.


GG} "The only pay down came from Hicks and I pocket. We put £128m in the last eighteen months to buy players on top of the money that came from the club not. The reason I'm upset is that he (mc) just said I have no more confidence and fundamentally I don’t believe you and all I can do is tell him the facts and he’s recommended I think correctly that there’s no wall of silence that the information is being drip fed to the media and we should make the facts more available".

FMc "One thing about SOS is that their mad passionate Liverpool supporters like we all are and they’ll always speak from the heart and if they know the situation and you tell them the situation they’ll take that on and I know that. Its all about us isn’t it".

MC} "It’s about LFC George. When you quote Chelsea, Man U and Arsenal, as I said the only time I worry about them is when we are playing them, as clubs the can crash and burn I’m worried about LFC"

GG} "We are putting more money in than they are and we are not getting credit for it from SOS because all they care about is Liverpool. On the other hand the same media they quote are criticising us for not being competitive with the other teams.


Frank McParland went on to say that he was 100% behind Rafa and that every time he’d asked for something for the academy it had been provided and he and GG used the AstroTurf pitch as an example.


MC} "The academy and Melwood is fine we are worried Anfield and the progression of the club on the basis that the club progresses from the success of the first team onwards. So as a group and as Liverpool supporters that’s what we are worried about.


I repeated to FMc that one of the biggest selling factors of the club from DM to H+G was the stadium.

MC} "A lot of this is based around the stadium. I personally and not speaking for SOS believe that personally that could move this situation forward is if we seen progress on the stadium and we seen a way forward and lets start competing with Barca and Madrid. The stadium is one of the biggest issues George".

GG}"Let’s focus on one set of challenges. When I was in Spain the other day to try and understand the economics of those clubs. The way they survive is that every five years the government writes off their debt. They’ve spent crazily this is now the third cycle of what’s happening. That’s not going to happen here and its not going to happen to any other EPL".

As time was running short I ended the meeting by saying.


MC} "At the minute we have people from around the globe banging on the doors to watch Liverpool. If the club had a sustained run of poor results and went without success that the glory hunters would soon go and the support the next successful club and that that G+H would be glad of the bread and butter supporters like my self and SOS.


I have done my best to relate all of what was said between my self and George Gillett. If I have missed anything out it is because I have either forgotten or it was just things that have already been said.
 

BlueBen

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""Today the club has the lowest debt to each dollar of profit of any of the major clubs in the sport".


GG} "The club is in extraordinarily good condition, far better than Man U, Arsenal or Chelsea"."

Can somebody with knowledge of finance/economics please explain what it means, in practical terms, that we apparently have the "lowest debt to each dollar of profit"? It sounds impressive when it is written like that...
 
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G & H certainly didn't provide financial support to Benitez in the last transfer window.

The money spent on Johnson, Aquilani, the Greek bloke, came entirely from sales. Mainly from Alonso, our best player last season.
 

folester41

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they talk absolute shit, particurlaly that wanker george, they never answer a question directly and they keep going on about how our finances are in great shape. if they were we would have added more quality players, if rafa had the money he would spend it, he is not stupid like wenger thinking he needs to make beautfiul players, rafa knows its all about results.

we had the same amount out in sales as we did in, plus we had the money from selling robbie keane back to spurs, and the money paid for aquilani was installments. if these yanks cared a flying F about the club they would put their hand up their ass and pull a bit of money out and put it into the club. even if the stadium isnt built just yet, atleast give rafa the money to have a squad that can win the league, not be competitive. before we know it gerrard will be retired, torres will head back to spain and other talented players will be looking elsewhere because they are not winning medals and trophies at liverpool, its as simple as that.
 

Dagger5

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GG has gone out and blamed Rafa for our poor form in the press. This won't go down too well I feel.

Also it looks like the Aquaman is ready to start playing after the international break, probably will be a reserves game followed by a substitute appearance against Lyon.
 

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jod23

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Thread starter #7,665
Ha! :D

Dude, you really have to get over your love for Carragher.

He is GONE - and he is costing us points! If he was a horse he would've been taken out the back of Melwood and shot by now.
I agree he has had a poor start to the season and if Agger is fit, Carra should be dropped to the bench but i dont think he is gone. He was pretty good against Chelsea. Masch cost us the first goal but I dont directly blame Masch as he was trying to get forward and create because without Alonso we cant create anything through midfield.

The second goal didnt matter because we were beat anyways, Drogba may have outmuscled him but Drogba is one of the best in the world so what can ya do.

I do want Agger back though.
 

TorresIsGod

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To be honest, Carra should not even be playing ahead of the Greek.

He's been utterly disgusting so far this season, I'd almost give anything for Sami back :(
 

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SoS' response to the Gillette interview.

Nicked off their site:

George Gillett - We don't believe you!

Tue 06 Oct 2009



George Gillett. A billionaire (apparently). Fifty percent owner of Liverpool Football Club. A man who never has and never will understand what Liverpool Football Club is all about, no matter how much he has or hasn't got sitting in the bank. His recent impromptu meeting with a Spirit Of Shankly member prior to the Hull City game, further underlines, just how much he doesn't get it, and how out of touch he is. Whilst fans keep themselves updated with the on going turmoil behind the scenes, Gillett thinks fans are oblivious to all he and his partner Tom Hicks have done, and are gullible to believe his words. In his recent meeting, as is usual for George Gillett, he made a number of claims which simply aren't true, managed to contradict himself in the same meeting, and with what appears to be his favourite past-time, undermined the position of manager at Liverpool Football Club. Here are some of the things he had to say:
Debt on the club
George Gillett: “The club had £40-80m debt when we bought it, but no earnings." “The debt on the club today is very sound".


The auditors of LFC's accounts have a different opinion: “These conditions, along with other matters explained in note 1 to the financial statements, indicate the existence of a material uncertainty which may cast significant doubt on the Group's and parent company's ability to continue as a going concern. The financial statements do not include the adjustments that would result if the Group and parent company were unable to continue as a going concern." http://www.spiritofshankly.com/news/SOS-and-LFC-Accounts.html


Christian Purslow recently told us that the debt stands at £245 million. £40 million to £245 million in the space of less than 3 years. Doesn't sound very sound to me George. http://www.spiritofshankly.com/news/Christian-Purslow-Meeting-Minutes.html
Stadium
George Gillett: “Whether you see the value is a different issue. Where have we lied? Where’s the lie, for Christ’s sake? In those 60 days, what happened to the world? I didn’t say that. Hicks was the one who said. 60 days? Bulls**t. That was not me. It’s wrong. I have never talked about that. I think that what happened was that Hicks was convinced we were going to start to move dirt on the foundations within a 60-day period. In the period of time, the world credit market collapsed and he had big egg on his face, not living up to what we said. I don’t talk about absolute dates when we’re talking about credit markets.”

No George. Tom didn't say it. You did. Look
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMyKZjxmjQE

George Gillett claims the credit crunch happened in the 60 days from buying the club. He then goes onto claim “When we bought the club it was with our own money. Cash. A year and a half later, when the credit crisis hit we each put our portion of the club up as collateral for a loan to go into the club and refinance the business.”

So when did the credit crunch start George, within 60 days or a year and a half later?


When talking about paying for a stadium, Gillett said the following “You want a bigger stadium and if we could figure how to do it I would have done it yesterday. Not going to use our own capital because that is not the way a smart investment occurs for this club.” He said the following back in January 2009 "He claimed they had spent £100m on the stadium so far and were still working with designers, architects and planners.
"I asked why they were spending the club's money on this and he claimed it was coming from himself and Tom Hicks and not the club.”
http://www.spiritofshankly.com/news/SOS-Meeting-and-Action-_-Sunday-1st-February-2009.html


Expenses

When quizzed about his expenses, George Gillett claimed "The money taken out is for the benefit of the club, not the detriment.” Obviously the £1.327 million claimed by Gillett has benefitted us greatly. Or more likely, paid for his travel, his security, his expenses, his bills for buying the club. http://www.spiritofshankly.com/documents/gillett_hicks_out_leaflet.pdf


Transfers


George Gillett :“We have put £128 million in to buy players on top of what’s come in in the last 18 months.”


Using figures from LFChistory.net, LFC have spent approximately £100 million on transfers in the past 18 months. From player sales, they have recouped approximately £80 million. A net spend of around £20 million. Where's the other £100 million George?

You were right about 2 things in the meeting though. We don't like you. And we certainly don't trust you.

You're not welcome here. So do us all a favour - sell the club and don't come back.

YANK LIAR$ OUT
 

Clown Prince

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He is clearly a filthy lying ____ this bloke & I am not convinced Hicks is much better. Some people don't agree with the way SoS goes about things, but at least they are being a bit proactive and getting up these two ____'s noses.

I don't know if being bought out by some random arab billionaire is the answer either, but this great club deserve better than these two ____ .




You fill in your own blanks.
 

archiemoses

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""Today the club has the lowest debt to each dollar of profit of any of the major clubs in the sport".


GG} "The club is in extraordinarily good condition, far better than Man U, Arsenal or Chelsea"."

Can somebody with knowledge of finance/economics please explain what it means, in practical terms, that we apparently have the "lowest debt to each dollar of profit"? It sounds impressive when it is written like that...
Well Total Debt divided by Total Profit. It would be fairly high because liverpool turned a decent profit and debt is much lower than Chelsea, Arsenal or Man United.

So for every $1 of debt each club has, liverpool earns more profit per $1 than any other club.

The ratio just shows we are in better shape than the other 3 clubs....financially.. but because of that we are struggling with the others due to us having to play lucas and reira and having no depth in the squad.

And it ruddy annoys me when he says he has splashed $127m on players in the last 3 years. But like the article says we sold players worth $80m. Net spend is fck all. Man City spent net $300m in one transfer period.
 

archiemoses

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He is clearly a filthy lying ____ this bloke & I am not convinced Hicks is much better. Some people don't agree with the way SoS goes about things, but at least they are being a bit proactive and getting up these two ____'s noses.

I don't know if being bought out by some random arab billionaire is the answer either, but this great club deserve better than these two ____ .




You fill in your own blanks.
Nice work with the article. Fact is money talks and to remain competitive you need to spend the $$.

I would much prefer an arab billionaire to take over provided he will put the cash for transfers.

This was released september 29 2009

"Insiders at Anfield have dismissed reports that a Saudi Arabian Prince is set to complete a deal for a majority share of Liverpool FC.

Prince Faisal bin Fahd bin Abdullah bin al-Saud was pictured alongside current Reds' co-owner George Gillett in the directors box on Saturday during the Reds' 6-1 defeat of Hull City amidst reports that he was set to buy a stake in the club.

This morning, the Saudi Prince revealed that he is eyeing a 50% stronghold at the club, currently owned by Gillett and fellow American Tom Hicks, and is prepared to pay up to £350 million to push secure a deal.

"We are currently seeking to buy 50% of the shares in the club which is now suffering with debts worth £245 million," he reportedly told a Saudi newspaper.

"The transaction, upon which a decision is close to be reached, will be worth 200 to 350 million pounds."

However sources close to the club have refuted the claims, insisting that the Prince's visit was arranged solely to discuss setting up club-affiliated youth academies in the Middle East."

Would be nice..
 

TorresIsGod

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The latest on the Aquaman. It's all good and well, but when you get down the bottom...

'He's not kicking a football yet'... :thumbsu:

How awesome is that, he's doing everything else with the team... except kicking a ball...

Rafa Benitez has revealed how Alberto Aquilani is edging ever closer to making his Liverpool debut.

The Italian international has not figured for the Reds since completing a transfer from AS Roma in August due to an ankle injury, but the 25-year-old began light training at Melwood last month.

Benitez is delighted with the progress Aquilani has made in his recovery - though the manager admits he will err on the side of caution with the fitness of Anfield's new No.4.

"I have been speaking to the doctors and things are going well with him," said the Reds boss.

"Alberto is progressing all the time. It could be two to three weeks before he is back.

"But we need to use caution. If it is two weeks everyone will say 'that is fantastic' but if it is three, everyone will say it is not a problem. I think that we have to be careful.

"We will take it one step at a time and we have the international break to look forward to now. That will be good for him, as he will have some more time (to recover without missing any games)."

Benitez added: "He is running and swimming - I think he will have the record in the swimming pool by the end of his programme - and he is working in the gym.

"He is doing almost everything and he is doing some things with the team. The only thing he is not doing is kicking a ball - not yet anyway."
 

archiemoses

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They say Aquaman will be ready to go end of October. But surely he will need a few games in the reserves to get match fit?

And they won't rush him. I wouldn't be suprised if we don't see him until mid November. That's 6 more weeks of Lucas Leiva wasting space on the pitch.
 

TorresIsGod

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Well, it's the 8th of October in England right now, he's been doing some light training and swimming, he's running... but he cant kick a ball yet... so, not sure how he could be ready to go in anything less than 3 or 4 weeks at least.

By this time in November I reckon he could a go-er after a game in the reserves or two.
 
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Well, it's the 8th of October in England right now, he's been doing some light training and swimming, he's running... but he cant kick a ball yet... so, not sure how he could be ready to go in anything less than 3 or 4 weeks at least.

By this time in November I reckon he could a go-er after a game in the reserves or two.
Once again illustrating the folly of selling our best midfielder (and probably best player, full stop) of the previous season and then buying an injured replacement.

If the estimated return is early November, then we're talking 3 months into the season.

As much as we despise the two Septics, Benitez has sure made some dumb decisions as well.
 
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