The BIG Question Marks - What needs to go right to win The 2019 Cup...

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Thread starter #51
**** oath we went close in 2015. Only taking ladder position in to consideration really is deer with no eyes stuff.
We were good that year and were hitting our straps going in to Crows game. We bottled it somehow and the rest is history.
I think where 2014/15 is relevant is that your view on where the team is at would slot comfortably in to WB BF threads circa Nov 2014 without anyone batting an eyelid.
I suppose the strange thing for me is your post suggests we’re years away from even contending.
Were you just adding some sugar or do actually think this team is that far away ?

Edit: delayed post as your reply slipped through to the keeper.
Yep, 2015, if Lachie Hunter's handball didn't fly over Crameri's head, we would have been into week 2 of finals and then just like 2016, belief and momentum may have carried us anywhere.

Every year, have hope and positivity, as you are always a shot.
 

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the dog's kennel

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#52
Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight! Kick straight!

(Have I made my point?)
 

JJHunter

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#53
**** oath we went close in 2015. Only taking ladder position in to consideration really is deer with no eyes stuff.
We were good that year and were hitting our straps going in to Crows game. We bottled it somehow and the rest is history.
I think where 2014/15 is relevant is that your view on where the team is at would slot comfortably in to WB BF threads circa Nov 2014 without anyone batting an eyelid.
I suppose the strange thing for me is your post suggests we’re years away from even contending.
Were you just adding some sugar or do actually think this team is that far away ?

Edit: delayed post as your reply slipped through to the keeper.
We were four finals wins away from a flag in 2015. Let’s not pretend that is close.

Our crows prelims in the 90s we were close but not in 2015. And as for being devastated that we felt we should have beaten the crows in 2015 there would be 6 other finalists thinking the same thing about closeness to a flag.

With respect to those ultra positive one eyed dogs out there I think we are very far away from a flag in 2019. As I’ve suggested my main reasoning in the number of clubs we need to leap frog to even get to top 4.
I say top 4 as history as shown its extremely rare to do it outside top four.
Yeh ok we did it in 2016 but there is a reason why we have been only ones to do it a cause it’s bloody tough.

Tigers have lynch who can make them better - yeh their depth may be tested this year but if your looking at them through the same one eyed goggles are fans are in here they would be very positive about top 4.

The pies have strengthened an already very strong midfield with beams and get another hear into Stephenson and Cox who were essentially learning their roles throughout 2018.

The eagles get back gaff from the gf and then eventually nicnat later in the year. Last year darling and Kennedy missed big chunks of the year so they have them fit and they are better than 2018.

Then there are Essendon and Melbourne who filled big holes in their line ups. Shiel and May will have impacts on these clubs in the rise. Essendon get Daniher back also.

So there are five clubs that if you look upon with the positive goggles people are applying to our list in here you’d thinks will be hard to get over for a spot in the top 4.

I also personally are not as positive about our run him in 2018 than others. People also suggesting we get a few injured players back this year. Our list is very even imo so I don’t see many outside perhaps Libba at his best who would have a huge impact returning from injury.

Our improvements to me must come from developed youth and fwd of the ball.
I’m a fan of schache and loved his 2018 but next to no faith in Tom Boyd being a reliable week in week out forward. I actually think he may spend some time at Footscray this year after an interrupted pre season.

Lloyd has some potential to impact. Taking a money ball approach to his numbers at tigers in his position and he should have an impact. I also have confidence cavarra can fill the dalhaus shoes well enough
 

stmookeyj

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#54
To make the finals we'd need to win 4 out of the 6 road games (and I'm including Geelong as a road game as opposed to an interstate game) as well as both games in Ballarat, leaving a realistic 8/14 around Melbourne.

Also what we need with the new rules is to find a ground trio adept at holding the ball in the middle to create secondary stoppages, thus giving the chance to create the extra defenders and organise the defence when the situation demands it. The game is going to get even scrappier in the middle as the defensive mindsets of coaches will usually prevail. That said finding a trio that can get a quick exit to a tall target who can create crumbs (as opposed to marking it) will also be handy.
 
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Thread starter #55
We were four finals wins away from a flag in 2015. Let’s not pretend that is close.

Our crows prelims in the 90s we were close but not in 2015. And as for being devastated that we felt we should have beaten the crows in 2015 there would be 6 other finalists thinking the same thing about closeness to a flag.

With respect to those ultra positive one eyed dogs out there I think we are very far away from a flag in 2019. As I’ve suggested my main reasoning in the number of clubs we need to leap frog to even get to top 4.
I say top 4 as history as shown its extremely rare to do it outside top four.
Yeh ok we did it in 2016 but there is a reason why we have been only ones to do it a cause it’s bloody tough.

Tigers have lynch who can make them better - yeh their depth may be tested this year but if your looking at them through the same one eyed goggles are fans are in here they would be very positive about top 4.

The pies have strengthened an already very strong midfield with beams and get another hear into Stephenson and Cox who were essentially learning their roles throughout 2018.

The eagles get back gaff from the gf and then eventually nicnat later in the year. Last year darling and Kennedy missed big chunks of the year so they have them fit and they are better than 2018.

Then there are Essendon and Melbourne who filled big holes in their line ups. Shiel and May will have impacts on these clubs in the rise. Essendon get Daniher back also.

So there are five clubs that if you look upon with the positive goggles people are applying to our list in here you’d thinks will be hard to get over for a spot in the top 4.

I also personally are not as positive about our run him in 2018 than others. People also suggesting we get a few injured players back this year. Our list is very even imo so I don’t see many outside perhaps Libba at his best who would have a huge impact returning from injury.

Our improvements to me must come from developed youth and fwd of the ball.
I’m a fan of schache and loved his 2018 but next to no faith in Tom Boyd being a reliable week in week out forward. I actually think he may spend some time at Footscray this year after an interrupted pre season.

Lloyd has some potential to impact. Taking a money ball approach to his numbers at tigers in his position and he should have an impact. I also have confidence cavarra can fill the dalhaus shoes well enough
As Bon Jovi said: Keep the Faith.
 

Beasley

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#57
i dont get why everyone is obsessed with winning the flag every year. we won it not long ago. let another team who hasnt won it for a while have a go. we will win one again soon because we have bont and macrae. i just hope the boys crack in and give it their best go and whatever happens im okay with.
Bloody hell I hate hearing the "crack in" words. It simply reminds me of the gloomy days under that goose that lost us a captain and very nearly a group of highly talented players nearing the end of their contracts.
 

Charlie Bucket

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#58
We were four finals wins away from a flag in 2015. Let’s not pretend that is close.

Our crows prelims in the 90s we were close but not in 2015. And as for being devastated that we felt we should have beaten the crows in 2015 there would be 6 other finalists thinking the same thing about closeness to a flag.

With respect to those ultra positive one eyed dogs out there I think we are very far away from a flag in 2019. As I’ve suggested my main reasoning in the number of clubs we need to leap frog to even get to top 4.
I say top 4 as history as shown its extremely rare to do it outside top four.
Yeh ok we did it in 2016 but there is a reason why we have been only ones to do it a cause it’s bloody tough.

Tigers have lynch who can make them better - yeh their depth may be tested this year but if your looking at them through the same one eyed goggles are fans are in here they would be very positive about top 4.

The pies have strengthened an already very strong midfield with beams and get another hear into Stephenson and Cox who were essentially learning their roles throughout 2018.

The eagles get back gaff from the gf and then eventually nicnat later in the year. Last year darling and Kennedy missed big chunks of the year so they have them fit and they are better than 2018.

Then there are Essendon and Melbourne who filled big holes in their line ups. Shiel and May will have impacts on these clubs in the rise. Essendon get Daniher back also.

So there are five clubs that if you look upon with the positive goggles people are applying to our list in here you’d thinks will be hard to get over for a spot in the top 4.

I also personally are not as positive about our run him in 2018 than others. People also suggesting we get a few injured players back this year. Our list is very even imo so I don’t see many outside perhaps Libba at his best who would have a huge impact returning from injury.

Our improvements to me must come from developed youth and fwd of the ball.
I’m a fan of schache and loved his 2018 but next to no faith in Tom Boyd being a reliable week in week out forward. I actually think he may spend some time at Footscray this year after an interrupted pre season.

Lloyd has some potential to impact. Taking a money ball approach to his numbers at tigers in his position and he should have an impact. I also have confidence cavarra can fill the dalhaus shoes well enough
We disagree on 2015 but I’ll leave it.

Fair calls on the oppo teams around the top 4 mark.
Do you see improvement in our list as you do those teams ?
Due to the age of our list we have huge room for improvement, which is pretty scary I think as we can definitely see the talent have improved since 2016 or more so 2017. Plus a large percentage of the better players in the 2016 finals are about to hit their prime.

Going back to the teams you mentioned, in my opinion Tigers, WC and the pies were probably in worse shape in the years before winning the flag or playing in a GF than we were in 2018. I mean we were even a basket case in 2014 before our rise in 15/16.
Would you agree that the way teams play and the ever changing game styles that now more than ever teams can come from a little further away to get close or even win it ?

Do you also see improvement in Bont, MaCrae, McLean, Hunter, Dunkley, Williams ?
Plus inclusions of Libba and possibly Picken and Dicko ?
For me these improvements and possible inclusions account for much of our improvement for 2019.
I almost see it in a way that something drastic would have to go wrong for us to not improve a fair bit next year.
So a bit of improvement sees us pushing top 8. So the improvement I can see happening... well who knows ??
 

Charlie Bucket

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#60
To make the finals we'd need to win 4 out of the 6 road games (and I'm including Geelong as a road game as opposed to an interstate game) as well as both games in Ballarat, leaving a realistic 8/14 around Melbourne.

Also what we need with the new rules is to find a ground trio adept at holding the ball in the middle to create secondary stoppages, thus giving the chance to create the extra defenders and organise the defence when the situation demands it. The game is going to get even scrappier in the middle as the defensive mindsets of coaches will usually prevail. That said finding a trio that can get a quick exit to a tall target who can create crumbs (as opposed to marking it) will also be handy.
Regarding the rule changes I agree with your last point, not so much your first.
Slowing up in the middle gives oppo teams time to set up defensively also making it hard to hit clear targets or even get clear space once the ball hits the ground.
You’re almost just setting both teams up to structure as they have the last few years.
I’m tipping the smarter coaches will manipulate the 6 fwds set up to maximise fwd efficiency and scoring ops and i reckon it’ll also involve mids pushing inside fwd 50 from centre clearances more than usual.
The new kick in rule is a different story all together. Not sure what’ll happen but it’ll quicken the game up that’s for certain.
 

JJHunter

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#61
Do you see improvement in our list as you do those teams ?
I see improvements no doubt but just not enough to catapult us over others and into top 4 calculations where I believe you need to be for a premiership.

Would you agree that the way teams play and the ever changing game styles that now more than ever teams can come from a little further away to get close or even win it ?
Yeh it would be hard to argue against that point given the results of the last three seasons.

Do you also see improvement in Bont, MaCrae, McLean, Hunter, Dunkley, Williams ?
Plus inclusions of Libba and possibly Picken and Dicko ?
Macrae and Hunter IMO had career best seasons - Id just be pleased if they replicated their 2018 seasons tbh.
McLean Dunkley and Williams all showed enough in patches in 2018 so a full consistent season from them would be required for improvement.

Harsh to say but I cant really see Picken playing again - a win for all supporters would be to just see him out there again.
But cannot expect that he is going to impact as he did in the 2016 finals.

Dicko playing 15+ games would be great but personally think he is played way out of position.
If you rewatch the games where he has an impact he is often our deepest forward - not playing high and getting touches at half back.
He is a pure opportunist and needs to be in the spots to utilize he one major asset - But I just dont see him being played in that manner.
 

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