The Bigfooty Liverpool Thread - Champions of England

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The Punter

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I wonder if any of this is in response to UEFA's plans for the Champions League. Perhaps the 12 clubs are thinking "if we are going to play more games in a different kind of group stage, we might as well try to get rid of the smaller clubs from the smaller nations and control everything ourselves".

There is little wrong with the Champions League, and nothing wrong with domestic English football that three things couldn't fix: greater revenue sharing down the leagues, the abolition of the League Cup (or a massive increase in prizemoney) and the continued absence of FA Cup replays.
 

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kane249

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Have any breakaway leagues ever actually gone the distance?

Eg rugby super league, World Series Cricket. Lasts a little while then comes back together, compromise made
Grain of salt, but someone else on Bigfooty posted this take on it

RE: The soccer stuff.

The Premier League fans complaining of breakaway leagues/clubs who want a higher % of revenues so move away from controlling bodies with no sense of irony is making my day (The Premier League itself was formed in the exact same way in 1992, and eventually as a bargaining tool included a pathway to reach the Premier League from the lower divisions). I would expect this Super League to do something similar.

Basically when this is said and done I would expect UEFA to not own the Champions League anymore, and instead have that tournament run by an organisation founded by the clubs (in the same way the English Premier League is run by its own organisation, and not the Football Association).

The main difference between AFL/NBA/NFL etc... and most soccer leagues is relegation, which makes heavy equalisation such as drafts and salary caps impossible. It isn't necessarily bad, just different.
 

Xmc08

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I wonder if any of this is in response to UEFA's plans for the Champions League. Perhaps the 12 clubs are thinking "if we are going to play more games in a different kind of group stage, we might as well try to get rid of the smaller clubs from the smaller nations and control everything ourselves".

There is little wrong with the Champions League, and nothing wrong with domestic English football that three things couldn't fix: greater revenue sharing down the leagues, the abolition of the League Cup (or a massive increase in prizemoney) and the continued absence of FA Cup replays.
I recommend reading some of the past articles and watching some of the past superleague videos with interviews with top club presidents.

All of the top clubs hate the current champions league format. They're sick of sending the team up to the north of Russia or Turkey, and have been adamant in the belief that the competition needs to change. Instead, UEFA did the opposite of what they wanted, and added even more clubs.
 

CP28

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Is everyone complaining about FSG not spending in the transfer market also the same people that lambasted them for initially planning to furlough staff when the pandemic hit, even though it was a perfectly legal option?

I could be way off base here and you guys would know plenty more than me, but the way it seems to me - UEFA have been lining their own pockets for years and despite complaints from the "bigger" clubs, very little has ever changed. If the clubs are able to take a greater slice of that revenue pie, you can't blame them for trying to do so. They've now called EUFA's bluff, and would hope for better financial outcomes under alterations to the current system or will go it alone and get a better result anyway, win/win situation in their minds. As for supporters being ashamed of their club and threatening to leave - Say we were the only one's to decline, we'd be consigning our club to also ran's quite possibly forever.

Maybe I'm stung a little by my SANFL club not having the spine to force a move into a bigger league which would have ensured it's future existence, at the highest level possible, but instead consigned themself to obscurity.

I'll add that I like the setup of the current competitions in Europe and would prefer to see no change to the structure .. Also hate the thought of forcing hardship on other clubs. But priority 1 for me is the long term survival and standing of our club at the highest possible level in our region.

OK, Im ready to get sh*t-canned over this, maybe I'm just not understanding enough so when I cop it please try and include some educational points along the way. 🙏🖕
 

The Punter

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I recommend reading some of the past articles and watching some of the past superleague videos with interviews with top club presidents.

All of the top clubs hate the current champions league format. They're sick of sending the team up to the north of Russia or Turkey, and have been adamant in the belief that the competition needs to change. Instead, UEFA did the opposite of what they wanted, and added even more clubs.
Personally, I find "we don't want to travel to small European nations in the UCL" the same as not wanting to play in the FA Cup because you might draw at Hartlepool (Liverpool fans can ask people who support other big clubs what is feels like to draw a lower division club in a domestic cup). Any romance surrounding the competition disappears without the chance of a big club being felled by a smaller club.
 
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Is it more the big 12 (or 15) trying to insure themselves against the boom-bust nature of the sport?

We've said ourselves good luck attracting big name players if we're not in the CL

Which means we have to pay more

If you're paying CL level wages but not getting CL level income, and then spend more trying to chase it...

Guaranteed participation, guaranteed income. Removes the main unknown clubs deal with

The traveling to small, obscure European clubs... meh
 

Dylan8

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Maybe I'm stung a little by my SANFL club not having the spine to force a move into a bigger league which would have ensured it's future existence, at the highest level possible, but instead consigned themself to obscurity.
Port or in an alternate universe Norwood forcing the SANFL's hand and defecting to a bigger national competition was a move borne of ambition, this Super League thing feels like the opposite. They want it to be a comfortable, boring competition which keeps the money more reliably in their pockets rather than any other club that may have actually earned it.

The Premier League/CL is already basically gamed so the big six teams are always at the top. This will just kill the last inkling of competitive/financial equality in England.
 

Rabbit of Caerbannog

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Have any breakaway leagues ever actually gone the distance?

Eg rugby super league, World Series Cricket. Lasts a little while then comes back together, compromise made
VFL was a breakaway league from the VFA. A different time with completely different circumstances obviously.
 

CP28

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Port or in an alternate universe Norwood forcing the SANFL's hand and defecting to a bigger national competition was a move borne of ambition, this Super League thing feels like the opposite. They want it to be a comfortable, boring competition which keeps the money more reliably in their pockets rather than any other club that may have actually earned it.

The Premier League/CL is already basically gamed so the big six teams are always at the top. This will just kill the last inkling of competitive/financial equality in England.
I agree with all of that - In relation to the SANFL clubs, you're right it was borne of ambition, but regardless of the reason what it did do was ensure Port's future at the highest level. Agreed things aren't as desperate for these bigger European clubs (or shouldn't be - In the cases of the debt laden clubs that's their own doing), could you imagine if all others said "yes" and we didnt? We'd certainly run a massive risk of forever falling behind them. Hopefully it doesn't go ahead and ALL clubs can live or die by their own decisions and actions.
 

BackOnOurPerch

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The same people who are disgusted by the willingness of FSG to participate in this super league would be appalled if FSG were not involved and had no desire to do so.
I hate the idea as much as much as anyone, but come on let's be realistic here.
If we don't get involved we will be left behind.
Also, Sky Sports and the Premier League appalled by this development?
******* hypocrites.
 

Nuke Fremantle

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I think it's just posturing from the super clubs to get a bigger slice of the profits.
Doubt they actually go through with it given the ramifications UEFA and FIFA are threatening.
If that's the case I think it's a pretty dangerous game of bluff.

Got a feeling a lot of lawyers are about to get very wealthy.
 

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The Punter

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If you continue to support Liverpool , you are a pretty sh*t person really.

All I have to say.
That's all well and good to say, but I would make two points:

1. This analysis implies a level of rationality not really associated with supporting a sporting club
2. Say what you like about Liverpool and the other clubs betraying their fans, but as of yet, there is no real "human wreckage" caused here through gross negligence of a club towards its staff and players ... like West Coast in the early 2000s (refer to point 1 about rationality of sporting club support)
 

Zidane98

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I think it's just posturing from the super clubs to get a bigger slice of the profits.
Doubt they actually go through with it given the ramifications UEFA and FIFA are threatening.
This is absolutely what it is and has gone on for years. I'm not a fan of this sort of negotiating, there are other ways to achieve what you want. The clubs involved are the ones that have worn the biggest losses and clearly aren't happy with the new CL proposal by UEFA. Surely a deal can be done to put this to bed.
 

GoEaglesGoSGIO

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Yes you can. It’s possible to condemn an owner, player, manager or fan as a singular entity and not condemn the whole club.
The club is a representation in its entirety unfortunately. One person can take down the entire club with it, especially when its the owner. Whether you like it or not, April 19th 2021 is the day Liverpool FC died.

Whats left behind is a new entity altogether. You can continue supporting the new entity and the evil it stands for or you can move on and support something thats better. Its your choice I suppose
 

Cooldude

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The club is a representation in its entirety unfortunately. One person can take down the entire club with it, especially when its the owner. Whether you like it or not, April 19th 2021 is the day Liverpool FC died.

Whats left behind is a new entity altogether. You can continue supporting the new entity and the evil it stands for or you can move on and support something thats better. Its your choice I suppose
You are either trolling or are being insanely melodramatic, the world isn't black and white. The fans have always stood differently to what the owners have done for a better part of 20 years, if only things are as simple as you make it seem
 

The Punter

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The club is a representation in its entirety unfortunately. One person can take down the entire club with it, especially when its the owner. Whether you like it or not, April 19th 2021 is the day Liverpool FC died.

Whats left behind is a new entity altogether. You can continue supporting the new entity and the evil it stands for or you can move on and support something thats better. Its your choice I suppose
Evil is really a gross overstatement of what is going on.

Also, your rationale invites one to believe you are happy for a club to turn its back on life-destroying drug abuse as long as premierships are won.
 

GoEaglesGoSGIO

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You are either trolling or are being insanely melodramatic, the world isn't black and white. The fans have always stood differently to what the owners have done for a better part of 20 years, if only things are as simple as you make it seem
I think you are greatly underestimating what has been done to be honest.

You can do a inexcusable act without any form of retribution in life. Not everything is forgivable. In the context of the sporting world, this is a unforgivable act
 

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