Opinion The 'Carlton related stuff that doesn't need it's own thread' thread

JustaBattler

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Jab. I take things as they come forward and if I had a particular dislike for an individual, why would have I applaud him for:
1. An independent committee to appoint a new coach in 2014?
2. His stance of unity as I have already laid forward.

I don't harbour resentment towards anyone but simply on their grounds of action.
I know you won't care to go back 5 years but what I always said was: 'It's not what you do but for the way you do it' that counted for me.
I just don't like the way we do things and for the disunity we create under the guise of unity. I have nothing further to add.
OK - I believe that it isn't what you say but what you do that matters ; and

and maybe (regarding your second point) you are expecting too much from a Football Club and its inevitable politics and egos....
 
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mediumsizered

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Part of the reason I was advocating for a change of leadership of the playing group for so long.

The tail should not wag the dog, has been for too many years at our club. Players that have seen off multiple coaches they couldn’t work with, or perform for, should be very concerned for their future prospects at the club. Unfortunately we have simply jumped on the same merry-go-round and hoped a change of coach will fix all the problems with the playing group. Seen dead cat bounce after dead cat bounce.

Can forgive one coach who you just cannot get along with, several leads to questions about the common denominator in all the coach sackings.
This is something I have been saying for a long time & I must say there initially seemed to be mixed messages coming from Cripps & Doc when they spoke to the media shortly after the sacking of Bolts was announced earlier this year.

For too long we have heard players express their support for the coach only to pull out an absolute stinking performance shortly afterwards. Brisbane 2007, Gold Coast 2012 & the Dopers this year. Then of course comes the 'dead cat bounce' to which you have referred, supposedly confirming the decision to sack the coach was the right one, only for it to become a case of rinse & repeat.

We have seen at the clubs which have enjoyed success over the past decade a tendency to back in the coach & bring in the type of players who are prepared to buy-in to what the coach is doing & also who are capable of playing the style of football the coach believes will achieve the ultimate success. Over the last 20 years I have only really seen buy-in during the Ratten years & we haven't always recruited the players who can carry out the coach's plan.

We now have a very talented list, with only a couple of holes yet to be filled, so it is going to be interesting to see if they fulfil this talent. If they don't I'm not sure it will be the fault of the coach, CEO, President, recruiters, High Performance Manager etc, it may well be the result of some players just being happy to be AFL players, something which I believe has afflicted our club for quite some time.
 

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Metalcrusher

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This is something I have been saying for a long time & I must say there initially seemed to be mixed messages coming from Cripps & Doc when they spoke to the media shortly after the sacking of Bolts was announced earlier this year.

For too long we have heard players express their support for the coach only to pull out an absolute stinking performance shortly afterwards. Brisbane 2007, Gold Coast 2012 & the Dopers this year. Then of course comes the 'dead cat bounce' to which you have referred, supposedly confirming the decision to sack the coach was the right one, only for it to become a case of rinse & repeat.

We have seen at the clubs which have enjoyed success over the past decade a tendency to back in the coach & bring in the type of players who are prepared to buy-in to what the coach is doing & also who are capable of playing the style of football the coach believes will achieve the ultimate success. Over the last 20 years I have only really seen buy-in during the Ratten years & we haven't always recruited the players who can carry out the coach's plan.

We now have a very talented list, with only a couple of holes yet to be filled, so it is going to be interesting to see if they fulfil this talent. If they don't I'm not sure it will be the fault of the coach, CEO, President, recruiters, High Performance Manager etc, it may well be the result of some players just being happy to be AFL players, something which I believe has afflicted our club for quite some time.
This might agitate ... but Gibbs was a perfect example of this both at CFC and Adelaide ...
 

JustaBattler

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This might agitate ... but Gibbs was a perfect example of this both at CFC and Adelaide ...
Remember the genius marketing slogan?

"The Chosen Ones"...??

If the mission was to create team disharmony - they couldn't have done a better job. Summed up just how woeful and incompetent the Club was back then.
 

gbatman

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Bolton was the right man for the job and he did an excellent job for a good while but it came to a point where something just went wrong. I think he made mistakes and he is probably aware of that now.

To me it just seemed like Bolton was very sure of himself and how he wanted the team to play and a lot of how we played was really good but there were problems. I think Bolton's problem was an inability to figure it out and an unwillingness to change and be flexible. I think a lot of coaches who have been at a strong club for a long time can get too sure of themselves and stuck in their ways.

Either way we have moved on to a coach who is anything but that. Teague sounds like he's going to be very open minded and flexible.

I think the right calls have been made all the way along here.

The president has been great. Probably the first president I have seen really take the club forward. Managed to find the right mix of stability all the while quietly moving people on for ones who have shown signs of being better. I would expect a little disharmony at a footy club, that's normal, it's up to the superiors to manage that and so far the signs are that they are being managed.

People need to take what club officials say in the media with a grain of salt. It's not going to be accurate if they don't want it to be. Need to take notice of action and little notice of words.
 

Gethelred

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I could never see the appeal of Clarko. Massively relieved to avoid him as head coach.
What's not to see? 4 time premiership coach, capable development instigator as well as an expert pregame and mid game tactician.

I get that we're happy to have a Carlton man at the helm, but one doesn't dismiss the best current coach in the game simply.
 

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The Blue Weirdo

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What's not to see? 4 time premiership coach, capable development instigator as well as an expert pregame and mid game tactician.

I get that we're happy to have a Carlton man at the helm, but one doesn't dismiss the best current coach in the game simply.
Been good for the Hawks, I don't think he would have impacted Carlton as much as Teague will. Malthouse was a legendary coach from another team also. Talk on the streets was $2 mil. a season wasn't it.
 

Arr0w

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What's not to see? 4 time premiership coach, capable development instigator as well as an expert pregame and mid game tactician.

I get that we're happy to have a Carlton man at the helm, but one doesn't dismiss the best current coach in the game simply.
Still believe coaches like Clarko (coaches in general) are overrated. Was it he or that gifted/elite group? I guess we will know more in the next couple of years, given the average list he has.

Personally I see a guy like Beveridge as a better coach, especially with the resources at his disposal
 
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Metalcrusher

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Still believe coaches like Clarko (coaches in general) are overrated. Was it he or that gifted/elite group? I guess we will know more in the next couple of year, given the average list he has.

Personally I see a guy like Beveridge as a better coach, especially with the resources at his disposal
And how then would you explain Bolton taking over for 4 or 5 games when Allister was sick??? They still kept winning?

Oh wait .....

Let me change my Narrative .... The players were THAT inspired and well groomed that it did not matter if AC turned up or not on the day ....

There ... better narrative.

Coaching ie HEAD COACH, yes is a force a personality, however a footy club and CULTURE is a some of its parts. Having a AC at for arguments sake GC would five eights of fu** all next year as too their ladder position.
 

DangerousD

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Still believe coaches like Clarko (coaches in general) are overrated. Was it he or that gifted/elite group? I guess we will know more in the next couple of years, given the average list he has.

Personally I see a guy like Beveridge as a better coach, especially with the resources at his disposal
I thought we had a great list in 92-95 and we won only 1 flag
The Bombers had a fantastic list from 98-2001 and managed only 1 flag
We had a really good list in 99-2000 and faltered
Ross Lyons St kilda and Fremantle teams were strong and constantly made grand finals, yet finished with none.
Geelong, continually finishing on top of the ladder the last few years and haven't made a grand final since 2011

Its extremely hard even getting to a grand final, let alone winning one and he has managed to get his team there, 5 times for 4 wins. I don't like the man, but cmon, give credit where it's due.
 

Blue__Balls

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This is something I have been saying for a long time & I must say there initially seemed to be mixed messages coming from Cripps & Doc when they spoke to the media shortly after the sacking of Bolts was announced earlier this year.

For too long we have heard players express their support for the coach only to pull out an absolute stinking performance shortly afterwards. Brisbane 2007, Gold Coast 2012 & the Dopers this year. Then of course comes the 'dead cat bounce' to which you have referred, supposedly confirming the decision to sack the coach was the right one, only for it to become a case of rinse & repeat.

We have seen at the clubs which have enjoyed success over the past decade a tendency to back in the coach & bring in the type of players who are prepared to buy-in to what the coach is doing & also who are capable of playing the style of football the coach believes will achieve the ultimate success. Over the last 20 years I have only really seen buy-in during the Ratten years & we haven't always recruited the players who can carry out the coach's plan.

We now have a very talented list, with only a couple of holes yet to be filled, so it is going to be interesting to see if they fulfil this talent. If they don't I'm not sure it will be the fault of the coach, CEO, President, recruiters, High Performance Manager etc, it may well be the result of some players just being happy to be AFL players, something which I believe has afflicted our club for quite some time.
And it seems Teague is taking the opposite approach.

Recognising the list is full of talented footballers, and encouraging a system which allows them, as a collective, to influence/cultivate the gameplan.

Curious to see how it plays out.
 

Arr0w

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I thought we had a great list in 92-95 and we won only 1 flag
The Bombers had a fantastic list from 98-2001 and managed only 1 flag
We had a really good list in 99-2000 and faltered
Ross Lyons St kilda and Fremantle teams were strong and constantly made grand finals, yet finished with none.
Geelong, continually finishing on top of the ladder the last few years and haven't made a grand final since 2011

Its extremely hard even getting to a grand final, let alone winning one and he has managed to get his team there, 5 times for 4 wins. I don't like the man, but cmon, give credit where it's due.
All I will say, his recent record speaks for itself

Average group, average results
 

DangerousD

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All I will say, his recent record speaks for itself

Average group, average results
I totally disagree with this, but this part will differ from person to person. Agree, average group, imo he has overachieved with what he currently has.
 

Mezzoculo

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