Opinion The case for Harves

lewdogs

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It looks increasingly likely that this will be Richo's last year as coach. Unfortunately at this stage the improvement just isn't there and the board will look for a fresh start.

I feel that we should get Robert Harvey in. Here's why:
- A club legend that would demand respect. I feel it's time to get a St Kilda person into the job.
- He has served a long apprenticeship at a number of clubs and is highly rated as an assistant coach.
- As far as we know, he wants the job. There seems to be some idea that he won't be good as a senior coach but I tend to think with Harves that if he thinks he can do it, then we back him in.
- The most professional player to ever play for our club. He could teach our young side about discipline and what it takes to make it at the top level.

I just think the time is right to appoint Harves as senior coach, get a good team of coaches around him and see what he can do for our side.

Thoughts?
 
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Plugger35

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The case against - James Hird, Michael Voss, Brett Ratten....

Appointing favourite sons as senior coaches often doesn't end well and can tarnish the legacy they had as champion players, you could argue that Buckley has been a success at Collingwood but for a long time he wasn't and he was lucky to stay in the job.

Harvey could well turn out to be a great senior coach for us but if he wasn't it could get ugly if supporters turned on him and the club was forced to sack him.
 

CaptainRisky

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It looks increasingly likely that this will be Richo's last year as coach. Unfortunately at this stage the improvement just isn't there and the board will look for a fresh start.

I feel that we should get Robert Harvey in. Here's why:
- A club legend that would demand respect. I feel it's time to get a St Kilda person into the job.
- He has served a long apprenticeship at a number of clubs and is highly rated as an assistant coach.
- As far as we know, he wants the job. There seems to be some idea that he won't be good as a senior coach but I tend to think with Harves that if he thinks he can do it, then we back him in.
- The most professional player to ever play for our club. He could teach our young side about discipline and what it takes to make it at the top level.

I just think the time is right to appoint Harves as senior coach, get a good team of coaches around him and see what he can do for our side.

Thoughts?
No dont do it Banger , its only going to end in pain
 

lewdogs

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The case against - James Hird, Michael Voss, Brett Ratten....

Appointing favourite sons as senior coaches often doesn't end well and can tarnish the legacy they had as champion players, you could argue that Buckley has been a success at Collingwood but for a long time he wasn't and he was lucky to stay in the job.

Harvey could well turn out to be a great senior coach for us but if he wasn't it could get ugly if supporters turned on him and the club was forced to sack him.
Agreed but a few of those didn't have as much experience as Harves beforehand, and Ratten wasn't actually too bad for the Blues.
 

George

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The case against - James Hird, Michael Voss, Brett Ratten....

Appointing favourite sons as senior coaches often doesn't end well and can tarnish the legacy they had as champion players, you could argue that Buckley has been a success at Collingwood but for a long time he wasn't and he was lucky to stay in the job.

Harvey could well turn out to be a great senior coach for us but if he wasn't it could get ugly if supporters turned on him and the club was forced to sack him.
I don't think either of Hird, Voss or Ratten's reputation at their old clubs has been tarnished at all. People get over that stuff quickly.
 

Plugger35

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I don't think either of Hird, Voss or Ratten's reputation at their old clubs has been tarnished at all. People get over that stuff quickly.
Hird's reputation has definitely been tarnished, although that was mainly due to the drugs saga rather than his coaching but his coaching wasn't great either.

Voss and Ratten's reputations haven't been tarnished as much, in fact Ratten's reputation has recently been enhanced as his coaching record at Carlton looks pretty good now in comparison to Malthouse and Bolton's coaching records there.
 

tomsimpkin31

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I don't think either of Hird, Voss or Ratten's reputation at their old clubs has been tarnished at all. People get over that stuff quickly.
Ratten is probably in tact still, his time as coach has aged well in hindsight. Voss I’m not sure how the Brissy faithful feel so I won’t comment. Hird’s legacy is shattered though and in absolute tatters.
 

George

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Hird's reputation has definitely been tarnished, although that was mainly due to the drugs saga rather than his coaching but his coaching wasn't great either.

Voss and Ratten's reputations haven't been tarnished as much, in fact Ratten's reputation has recently been enhanced as his coaching record at Carlton looks pretty good now in comparison to Malthouse and Bolton's coaching records there.
Ratten is probably in tact still, his time as coach has aged well in hindsight. Voss I’m not sure how the Brissy faithful feel so I won’t comment. Hird’s legacy is shattered though and in absolute tatters.
I'll give you Hird, although I think over time people will compartmentalize his playing career and his coaching career.
 

SaintsSeptember

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It looks increasingly likely that this will be Richo's last year as coach. Unfortunately at this stage the improvement just isn't there and the board will look for a fresh start.

I feel that we should get Robert Harvey in. Here's why:
- A club legend that would demand respect. I feel it's time to get a St Kilda person into the job.
- He has served a long apprenticeship at a number of clubs and is highly rated as an assistant coach.
- As far as we know, he wants the job. There seems to be some idea that he won't be good as a senior coach but I tend to think with Harves that if he thinks he can do it, then we back him in.
- The most professional player to ever play for our club. He could teach our young side about discipline and what it takes to make it at the top level.

I just think the time is right to appoint Harves as senior coach, get a good team of coaches around him and see what he can do for our side.

Thoughts?
It worked for Collingwood and Buckly, just had to wait a decade after starting in a competitive position.
 

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SaintsSeptember

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Profile the successful coaches.

Simpson : High profile midfielder.
Beverage : Low profile small forward.
Hardwick : Small Defender
Clarkson : Low profile small forward.
Longmire : High profile forward.

To me , how good they are as a player is irrelevant.
To me , targeting a favourite son, is skewing your selection for an irrelevant bit of sentimentality, which soon gets flushed away if things go sour.
 

sammm

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The case against - James Hird, Michael Voss, Brett Ratten....

Appointing favourite sons as senior coaches often doesn't end well and can tarnish the legacy they had as champion players, you could argue that Buckley has been a success at Collingwood but for a long time he wasn't and he was lucky to stay in the job.

Harvey could well turn out to be a great senior coach for us but if he wasn't it could get ugly if supporters turned on him and the club was forced to sack him.

not only that, he cannnot communicate. have you heard him speak in public. ummn ummn ummn. every second word is that.
 

sobraz

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The next best for us isn’t someone who has done the rounds before.

Statistics suggest if they’ve coached before, they’re further from a flag than a first timer.

I’d be looking closely at the Beveridge type left field options, and that is headed by Rhys Shaw who I think will make an excellent head coach.

I’d be looking to poach him from right under the kangaroos, while they’re busy looking at Longmire and Carlton’s getting hot and heavy with Clarkson. Those two will never win another premiership, guaranteed. As for Brad Scott...

Favourite son, champion player - no relevance. Although I would take the punt on Harves over those three mentioned experienced coaches, for me it’s a Shaw, Caracella type appointment we need.


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gobbles

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Ross Lyon actually gave a good reference for Harvey on the Rub not to long ago ... paraphrase - everyone has the opinion that Harvey is quietly mannered etc etc , believe it or not he can actually grab the attention of the team and also have those hard one on one talks
 

chris_h_11

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I would hate to see us speak about Harves the way we’ve spoken about Richo these last 18 months. And that would be inevitable - when we’re in the back half of 2021 season and looking at a finish between 10th and 14th, we’ll be calling for blood again. I reckon our new coach is destined for failure with our list.
 

Munga

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The next best for us isn’t someone who has done the rounds before.

Statistics suggest if they’ve coached before, they’re further from a flag than a first timer.

I’d be looking closely at the Beveridge type left field options, and that is headed by Rhys Shaw who I think will make an excellent head coach.

I’d be looking to poach him from right under the kangaroos, while they’re busy looking at Longmire and Carlton’s getting hot and heavy with Clarkson. Those two will never win another premiership, guaranteed. As for Brad Scott...

Favourite son, champion player - no relevance. Although I would take the punt on Harves over those three mentioned experienced coaches, for me it’s a Shaw, Caracella type appointment we need.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This. Which genius rookie coach will pop up and revolutionise the game and bring premierships to St Kilda?
 

joop

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Is Banger really rated highly as an assistant? Yes he won Assistant coach of the year (back in 2013) but if he was rated highly how come he hasn't got a senior gig in the preceding 6 years? And I'm not even sure how they'd judge that award, and by the the look of the winners not many have gone on to become senior coaches and only 1 doing any good.
I mean if he doesn't come to us would he get a senior job elsewhere?
One of my all time favourite players but with what happened with Hird and Crazy Vossy, I'm pretty reluctant to get a club great in.
 

St Muir

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I agree that it often ends in tears when a legend takes on the coaching role. Problem with that theory is that nearly all head coach roles end in tears anyway.
Harvey is a magnificent reader of the game, he has worked under a few coaches now and built his experience. One of the best of the assistants available, so would need to be considered, especially if we want a newbie.
It’s the legend that hooks me though. Back in the 80’s when we were complete crap and burning coaches frequently, it was Harvey and Bourke who decided it was up to them to turn the club around. They figured the turnaround had to come from the players and that they would lead that change. It takes leadership to take on responsibility in those circumstances. Not only did they commit to that, they actually succeeded, so that’s a huge tick from me.
I suspect we’ll go for experience in the end but never write off Harves.
 

lewdogs

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I would hate to see us speak about Harves the way we’ve spoken about Richo these last 18 months. And that would be inevitable - when we’re in the back half of 2021 season and looking at a finish between 10th and 14th, we’ll be calling for blood again. I reckon our new coach is destined for failure with our list.
But if he believes he can do it, I would tend to think he can do it.
 

Cornish

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Well he was right about Watters at least ;)
I had a conversation with Sir Robert down at Mt Martha when he first got the assistants gig, i said to him welcome back to the Saints, his reply was that its great to be home.

I couldnt blame him for throwing the toys out of the cot when Watters got the gig, i was like WTF is this club doing, and still saying it today :D
 
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