Roast The Chronicles of Alan Richardson - Part II

VDS66

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That DID NOT happen when Ratts was at Carlton.
Players were drafted with minimal input from the coaching panel.
In fact, one year they drafted players the coaching panel did not even want.
That caused a major argument internally, and undoubtedly ultimately cost Ratts the gig.
Hence why I’m skeptical about any suggestion that Ratts would ever return to coach Carlton.
Ironically guess which club employed that Carlton recruiter?
Hint: rhymes with Hilda.
And he didn't want lose Betts. Club thought otherwise.
 

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I actually feel for Richo

For me the main problem is the skills of the players we've got. He can only work with what he's got, and I think the club has been unrealistic about our talent, especially with those "top 4" comments a while ago. I have a feeling it would have been really hard for him to come out and say to the club "you just don't have the cattle" with where they seemed to be at.
Having said that, i still feel a change is needed and Ratten is the man... but I'll be left wondering how Richo would have gone with a decent list.
 
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I actually feel for Richo

For me the main problem is the skills of the players we've got. He can only work with what he's got, and I think the club has been unrealistic about our talent, especially with those "top 4" comments a while ago. I have a feeling it would have been really hard for him to come out and say to the club "you just don't have the cattle" with where they seemed to be at.
Having said that, i still feel a change is needed and Ratten is the man... but I'll be left wondering how Richo would have gone with a decent list.

Lack of high end talent generally is pretty hard to compete with. Geelong and North are pretty good ways to assess how two coaches with near identical back grounds go with two lists with big talent differentials. Malthouse won a Premiership with Collingwood, went to Carlton and ended up at the other end of the ladder as well.

Collingwood's recent ladder rise has been on the back of several players turning into stars as well as having found draft and trade bargains as well. Richo has never really had a side with more than 2 or 3 A grade/ Elite players. Rooey, Montagna and Stuv probably the best he's had at his disposal. Unfortunately we then had no middle order to help out. We have turned over a large amount of players too. We have 17 left from the 45 or so on the list from 2015. In 4 years we have lost more than half the list and we probably lose Roberton, Stuv, Armo and Paddy next year. That's not the settled line up that generally leads to success.
 

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Lack of high end talent generally is pretty hard to compete with. Geelong and North are pretty good ways to assess how two coaches with near identical back grounds go with two lists with big talent differentials. Malthouse won a Premiership with Collingwood, went to Carlton and ended up at the other end of the ladder as well.

Collingwood's recent ladder rise has been on the back of several players turning into stars as well as having found draft and trade bargains as well. Richo has never really had a side with more than 2 or 3 A grade/ Elite players. Rooey, Montagna and Stuv probably the best he's had at his disposal. Unfortunately we then had no middle order to help out. We have turned over a large amount of players too. We have 17 left from the 45 or so on the list from 2015. In 4 years we have lost more than half the list and we probably lose Roberton, Stuv, Armo and Paddy next year. That's not the settled line up that generally leads to success.
At the moment we don't really have the cattle , we have a team of calves and a few cattle with foot and mouth (Carlisle , Hannebery , Steven , Geary)
 
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I actually feel for Richo

For me the main problem is the skills of the players we've got. He can only work with what he's got, and I think the club has been unrealistic about our talent, especially with those "top 4" comments a while ago. I have a feeling it would have been really hard for him to come out and say to the club "you just don't have the cattle" with where they seemed to be at.
Having said that, i still feel a change is needed and Ratten is the man... but I'll be left wondering how Richo would have gone with a decent list.
Not sure it’s all down to the list. If he recognise the skill problems, why didn’t he address this earlier on and weed out the unskilled players quickly? We were light on ruck/mids/key backs all throughout the 5-6 years he’s been here.. we’re still having the same issue as before.. as a coach, he should be able to see the problem and at least seem to be on the way to fix these.. last year was the worst football I’ve seen any team played all time.. and that crap run and gun game plan lasted the whole season, as a senior coach, he is solely responsible for making every player worse, and we suffered as a club.. now the assistant coaches took the fall for him, that doesn’t mean he is good. Making no mistake, if he didn’t have a contract this year, he would have been sacked already..
 

VDS66

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I actually feel for Richo

For me the main problem is the skills of the players we've got. He can only work with what he's got, and I think the club has been unrealistic about our talent, especially with those "top 4" comments a while ago. I have a feeling it would have been really hard for him to come out and say to the club "you just don't have the cattle" with where they seemed to be at.
Having said that, i still feel a change is needed and Ratten is the man... but I'll be left wondering how Richo would have gone with a decent list.
Brave post. I know you want him gone but at least you're being objective.

I think the disappointment is exacerbated after the improvement in 16/17.

Had we got the recruiting better, we may have played finals.

Last year we dropped our bundle and the key is that he wasn't able to stem the bleeding.

Partly him, partly the assistants, partly the players IMO.

The interesting part is that for some reason, he is forgiven the injuries for this year, but not last year.

Anyway I believe all three of the above are being addressed over time.

Expect him to be one and expect some favourite players who are underperforming to get traded out.
 
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Brave post. I know you want him gone but at least you're being objective.

I think the disappointment is exacerbated after the improvement in 16/17.

Had we got the recruiting better, we may have played finals.

Last year we dropped our bundle and the key is that he wasn't able to stem the bleeding.

Partly him, partly the assistants, partly the players IMO.

The interesting part is that for some reason, he is forgiven the injuries for this year, but not last year.

Anyway I believe all three of the above are being addressed over time.

Expect him to be one and expect some favourite players who are underperforming to get traded out.

I have a feeling we gave him the extension so that he could play kids and start creating a future side rather than a competitive in the now side. The fans got shitty and we were worse than we thought we would be and he was forced to make us competitive in the short term, then injury hit and any return of momentum was already dashed.
 
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I actually feel for Richo

For me the main problem is the skills of the players we've got. He can only work with what he's got, and I think the club has been unrealistic about our talent, especially with those "top 4" comments a while ago. I have a feeling it would have been really hard for him to come out and say to the club "you just don't have the cattle" with where they seemed to be at.
Having said that, i still feel a change is needed and Ratten is the man... but I'll be left wondering how Richo would have gone with a decent list.
Sorry Sully I've got to disagree with this one. I see what you're saying about not having the cattle, which may well be correct. But Cho is responsible for removing players from the list that aren't up to it. In this area he's failed pretty badly also as we see how long Wright, Minch and some others have been kept on after it's clear they weren't up to it. To me it's a mix of all 3. Trout couldn't pick them, Cho couldn't develop them, and Cho wouldn't cut them. Our whole footy department had become so unbelievably full of sh1t that Leathers couldnt flush all the turds in just a single year.
 
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Lack of high end talent generally is pretty hard to compete with. Geelong and North are pretty good ways to assess how two coaches with near identical back grounds go with two lists with big talent differentials. Malthouse won a Premiership with Collingwood, went to Carlton and ended up at the other end of the ladder as well.

Collingwood's recent ladder rise has been on the back of several players turning into stars as well as having found draft and trade bargains as well. Richo has never really had a side with more than 2 or 3 A grade/ Elite players. Rooey, Montagna and Stuv probably the best he's had at his disposal. Unfortunately we then had no middle order to help out. We have turned over a large amount of players too. We have 17 left from the 45 or so on the list from 2015. In 4 years we have lost more than half the list and we probably lose Roberton, Stuv, Armo and Paddy next year. That's not the settled line up that generally leads to success.
Could Seb have been an A grader or better if he'd been drafted to the Hawks or WCE? Where would Billings be at if he's gone to the Swans? Failure to recrute talent displays identically as failure develop it, so how do you tell the difference gringo??
 
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Sorry Sully I've got to disagree with this one. I see what you're saying about not having the cattle, which may well be correct. But Cho is responsible for removing players from the list that aren't up to it. In this area he's failed pretty badly also as we see how long Wright, Minch and some others have been kept on after it's clear they weren't up to it. To me it's a mix of all 3. Trout couldn't pick them, Cho couldn't develop them, and Cho wouldn't cut them. Our whole footy department had become so unbelievably full of sh1t that Leathers couldnt flush all the turds in just a single year.
Yeah i get you. Don't get me wrong... i'm not really defending him. I'm simply saying I think maybe he was up against it a bit when those around him at the club seemed to think we had a list full of talent. I wish he'd shown more balls to be honest with you.
 

VDS66

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Sorry Sully I've got to disagree with this one. I see what you're saying about not having the cattle, which may well be correct. But Cho is responsible for removing players from the list that aren't up to it. In this area he's failed pretty badly also as we see how long Wright, Minch and some others have been kept on after it's clear they weren't up to it. To me it's a mix of all 3. Trout couldn't pick them, Cho couldn't develop them, and Cho wouldn't cut them. Our whole footy department had become so unbelievably full of sh1t that Leathers couldnt flush all the turds in just a single year.
Might have had something to do with meeting cap requirements at the time.

But don't let facts get in the way...

Keeping Minch and Wright on the list for an extra year isn't the source of our problems.

Now explain to me which players he has kept on the list that aren't up to it...
 

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Could Seb have been an A grader or better if he'd been drafted to the Hawks or WCE? Where would Billings be at if he's gone to the Swans? Failure to recrute talent displays identically as failure develop it, so how do you tell the difference gringo??

I guess some are just so gifted nothing holds them down. Definitely developing in a good squad means you can free wheel and have little responsibility as you mature. Geelong kids seem to be able to get off the leash because they aren't forced to take more responsibility than their peers.
 

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I have a feeling we gave him the extension so that he could play kids and start creating a future side rather than a competitive in the now side. The fans got shitty and we were worse than we thought we would be and he was forced to make us competitive in the short term, then injury hit and any return of momentum was already dashed.
Let’s not forget that we lost a significant amount of experience with Roo, Joey, Dempster and Gilbo out and Armo injured a lot.
With not many players in the middle age bracket the kids were always going to get whacked. Game plan etc aside.

That’s why, frustrating as it was, I cut Richo a little slack. But at the end of the year a decision has to be made. I personally don’t believe you can judge over six years given the unbalanced team he inherited, but by end of this year it’s huge improvement or bye bye Richo.
 
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Let’s not forget that we lost a significant amount of experience with Roo, Joey, Dempster and Gilbo out and Armo injured a lot.
With not many players in the middle age bracket the kids were always going to get whacked. Game plan etc aside.

That’s why, frustrating as it was, I cut Richo a little slack. But at the end of the year a decision has to be made. I personally don’t believe you can judge over six years given the unbalanced team he inherited, but by end of this year it’s huge improvement or bye bye Richo.
Richo was the one that moved Roo & Joey on

Anyhow if he gets a 7th year without making finals this year he is 1 lucky person

Can anyone say after 6th years what he has brought to the club and playing group that has made us better
 

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Richo was the one that moved Roo & Joey on

Anyhow if he gets a 7th year without making finals this year he is 1 lucky person

Can anyone say after 6th years what he has brought to the club and playing group that has made us better
It was time for Roo. Blind Freddie could see that. Joey could have had another year.

Agree with your second point, which is why I said although I did cut him some slack last year, this year had really better show a very big improvement, despite out injuries, otherwise he’ll be gone.
 
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Apparently all coaches are the same, it's just recruiting and the rest takes care of itself? Yeah nah...
All our players are spuds so our coach must be pretty good to get the team winning games at all.
But then we never get those good draft picks.
We need a really bad Coach then we can get a good coach once we are loaded up on early picks for a few years.
 
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Ok - so how would Sicily & Worpedo both late picks for the Hawks have fared with us?

I bet they would’ve been duds.

Our development sucks.

So Worpol had 3 months at the Hawks and was so drilled by then he was a gun? Not his natural talent or anything? I watched his All Stars game and was asking everyone why he wasn't a top 15 pick. He was a ball winner and a competitor. Geelong Falcons captain, perhaps even Vic country captain and just a good old school inside mid.

Could it be that the Hawks just selected a good player? Why wasn't Kieran Lovell any good then?
 

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So Worpol had 3 months at the Hawks and was so drilled by then he was a gun? Not his natural talent or anything? I watched his All Stars game and was asking everyone why he wasn't a top 15 pick. He was a ball winner and a competitor. Geelong Falcons captain, perhaps even Vic country captain and just a good old school inside mid.

Could it be that the Hawks just selected a good player? Why wasn't Kieran Lovell any good then?
Knowing us Worpol would still be battling on a half back flank in the two's!
And Sicily would have already been delisted after throwing him to the wolves as a fwd, which he struggled at
Then in frustration got suspended for 8 weeks, so we turfed him on account of him being a Dickhead!
 
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My hatred for Richo is growing day by day. He was supposedly a great developer of kids..surely whitey deserves a game after a long pre-season and being in the best at VFL for a few weeks..but instead he gives Marsh a chance after 1 good game at VFL. Maybe going a bit over but I will try and call the club tomorrow to pass on some feedback.

I don't know Brando but this is beyond my understanding..only St Kilda can make silly decisions..
 

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Brave post. I know you want him gone but at least you're being objective.

I think the disappointment is exacerbated after the improvement in 16/17.

Had we got the recruiting better, we may have played finals.

Last year we dropped our bundle and the key is that he wasn't able to stem the bleeding.

Partly him, partly the assistants, partly the players IMO.

The interesting part is that for some reason, he is forgiven the injuries for this year, but not last year.

Anyway I believe all three of the above are being addressed over time.

Expect him to be one and expect some favourite players who are underperforming to get traded out.
injury list would be interesting! i do remember us having some decent outs last year. probably not as many LTIs though?

i think Richo killed last year, which he has publicly admitted to. he went in too hard and killed their confidence. over-reacted and then had to drag them back. he did mention injuries too though!
 
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