The Clayton Oliver Statistical Analysis Thread

[Farm Boy]

I'm not spruiking the relevance of the stat, merely pointing out that while comparing his meters gained to an outside mid/rebounding defender is certainly pointless, comparing it to his peers is not.

Comparing it to his peers is also pointless - unless you share their turnover rate also. What is the point of gaining metres if you are just going to give the ball up? Peers or not, there are other variables than just gaining metres.

 

[Brutalitops]

That's very much your opinion. He's not Diesel Williams at 19 years-old, so he isn't worth getting excited over?

Youre a delicate little flower, arent you? This thread makes strong claims that he is already in consideration for GOAT. Im saying he needs to more than just be an inside mid for that to be a possibility. FMD even Judd won a Brownlow at West Coast as a blaze-away outside mid and a Brownlow at Carlton as an in-and-under extractor.

Do you understand that in todays game you cant just be a one trick pony? Players have to be that rare hybrid type to even get a mention. Look at Ablett, perfectly balanced midfielder. In or out doesnt matter. Franklin is a KPF who has ground level skills of a small forward. He (Oliver) needs more strings to his bow.

And before you bang on about his age or games played, remember that we arent on the Melbourne board. You (Demons fans) insisted on having a stand-alone thread for him on the Main Board, rather than discussing him with the other young talent.

This means he gets more scrutiny than the other young players. Dont like it? Stop posting and let the thread die then.

 

[Tulip]

Youre a delicate little flower, arent you? This thread makes strong claims that he is already in consideration for GOAT. Im saying he needs to more than just be an inside mid for that to be a possibility. FMD even Judd won a Brownlow at West Coast as a blaze-away outside mid and a Brownlow at Carlton as an in-and-under extractor.

Do you understand that in todays game you cant just be a one trick pony? Players have to be that rare hybrid type to even get a mention. Look at Ablett, perfectly balanced midfielder. In or out doesnt matter. Franklin is a KPF who has ground level skills of a small forward. He needs more strings to his bow.

And before you bang on about his age or games played, remember that we arent on the Melbourne board. You (Demons fans) insisted on having a stand-alone thread for him on the Main Board, rather than discussing him with the other young talent.

This means he gets more scrutiny than the other young players. Dont like it? Stop posting and let the thread die then.

What?

 

[Trav 20]

Since when did the word "metres" turn into "meters" ?

 

[Brutalitops]

What?

Im sorry. Is not unprecedented anymore?

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

Comparing it to his peers is also pointless - unless you share their turnover rate also. What is the point of gaining metres if you are just going to give the ball up? Peers or not, there are other variables than just gaining metres.

Best I've got is clangers. They all pretty much sit around 3.3-3.5 per game, so the difference is negligible. Mitchell being the standout with 4.5 per game and Priddis the best with 3.

 

[Sando22]

Two replies to the one post? Chill dude. People will continue to point out his flaws in spite of his strong attributes. Just learn to deal with it.

I'm not spruiking the relevance of the stat, merely pointing out that while comparing his meters gained to an outside mid/rebounding defender is certainly pointless, comparing it to his peers is not.

Everything you're saying though is such rubbish it's impossible not to comment.
It's an irrelevant stat regardless of who you use it on.

 

[Sando22]

Comparing it to his peers is also pointless - unless you share their turnover rate also. What is the point of gaining metres if you are just going to give the ball up? Peers or not, there are other variables than just gaining metres.

This.
No point kicking it 55m to your opponent.
We don't bother quantifying that though because "meters gained"!!

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

Comparing it to his peers is also pointless - unless you share their turnover rate also. What is the point of gaining metres if you are just going to give the ball up? Peers or not, there are other variables than just gaining metres.

Best I've got is clangers. They all pretty much sit around 3.3-3.5 per game, so the difference is negligible. Mitchell being the standout with 4.5 per game and Priddis the best with 3.

It appears the missing piece of the puzzle is 'retention rate'. This gives a percentage of how often a player moves the ball forward to a teammate, rather than to the opposition or to a contest and stoppage.
I don't have access to that info, but in my examples above, Oliver would have to have a 100% retention rate to Rockliff's sub 50% retention to even draw even. I can't see that being the case.
The problem is we only see metres gained in isolation, when it's intended to be used in conjunction with the retention rate. Teams use it, so it can't be useless.

 

[Farm Boy]

It appears the missing piece of the puzzle is 'retention rate'. This gives a percentage of how often a player moves the ball forward to a teammate, rather than to the opposition or to a contest and stoppage.
I don't have access to that info, but in my examples above, Oliver would have to have a 100% retention rate to Rockliff's sub 50% retention to even draw even. I can't see that being the case.
The problem is we only see metres gained in isolation, when it's intended to be used in conjunction with the retention rate. Teams use it, so it can't be useless.

Retention rate is not THE missing piece - but A missing piece.

 

[Sprout]

You (Demons fans) insisted on having a stand-alone thread for him on the Main Board, rather than discussing him with the other young talent.

Did we?

I was of the impression it was ONE Demon fan, Striker, who decided that. I must have been absent when all the fans voted on it as a collective.

 

[jack son 5]

Since when did the word "metres" turn into "meters" ?

Too many on here have been Americanised mate. Arguing stats FFS.

If you go to a footy game and need stats to tell you who played ok and who didn't, well * me.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

I don't have access to that info, but in my examples above, Oliver would have to have a 100% retention rate to Rockliff's sub 50% retention to even draw even. I can't see that being the case.

How do you figure? If both had 35 disposals for example and both had 30 of them retained, yet Rockliff's metres gained was 380 compared to Oliver's 180, yet Oliver's 5 disposals that were not retained were errant handballs that went backwards or sideways while Rockliff's were all 50 metre kicks would that not completely suggest the opposite to what you've posted?

 

[Trav 20]

It appears the missing piece of the puzzle is 'retention rate'. This gives a percentage of how often a player moves the ball forward to a teammate, rather than to the opposition or to a contest and stoppage.
I don't have access to that info, but in my examples above, Oliver would have to have a 100% retention rate to Rockliff's sub 50% retention to even draw even. I can't see that being the case.
The problem is we only see metres gained in isolation, when it's intended to be used in conjunction with the retention rate. Teams use it, so it can't be useless.

What if he was averaging more score involvements ? Wouldn't that be just as or more valuable ?

I don't know whether he is or isn't, btw.

 

[markm106]

6 more coaches votes for Clarry. 5th overall in AFLCA voting.

 

[Trav 20]

6 more coaches votes for Clarry. 5th overall in AFLCA voting.

Yep.

7th time in 10 matches he's received votes from BOTH coaches.

MELBOURNE v GOLD COAST
9 Nathan Jones (Melb)
6 Jeff Garlett (Melb)
6 Clayton Oliver (Melb)
4 Jordan Lewis (Melb)
2 Jack Leslie (GC)
2 Jake Melksham (Melb)
1 Michael Hibberd (Melb)

AFLCA LEADERBOARD
53 Rory Sloane (Adel)
47 Elliot Yeo (WC)
46 Joel Selwood (Geel)
43 Dustin Martin (Rich)
42 Clayton Oliver (Melb)
40 Scott Pendlebury (Coll)
39 Patrick Dangerfield (Geel)
33 Taylor Adams (Coll)
32 Gary Ablett (GC)
32 Sebastian Ross (StK)

 

[Brutalitops]

This.
No point kicking it 55m to your opponent.
We don't bother quantifying that though because "meters gained"!!

Because that scenario doesnt register any meters gained. How are you this dense?

 

[JVseven]

Number 1 in the league for ground ball gets. Could explain the quick handballs..

 

[theprospect]

Why do Melbourne fans feel the constant need to shove all these stats and praises of him down our throats?

 

[markm106]

Why do Melbourne fans feel the constant need to shove all these stats and praises of him down our throats?

This is a Clayton Oliver thread. If you don't want to hear how much we rate him I suggest you do not enter the thread.

 

[Toump Ass]

Why do Melbourne fans feel the constant need to shove all these stats and praises of him down our throats?

So what did you expect from a thread about a brilliant young player with the word "statistics" in it?

 

[Ando727]

I'm a bit annoyed that this thread was ever started with all the "unprecedented" stuff. It's turned the discussion of a very good young talent into a massive piss-take and also attracts unnecessarily harsh commentary on how he's going. I can't see how he will not continually be connected with that word for the rest of his career as far as discussion on BF is concerned. All Oliver wants to do is play football, not be unprecedented. He shouldn't be saddled with ridiculous expectations or be turned into a running joke just because somebody got excited in BigFooty.

It's a cautionary tale: If you like a player at your club, be very wary of singing his praises anywhere but on your club board because you are inviting people to pick him apart and look for every flaw they can find just to stick it to you.

 

[00Stinger]

6 more coaches votes for Clarry. 5th overall in AFLCA voting.

But what about metres gained?

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[JVseven]

Why do Melbourne fans feel the constant need to shove all these stats and praises of him down our throats?

Why do opposition fans feel the need to negate the praise? It's a thread about Oliver, if you don't like it, go to one of the McCartin threads.

 

[Sando22]

Because that scenario doesnt register any meters gained. How are you this dense?

Do you know this to be the case though or are you making it up?