The utensil up that is the east coast energy market

[QuietB]

This is 100% classic Sky response - man who drives "straight through a crowd" only did it because "A commuter appeared to lose their patience" - lol

Next time I get held up by a funeral or something I'll just drive straight through them and it will all be OK because I lost my "patience".

Idiots

 

[Carn The Berries]

This is 100% classic Sky response - man who drives "straight through a crowd" only did it because "A commuter appeared to lose their patience" - lol

Next time I get held up by a funeral or something I'll just drive straight through them and it will all be OK because I lost my "patience".

Idiots

CM would have you believe someone who posts in this thread wrote that headline...

 

[CM86]

CM would have you believe someone who posts in this thread wrote that headline...

I'm sorry I thought you were capable of good faith.

We good now?

 

[Carn The Berries]

I'm sorry I thought you were capable of good faith.

We good now?

Good faith would be to own what you said.

I'll ask a simple, 2-part question as a guide.

Q. Did you make a post suggesting that the discussion being had in this thread contributed to the horrific incident we saw in Sydney yesterday? If so, do you still believe this to be the case.

Consider this my act of good faith. I'm giving you a chance to set the record straight.

 

[CM86]

Good faith would be to own what you said.

I'll ask a simple, 2-part question as a guide.

Q. Did you make a post suggesting that the discussion being had in this thread contributed to the horrific incident we saw in Sydney yesterday? If so, do you still believe this to be the case.

Consider this my act of good faith. I'm giving you a chance to set the record straight.

I was referring to posters, in this thread, who have been doing so. Not just specific to this thread. But I worded it poorly, and should have corrected it earlier on.

I'm sorry for my poor wording, that's why I attempted to explain my reasoning in post 373

My position is that people who have been supporting, regurgitating and agitating these talking points, contribute to what could have been an angry attack on climate change activists.


My position after that, is that regardless of my comment, the big issue should have been that someone drove their car into protestors.

Sorry for my poor wording. I posted it in three threads. This one got the most attention, because I worded my comment poorly.

 

[Chief]

Note: While the action of the driver is deplorable, those running into the path of the offending vehicle must be a bit deranged as well.

Trying to get someone to stop so they don't hit more people? Defending their people on the ground?

Hardly deranged.

The deranged bit is the response from conservatives - from shrugs to applause.

We saw that in Charlottesville in the US, too. "Oh he must have felt threatened so he had to ram his car through a crowd."

Nah. Not buying it.

 

[Carn The Berries]

I was referring to posters, in this thread, who have been doing so. Not just specific to this thread. But I worded it poorly, and should have corrected it earlier on.

I'm sorry for my poor wording, that's why I attempted to explain my reasoning in post 373

My position is that people who have been supporting, regurgitating and agitating these talking points, contribute to what could have been an angry attack on climate change activists.


My position after that, is that regardless of my comment, the big issue should have been that someone drove their car into protestors.

Sorry for my poor wording. I posted it in three threads. This one got the most attention, because I worded my comment poorly.

Yes it did, because that poor wording ended up being an accusation that this particular discussion (or at least the views being discussed in it) had some link to the disgusting behaviour that we saw yesterday.

I think there are very, very few "climate deniers" or people of the ilk that don't think action on climate change is necessary around these parts. There are definitely different views on how to address is (and the roles that various energy sources have) but I haven't seen anyone straight out say "everything is fine, those climate whack jobs are crazy".

Trying to imply that the views held by posters on SRP are akin to those held by the sort of people who would willfully injure people doesn't serve any purpose. Your post could quite easily (e.g. absolutely was) interpreted as saying there shouldn't be any debate on how to tackle climate change. Not ostracising people is a good start to getting proper engagement.

 

[QuietB]

CM would have you believe someone who posts in this thread wrote that headline...

The Sky headline should be condemned.

The person who drove through the crowd should be condemned. They should be charged and imprisoned. In Melbourne they could use the new offensive conduct laws to jail them for 5 years and it would be deserved.

Sky news masquerading as a legitimate "news" service should not be condoning this behaviour but as we all know that is their business model.

You may not like the protests. You may not agree with them. You may be vehemently opposed to them. But there are no circumstances where it is ok to drive a car through them with deliberate intent to harm.

If that is not an accepted standard in Australia then we are beyond screwed.

 

[CM86]

Consider this my act of good faith. I'm giving you a chance to set the record straight.

I was referring to posters, in this thread, who have been doing so. Not just specific to this thread. But I worded it poorly, and should have corrected it earlier on.

I'm sorry for my poor wording, that's why I attempted to explain my reasoning in post 373

My position is that people who have been supporting, regurgitating and agitating these talking points, contribute to what could have been an angry attack on climate change activists.


My position after that, is that regardless of my comment, the big issue should have been that someone drove their car into protestors.

Sorry for my poor wording. I posted it in three threads. This one got the most attention, because I worded my comment poorly.

Trying to imply that the views held by posters on SRP are akin to those held by the sort of people who would willfully injure people doesn't serve any purpose.

OK mete.

You tricked me into thinking you'd be good faith. You aren't.
Hope it was worth it. Enjoy your day.

 

[CM86]

The Sky headline should be condemned.

The person who drove through the crowd should be condemned. They should be charged and imprisoned. In Melbourne they could use the new offensive conduct laws to jail them for 5 years and it would be deserved.

Sky news masquerading as a legitimate "news" service should not be condoning this behaviour but as we all know that is their business model.

You may not like the protests. You may not agree with them. You may be vehemently opposed to them. But there are no circumstances where it is ok to drive a car through them with deliberate intent to harm.

If that is not an accepted standard in Australia then we are beyond screwed.

How is this not the default position?
I cannot understand the bullshit and gaslighting coming from posters IN THIS THREAD.

Any way to minimise or distract from the fact that someone DROVE THEIR CAR... INTO A GROUP OF PEOPLE... is just a different reality to me.

 

[Carn The Berries]

The Sky headline should be condemned.

The person who drove through the crowd should be condemned. They should be charged and imprisoned. In Melbourne they could use the new offensive conduct laws to jail them for 5 years and it would be deserved.

Sky news masquerading as a legitimate "news" service should not be condoning this behaviour but as we all know that is their business model.

You may not like the protests. You may not agree with them. You may be vehemently opposed to them. But there are no circumstances where it is ok to drive a car through them with deliberate intent to harm.

If that is not an accepted standard in Australia then we are beyond screwed.

I wholeheartedly agree with everything you have said there.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

How is this not the default position?
I cannot understand the bullshit and gaslighting coming from posters IN THIS THREAD.

Any way to minimise or distract from the fact that someone DROVE THEIR CAR... INTO A GROUP OF PEOPLE... is just a different reality to me.

Its not relevant to this thread.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

All sorts of stuff going down

Who are Blockade Australia, and why are some members facing charges that carry up to 10 years in prison?

Police say they feared for their lives, protesters say they were startled by armed men in camouflage who refused to identify themselves. What happened in Colo on Sunday, and what has it got to do with NSW's beefed-up protest laws?

www.abc.net.au

But none really relevant to this thread.

 

[Kwality]

How is this not the default position?
I cannot understand the bullshit and gaslighting coming from posters IN THIS THREAD.

Any way to minimise or distract from the fact that someone DROVE THEIR CAR... INTO A GROUP OF PEOPLE... is just a different reality to me.

We still have the cocked up east coast energy market & no amount of spin is going to fix it.

'In a statement issued overnight, CEC chief executive Kane Thornton says the capacity mechanism, regarded by most as one of the worst proposals of the Coalition government, yet embraced by the new Labor government, is not necessary.

“Government needs to be looking at ways to bring more clean, low-cost renewable energy into homes and to power industry without paying unreliable and expensive coal and gas to stay open, which ultimately results in more expensive electricity bills,” Thornton said.

“Clean energy and storage can meet our energy and capacity needs and the technology is here now.

“A storage target can accelerate the deployment of batteries, pumped hydro and other means of storing energy when it’s needed. A target worked for renewable energy in its formative years and can do the same for storage.

The push for a storage target is gaining momentum, mainly because it is unequivocally focused on clean technologies that can support the growth of wind and solar.'

“Unreliable and dirty:” CEC urges storage target over capacity mechanism

Clean Energy Council joins growing chorus rejecting capacity mechanism in favour of an energy storage target.

reneweconomy.com.au

Until we have a market that delivers 24/7 power as and where required, we need the dispatchable capacity that coal & gas give us.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Trying to get someone to stop so they don't hit more people? Defending their people on the ground?

Hardly deranged.

The deranged bit is the response from conservatives - from shrugs to applause.

We saw that in Charlottesville in the US, too. "Oh he must have felt threatened so he had to ram his car through a crowd."

Nah. Not buying it.

Listen to the commentary after 3:34.

 

[QuietB]

Its not relevant to this thread.

I'd argue it is very relevant.

We had the Australian Covid Recovery Board stacked with gas executives. There was one token person from the Labor side of politics and completely unsurprisingly he was a gas executive as well.

Then we have the conservative media who are completely happy to overlook and never report the fact that the gas lobby largely wrote Australia's policy for Covid recovery while at the same time openly condoning violence against climate protesters - cause someone was "impatient".

The reason we have a crisis in the east coast energy market is because the energy companies have been allowed to write their own policies, even worse write government policies, and self regulate with impunity for too long.

At every point both the conservative media and the Morrison government openly ridiculed and condemned any and all dissenting voices - school children, women, climate rallies, and yesterdays incident.

This was done for no other reason to protect gas and coal companies from any scrutiny at all.

It is absolutely relevant. The Morrison government at the behest of the gas and coal lobby created new laws to ban protests, have openly ridiculed and suppressed legitimate protests at every opportunity, have diverted environmental and climate spending to the gas and coal companies and and now we have Sky condoning violence against protests.

And we wonder how we ended up in an energy crisis where the gas and coal companies could hold the entire nation to ransom charging whatever the hell they wanted for gas, coal and energy?

If Australia had not diddled for 9 years, if Australia had not caved entirely to the gas and coal companies which by the way are 97% foreign owned and pay SFA tax or royalties, then maybe we might not be in this crisis.

People absolutely have a right to be pissed off and protest.

This is not democracy.

 

[Gralin]

So the driver has copped a $480ish fine for driving their car into the protestors, some of who are looking at jail time and $22k fines under the new legislation that NSW recently passed.

What a great free democracy we live in where protesting inaction on climate change is considered worse than driving your car into protestors

 

[Kwality]

I'd argue it is very relevant.

We had the Australian Covid Recovery Board stacked with gas executives. There was one token person from the Labor side of politics and completely unsurprisingly he was a gas executive as well.

Then we have the conservative media who are completely happy to overlook and never report the fact that the gas lobby largely wrote Australia's policy for Covid recovery while at the same time openly condoning violence against climate protesters - cause someone was "impatient".

The reason we have a crisis in the east coast energy market is because the energy companies have been allowed to write their own policies, even worse write government policies, and self regulate with impunity for too long.

At every point both the conservative media and the Morrison government openly ridiculed and condemned any and all dissenting voices - school children, women, climate rallies, and yesterdays incident.

This was done for no other reason to protect gas and coal companies from any scrutiny at all.

It is absolutely relevant. The Morrison government at the behest of the gas and coal lobby created new laws to ban protests, have openly ridiculed and suppressed legitimate protests at every opportunity, have diverted environmental and climate spending to the gas and coal companies and and now we have Sky condoning violence against protests.

And we wonder how we ended up in an energy crisis where the gas and coal companies could hold the entire nation to ransom charging whatever the hell they wanted for gas, coal and energy?

If Australia had not diddled for 9 years, if Australia had not caved entirely to the gas and coal companies which by the way are 97% foreign owned and pay SFA tax or royalties, then maybe we might not be in this crisis.

People absolutely have a right to be pissed off and protest.

This is not democracy.

is that analysis only relevant to the east coast power market?

Of course coal & gas producers should be scrutinised.
The State Governments that have failed to provide electricity to their constituents MUST be scrutinised - this is democracy.

 

[Chief]

So the driver has copped a $480ish fine for driving their car into the protestors

WTF??

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I'd argue it is very relevant.

We had the Australian Covid Recovery Board stacked with gas executives. There was one token person from the Labor side of politics and completely unsurprisingly he was a gas executive as well.

Then we have the conservative media who are completely happy to overlook and never report the fact that the gas lobby largely wrote Australia's policy for Covid recovery while at the same time openly condoning violence against climate protesters - cause someone was "impatient".

The reason we have a crisis in the east coast energy market is because the energy companies have been allowed to write their own policies, even worse write government policies, and self regulate with impunity for too long.

At every point both the conservative media and the Morrison government openly ridiculed and condemned any and all dissenting voices - school children, women, climate rallies, and yesterdays incident.

This was done for no other reason to protect gas and coal companies from any scrutiny at all.

It is absolutely relevant. The Morrison government at the behest of the gas and coal lobby created new laws to ban protests, have openly ridiculed and suppressed legitimate protests at every opportunity, have diverted environmental and climate spending to the gas and coal companies and and now we have Sky condoning violence against protests.

And we wonder how we ended up in an energy crisis where the gas and coal companies could hold the entire nation to ransom charging whatever the hell they wanted for gas, coal and energy?

If Australia had not diddled for 9 years, if Australia had not caved entirely to the gas and coal companies which by the way are 97% foreign owned and pay SFA tax or royalties, then maybe we might not be in this crisis.

People absolutely have a right to be pissed off and protest.

This is not democracy.

OK , so if i go around and throw some concrete, trash someone's bike and yell at people it'll all be good , great.

( The protest has the stated goal to raise awareness about global warming and how it caused the bushfires etc , not sure that awareness is the biggest issue right now, it also won't really affect the largest "global" emitters in the slightest ).

My opinion is that the energy shortage is purely a result of the privatised electricity producers responding to economics, without having the previous mandate ( under state ownership ) to provide Electricity for Australians all the time.
Adding more Solar to the mix ( Solar is the easiest payback ) will make the crisis worse.

I have no idea what the protesters think about the issue, except apparently doing nothing is not good. I agree , but 50 noisy people hurling blocks of concrete seems to be neither constructive , nor indicative of a popular movement.

 

[CM86]

I have no idea

Well said.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

i am a dumb dumb.

OK

 

[SaintsSeptember]

So the driver has copped a $480ish fine for driving their car into the protestors, some of who are looking at jail time and $22k fines under the new legislation that NSW recently passed.

What a great free democracy we live in where protesting inaction on climate change is considered worse than driving your car into protestors

Seems strange, it was reported as fined for Negligent Driving.

Serious driving offences and penalties

A serious driving offence is when a person drives a vehicle in a way that causes, or is likely to cause, death or serious injury.

www.nsw.gov.au

Would seem that it should have been "Reckless Driving"

• seriously endangers other road users and community members
• creates an obvious and serious risk of causing physical injury to other road users

I'd have thought that the charge should be close to the maximum ( $2200 ).
Disqualification without a court order 3 years.

Jail time should at least be considered.

 

[Gralin]

Seems strange, it was reported as fined for Negligent Driving.

Serious driving offences and penalties

A serious driving offence is when a person drives a vehicle in a way that causes, or is likely to cause, death or serious injury.

www.nsw.gov.au

Would seem that it should have been "Reckless Driving"

• seriously endangers other road users and community members
• creates an obvious and serious risk of causing physical injury to other road users

I'd have thought that the charge should be close to the maximum ( $2200 ).
Disqualification without a court order 3 years.

Jail time should at least be considered.

Yeah funny how the government and the cops are going easy on the driver and hard on the climate protestors

Almost like they want to send the message that blocking the road is worse than running someone over....

 

[CM86]

Yeah funny how the government and the cops are going easy on the driver and hard on the climate protestors

Almost like they want to send the message that blocking the road is worse than running someone over....

Not that they condone it, or anything. Of course.

bhut...