The cull 06

[tigerdan]

You'd have to think we'll see no more than 6 guys leave the list at the end of the year, through delisting and retiring. I would expect us to trade for 1-2 players and draft 4-5.

That means those who want to banish everyone who played poorly last week will be disappointed.

I think it's likely that guys like Tivendale, Hall, Krakoeur and Rodan will remain on the list. They would have almost no trade value, especially since such low profile players could be delisted by richmond and then invited to train at another club over the preseason.

I would be amazed if we delisted a player who is under contract. That achieves very little and costs us money. It's not like Rodan is a bad influence at the club and must be shipped on no matter what (like Zantuck was).

We'll have a few guys retire, and a few young guys get delisted. On top of that we may lose a player in a trade. That's about it.

There's no point in delisting for delisting's sake. And I would be very surprised if any other club is interested in trading for Greg Tivendale. He'll stay on the list because he's not old enough to retire and not good enough to be wanted elsewhere. There's also worse players than him on the list, who will get the boot first.

 

[metallichris]

Moore- Unskilled? Definately not, probably one of the highest skilled players at Punt rd.

Easy, Tambo.

Stafford - Retire
Hall - Delist (no one would pick him up in a trade)
Rodan - Will remain as he is contracted until the end of 2007
Roach - I'd rather him have one more year to show his worth. In Round 3 he made the senior team to only be set back by a broken jaw.
Jackson - Will probably get one more year to prove himself, being introduced to AFL at a later stage that most.
Gaspar - Will remain, we don't have any better key position players down back and will be needed to help shoulder the load.
Tivendale - Will remain, has bad games, but can get the pill.
Knobel - Will stay as a back-up ruckman.
Chaffey - Who knows? I'd rather him be delisted. Isn't a part of the future.

 

[woodydrake]

Tivendale
Gasper
Tvendale
Roach
Tivendale
Rodan
Tivendale
Stafford
Tivendale
Hall
Tivendale

Did I mention Tivendale????????

 

[Crumden]

You'd have to think we'll see no more than 6 guys leave the list at the end of the year, through delisting and retiring. I would expect us to trade for 1-2 players and draft 4-5.

That means those who want to banish everyone who played poorly last week will be disappointed.

I think it's likely that guys like Tivendale, Hall, Krakoeur and Rodan will remain on the list. They would have almost no trade value, especially since such low profile players could be delisted by richmond and then invited to train at another club over the preseason.

I would be amazed if we delisted a player who is under contract. That achieves very little and costs us money. It's not like Rodan is a bad influence at the club and must be shipped on no matter what (like Zantuck was).

We'll have a few guys retire, and a few young guys get delisted. On top of that we may lose a player in a trade. That's about it.

There's no point in delisting for delisting's sake. And I would be very surprised if any other club is interested in trading for Greg Tivendale. He'll stay on the list because he's not old enough to retire and not good enough to be wanted elsewhere. There's also worse players than him on the list, who will get the boot first.

That pretty well sums it up.

 

[Crumden]

...I dont see why people have Rodan on their list before Roach. IMO, Roach has been far more dissapointing, and has had twice the opportunity.

How do you figure that one tom? Rodan has played 65 games to Roaches 10.

 

[Tambo]

Tambo.

Rodan is much quick enough. His pace and strength are his two qualitys. Im not sure where you got the idea that he is slow from. Its his skill and decision making that will be his demise, but he has another year to serve so he sint going anywhere.

Moore is certainly on that list of "under considerations". I would personally like to see him given another year but you can hardly blame people for including him in the delistments. He has been on the list a few years and shown next to nothing despite a few oppourtunitys in the seniors. Granted he has had to deal with injurys but so did Rory Hilton.....

Rodan is pacey for his first few metres, then is easily tracked down, hence the reason why he never holds the ball more than a few seconds. Endurance is not up with it.

Moore is in the lucky situation where we have a struggling defence. If we had a half decent solid defence, I too would agree he has next to no chance to playing in 07. However Gas is under clouds, Chaffey is also, Kellaway has only a few years providing he has no injuries, Hall is disapointing (little skills), Thursfield is returning from a knee reco, Mcguane hasn't quite made it, Newman is a midfielder stuck in defence who is also going to take some time to return, Raines-Roach-White-JON are running defenders, don't have the height Moore and Mcguane have and finally the Bowden bro's who are attacking defenders and barely have a defending style to their game.

Moore, (luckily for himself) should keep his spot by default. We clearly lack depth in defence. Although he hasn't quite reached AFL regularly, he is still required as stated above.


Mettalichris, Moore's skills are quite easily in top 10, probably close to top 5 of our team. TW himself rates Moore as one of the highest skilled in the Tiger line-up. His decision making has let him down on few occasions, but his skills are not to be doubted.

 

[Heisenberg_]

Tivendale- high skill level is a total myth
Moore- dont think he has what it takes
Rodan- not AFL standard
Stafford- retire

 

[The BRICKSTER]

Tivendale, it may look like he can kick, but he can't
Stafford, retire
Gaspar, retire,
Hall Trade/delist
Rodan Trade
Krakour Trade (too hot and cold)


Knobels good i think may be unco but he was one of the reasons st kilda were doing so well a few years back

 

[rfctigerarmy]

Tambo.

Rodan is much quick enough. His pace and strength are his two qualitys. Im not sure where you got the idea that he is slow from. Its his skill and decision making that will be his demise, but he has another year to serve so he sint going anywhere.

Rodan's slow. How often do you see him outrun or run down a player?

Dont get the rate his legs go and the ground he covers mixed up.

Oh and I laugh at all these people who dont watch the VFL often and make choices based on what they've seen at AFL level.

 

[Kurtis G]

Rodan's slow. How often do you see him outrun or run down a player?

Dont get the rate his legs go and the ground he covers mixed up.

Oh and I laugh at all these people who dont watch the VFL often and make choices based on what they've seen at AFL level.

If you are refering to me then I dont think you have any grounds to judge how much VFL I watch.

If not then my apologies.

 

[Kurtis G]

Rodan is pacey for his first few metres, then is easily tracked down, hence the reason why he never holds the ball more than a few seconds. Endurance is not up with it.

Moore is in the lucky situation where we have a struggling defence. If we had a half decent solid defence, I too would agree he has next to no chance to playing in 07. However Gas is under clouds, Chaffey is also, Kellaway has only a few years providing he has no injuries, Hall is disapointing (little skills), Thursfield is returning from a knee reco, Mcguane hasn't quite made it, Newman is a midfielder stuck in defence who is also going to take some time to return, Raines-Roach-White-JON are running defenders, don't have the height Moore and Mcguane have and finally the Bowden bro's who are attacking defenders and barely have a defending style to their game.

Moore, (luckily for himself) should keep his spot by default. We clearly lack depth in defence. Although he hasn't quite reached AFL regularly, he is still required as stated above.


Mettalichris, Moore's skills are quite easily in top 10, probably close to top 5 of our team. TW himself rates Moore as one of the highest skilled in the Tiger line-up. His decision making has let him down on few occasions, but his skills are not to be doubted.

Fair points on Moore, but you make our defence sound so bad

 

[tigerT]

Stafford
Hall
Chaffey
Humm
Tivendale

I think Gaspar needs to stay on one more season, I'd take him over Razor anyday. Tiver will stay on, but really this guy is a dud, just turns the ball over too much and is severely lacking in the decision making department. Humm is a goer but has horrible skills. Chaffey we can move forward without.

I don't think we are in a position to be culling players like Roach, Jackson and Moore just yet. Of those 3 I have serious doubts over Roach but he needs to be given a fair crack next season, injury probably saved his imminent appraisal this season.


On notice one more year
Rodan
Roach
Jackson
Moore
McGuane
Limbach
Gaspar(ret)

 

[the arrogance]

Your joking right?


Moore- Unskilled? Definately not, probably one of the highest skilled players at Punt rd. Mcguane Soft? He's a pretty hard nut for a backman. No future? You will probably more than likely see both guys on our list due to lack of backs. Particularly those with height.

You clearly have no idea/ don't watch the development (VFL/Training)

Obviously you only watch AFL level.

u r a not serious are u mate? look if moore was up to the afl level and if mooe had the skill that u said then he wouldn't have got dropped last week. We have so many injuries in the back line, and even with these injuries he doesn get picked. He cant be as good as you say he is.

Look it doesn't matter if we go to training or not because i play footyball of a high level and i will tell you that anyone can kick the ball straight or take a mark at training because there is not pressure like there is on game day. All that matters is game day and if he can play on game day then he is not good enough.

So get off rainsy's back because from reading his responses he knows what he is taking about.

 

[tugga]

As True Thylacine said earlier on, it's all very well to put a line through half a dozen players who you don't think are good enough, but who do you replace them with? I'll tell you who. Six picks in the draft means means roughly picks 7, 23, 39, 55, 71, 87, not accounting for priority picks for other clubs and assuming we finish 10th. So effectively you are replacing six players with those picks in the draft. The draft is a lottery and yes good players can be had low down, but what are the chances of striking the pot of gold with picks 55, 71 and 87 for example? Think about it before you type.

 

[Goldust]

As True Thylacine said earlier on, it's all very well to put a line through half a dozen players who you don't think are good enough, but who do you replace them with? I'll tell you who. Six picks in the draft means means roughly picks 7, 23, 39, 55, 71, 87, not accounting for priority picks for other clubs and assuming we finish 10th. So effectively you are replacing six players with those picks in the draft. The draft is a lottery and yes good players can be had low down, but what are the chances of striking the pot of gold with picks 55, 71 and 87 for example? Think about it before you type.

SPOT on! No doubt some fool will trot out the ol' chestnut of "well, Essendon got James Hird with pick 70 odd in the draft" line....but fact is that for every James Hird taken between picks 40 to 80, there are 38 or 39 Billy Nicholls', Martin McGrath's, Daniel Sipthorp's and Adam Houlihan's taken. So don't go thinking for one minute the solution is to offload eight or nine players....especially given we have a somewhat young list already! Deledio, Tambling, Polo, Meyer, Pattison, Oakley-Nicholls, Hughes, Limbach, McGuane, Casserley, Hughes constitute nearly a third of our list and under 20. Add seven or eight more first year players next year and we could be confused for a college or university team!!!

For what it's worth, four or five additions seems more around the mark. Stafford will retire, making that decision easy. Chaffey will likely retire, if not may not survive the cut. That would leave three others. Think Rodan is in trouble...injuries have been cruel, but has not come on. Would think Humm is in trouble too. Impact has been nil and skills aren't where they should be. And have an inkling Roach is on the outer too. I don't see him making that next step.
So, Stafford, Chaffey, Roach, Rodan and Humm to go.

Tivva to stay.....amazing how he becomes the scapegoat again once we lose a few!!!!!

 

[PHX]

Roach, Hall and Mcguane are 3 to me that must go.

 

[jezza]

Yes, but why keep on players we know aren't good enough? IMO it's far better to cut all the ones we know aren't up to the standard we need, replace them with kids even if they're late draft picks. Then see how they go, keep the ones that are good enough, cut those that aren't and repeat the cycle. We can't live in fear that any future kids we draft won't make it and as a result just hang on to what we've got. We won't get anywhere as a club that way.

Ideally for me right now, I would be looking at:

Retiring: Stafford, Chaffey
Attempt trade: Hall
Delist: Roach, Humm, Hall, Howat, maybe Moore. Seriously look into the cost of cutting Roday.

And move Gaspar on to the veterans list.

That would leave 5 (maybe 6 or 7) spaces free on the main list and 3 spaces free on the rookie list (assuming we keep Graham). I would expect us to pick up one mature player around 24-26 years old, probably PSD or trade.

The big problem for me is injuries. If Gaspar is injured and cut, then I can see us keeping Hall as a backup, and Chaffey as a veteran, which to me isn't a good result for us. Probably would save Moore too due to our shortage of key defenders.

 

[LVAK]

McGuane is virtually a first year player with last years injury and his age.He's been doing OK for Coburg too. Anyone asking for his head follows the 22 not the list.
Jacko is similar but closer to the edge. He also was taken a year early and I don't think that he had a lot of footy experience before that . So he will stay for now.
I know Rodan's still in contract but maybe we could try and trade up a pick or two. Let him go and pay part or all of his wage for a year. Just too annoying after 2 seconds with the ball in his hands.
Maybe try a trade up for Ray Hall as well. Depends upon what happens with Gaspar , Moore and others. Possible delist. Gaspar can be vets listed I think?
Keep Moore for another year. We need those types to pay off. One more year and cross fingers.
Stafford and Chaffey to retire or we'll have to de.....
Roach . Watch for another year.
Tivendale . Wouldn't care if he was delisted. The 'old Richmond' and have replacements for him.
Humm. Gone.

Remember we have drafted alot of kids in 2003 and 2004 that need a few years so I would prefer to hang on and look at weeding more out next year . That's why trading up so opening up a spot but getting a better pick is attractive this year. If we don't the none or two more will have to go.

 

[Tambo]

u r a not serious are u mate? look if moore was up to the afl level and if mooe had the skill that u said then he wouldn't have got dropped last week. We have so many injuries in the back line, and even with these injuries he doesn get picked. He cant be as good as you say he is.

Look it doesn't matter if we go to training or not because i play footyball of a high level and i will tell you that anyone can kick the ball straight or take a mark at training because there is not pressure like there is on game day. All that matters is game day and if he can play on game day then he is not good enough.

So get off rainsy's back because from reading his responses he knows what he is taking about.

Umm you really just made a **** of yourself. Moore is injured, hence the reason why he is out. He will be back in the side next week. (two weeks out according to the HUN. )

Moores gameday? More effective than the whole team in the match against Sydney, yet he still missed out on playing the last qtr.

-6 marks (equal 4th for the team)
-about 10 possessions (in 3qtrs of footy, while playing a defensive role)
-4 tackles, equal 2nd
-only 1 clanger in his last two matches according to pro stats. (The handball to Raines where he go tackled)
-All his kicks in both matches hit their target and were effective
-He kicks long more than he kicks short or handballs combined.
-He is in the teams top 5 runners (huge speed for someone of his height)
-Has only been on the senior list for 2 and a bit years.
-


If he is delisted, it is because he is injury prone.

If you are not skilled how are the team able to move the ball forward and kick goals?

Turnovers give the opposition a chance to goal. So yes, you do need to be highly skilled at AFL level.

He has only played 17 games. If you think about the fact he has been injured for half of the time he's been on our list. 17 games is bugger all to get yourself a name. Ask Pettifer, ask Patrick and Joel Bowden, ask just about any player and I am sure they will quite simply let you know it's bugger all.

Consider the fact that he's never had one solid spot in the side eg thrown in forward, back, wing, centre and back forward in one game is a prime example. He is set with a defensive role to work on. Currently he is doing well.

Raines? I never knocked him. I stated he playes an entirely different role to Moore. He doesn't have the height Moore has. Never once said Raines form is poor. He is going great.

 

[Kurtis G]

Umm you really just made a **** of yourself. Moore is injured, hence the reason why he is out. He will be back in the side next week. (two weeks out according to the HUN. )

Moores gameday? More effective than the whole team in the match against Sydney, yet he still missed out on playing the last qtr.

-6 marks (equal 4th for the team)
-about 10 possessions (in 3qtrs of footy, while playing a defensive role)
-4 tackles, equal 2nd
-only 1 clanger in his last two matches according to pro stats. (The handball to Raines where he go tackled)
-All his kicks in both matches hit their target and were effective
-He kicks long more than he kicks short or handballs combined.
-He is in the teams top 5 runners (huge speed for someone of his height)
-Has only been on the senior list for 2 and a bit years.
-


If he is delisted, it is because he is injury prone.

If you are not skilled how are the team able to move the ball forward and kick goals?

Turnovers give the opposition a chance to goal. So yes, you do need to be highly skilled at AFL level.

He has only played 17 games. If you think about the fact he has been injured for half of the time he's been on our list. 17 games is bugger all to get yourself a name. Ask Pettifer, ask Patrick and Joel Bowden, ask just about any player and I am sure they will quite simply let you know it's bugger all.

Consider the fact that he's never had one solid spot in the side eg thrown in forward, back, wing, centre and back forward in one game is a prime example. He is set with a defensive role to work on. Currently he is doing well.

Raines? I never knocked him. I stated he playes an entirely different role to Moore. He doesn't have the height Moore has. Never once said Raines form is poor. He is going great.

Wow. You really know your Kelvin Moore. Give him another year!

And I think that 'the arrogance' was refering to the poster "Rainsy" not the player.

What is Moores injury?

 

[pettifers.sexy]

Wow. You really know your Kelvin Moore. Give him another year!

And I think that 'the arrogance' was refering to the poster "Rainsy" not the player.

What is Moores injury?

Pretty sure he did a groin.

 

[JohnF]

There's probably about 12 players that warrant arssing, but I think 7 or 8 will do.

Humm
Stafford
Chaffey
Tivendale
Rodan
Moore
Jackson
Roach

Last chance: Howat, Krakouer, Schulz, Meyer, Hall, Gaspar, Kellaway.

 

[Tambo]

Pretty sure he did a groin.

Yep

Earlier on in the pre-season he suffered a groin, however the papers reported it as a hip.

IMO he pushed himself hard to early to try and save his career (in pre-season) while putting himself out for 6-8 weeks. He suffered a slight soreness and did not wan't to risk it again, hence the reason why he spent a few more weeks out.

He should be back this week in place of JON I would asume.

(was in the bests for Coburg last week)

 

[Bentleigh]

There's probably about 12 players that warrant arssing, but I think 7 or 8 will do.

Humm
Stafford
Chaffey
Tivendale
Rodan
Moore
Jackson
Roach

Last chance: Howat, Krakouer, Schulz, Meyer, Hall, Gaspar, Kellaway.

* Tivendale has got too much of the pill to get the ass, im afraid.
* Jackson would be abit stiff. Only a 3rd year player (bottom age, young), was late to the game.
* Krakouer? No chance.
* Schultz? No chance.
* Meyer? 2nd year player.. no chance.
* Hall? Too important to the list to get the ass. mid 20's, verstitle key defender at a pinch under 200cm's. Very little chance, dispite being unco cause we have nothing else on the list. Will be put up for trade (for a 3rd year stright).
* Gaspar will either retire or be retained.
* AK? no chance.

 

[tomthetiger]

There's probably about 12 players that warrant arssing, but I think 7 or 8 will do.

Humm
Stafford
Chaffey
Tivendale
Rodan
Moore
Jackson
Roach

Last chance: Howat, Krakouer, Schulz, Meyer, Hall, Gaspar, Kellaway.

Are you on something? Two are first and second year players, one has been perhaps our best defender this year. COME ONNN.