The Dean Jones appreciation thread!

[big_e]

Just caught up with this thread mate. Site needs more Deano appreciation threads.

I vaguely remember this game. Deano seen as good enough for a World XI but not good enough for our one-day side. He was still in the top handful of one-day players on the planet at the time.

People can say what they like about his sacking from the Test team but he was treated disgracefully by Simmo and that fraud Trevor Hohns.

By this stage he hadn't played for Australia in ODIs for two years, and four years in tests. Given we made the CWC final that year,I reckon team selection was pretty good.

And he played his last game for Australia even before Trevor Hohns was a selector.

Other than that, your post is very accurate.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

By this stage he hadn't played for Australia in ODIs for two years, and four years in tests. Given we made the CWC final that year,I reckon team selection was pretty good.

And he played his last game for Australia even before Trevor Hohns was a selector.

Other than that, your post is very accurate.

He may have played his last game for Australia before Hohns was a selector but he was treated shabbily even after Hohns was appointed. Jones could have scored Bradman-like runs at Shield level and he'd never have been picked.

The fact is he was dropped after topping the averages in Sri Lanka. Mark Waugh kept his spot after four consecutive ducks.

 

[The King!]

the other odd part with jones from memory (i was 12 so could be wrong)

didnt he retire after south africa 1994 tour when he couldnt get a test and maybe even dropped for a one dayer? so wasn't available and then wasnt in the australia or australia a side in 94/95

then i think he wanted to get back for the 96 world cup and played that game for Australia a when steve waugh was skipper, thats on you tube

so i guess to be fair to the 96 selectors if he retired he wasnt available much, but of course he retired after being mucked around a fair bit

eg dropped ahead of M Waugh, then S Waugh who had an inferior record got back (obviously had great careers)

at 52 tests jones had more runs than guys like ponting, the waughs, boon and even border i think?

even if you dropped him from the test side, still one of the best one day batsmen i ever saw

 

[big_e]

He may have played his last game for Australia before Hohns was a selector but he was treated shabbily even after Hohns was appointed. Jones could have scored Bradman-like runs at Shield level and he'd never have been picked.

The fact is he was dropped after topping the averages in Sri Lanka. Mark Waugh kept his spot after four consecutive ducks.

Neither the first nor the last player to be stiffed by selectors.

 

[qman]

the other odd part with jones from memory (i was 12 so could be wrong)

didnt he retire after south africa 1994 tour when he couldnt get a test and maybe even dropped for a one dayer? so wasn't available and then wasnt in the australia or australia a side in 94/95

then i think he wanted to get back for the 96 world cup and played that game for Australia a when steve waugh was skipper, thats on you tube

so i guess to be fair to the 96 selectors if he retired he wasnt available much, but of course he retired after being mucked around a fair bit

eg dropped ahead of M Waugh, then S Waugh who had an inferior record got back (obviously had great careers)

at 52 tests jones had more runs than guys like ponting, the waughs, boon and even border i think?

even if you dropped him from the test side, still one of the best one day batsmen i ever saw

That's the thing mate, he had more runs than those blokes you mentioned. They get the chance to continue on and stack their career record, where as Jones gets ****ed over and remains frozen in time, so to speak. He must still be pissed off deep down.

 

[thejockey]

One of the games great characters .

Saw him play and miss his first 3 balls while sledging the keeper then announcing he was going to take it 'seriously'

140 later on a green top he walked off . Later seen perched at the bar on his own beer in hand , telling anyone who came near him that they nicely and quickly should move on ( not exactly those words )

 

[t_94]

One of the games great characters .

Saw him play and miss his first 3 balls while sledging the keeper then announcing he was going to take it 'seriously'

140 later on a green top he walked off . Later seen perched at the bar on his own beer in hand , telling anyone who came near him that they nicely and quickly should move on ( not exactly those words )

Sounds like a ripping character

 

[DaRick]

Great ODI player, overrated Test player (he was a dead rubber specialist) and unfortunately seemingly such a flawed character that he makes Shane Warne look like Mahatma Gandhi, judging by everything the man has said and done, plus the issues that people around him have had with him.

 

[DaRick]

He may have played his last game for Australia before Hohns was a selector but he was treated shabbily even after Hohns was appointed. Jones could have scored Bradman-like runs at Shield level and he'd never have been picked.

The fact is he was dropped after topping the averages in Sri Lanka. Mark Waugh kept his spot after four consecutive ducks.

I think Jones was treated somewhat harshly by selectors, but longer term I think sticking with Mark Waugh was probably the correct decision, at least in Tests (ODI's are closer, but even then, by the time he was dropped Jones was approaching his mid-30's). He was younger, he was a useful part-time bowler, he was just as good a fielder as Jones if not better, and although he wasn't a great Test batsman, he played a lot more clutch innings IMO. Jones tended to save his best for dead rubbers.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

I think Jones was treated somewhat harshly by selectors, but longer term I think sticking with Mark Waugh was probably the correct decision, at least in Tests (ODI's are closer, but even then, by the time he was dropped Jones was approaching his mid-30's). He was younger, he was a useful part-time bowler, he was just as good a fielder as Jones if not better, and although he wasn't a great Test batsman, he played a lot more clutch innings IMO. Jones tended to save his best for dead rubbers.

Dunno about your last comment but get where you are coming from. Jones made some very big scores when needed. His double ton in India stands out. Test average in the high 40's in a rubbish team batting at 3 before Boony dropped down a spot too.

Hasn't it been said about Mark Waugh, that for all of his talent that he only ever made runs when Australia didn't need them?

 

[Kapow!!!]

Dunno about your last comment but get where you are coming from. Jones made some very big scores when needed. His double ton in India stands out. Test average in the high 40's in a rubbish team batting at 3 before Boony dropped down a spot too.

Hasn't it been said about Mark Waugh, that for all of his talent that he only ever made runs when Australia didn't need them?

I'd suggest his 126 in the fourth test against the West Indies in 95, even though eclipsed by Steve's 200, was perhaps about as important an innings there could possibly be.

 

[DaRick]

Dunno about your last comment but get where you are coming from. Jones made some very big scores when needed. His double ton in India stands out. Test average in the high 40's in a rubbish team batting at 3 before Boony dropped down a spot too.

Hasn't it been said about Mark Waugh, that for all of his talent that he only ever made runs when Australia didn't need them?

Yes, his 210 was a legendary innings, agreed.

A cursory look at Jones' Test career indicates that he averaged around 90 in the 5th and 6th Tests of a series (from a sample size of 7 Tests, but still) - including his highest score of 216. To be fair though, he also averaged 57 in the 2nd Test of a series - and there were some genuinely important centuries besides the one you listed too (the 100* against SL, the twin centuries against PAK at Adelaide in 1989/90). So the truth is a little more complex.

Mark Waugh's average in the 5th and 6th Tests of a series was around 46 (from a sample size of 12 Tests). One of those Tests was live too (the one in 1997 against ENG where he scored 68 in the first innings). But while he did pretty well, he didn't pad his stats the way Jones did.

Mark Waugh scored 20 Test centuries. I rate the following as clutch, or at least important:
- 138 vs ENG, 1990/91 (gave AUS a big lead over ENG, helped us secure the Ashes)
- 112 vs WI, 1992/93 (set up a 1-0 series lead for AUS)
- 113* vs SA, 1993/94 (prevented us from losing the series over there)
- 140 vs ENG, 1994/95 (set up a 1-0 series lead for AUS alongside Slater's 176)
- 126 vs WI, 1994/95 ('nuff said)
- 116 vs SA, 1996/97 (one of the greatest innings by an Australian batsman since 1990 IMO)
- 100 vs SA, 1997/98 (set up a 1-0 series lead for AUS)
- 115* vs SA, 1997/98 (secured a series win for AUS)
- 117 vs PAK, 1998/99 (secured a series win for AUS)
- 100 vs PAK, 1999/00 (probably would have won without it, but still helped us secure a 1-0 series lead)
- 119 vs WI, 2000/01 (would most likely have won anyway, but helped us win by an innings)
- 108 vs ENG, 2001 (helped us secure a 2-0 series lead)

There were also many occasions in a live Test match where Mark Waugh failed to score a century, but nonetheless made a contribution that shaped the outcome of the match (the 56 vs SL in 1992/93 and the 88 vs PAK in Hobart in 1995/96 stand out in this regard). But then the same would apply to Jones, but IMO to a lesser degree. Plus you have to consider the catches that M Waugh could pull off right when AUS needed them (the one off Inzamam in Hobart in 1999/00) and the wickets he could nip out.

The issue I have with Mark Waugh was that he failed to do justice to his talent in Tests and succumbed to far too many lazy dismissals after contributing a neat little cameo, not that he saved his best for dead rubbers.

 

[revo333]

Sounds like a ripping character

His Dad sounded like a ripping character as well.

 

[revo333]

Hasn't it been said about Mark Waugh, that for all of his talent that he only ever made runs when Australia didn't need them?

Only ever made runs that didn't count is a little harsh but his reputation in that regards is fair.

The stats don't say it but he did seem to go out cheaply too many times.

 

[revo333]

didnt he retire after south africa 1994 tour when he couldnt get a test and maybe even dropped for a one dayer? so wasn't available and then wasnt in the australia or australia a side in 94/95

I think he spoke to Border and found out he probably wasn't going to play any games so his reaction was 'What am I doing here if I am not going to play?'

 

[Dipper]

Phil Tufnell who is amusingly self depreciating when talking about his career, especially his nerves, was talking about an England tour to Australia, must have been 90/91 and he said something to the effect that his confidence was shot and '...when you've got Dean Jones already 3 paces down the wicket before you've even let go of the ball...'.



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