The Denis Pagan Era and its legacy

[Knox Harrington]

No better than Matthew knights
Great one on one developer.
Hopeless strategically.
Carey got his flags for him.
And they beat a pus Carlton side in 99 too
Gifting his son Ryan games and bringing back washed up Mick Martyn.
Master strategist my foot

 

[Yojimbo]

And they beat a pus Carlton side in 99 too

I can't seem to remember who Carlton beat in the Preliminary Final in 1999 must have been a puss side, i
think they beat the minor premier who went 18-4 for the year, can't recall who it was.

 

[The Warlord]

No better than Matthew knights
Great one on one developer.
Hopeless strategically.
Carey got his flags for him.
And they beat a pus Carlton side in 99 too
Gifting his son Ryan games and bringing back washed up Mick Martyn.
Master strategist my foot

That's why there's a coaching strategy named after him that still gets referenced today.

 

[The Warlord]

I can't seem to remember who Carlton beat in the Preliminary Final in 1999 must have been a puss side, i
think they beat the minor premier who went 18-4 for the year, can't recall who it was.

The same team that choked in the 96 prelim? The one we beat in the 98 finals after they'd done that thing where they puff themselves up?

FWIW the best game of that era was North v Dogs Rd22 1998.

 

[Robertio]

That's why there's a coaching strategy named after him that still gets referenced today.

They named Pagans Paddock after Wayne Carey.

 

[Yojimbo]

FWIW the best game of that era was North v Dogs Rd22 1998.

Round 22: 1998
North Melbourne: 17-11-113 Defeated The Western Bulldogs: 16-12-108

Brownlow Votes: 3- A.Stevens, 2- S.Wynd, 1- G.Archer

North: 183 Kicks, 95 Handballs, 278 Disposals.
Bulldogs: 193 Kicks, 102 Handballs, 295 Disposals.

D.P.G: North 16.35, Bulldogs 18.44
D.P.S.S: North 9.93, Bulldogs 10.54

North Goals: Wayne Carey 4, Brent Harvey 3, Corey McKernan 2
Bulldogs Goals: Chris Grant 4, Paul Hudson 4

James Cook: 1 Goal, 4 Behinds, Did not discover Australia on this day James Cook.

Different time, when football was innocent and free.

 

[Buzzasto DaSilva]

The fact that Pagan is Carlton's second best coach of the past twenty years makes it surprising that their supporters are so desperate to slag him off in this thread.

Pagan was a brilliant coach and it's a shame he's not still involved with the game today, but it seems likes loving the real estate business.

 

[The Warlord]

Round 22: 1998
North Melbourne: 17-11-113 Defeated The Western Bulldogs: 16-12-108

Brownlow Votes: 3- A.Stevens, 2- S.Wynd, 1- G.Archer

North: 183 Kicks, 95 Handballs, 278 Disposals.
Bulldogs: 193 Kicks, 102 Handballs, 295 Disposals.

D.P.G: North 16.35, Bulldogs 18.44
D.P.S.S: North 9.93, Bulldogs 10.54

North Goals: Wayne Carey 4, Brent Harvey 3, Corey McKernan 2
Bulldogs Goals: Chris Grant 4, Paul Hudson 4

James Cook: 1 Goal, 4 Behinds, Did not discover Australia on this day James Cook.

Different time, when football was innocent and free.

IIRC a very young Boomer Harvey kicked the sealer.

 

[Yojimbo]

The fact that Pagan is Carlton's second best coach of the past twenty years makes it surprising that their supporters are so desperate to slag him off in this thread.

Pagan was a brilliant coach and it's a shame he's not still involved with the game today, but it seems likes loving the real estate business.

He is actually going for his horse trainers full license at the moment, always been his passion.

 

[FRUMPY]

The fact that Pagan is Carlton's second best coach of the past twenty years makes it surprising that their supporters are so desperate to slag him off in this thread.

Pagan was a brilliant coach and it's a shame he's not still involved with the game today, but it seems likes loving the real estate business.

How'd did you come up with 2nd best in past 20 years (2000-2019)?

Guessing winning % is the easiest/quickest way to look at it:
Brett Ratten - 51.29%
Mick Malthouse - 37.5%
Wayne Brittain - 38.64%
Denis Pagan - 25.00%
Brendan Bolton - 20.78%

Only coach he was better as was Bolton (havnt included caretaker coaches Barker & Teague)

I dont think he's record at Carlton takes anything away from his legacy - he is a very good career coach (u19's reserves and AFL) - won 2 flags but probably could/should have got more out of the side he had in the mid-late 90's. Got very lucky Essendon choked in the 99 prelim as well.

 

[Yojimbo]

How'd did you come up with 2nd best in past 20 years (2000-2019)?

Guessing winning % is the easiest/quickest way to look at it:
Brett Ratten - 51.29%
Mick Malthouse - 37.5%
Wayne Brittain - 38.64%
Denis Pagan - 25.00%
Brendan Bolton - 20.78%

Only coach he was better as was Bolton (havnt included caretaker coaches Barker & Teague)

I dont think he's record at Carlton takes anything away from his legacy - he is a very good career coach (u19's reserves and AFL) - won 2 flags but probably could/should have got more out of the side he had in the mid-late 90's. Got very lucky Essendon choked in the 99 prelim as well.

If you look at his last two years at North Melbourne he was just hanging on to 50% and he was done, ego
and money are powerful tempters, but Carlton made a mistake and then backed it up with Mick Malthouse
just to prove it was not a fluke. Not your finest moments as a football club, full stop.

 

[FRUMPY]

If you look at his last two years at North Melbourne he was just hanging on to 50% and he was done, ego
and money are powerful tempters, but Carlton made a mistake and then backed it up with Mick Malthouse
just to prove it was not a fluke. Not your finest moments as a football club, full stop.

When i was writing those percentages it did make me sad - when will it end haha

 

[Yojimbo]

When i was writing those percentages it did make me sad - when will it end haha

I think you are on the right track at the moment, David Teague is a good choice for coach onwards and
upwards hopefully.

 

[Buzzasto DaSilva]

How'd did you come up with 2nd best in past 20 years (2000-2019)?

Guessing winning % is the easiest/quickest way to look at it:
Brett Ratten - 51.29%
Mick Malthouse - 37.5%
Wayne Brittain - 38.64%
Denis Pagan - 25.00%
Brendan Bolton - 20.78%

Only coach he was better as was Bolton (havnt included caretaker coaches Barker & Teague)

I dont think he's record at Carlton takes anything away from his legacy - he is a very good career coach (u19's reserves and AFL) - won 2 flags but probably could/should have got more out of the side he had in the mid-late 90's. Got very lucky Essendon choked in the 99 prelim as well.

Brittain and Malthouse took your club backwards at a rapid rate. At least Pagan stabilised the ship and their downfall stagnated under him.

 

[The Warlord]

I think you are on the right track at the moment, David Teague is a good choice for coach onwards and
upwards hopefully.

The David Teague that Pagan traded for when he was Carlton coach?

If Carlton win a flag under Teague, then the premise of this thread if magnified.

 

[Beerfish]

He is actually going for his horse trainers full license at the moment, always been his passion.

Well he's already had some experience training horses so this is no surprise.

 

[The Warlord]

Well he's already had some experience training horses so this is no surprise.

Well, his most successful protege was a duck, should he be duck racing too?

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Was ahead of the curve with pagans paddock. Was quickly found out when teams started flooding. Never had any other game plan

 

[Cuzz09]

Loved when Adam Simpson knocked Pagans hand away for a handshake then pulled him in for a hug.

On SM-G925I using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[The Warlord]

Was ahead of the curve with pagans paddock. Was quickly found out when teams started flooding. Never had any other game plan

You do know Pagan's Paddock only began in 1998?

That he'd already won a flag with non game plan?

 

[Cuzz09]

"Dont piss down my neck and tell me its raining". Not his originally, but the only time ive heard it at a presser

Yeah great line. Only ever heard him say it

On SM-G925I using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Yojimbo]

Was ahead of the curve with pagans paddock. Was quickly found out when teams started flooding. Never had any other game plan

Did Clarkson take his dominant team to seven Preliminary Finals in a row ?

Note: I know the answer already no need to answer.

 

[The Warlord]

Loved when Adam Simpson knocked Pagans hand away for a handshake then pulled him in for a hug.

On SM-G925I using BigFooty.com mobile app

Simmo has taken the good from what he learned with Denis, and abandoned the bad.

 

[blueboy25]

Did Clarkson take his dominant team to seven Preliminary Finals in a row ?

Note: I know the answer already no need to answer.

North lost 4 of those prelims and 3 of only one was close which the Geelong one in 94.
Lost by 62 in 95
Lost by 31 in 98
Lost by 50 in 2000

 

[carloss]

Nah, I reckon Denis put $$$ over his pride.

He knew Carlton were his one last payday and took it.

Knowing they'd be s**t.

Wasn't Denis a Carlton supporter and that was part of the reason?