The Dilemma on pick 2

[Demon Revival]

Watching the game tonight & seeing the lions midfield delivery to the forwards, you naturally think that we should go with Trengove, but as the ball is in the air you realise that a big bodied target is so important as a target, so imagining our target being Butcher (playing the role role of Bradshaw or Brown) immediately enters your mind...

So what is more important for us??????

 

[Bartram_Class]

Butcher isn't a Bradshaw or a Brown though. He's a KPP, but so is Juice; we need a quality KPP.

If Butcher is good enough, we'll take him, but if not, Trengove.

 

[Dez!]

Trengove.

His kicking will be instrumental to improving our delivery into the forward line, you don't need superstars in the forward line to be successful. Tom Hawkins and Cameron Mooney for example aren't superstars by any stretch of the imagination and they do just fine for the Cats because of the dominant midfield and the excellent supply they get.

 

[cannons]

Apparently Butcher was poor today. Kicked 0.3 and didn't provide any second efforts or defensive pressure when the ball hit the ground.

In that same match, Scully was named BOG, and won the match for his team in the last. Apparently he didn't play in the centre until the last quarter, but when he did, he played exceedingly well when the match was there to be won, getting the vital clearances out of the middle.

I'm not sure how Trengove played overall, but he did manage 2 goals for Sturt in the SANFL. I'm very much leaning towards him at the moment, but I'm not totally discounting Butcher just yet.

 

[Bartram_Class]

Anyone else a bit disconcerted by the Butcher-Kosi comparisons?

 

[Dez!]

Apparently Butcher was poor today. Kicked 0.3 and didn't provide any second efforts or defensive pressure when the ball hit the ball.

In that same match, Scully was named BOG, and won the match for his team in the last. Apparently he didn't play in the centre until the last quarter, but when he did, he played exceedingly well when the match was there to be won, getting the vital clearances out of the middle.

I'm not sure how Trengove played overall, but he did manage 2 goals for Sturt in the SANFL. I'm very much leaning towards him at the moment, but I'm not totally discounting Butcher just yet.

Exactly what we need a clearance machine, I can't believe we're going to get this kid and then we even have the next pick after to get another gun.

Awesome.

 

[master bate]

Anyone else a bit disconcerted by the Butcher-Kosi comparisons?

Yes, Kosi spends half his time as a liability for the Saints, getting in the way of Riewoldt.

Anyone who thinks Watts and Jurrah forward line can't do the trick only needs to watch two pieces of footage:

1. The Cats winning a grand final by 119 odd points with Nablett and Mooney
2. Jack Watts taking big pack marks in the VicM U18 game at the dome last year.

That said if they go with Butcher I'm willing to support the decision unconditionally for 3 years, after which if Butcher is a spud and Trengove dominating I'll be angry!

 

[melbournemartin]

Big power forwards win Grand Finals?

When was the last time there was a bag of goals kicked in a Grand Final? From memory, Aker kicking 5 in 2003 was the biggest this decade.

Big key forwards are important, and we have one in the making with Watts, but having a class midfield is more important

Essendon 2000: Hird, Caracella, Misiti, Blumfield, Long
Brisbane 2001-2003: Voss, Black, Power, Akermanis, Lappin
Port 2004: Burgoyne x2, Carr, Cornes cbf thinking of any others but you get the drift
Sydney 2005: O'Keefe, Kirk, Bolton, Goodes, Kennelly
West Coast: 2006: Cousins, Judd, Kerr, Embley
Geelong 2007: Selwood, Corey, Bartel, Ablett, Ling, Enright
Hawthorn 2008: Mitchell, Sewell, Bateman, Hodge, Rioli, Young

Melbourne 2011: Davey, Scully, Blease, Trengove, McLean, Jones, Moloney

 

[omit]

Melbourne 2011: Grimes (c), Davey, Scully, Blease, Trengove, McLean, Jones, Moloney

Fixed it for you

 

[deeman12]

Trengove easily. Our forward line should be fine with Jurrah, Watts, Petterd, Wonnas and Davey freed up to play there.

We might also steal a good KPP at pick 18.

 

[stickman11]

There would have to be questions about Butcher by now - you need more than ability.

 

[melbournemartin]

Fixed it for you

Ahh. How sloppy of me. There will also be Cale Morton on the wing marking the kickins and then kicking 60 metre bullets to Watts and Jurrah on the lead.

 

[cannons]

Ahh. How sloppy of me. There will also be Cale Morton on the wing marking the kickins and then kicking 60 metre bullets to Watts and Jurrah on the lead.

All sounds very impressive, and we haven't even mentioned Sylvia yet

 

[Dez!]

Trengove easily. Our forward line should be fine with Jurrah, Watts, Petterd, Wonnas and Davey freed up to play there.

We might also steal a good KPP at pick 18.

You missed the Master, THE MASTER!!!!!!

 

[The Flash]

Trengove.

His kicking will be instrumental to improving our delivery into the forward line, you don't need superstars in the forward line to be successful. Tom Hawkins and Cameron Mooney for example aren't superstars by any stretch of the imagination and they do just fine for the Cats because of the dominant midfield and the excellent supply they get.

Dez youve summed it up perfectly, Im now convinced Trengove is the way to go. Precision like passing into the forward line can make even Juice look good. I say take the 2 mids, and with #18 take the best available KPF. In the meantime play Greeny as our FF where he could play until our #18 is ready for that FF spot (2-3 years away), where we can develope him properly. Jurrah should be played at HF. Have Watts and Wona as our pockets.
HF Jurrah Bate Jetta
FF Wona Green Watts
IMO thats the perfect setup

 

[omit]

the question is

do we want Watts to play out of the goal square as a more traditional FF or as a lead up CHF in the ilk of Reiwoldt?

FF - we go for Trengove
CHF - we go for Butcher

I guess it really depends on how Bailey wants the team to line up and the structures he wants to use

of course there could always be a good kpp available at 18

 

[RandB]

Trengove easily. Our forward line should be fine with Jurrah, Watts, Petterd, Wonnas and Davey freed up to play there.

We might also steal a good KPP at pick 18.

Surely this is a must if we go with Trengove (who appears to be the best option).

Despite the emergence of Petterd (who I like) and the prospect of Wona returning I still think we are short of a decent tall atm who can share the load with Watts. Jurah is a freak as it is but if we can get him on shorter opponents week in week out with the other forwards taking the keys then that would be awesome.

 

[DeesFan]

Just throwing it out there but what about Tippet for pick 2? This way Crows will get Trentgrove - which they will do. They also have enough forward power that it may be something they would think about. Melbourne also get someone that can add value straight away and give time for Watts to come along.

 

[The Flash]

Just throwing it out there but what about Tippet for pick 2? This way Crows will get Trentgrove - which they will do. They also have enough forward power that it may be something they would think about. Melbourne also get someone that can add value straight away and give time for Watts to come along.

Tippet would be awesome, but from all reports he wants to goto the new GC team.

 

[cannons]

A quick note on Trengove's game yesterday, taken from another forum:

Just had a quick look at the paper.Trengoves stats. 14 kicks,6 handballs,3 marks & 2 goals & was named in Sturts best players

Looks like another impressive performance from Jack in the SANFL, so he certainly firming as the number 2 pick due to his recent efforts.

 

[omit]

Just throwing it out there but what about Tippet for pick 2? This way Crows will get Trentgrove - which they will do. They also have enough forward power that it may be something they would think about. Melbourne also get someone that can add value straight away and give time for Watts to come along.

Tippet is worth more than pick 2

arguably the best young kpp in the game and will be a power forward for many years to come.

and if he wants to go back to the GC as has been reported, they'll probably be able to get 2 top 10 picks for him

 

[thetank]

I'm not completely sold on the fact that an A+ midfield was the main driver of Geelong's success in 2007-2008 (and at the same time, justifies Melbourne in not drafting the best forward structure we can).

You all are forgetting that Geelong has had the best defence in the past few seasons - the stingiest, with incredible rebounding from Scarlett, Milburn, Harley and Enright. It is also largely because of their defence that Geelong was able to get away with having an average set of KPFs. Geelong would trade away Jimmy Bartel or Joel Selwood for Jonathan Brown in a second, in my opinion. Melbourne, we won't have as good a defence. We need tilt the advantage to our favour elsewhere. To me, we have our Steve Johnson in Jurrah, and we have Jack Watts as our CHF/FF. We're missing the other strong forward (someone hopefully can kick better than Tom Hawkins).

This is the last chance we have of getting a potential elite KPF for the next few years and really attempt to stretch opposing defences. And free up Jurrah.

Chances are that our pick at no. 18 will be a journeyman, average-level KPF. We can still unravel a very good/gun mid at 18 (who here is not excited about Sam Blease?). And, we can still pick a very good/gun mid in the 2010 draft at around pick 10-15.

 

[Carnthe]

Big power forwards win Grand Finals?

When was the last time there was a bag of goals kicked in a Grand Final? From memory, Aker kicking 5 in 2003 was the biggest this decade.

Don't underestimate the fact that key forwards force defenders to actually defend rather than leave their man when the ball is in the air and double team other forwards, or link up and offer run out of defence.

From an outsiders point of view I reckon you guys should take Butcher. But it just depends whether you reckon you've already got your midfield covered with Scully, Sylvia, McLean, Grimes, Morton, Blease, Valenti - alot of unknown quantities in there and you guys would know your midfield better than me.

But look at Carlton last night, even when your midfield is on top you need options up forward. You guys have certainly struggled for forward options lately. Watts and Jurrah look good, but what if one of them goes down? I just think with Butcher and Watts up forward your structure would be set.

 

[00Stinger]

You all are forgetting that Geelong has had the best defence in the past few seasons - the stingiest, with incredible rebounding from Scarlett, Milburn, Harley and Enright. It is also largely because of their defence that Geelong was able to get away with having an average set of KPFs. Geelong would trade away Jimmy Bartel or Joel Selwood for Jonathan Brown in a second, in my opinion. Melbourne, we won't have as good a defence. We need tilt the advantage to our favour elsewhere. To me, we have our Steve Johnson in Jurrah, and we have Jack Watts as our CHF/FF. We're missing the other strong forward (someone hopefully can kick better than Tom Hawkins).

I feelour defence will be one of the best in the league in a couple of years. Our backline has some awesome talent.
So we should build our midfield up and the rest will take care of its self

 

[KTLK]

Pick 2 = Butcher.

You won't get another quality KPP like Butcher in the 2010 + 2011 draft with all the picks goes to GC and WS. Chances of getting another quality midfielder equivalent to Trengrove during these 2 years draft is much higher than Butcher.

Butcher