Strategy The DRAW and Pyke --- crazy, like a fox ...?

[CrowBloke]

I've been thinking about that amazing draw all week.
The Jekyll-and-Hyde nature of the draw vs Collingwood didn't make sense on several levels. A team doesn't lose its ability to play well, then get it back after half-time.

Since Brisbane's dominance and the most recent era where Hawthorn flourished, I always felt uneasy playing one of those super-form teams (Geelong, Sydney too) even when we were 5 or 6 goals up because there was always the feeling that they had the belief and the ability to win a game from almost any position, which they often did eg Hawks in 2015.
That belief came from many comebacks, developed over 2 or 3 seasons after surging back from near-impossible situations, to win.

Has anyone been thinking that maybe just maybe, Pykey gave the boys "mixed messages" pre-match, enough to confuse them or get them out of position so that they'd be in a losing position at half-time?
I doubt that he would've wanted them to be 50 points down some minutes into the third quarter, but let's suppose he moved a few magnets, sent out better/different instructions and structures much closer to what he really wanted, then waited for a fightback which, if successful, would instill tremendous self-belief in the group.
There was in fact a double-fightback by the Crows, first after they were 50 points down, then later in the last when they were 22 points down after leading by 3.

I can't remember a time when a Crows team came back from 50 points down to snatch a tie (nearly a win) and the team now knows that if they are within 7 or 8 goals of the lead, they can still win the game.
A loss to Collingwood would've been the kick up the butt they needed to fire them up for the last 4 games, but a tie/win from a losing position would've been even better.
So, was it just an aberration, or a plan by Pyke to get the team behind then pull a few strings to see if they could fight their way out of it?

P.S. I reckon a few tennis champions have used a similar tactic against weaker opposition, playing "safe" tennis to be 3-0 or 4-0 (or similar) down, then lift a notch to surge back and claim the set ie it gives them "practice" at fighting back from losing positions.
Navratilova did it, often, Serena Williams and Sampras too.
After training drills my ex-Squash coach used to give me a 7-0 lead in match play to push himself to beat me, which he did.

 

[baldandbroke]

I've been thinking about that amazing draw all week.
The Jekyll-and-Hyde nature of the draw vs Collingwood didn't make sense on several levels. A team doesn't lose its ability to play well, then get it back after half-time.

Since Brisbane's dominance and the most recent era where Hawthorn flourished, I always felt uneasy playing one of those super-form teams (Geelong, Sydney too) even when we were 5 or 6 goals up because there was always the feeling that they had the belief and the ability to win a game from almost any position, which they often did eg Hawks in 2015.
That belief came from many comebacks, developed over 2 or 3 seasons after surging back from near-impossible situations, to win.

Has anyone been thinking that maybe just maybe, Pykey gave the boys "mixed messages" pre-match, enough to confuse them or get them out of position so that they'd be in a losing position at half-time?
I doubt that he would've wanted them to be 50 points down some minutes into the third quarter, but let's suppose he moved a few magnets, sent out better/different instructions and structures much closer to what he really wanted, then waited for a fightback which, if successful, would instill tremendous self-belief in the group.
There was in fact a double-fightback by the Crows, first after they were 50 points down, then later in the last when they were 22 points down after leading by 3.

I can't remember a time when a Crows team came back from 50 points down to snatch a tie (nearly a win) and the team now knows that if they are within 7 or 8 goals of the lead, they can still win the game.
A loss to Collingwood would've been the kick up the butt they needed to fire them up for the last 4 games, but a tie/win from a losing position would've been even better.
So, was it just an aberration, or a plan by Pyke to get the team behind then pull a few strings to see if they could fight their way out of it?

P.S. I reckon a few tennis champions have used a similar tactic against weaker opposition, playing "safe" tennis to be 3-0 or 4-0 (or similar) down, then lift a notch to surge back and claim the set ie it gives them "practice" at fighting back from losing positions.
Navratilova did it, often, Serena Williams and Sampras too.
After training drills my ex-Squash coach used to give me a 7-0 lead in match play to push himself to beat me, which he did.

You should not sniff glue for breakfast, stick to spirits and soft drugs.

 

[RodnyDangrfield]

Where's that tin foil hat and tarot cards....

 

[CrowBloke]

You should not sniff glue for breakfast, stick to spirits and soft drugs.

Does LSD count?

Yeah, it's very far-fetched so it probably deserved the first 2 responses.

But wouldn't it be something --- good --- if it was true?

 

[DD#23]

if this is what we're already getting mid-week I can't wait to see what people come up with over the off-season.

 

[CrowBloke]

That draw was bizarre.
When's the last time anyone came back from 50 points down in the third quarter to tie or win the game?
Bizarre events have bizarre causes/reasons.

 

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

 

[AmericanCrow]

CB should be commended for being a good sport about his thread and taking his jabs in stride.

However mate, you need a refresher course on Occam's razor.

They fell behind because they stunk up the joint. They caught them because they woke the hell up.

 

[Deaneus!]

Oh, i reckon he probably wasn't aiming for a draw.

We do get the best of both worlds though, points on the table to ensure we're effectively 2 games ahead of 2nd; plus a giant wake up call.

Navratilova did it, often, Serena Williams and Sampras too

Yeah, one-on-one sport. Too many variables in a fairly even competition to try it, and not with so much on the line.

 

[Deaneus!]

They fell behind because they stunk up the joint.

And remember CrowBloke this is coming from a guy who knows a lot about teams that stink up the joint.

 

[Jack is Back]

That draw was bizarre.
When's the last time anyone came back from 50 points down in the third quarter to tie or win the game?
Bizarre events have bizarre causes/reasons.

Most of the great comebacks relate to teams that should have been well ahead in the first place.

In the 1993 Preliminary Final, Essendon were massive favourites. The odd thing was our 42 point lead at half time rather than their comeback.

Things went according to plan in the second half after Collingwood kicked two quick goals. We outplayed them as expected pre-game and were within a few points six minutes into the last quarter. We should have won it from this point.

The fact that Collingwood then kicked the next three goals was also not unusual in big comebacks when the leading side only needs one goal and they will kick away again.

What was surprising is that we came again and were 5 points down with 10 minutes to play. We should have won it from this point.

Collingwood outplayed us in the last ten minutes and we were very lucky to draw the game.

If this was all part of THE MAESTRO's plan then he could have taught Einstein a thing or two.

P.S. Or perhaps Buckley handed over the reins to Sando at half time.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

We played like s**t in the first half and Collingwood are a very average footy side who lets us back into the game. Simple as that.

I seriously don't rate Collingwood. I see them as a bottom four side. If they got that kind of performance from Wells every week they would have won more games this season but we all know Wells won't play that kind of footy against any club but the Crows.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

People are forgetting we also stunk in the second half but not as much

Looking at contested possession stats we should have lost by 8-10 goals , even with our second half come back

We created turnovers but still got flogged in mid all game , we got a bit lucky or took our chances without winning I50s in 3rd qtr - 11 entries for 7 goals straight

 

[CrowBloke]

However mate, you need a refresher course on Occam's razor.

Yes, the simplest solution is nearly always the solution --- and thanks for the support.
Take a year like 2013 when after Round 8 the Hawks were clearly the best team in the Comp and GWS was a basket case, with the basket full of raw, but untapped talent. It's conceivable to me that Clarkson might have structured things against GWS so that the Hawks took it easy for a quarter or two, then made a few changes back to his best layout and structure to run away with it.

Anyway, I can see that what I suggested --- not thinking for a moment that actually was Pyke's plan --- has far too many assumptions and maybes to even be considered.
I've been stuck in a Motel Room in Outback NSW for over 2 weeks and am running a Temp. of 101 with the flu, too crook to drive back to Adelaide.
Maybe that's it (and not just the drugs )?

 

[Brasher]

My post mortem conspiracy was a little simpler....Crows beat their nemesis in Geelong and start looking forward to the Showdown in a fortnight. Forget all about trivial matter of playing a bottom four side in between.

The first half was reflective of previous form the Crows have demonstrated in these situations in the past.

The positive from the weekend was rather than just backing in a 4 or 5 goal loss after giving up a big lead they actually faught all the way back, not once but twice in the last quarter.

 

[CrowBloke]

We do get the best of both worlds though, points on the table to ensure we're effectively 2 games ahead of 2nd; plus a giant wake up call.

Absolutely right. The draw becomes a win-win

 

[CrowBloke]

If this was all part of THE MAESTRO's plan then he could have taught Einstein a thing or two.

P.S. Or perhaps Buckley handed over the reins to Sando at half time.

bloody funny, and I need a good laugh what with the flu and the flak this thread'll cop.

 

[AmericanCrow]

And remember CrowBloke this is coming from a guy who knows a lot about teams that stink up the joint.

Brother isn't that the truth!! I am a veritable oracle on stinking up the jointness!!

 

[CrowBloke]

The first half was reflective of previous form the Crows have demonstrated in these situations in the past.

Yes, agree totally.
COMPLACENCY is one of their biggest problems. I hope it won't be a factor against Essendon

 

[CrowBloke]

I am a veritable oracle on stinking up the jointness!!

**MEMO to self: do some Googling on Cleveland Browns, Indians and Cavs**

 

[AmericanCrow]

**MEMO to self: do some Googling on Cleveland Browns, Indians and Cavs**

Or not--will make you want to do some really really hard drugs

 

[Smoooothy]

My post mortem conspiracy was a little simpler....Crows beat their nemesis in Geelong and start looking forward to the Showdown in a fortnight. Forget all about trivial matter of playing a bottom four side in between.

The first half was reflective of previous form the Crows have demonstrated in these situations in the past.

The positive from the weekend was rather than just backing in a 4 or 5 goal loss after giving up a big lead they actually faught all the way back, not once but twice in the last quarter.

bloody good post this one

never in the history of our club have we been so far behind and gotten points. sure there is the argument that it shouldn't have happened in the first place, but in previous years we would have just sat back and taken the 10 goal loss

 

[crowsup]

I don't know! I think your theory is spot on except that Pyke massed it up by only getting a draw. I'm sure he demanded a win from the players and the players let him down. Especially when they let Collingwood get 3 goals to zero when we had got within 3 points of them.
I think Pyke misjudged our team's ability to comeback from such a way back and it was only luck that saved us.

 

[fabs33]

Now I know how Port supporters feel after reading one of Janus' crazy theories.

 

[CrowBloke]

1) never in the history of our club have we been so far behind and gotten points. sure there is the argument that it shouldn't have happened in the first place, 2) but in previous years we would have just sat back and taken the 10 goal loss

1) I didn't know that for sure, but couldn't remember such a big comeback for points.
2) tend to agree. I don't think we're known as the come-back Kings. Maybe it's the start of an era?