Opinion The Evolution of Your Best 23 for 2022

[TeeKray]

Height is overrated in defence. The Dulmial Gun is 3cm shorter than Alex Rance

Alex Rance

Age

34

Ht

194cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.6

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

7.7

5star

M

5.7

5star

T

2.4

4star

MG

226.9

3star

No current season stats available

D

17.0

5star

K

5.8

3star

HB

11.2

5star

M

5.0

5star

T

3.6

5star

, the greatest full back this century. Maybe his 2 best games this year were against the King brothers, destroying both and actually cleanly outmarking them one on one several times each. Speed and body work is more important than height. He had a s**t prelim but 21 of them did.

Jonas is actually 3cm shorter than the Dulmial Gun but has been more than handy playing on taller opponents. The reason he's a bit shaky now is that he's lost speed.

Height is important in defence for the intercept marker, which we have in spades with Aliir and his height but just as importantly his leap.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

Height is overrated in defence. The Dulmial Gun is 3cm shorter than Alex Rance, the greatest full back this century. Maybe his 2 best games this year were against the King brothers, destroying both and actually cleanly outmarking them one on one several times each. Speed and body work is more important than height. He had a sh*t prelim but 21 of them did.

Jonas is actually 3cm shorter than the Dulmial Gun but has been more than handy playing on taller opponents. The reason he's a bit shaky now is that he's lost speed.

Height is important in defence for the intercept marker, which we have in spades with Aliir and his height but just as importantly his leap.

I disagree and think we absolutely need more height down back. In just about every loss we’ve had the past couple years it’s always been the key tall towards that have got the better of us.

Even a short look at our losses this year;

Rnd 3 Eagles: Kennedy 4, Darling 3 goals.

Rnd 7 Lions: Cameron killed us.

Rnd 9 Dogs: Naughton 4.

Rnd 13 Cats: Cameron 5, Hawkins 4

Rnd 17 Demons: McDonald 3

Prelim: Pretty even but again Naughton and Schache had a lot of influence and multiple shots on goal.

And again in 2020;

Rnd 8 Saints: Marshall, Ryder and Membrey all 2 goals

Rnd 12 Cats: Hawkins 6

And luckily the Semi Hawkins kicked 5 behinds and missed a couple others from memory.

I think if I continued to look back over all our loses the past couple of years then majority of the time it’s when a tall forward kicks a bag on us.

Point being, tall forwards always overpower and out mark our undersized defence. Height does matter and we need one tall defender who can match these above players without having to loose Aliirs intercepting and rebound impact by needing him to be a tight defender as he was on Schache in the Prelim and because of that he was essentially useless as an interceptor.

Obviously our poor midfield performances in these games also made it hard for our defenders but the fact remains we need another tall strong FB. I don’t see why we would line up down back the same as we have in past years when it continues to be a weakness.

 

[TeeKray]

I disagree and think we absolutely need more height down back. In just about every loss we’ve had the past couple years it’s always been the key tall towards that have got the better of us.

Even a short look at our losses this year;

Rnd 3 Eagles: Kennedy 4, Darling 3 goals.

Rnd 7 Lions: Cameron killed us.

Rnd 9 Dogs: Naughton 4.

Rnd 13 Cats: Cameron 5, Hawkins 4

Rnd 17 Demons: McDonald 3

Prelim: Pretty even but again Naughton and Schache had a lot of influence and multiple shots on goal.

And again in 2020;

Rnd 8 Saints: Marshall, Ryder and Membrey all 2 goals

Rnd 12 Cats: Hawkins 6

And luckily the Semi Hawkins kicked 5 behinds and missed a couple others from memory.

I think if I continued to look back over all our loses the past couple of years then majority of the time it’s when a tall forward kicks a bag on us.

Point being, tall forwards always overpower and out mark our undersized defence. Height does matter and we need one tall defender who can match these above players without having to loose Aliirs intercepting and rebound impact by needing him to be a tight defender as he was on Schache in the Prelim and because of that he was essentially useless as an interceptor.

Obviously our poor midfield performances in these games also made it hard for our defenders but the fact remains we need another tall strong FB. I don’t see why we would like up down back the same as we have in past years when it continues to be a weakness.

No defender is literally going to prevent all tall forwards from ever kicking goals.

Also the Dulmial Gun, who is our best key defender, stupidly wasn't picked until round 10 this year and missed the Saints loss in 2020 through injury, which accounts for about half the games listed above anyway.

 

[Ash_Tray_Bon]

**Update after trade/draft period**

Port Adelaide POWER - Round 1

F: Finlayson - Georgiades - Fantasia
HF: Duursma - Dixon - Rozee
C: Sinn - Wines (C) - Amon
HB: Bergman - Aliir - Burton
B: Skinner - Jonas - Houston

R: Hayes - Butters - Boak

INT: Drew - Gray - Lycett - Powell-Pepper
Sub : Jones

EMERG : Mayes - McKenzie - Clurey - Motlop - Marshall - Byrne-Jones - Bonner

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

No defender is literally going to prevent all tall forwards from ever kicking goals.

Also the Dulmial Gun, who is our best key defender, stupidly wasn't picked until round 10 this year and missed the Saints loss in 2020 through injury, which accounts for about half the games listed above anyway.

Whether it’s Clurey, Jonas or mckenzie I don’t think is the point. They are all undersized and all regularly are out marked or out positioned by the tall forwards.

We’ve seen it for years and continues to happen. Just because perhaps Mckenzie didn’t play until a certain round doesn’t remove the fact that then our other tall defenders are also undersized and we still struggled with him in the side when came up against the best talls.

Difference of opinion but I don’t think we will win a premiership without that tall defender.

Just looking at the other top teams;
Dogs have Keath at 200
Demons have Petty at 197
Cats have Blicavs at 198
Lions have Andrews at 202

We need someone similar. They don’t have to be an AA level player but I think height certainly matters there.

 

[PortVic]

B: Jonas ------------------------ McKenzie
------------------Jones---------------------

I want Jones playing in front of our two best defenders - he has the speed to get across and help either one. I'd also have him pushing up to fill in the hole that any of our half-backs leave when they push up the ground. He can play tall and small as well.

HB: Byrne-Jones ----- Aliir ----- Burton

Need players who are willing to take the game on and also defend well. Also need speed.

C: -------------- Bergman ---------------
-Duursma---------------------------Amon-

Because our wings push forward pretty hard into the forward line, the center midfielder generally has to be more defensive. Ebert played this role pretty well when he was in the midfield. Bergman has the size and the athleticism to do the same.

HF: Rozee ------- Marshall ------ Butters

Pretty self explanatory. I want Marshall dropping into the hole that Bergman playing more defensively leaves.

F: -----Fantasia ---Dixon -------- Georgiades

Fantasia playing off of Dixon's shoulder if we're going slow, with Georgiades one out on the opposite side if we manage to pull our finger out and go fast.

FOL: Lycett - Wines - Boak

No explanation needed.

INT: Gray (gen fwd/mid) --- Finlayson (kpp/ruck) --- Houston (gen def/mid) --- Drew (mid)

Gray is still good enough to go into the midfield and up forward in spurts and create a different look than Georgiades or Fantasia does. Finlayson should be rotating with Marshall for most of the game and then with Lycett when he needs a rest. Houston gets the nod over Bonner because he can go into the midfield as well (eventually Sinn will take over this spot), while Drew gives Boak and Wines a chop out.

MED: Powell-Pepper

What's different from the prelim final? Not much - Jones into defence, Georgiades into the forward line, the 'ruck' on the bench (Finlayson instead of Ladhams). No matter how much we sh*t the bed, it WAS a prelim final FFS. People want to throw everything away because we met a team that literally had nothing to lose and had the freedom to play the way they wanted because of it.

I am surprised more people don’t have Jones in their best 22. For me he has to play. I realised we have plenty of depth in medium backs, but that hasn’t helped get us to a GF. I think we tell Houston his spot has been taken in defence & the only way he plays if he makes it as a midfielder/ winger. When we have tried him midfield he always had the luxury of falling back to defence. If he trains with the mids all pre season & really wants to play there. I think he can make it as a full time defender. Jones brings power, speed & grunt to the backline we are missing from Jonas.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Great example of shiny new toy syndrome. Jones is yet to show anything to suggest he's fit to tie Houston's boots.

 

[PortVic]

Great example of shiny new toy syndrome. Jones is yet to show anything to suggest he's fit to tie Houston's boots.

Jones has shown he can be a more damaging player then Drew. Love Drew effort but provides no attack. Jones replaces Houston down back, Houston replaces Drew in midfield. Wines, Boak, Drew can’t all play in same side. We keep rolling out same old side, we get same result. All we changed in our midfield from 2 preliminary was Rocky to Drew. For some reason Port are obsessed with defensive midfielders. Cornes, Casassi, Roger James, Logan,Jacobs, Drew. It’s time other teams fear our midfield. Bulldogs and Melbourne have much more attacking midfields. Did u see Melbournes centre clearances in the GF. If we trot out same team next year, we will get the same results.

 

[Andre]

Great example of shiny new toy syndrome. Jones is yet to show anything to suggest he's fit to tie Houston's boots.

I don't know why we'd want to push out Houston. Down back there's much more obvious players that are clearly already going downhill due to age and will only get worse. Just let Houston be a defender who has an occasional run further up the ground, rather than trying to reinvent him as a midfielder to cover our drafting more flankers then genuine mids.

 

[VineValerian]

POWER 22 (assuming only Farrell injured)
FF	Finlayson	Geordiadis	Fantasia
HF	Rozee	Dixon	Amon
C	Bonner	Wines (c)	Bergmann
HB	Houston	Alliir	Burton
FB	Duursma	McKenzie	Jonas
1R	Lycett	Drew	Butters
Int	Boak	Gray	Marshall	Jones
Med	Mayes
MAGPIES 22 (assuming no injuries)
FF	Williams	Lord	Butcher
HF	Motlop	Weidemann	Mead, J
C	Frederick	Powell-Pepper	McEntee
HB	Burgoyne	Skinner	Sinn
FB	Clurey	Pasini	Byrne-Jones
1R	Hayes	Sutcliffe (c)	Dumont
Int	Schofield	Jackson	Visentini
T/Up	Wildman	Surman	Corcoran	Carter
	Westbrook	Appleton	Strange	Aldridge
	Saunders	Samblich	E Moore	Saraya
		et al

 

[Jonts]

From now on posting a team with Skinner at full back instead of the Dulmial Gun is a ban worthy offence.

Cluzza dislikes this post

 

[Powerage]

Going on unsubstantiated intuition, but I predict DBJ and Clurey won't be in our first 22 by mid season. Kenzie, Jonas and Bonner also potentially slipping. We have a great defensive system and can have all those players replaced by faster, stronger, (taller), more creative kids.

If Clurey, McKenzie and Jonas all slip out of our first 22, who is going to be our 3rd KPD?

 

[RossFC]

If Clurey, McKenzie and Jonas all slip out of our first 22, who is going to be our 3rd KPD?

If there was a situation where all 3 of them are out, we'd have Aliir and Skinner, and Finlayson or Burton would have to fill in.

 

[Powerage]

Height is overrated in defence. The Dulmial Gun is 3cm shorter than Alex Rance

Alex Rance

Age

34

Ht

194cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.6

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

7.7

5star

M

5.7

5star

T

2.4

4star

MG

226.9

3star

No current season stats available

D

17.0

5star

K

5.8

3star

HB

11.2

5star

M

5.0

5star

T

3.6

5star

, the greatest full back this century. Maybe his 2 best games this year were against the King brothers, destroying both and actually cleanly outmarking them one on one several times each. Speed and body work is more important than height. He had a sh*t prelim but 21 of them did.

Jonas is actually 3cm shorter than the Dulmial Gun but has been more than handy playing on taller opponents. The reason he's a bit shaky now is that he's lost speed.

Height is important in defence for the intercept marker, which we have in spades with Aliir and his height but just as importantly his leap.

I think Matthew Scarlett would disagree.

 

[Powerage]

No defender is literally going to prevent all tall forwards from ever kicking goals.

Also the Dulmial Gun, who is our best key defender, stupidly wasn't picked until round 10 this year and missed the Saints loss in 2020 through injury, which accounts for about half the games listed above anyway.

More accurately it was this after Round 10 this year.

Rnd 13 Cats: Cameron 5, Hawkins 4

Rnd 15 Sydney: Franklin 4

Rnd 17 Demons: McDonald 3

Rnd 22 Carlton: McKay didn't play

Anyone who thinks we aren't a tall key defender short is deluding themselves. We have been asking our 'talls' to play above their height and relied on zoning off for the last two seasons at least and there have still been games where it has quite obviously hurt us, and sometimes, cost us. As more young tall forwards such as the Kings develop, defenders under 193cm are going to really struggle.

 

[TeeKray]

I think Matthew Scarlett would disagree.

Speaking of Scarlett, his hand picked, multiple All Australian protege Tom Stewart is listed at 190cm.

 

[TeeKray]

More accurately it was this after Round 10 this year.

Rnd 13 Cats: Cameron 5, Hawkins 4

Rnd 15 Sydney: Franklin 4

Rnd 17 Demons: McDonald 3

Rnd 22 Carlton: McKay didn't play

Anyone who thinks we aren't a tall key defender short is deluding themselves. We have been asking our 'talls' to play above their height and relied on zoning off for the last two seasons at least and there have still been games where it has quite obviously hurt us, and sometimes, cost us. As more young tall forwards such as the Kings develop, defenders under 193cm are going to really struggle.

Franklin kicked 3 after McKenzie went off injured in Q4 so no pulling the wool over my eyes on that one.

Also once again, the measure of a good key defender is not literally never conceding any goals ever, otherwise there would never have been a good key defender in the history of the game. It's about more often than not nullifying an opponent.

Re the King giraffes, how did McKenzie go on them this year?

 

[Powerage]

Franklin kicked 3 after McKenzie went off injured in Q4 so no pulling the wool over my eyes on that one.

Also once again, the measure of a good key defender is not literally never conceding any goals ever, otherwise there would never have been a good key defender in the history of the game. It's about more often than not qualifying an opponent.

Re the King giraffes, how did McKenzie go on them this year?

He went fine given they are under 21.

Yeah we lost Trent McKenzie leaving us with Allir and Jonas and all of a sudden Franklin kicks 3 goals. So do you think maybe we were a tall defender short.

I have trememdous respect for McKenzie. He does the right thing week after week and outplays guys taller than him. But how in God's name does that equate to us not being a Key Defender Short??? McKenzie would be even better as a 2nd tall defender and we wouldn't have our hearts in our mouths whenever McKenzie gets caught one out against any forward over 195cm.

I don't understand what qualifying an opponent means so I will just take your word for that one.

 

[Powerage]

Speaking of Scarlett, his hand picked, multiple All Australian protege Tom Stewart is listed at 190cm.

Now who is trying to pull the wool over whose eyes??? Has Stewart ever been all australian full back? No. Back pocket? Yes. How often does he play full back for Geelong? What the * Stewart has to do with being six time AA full back Scarlett's so called hand picked protege I don't know.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

Franklin kicked 3 after McKenzie went off injured in Q4 so no pulling the wool over my eyes on that one.

My concerns on this isn’t Mckenzie in isolation as I think he’s been great for us. The issue is that our 3 ‘lockdown’ key defenders are all undersized and around the same height. I don’t think we can continue to go into games with a backline of Jonas, Mckenzie and sometimes Clurey who are basically like for like position and structure wise.

We need a point of difference down back who isn’t a carbon copy of those three and can affectingly counter the taller forwards wothout loosing Aliirs impact as an interceptor.

FB: Skinner
BP: Mckenzie
BP: Jonas
CHB: Aliir

When we play a team with a fast forward line and an extra small I think Jonas either moves up the field to allow Burton to go to the BP or he perhaps just misses a week as sub to refresh. This type of set up will allow Aliir to play that half a kick further up the ground and intercept before it gets into our defence as he did against the cats in the semi.

Jonas will be 31 by time the season starts so we need to start some form of a progression plan otherwise we have no one to step up once he starts to drop off in 18 months or so.

 

[TeeKray]

I reckon Aliir solved a lot of our previous defensive problems ... biggest issue this year was the rapid decline in the previously super reliable Jonas.

 

[Joshykins]

I reckon Aliir solved a lot of our previous defensive problems ... biggest issue this year was the rapid decline in the previously super reliable Jonas.

Yep could see Jonas hobbling and wincing all year. Body is starting to feel the abuse of pack crashing

 

[Joshykins]

If Clurey, McKenzie and Jonas all slip out of our first 22, who is going to be our 3rd KPD?

Dunno. I'm hoping Clurey gets to his best form consistently cos he's the best size. Hoping Skinner learns to crash packs and spoil well for us too

 

[PortVic]

Orazio Dixon Gray
Rozee Mitch Marshall
Bonner Wines Amon
Bergmen Alliir Burton
Jonas McKenzie Jones
Lycett
Boak
Butters
Houston, Duursma, SPP, Finlayson

McEntee Skinner Williams
Sutcliffe Lord Schofield
Dumont Mayes Motlop
DBJ Pasini Sinn
Corcoran Clurey Frederick
Hayes
Drew
Mead

Burgoyne Visentini Jackson Weidemann

 

[Mikevk123]

B DBJ T.Clurey T.Jonas
HB D.Houston A.Allir R.Burton
C K.Amon O.Wines X.Duursma
HF M.Georgiades C.Dixon C.Rozee
F R.Gray T.Marshall O.Fantasia
FOLL: S.Lycett W.Drew Z.Butters
INTER: T.Boak, SPP, M.Bergman, R.Bonner
Sub: L.Jones