Politics The Extinction Crisis

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Carringbush2010

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#2
This may be a surprise to you coming from me, but I think the Greens sentiment is practical their method of getting there (100% renewable in 11 years) is not so.

Whichever way you look at as a world we ALL have to change the way we live in the world - that's not going to be achievable unless every single individual buys in and tidies up their own back yard.

I don't think it's going to take a complete change in lifestyle, things that the individual has control of could be done more "frugally" as much governments and societies as a whole. Things like
  • Slowing the world populations
  • Corporations being more environmentally friendly (with in practical parameters)
  • Food wastage and it's unsustainable production levels
  • The over producing of non renewable products etc.

As for the thread subject it does have a wiff of "political donation".The sentiment is noble the method not so.
 

Malifice

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So you don't see any correlation between rapidly increasing Australia's population and the thread topic?
No. How does global mass extinction and global warming etc slow down if we have 300,000 less migrants here than overseas?

Those people dont magically cease to exist, eat, consume and pollute just because they're overseas, or on the other side of a dotted line drawn on a map.
 

herculez09

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#11
No. How does global mass extinction and global warming etc slow down if we have 300,000 less migrants here than overseas?

Those people dont magically cease to exist, eat, consume and pollute just because they're overseas, or on the other side of a dotted line drawn on a map.
The image talks about Australia -- so yeah, fewer people in Australia does reduce pollution and all that other fun stuff.
 

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Malifice

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The image talks about Australia -- so yeah, fewer people in Australia does reduce pollution and all that other fun stuff.
No it doesnt reduce pollution. Those people just pollute and consume elsewhere.

In fact Australia has an advanced recycling and waste management system for a developed OED nation. They're probably less of a burden here than they would be elsewhere.

Developed nations also have lower birth rates so it's also a win win for future generations of the planet.
 

Total Power

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#13
The image talks about Australia -- so yeah, fewer people in Australia does reduce pollution and all that other fun stuff.
What Mal said is true. When i lived in Switzelrand, it produced the most garbage per capita in the entire EEA region (might be the same now , but i havent checked for a while), but it also had the most advanced recycling system in Europe as well. All waste is recycled and recycled efficiently. Expensive Swiss brands like Freitag uses recycled materials only and most Swiss own atleast one Freitag bag to say "we support recycling"

I had paid many a fines in CH dumping the wrong garbage in the wrong bag (different colors), i leanred it the hard way and later found out i wasn't the only one. All waste bags cost CHF 1 which is used to invest in recycling stuff. Throwing rubbish on the streets resulted in a fine of upto 1,000 CHF if caught (happened to me once, never did it again)
 

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#14
What Total Power and Malifice show is the average liberal leftist is empty headed.

No. How does global mass extinction and global warming etc slow down if we have 300,000 less migrants here than overseas?

Those people dont magically cease to exist, eat, consume and pollute just because they're overseas, or on the other side of a dotted line drawn on a map.
The exact same argument as above is made by people in favour of coal fired power generation in Australia, and those who oppose a carbon tax.

The whole edifice of liberal left environmentalism is a fraud. Don’t believe them.
 

Malifice

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The exact same argument as above is made by people in favour of coal fired power generation in Australia, and those who oppose a carbon tax.
No its not.

Moving 300,000 people from overseas to Australia doesn't change the rate at which those 300k people pollute or consume.

30 million people stopping using coal and taking active measures to reduce their carbon footprint does have an impact on the rate of global warming.

You right wing ****heads are getting even more hillarious. 'Stop the brown people coming to Australia because.... 'global warming'. It's the height of ridiculousness.

I suppose it was a natural progression following on from your crocodile tears over people 'drowning at sea' ('We need to stop the brown people from coming to Australia to.... look after their welfare!).
 

Malifice

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This is absolute nonsense.
Fertility rates of the world:



No it's not.

Even taking into account the higher infant mortality rate in developing nations (which brings overall numbers down in developing nations, along with reducing the median age), in developed nations people (especially women) are educated, have easy access to contraception, expected to work, and trend towards fewer children and having them later in life.
 

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Moving 300,000 people from overseas to Australia doesn't change the rate at which those 300k people pollute or consume.
Yes, it does. A number of studies show that people’s individual consumption levels rise as they move to higher consumption countries. A person moving from Denmark would consume more energy and resources here than in Denmark.
30 million people stopping using coal and taking active measures to reduce their carbon footprint does have an impact on the rate of global warming.
No, it doesn’t. If Australia stopped using coal tomorrow, it would negligible impact on overall emissions.

However, if Australia slowed it’s immigration rate it would certainly have an impact on Australian ecological systems. Eg Mernda and other outer suburbs wouldn’t be built. We wouldn’t need to cut down trees for highways. Etc.
 

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#19
Fertility rates of the world:



No it's not.

Even taking into account the higher infant mortality rate in developing nations (which brings overall numbers down in developing nations, along with reducing the median age), in developed nations people (especially women) are educated, have easy access to contraception, expected to work, and trend towards fewer children and having them later in life.
Name one country that has seen its population decline because of outward emigration.
 

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#20
I'm honestly amazed at how logically inconsistent your arguments are Malifice.

1. Developed nations also have lower birth rates so it's also a win win for future generations of the planet.

2. Moving 300,000 people from overseas to Australia doesn't change the rate at which those 300k people pollute or consume.

So do immigrants change their behaviour when they emigrate to Australia or not? Or do they just change some behaviours, not others. Eg a person emigrating from Australia has only 2 children instead of 5 children, but still lives an Indian lifestyle?
 

Malifice

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What Total Power and Malifice show is the average liberal... is empty headed.
I see you not only didn't even bother to attempt to challenge my assertion you're an ethnic nationalist, and instead simply denounced liberalism.

You're not even trying to hide it anymore.
 

Malifice

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So do immigrants change their behaviour when they emigrate to Australia or not?
Of course they do. As they're assimilated into the host country over generations they largely adopt the customs, culture and identity of that nation.

When it comes to pollution and consumption, or using renewables and so forth they dont really have a choice living here do they?
 

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#25
So for the record, repudiate ethnic nationalism for me.
We've been over this: do you think the Uyghurs should have a homeland? Or should they remain subject to whims of the Han Chinese majority?

Why would I repudiate something that can deliver freedom to what currently is the most persecuted minority in the world?
 
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