Unsolved The Family Murders

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Kurve

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Dec 27, 2016
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Are you aware and/or surprised at the recent revelations about Colin Manock? There have been calls for a royal commission and if there is, it might impact the findings on your brothers murder.

I don't know how you might feel about that but imagine you might view any progress or shift to be positive?
 

Deni

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This comment you made:

Alan was my older brother, we lived in the same room all of Alan’s life . I went to most of the places Alan went and knew all his mates . He was a normal kid and remember he was just a kid . We were from Salisbury not Elizabeth and yes Alan smoked dope and did not like the way it made him feel . Preacher smoked dope a lot but Alan didn’t like it so he would drink beer more then smoke dope . Alan liked to make fun of anything and make people laugh , at times he was a prick and other times he was fun . He smoked cigarettes and was clean personally always washing his hair . I keep telling you that H was not something he would have played with . If you don’t get that then go tell your story’s at parties as I have said it to you now a number of times . Stop the bull and look for the truth . I am sick of people asking me the same thing over and over again . You say you knew mom well if you meet mom you should know better then to keep going on about H .
And this comment you made:

Well then stop relating what happened to your son to this . We as a family have never been shy of telling each other anything . If you knew mom she was not one to pull punches and we all did not keep things from her . The reason why I put my foot down on you was you have said this secret stuff over and over . What happened to your son is sad and I have understanding of the pain you are in but it is a far cry from what happened here . Your son died from a OD Alan was murdered they are to different things and I knew Alan very well . We slept in the same room for 14 years well just under and spent a lot of time together talking about everything .
Then this comment you made:

ncYour son died oe and once only Alan has been killed a million times by what people have said about him in the media and in the streets . Your son took drugs and Alan didn’t like them because of the way it made him feel . Alan liked beer smoked cigarettes and smoked dope a few times . Like I said he was just a kid and what kids do now to what they did back then are two different things . How old was your son ? Alan was 16 going on 17 a kid and in 1979 things were a lot different to even things in the mid 80s . Hich Hiking was something lots of people did back then . My dad would pick up hikers all the time and hiked it back from Queensland once . Things changed after the boys were killed here , everything changed in SA after that .
Are all related to the one comment I made i'm guessing?

I like to be able to defend myself and don't think I deserve all of this.
Especially this part, "I am sick of people asking me the same thing over and over again . You say you knew mom well if you meet mom you should know better then to keep going on about H."
I had never mentioned Alan on H to your mother.

"John I have never mentioned Alan on H to anyone. Only in that one post"
And you said this, "The reason I put my foot down on you was you said secret stuff over and over and over", what secret stuff?
I related to my son once, and he didn't only die once, he dies every time myself, my daughter and his father think about him!
I don't see what my sons age has anything to do with this but he was 33 when he very painfully passed away, which was in part due to a beating he received a week before. And you can't compare deaths!!

And one more thing, and I say this in respect of your father, may he R.I.P.
The first time I met Judy, your mother, she was very gracious and she spoke a lot about your father, and hated all wars, especially the Vietnam war. She was still devastated over his death quite early in the Vietnam war, At least I think it was Vietnam, it could have any of the wars back in that time. He was young when he signed up for duty or was drafted, I think the draft was still going back then?
Anyway up above you said, "your dad would pick up hikers all the time and hiked it back from Queensland once", but from what your mum told me and my partner that first day we met, your dad had died in the war.
I'm just wondering what his timeline was, that is all, i'm NOT acusing you of lying, i'm just curious!
 
Last edited:

John Barnes

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This comment:


And this comment:


Then this comment:



Are all related to the one comment I made i'm guessing?
I like to be able to defend myself and don't think I deserve all of this.
Especially this part, "I am sick of people asking me the same thing over and over again . You say you knew mom well if you meet mom you should know better then to keep going on about H."
I have never mentioned Alan on H to your mother.

And this comment:
"I like to be able to defend myself and don't think I deserve all of this.
Especially this part, "I am sick of people asking me the same thing over and over again . You say you knew mom well if you meet mom you should know better then to keep going on about H."
I haven't asked you the same thing over and over again

"John I have never mentioned Alan on H. Only in that one post"
And you said this, "The reason I put my foot down on you was you said secret stuff over and over and over", what secret stuff?
I related to my son once, and he didn't only die once, he dies every time myself, my daughter and his father think about him!
I don't see what my sons age has anything to do with this but he was 33 when he very painfully passed away, which was in part due to a beating he received a week before. And you can't compare deaths!!

And one more thing, and I say this in respect of your father, may he R.I.P.
The first time I met Judy, your mother, she was very gracious and she spoke a lot about your father, and hated all wars, especially the Vietnam war. She was still devastated over his death quite early in the Vietnam war, At least I think it was Vietnam, it could have any of the wars back in that time. He was young when he signed up for duty or was drafted, I think the draft was still going back then?
Anyway up above you said, "your dad would pick up hikers all the time and hiked it back from Queensland once", but from what your mum told me and my partner that first day we met, your dad had died in the war.
I'm just wondering what his timeline was, that is all, i'm NOT acusing you of lying, i'm just curious!
Dad died in 1990 from the war . The big c got him from that crap the yanks sprayed over Vietnam. He was 19 and went to korea and fort in all the Asia wars . He did not die over there . Note I did tell you this before.


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John Barnes

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This comment:


And this comment:


Then this comment:



Are all related to the one comment I made i'm guessing?
I like to be able to defend myself and don't think I deserve all of this.
Especially this part, "I am sick of people asking me the same thing over and over again . You say you knew mom well if you meet mom you should know better then to keep going on about H."
I have never mentioned Alan on H to your mother.

And this comment:
"I like to be able to defend myself and don't think I deserve all of this.
Especially this part, "I am sick of people asking me the same thing over and over again . You say you knew mom well if you meet mom you should know better then to keep going on about H."
I haven't asked you the same thing over and over again

"John I have never mentioned Alan on H. Only in that one post"
And you said this, "The reason I put my foot down on you was you said secret stuff over and over and over", what secret stuff?
I related to my son once, and he didn't only die once, he dies every time myself, my daughter and his father think about him!
I don't see what my sons age has anything to do with this but he was 33 when he very painfully passed away, which was in part due to a beating he received a week before. And you can't compare deaths!!

And one more thing, and I say this in respect of your father, may he R.I.P.
The first time I met Judy, your mother, she was very gracious and she spoke a lot about your father, and hated all wars, especially the Vietnam war. She was still devastated over his death quite early in the Vietnam war, At least I think it was Vietnam, it could have any of the wars back in that time. He was young when he signed up for duty or was drafted, I think the draft was still going back then?
Anyway up above you said, "your dad would pick up hikers all the time and hiked it back from Queensland once", but from what your mum told me and my partner that first day we met, your dad had died in the war.
I'm just wondering what his timeline was, that is all, i'm NOT acusing you of lying, i'm just curious!
Now as a reply to the rest you have stated more the 5 times kids keep things from there moms and dads . Yes they do and in your comments you insinuate Alan was on drugs and so I have told you no Alan was not on hard drugs then you made the insinuation again and again . Look at what you have posted , reread it then you will see why I have said what I said . People hear what they want to hear not what was said


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Last edited:

Deni

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I'll pass on this, you will hear no more from me, and you were right.

"People hear what they want to hear not what was said"
 

Bits

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Hi Charlie, I'm not sure if this has been asked before, do you know who Clocker is and what role he played? And what he is up to now? Thanks.
 

John Barnes

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Hi Charlie, I'm not sure if this has been asked before, do you know who Clocker is and what role he played? And what he is up to now? Thanks.
I don’t know that name and in saying that he was not in on it all . The family or group of ped gays who know each other from before 1972 knew how to keep there mouths shut . The only one who talked was mr b and he was the youngest one . Before 1972 remember gays were locked up so they kept thing quiet .


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Bits

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I don’t know that name and in saying that he was not in on it all . The family or group of ped gays who know each other from before 1972 knew how to keep there mouths shut . The only one who talked was mr b and he was the youngest one . Before 1972 remember gays were locked up so they kept thing quiet .


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Thanks Charlie. Apparently he was a young man who worked at the clock shop and still uses the nickname “Clocker”. I was just wondering if we know him by any other name but if you haven’t heard of him he must have managed to stay out of it.
 

John Barnes

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Thanks Charlie. Apparently he was a young man who worked at the clock shop and still uses the nickname “Clocker”. I was just wondering if we know him by any other name but if you haven’t heard of him he must have managed to stay out of it.
No problem happy to help you out . Like I said I am happy to tell you all I know as long as it is a question and not a insinuation cobber .


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Rodney Lomax

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Dec 9, 2020
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Creepy horrible crimes - discuss here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Family_Murders

The Family was the name given to a close-knit group of Adelaide homosexuals involved in the kidnapping, drugging, sexual abuse and, at times, torture of young men and teenaged boys in Adelaide, Australia and surrounding areas throughout the 1970s and into the mid 1980s. The existence of the group came to the attention of the public following the murder of five teenagers between 1979 and 1983.[1][2] The high profile occupations of some of the suspects led to claims of an alleged high society conspiracy.[3] The term stems from an interview a police detective gave on 60 Minutes,[4] claiming the police were taking some action "...to break up the happy family."
Victims

  • Alan Barnes, aged 17, murdered in 1979. Last seen being picked up by a white Holden sedan with three or four people in it while hitchhiking, his body had been hideously mutilated and dumped in the South Para Reservoir northeast of Adelaide. A post-mortem examination revealed that Barnes had died of massive blood loss from an anal injury, likely caused by the insertion of a large blunt object. He had died several days after he went missing and Noctec was found in his blood suggesting he had been drugged.
  • Neil Muir, aged 25, murdered two months after Alan Barnes in 1979. His remains had been dissected and neatly cut into many pieces, placed in a garbage bag and thrown into the Port River at Port Adelaide. Skin bearing tattoos had been removed and most of the body parts were placed in another garbage bag before being placed within the abdominal cavity. The head was tied to the torso with rope passed through the mouth and out through the neck. A post-mortem examination revealed that Muir had died of massive blood loss from an anal injury, likely caused by the insertion of a large blunt object and Noctec was found in his blood. A prominent Adelaide doctor was initially charged with Muirs' murder but found not guilty at trial. Police are now satisfied that he was not involved.
  • Peter Stogneff, aged 14, murdered in 1981. His skeletal remains were found ten months later by a local farmer at Middle Beach, 50 km north of Adelaide. Peter's body had been cut into three pieces in a similar fashion to Neil Muir. Little more could be determined as the remains had been accidentally burnt by the farmer while clearing his property of scrub.
  • Mark Langley, aged 18, murdered in 1982. His mutilated body was found in scrub in the Adelaide foothills nine days after his disappearance. Among the mutilations was a wound that appeared to have been cut with a surgical instrument that went from his navel to the pubic region and part of his small bowel was missing. The hair around the area had been shaved as it would have been in an operation in a hospital. The post-mortem revealed that Mark had died from a massive loss of blood from gross injuries to his anus, similar to Alan Barnes. Mandrax was found in Langley's blood.
  • Richard Kelvin, aged 15, murdered in 1983. He was abducted a short distance from his North Adelaide home. His body was found by an amateur geologist off a track near One Tree Hill in the Adelaide foothills. Kelvin was held captive for over 5 weeks and a post-mortem examination revealed that he had died of massive blood loss from an anal injury, likely caused by the insertion of a large blunt object. Analysis of Kelvin's bloodstream revealed traces of four hypnotic drugs, including Mandrax and Noctec.
Police do not recognise the term "The Family" stating that "They should not be given any title that infers legitimacy. These people have no such bond, only an association that with time probably no longer exists." [5]
Of the five murders, there has been one conviction. Bevan Spencer von Einem was charged and convicted in 1984 for the murder of Kelvin.[5] In 1989, von Einem was charged with the murders of Barnes and Langley. However, the prosecution was forced to enter a Nolle Prosequi (voluntarily discontinue criminal charges) during the trial when crucial similar fact evidence was deemed inadmissible by the presiding judge. The murders of Barnes, Muir, Stogneff and Langley are unsolved.
A cold case was opened in March 2008 with a $1,000,000 reward available for anyone who provides information leading to a conviction. The reward carries an offer of immunity to accomplices dependent on their level of involvement. Due to changes in the Forensic Procedures Act which now allows DNA samples to be taken from suspects in major indictable offences, all the suspects voluntarily submitted to DNA testing. The ongoing investigation featured in an episode of Crime Stoppers which went to air on Monday, 2 March 2009.[5][6] The cold case review was completed in November 2010 with no charges being laid against any of the three key suspects.[7][8]
Suspects

Police believe that up to 12 people, several of them high-profile Australians, were involved in the kidnappings. Apart from von Einem they list three other core members directly involved in the murders with the remaining known associates involved to a lesser degree, being either indirectly involved or had knowledge of the murders but continued to interact with the group. The suspects include several members of the legal community, the brother of an Olympian and members of the business community. Although many had previously been named, with the exception of 'Suspect 2' their identities have since been suppressed by the courts.[9][10][11]

Bevan Spencer von Einem: Currently serving life imprisonment for the murder of Richard Kelvin, police have evidence he was with Alan Barnes after he was abducted and he was one of the last people seen with Neil Muir following his abduction.

Suspect 1: An eastern suburbs businessman who is believed to have been with von Einem when Kelvin was abducted. The man he was living with at the time of the murders is also a "person of interest."
Suspect 2: An Adelaide doctor. The man he was living with at the time is also a "person of interest."
Suspect 3 A close friend of von Einem and suspect 1 and a former male prostitute.
[edit] Further reading

Bob O'Brien Young Blood: The Story of the Family Murders HarperCollins 2009 ISBN 9780732290368
O'Brien was the lead detective for the "Family Murders" investigation.
[edit] References

  1. ^ Shadowy clique preyed on the young AdelaideNow 1 April 2008
  2. ^ The "Family" Murders TruTV
  3. ^ Lock up your sons in the world's murder capital The Age August 14, 2002
  4. ^ Von Einem: Lawyers in new bid to re-open Kelvin case 27 October 1996
  5. ^ a b c DNA tests for Family murder suspects PerthNow 29 March 2008
  6. ^ Family Murders - Adelaide Crime Stoppers 2 March 2009
  7. ^ Hunt, Nigel (December 5, 2010). "Family murder truth may never be known | Adelaide Now". adelaidenow.com.au. http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/family-murder-truth-may-never-be-known/story-e6frea6u-1225965724732. Retrieved 15 March 2012.
  8. ^ $5m reward bid to solve Family murders The Advertiser 26 October 2008
  9. ^ $5m reward bid to solve Family murders The Advertiser 26 October 2008
  10. ^ Shadowy clique preyed on the young AdelaideNow 1 April 2008
  11. ^ Focus on three key suspects AdelaideNow 5 December 2010
I have used my real name, I knew Alan Barnes in real life, I was there with him during several drug deals. He was getting his drugs from someone he called an "important official". My friends and I were introduced to Alan by Michael Atkinson, the same Michael Atkinson that later refused Mrs Barnes request for an Inquiry when he was Attorney General of SA, in fact one of the drug deals with Alan was at his parents house at Plympton and there was a total of 6 people there at the time. The last time I saw Alan was in the car park of Kings Baptist College where a government registered limo delivered the drugs to Alan, counting Alan there were 4 of us there when the limo pulled in. John Charles Bannon opened the limo door for Alan to get in, funny how there was no reward offered to solve Alans murder until after Bannon died. We were not supposed to be there when the limo arrived, we were seen and there was a state election soon, Bannon had motive.

Alan told me that SAPOL officers often delivered the drugs when his "important official" was too busy, that scared me at the time. I had a close call with Peter Liddy years before when he tried to get me to go with him on one of his interstate camping trips when I was 13, Peter Liddy used to also hang around at the Seacliff Hotel in the late 1970s. During the late 1970s the Seacliff Hotel was being run by 4 SAPOL officers, one of them told me they had the liquor license in their childrens names as SAPOL officers were not allowed to. It was common knowlege at my school that underage boys could get free/cheap alcahol at that pub if you allowed those SAPOL officers to "chat you up", young girls could not get the free/cheap booze. Those SAPOL officers left the Seacliff Hotel the same time Peter Liddy left the Police Complaints Department. The day Liddy tried to pick me up was the first time I cut myself, to swear a blood oath.

3 times I have walked into SAPOL stations to makes statements.

First time was within days of Liddys arrest at the unfinished Wakefield St police station. I started by saying that I could name the politician giving drugs to Alan, the officer then asked "which political party?' to which I answered Labor. The SAPOL officer simply walked out of the room without saying anything, I was left alone for what seemed like nearly 5 min. Then another SAPOL officer entered the room and stated "I have been instructed to escort you from the building", he would not explain why.

Next I tried with one of the actual officers that was involved with arresting Liddy, Peter Rodney I believe the name he used, he had bleach blonde hair. I believe his name might have come from an amalgamation of Peter Liddys name and Rodney, the person that changed the Law to allow child victims of abuse to testify against their abusers, that was me. I threatened Judge Darren McGovern that if he didnt change the Law to allow my daughter to testify I "would do everything in my power to come up there and shove your stupid looking wig and little toy mallet up your f’ed up arse, your honour". That Law was backdated to the earliest possible date of conception of my daughter, I was trying to get it as far back as I could to get Liddy, that became December 30 1982.

The last time was after I posted comments on Julia Gillards facebook when she was PM, she sent Det Brevet Sgt Terry McCormack from the Sturt station to talk to me. He wrote nothing down, he recorded nothing, a few years later I submitted an FOI and Karen from SAPOL FOI division told me verbally on the phone that there was no statement from me on official record. She also told me that Terry had kept notes on what I had said but he keeps them at home in a notebook.

My association with Julian Assange in 1988/89 complicates things.
 

Kurve

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Steven Ey was the lawyer so no Derrance is telling porky pies


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Excuse me for coming back to this for a moment, if you don't mind Charlie.

Stephen Ey was only admitted to the bar in 1978, he would have been considered imo too green to take on a defence of very serious criminal charges at the time Alan was murdered. Would you be willing to accept that perhaps Derrance Stevenson might have offered Alan more experienced counsel either directly, or indirectly via Gambardella or Darko?
 

GreyCrow

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I have used my real name, I knew Alan Barnes in real life, I was there with him during several drug deals. He was getting his drugs from someone he called an "important official". My friends and I were introduced to Alan by Michael Atkinson, the same Michael Atkinson that later refused Mrs Barnes request for an Inquiry when he was Attorney General of SA, in fact one of the drug deals with Alan was at his parents house at Plympton
Its my understanding they lived in Salisbury


and there was a total of 6 people there at the time. The last time I saw Alan was in the car park of Kings Baptist College where a government registered limo delivered the drugs to Alan, counting Alan there were 4 of us there when the limo pulled in. John Charles Bannon opened the limo door for Alan to get in, funny how there was no reward offered to solve Alans murder until after Bannon died. We were not supposed to be there when the limo arrived, we were seen and there was a state election soon, Bannon had motive.
Alan died June 1979 , The State Election was September 1979 - Des Corcoran was the Premier who lost this one -

Alan told me that SAPOL officers often delivered the drugs when his "important official" was too busy, that scared me at the time. I had a close call with Peter Liddy years before when he tried to get me to go with him on one of his interstate camping trips when I was 13, Peter Liddy used to also hang around at the Seacliff Hotel in the late 1970s. During the late 1970s the Seacliff Hotel was being run by 4 SAPOL officers,
Can you name these officers and would they be similar names to 3 of the officers involved in the Duncan case?
 
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I have used my real name, I knew Alan Barnes in real life, I was there with him during several drug deals. He was getting his drugs from someone he called an "important official". My friends and I were introduced to Alan by Michael Atkinson, the same Michael Atkinson that later refused Mrs Barnes request for an Inquiry when he was Attorney General of SA, in fact one of the drug deals with Alan was at his parents house at Plympton and there was a total of 6 people there at the time. The last time I saw Alan was in the car park of Kings Baptist College where a government registered limo delivered the drugs to Alan, counting Alan there were 4 of us there when the limo pulled in. John Charles Bannon opened the limo door for Alan to get in, funny how there was no reward offered to solve Alans murder until after Bannon died. We were not supposed to be there when the limo arrived, we were seen and there was a state election soon, Bannon had motive.

Alan told me that SAPOL officers often delivered the drugs when his "important official" was too busy, that scared me at the time. I had a close call with Peter Liddy years before when he tried to get me to go with him on one of his interstate camping trips when I was 13, Peter Liddy used to also hang around at the Seacliff Hotel in the late 1970s. During the late 1970s the Seacliff Hotel was being run by 4 SAPOL officers, one of them told me they had the liquor license in their childrens names as SAPOL officers were not allowed to. It was common knowlege at my school that underage boys could get free/cheap alcahol at that pub if you allowed those SAPOL officers to "chat you up", young girls could not get the free/cheap booze. Those SAPOL officers left the Seacliff Hotel the same time Peter Liddy left the Police Complaints Department. The day Liddy tried to pick me up was the first time I cut myself, to swear a blood oath.

3 times I have walked into SAPOL stations to makes statements.

First time was within days of Liddys arrest at the unfinished Wakefield St police station. I started by saying that I could name the politician giving drugs to Alan, the officer then asked "which political party?' to which I answered Labor. The SAPOL officer simply walked out of the room without saying anything, I was left alone for what seemed like nearly 5 min. Then another SAPOL officer entered the room and stated "I have been instructed to escort you from the building", he would not explain why.

Next I tried with one of the actual officers that was involved with arresting Liddy, Peter Rodney I believe the name he used, he had bleach blonde hair. I believe his name might have come from an amalgamation of Peter Liddys name and Rodney, the person that changed the Law to allow child victims of abuse to testify against their abusers, that was me. I threatened Judge Darren McGovern that if he didnt change the Law to allow my daughter to testify I "would do everything in my power to come up there and shove your stupid looking wig and little toy mallet up your f’ed up arse, your honour". That Law was backdated to the earliest possible date of conception of my daughter, I was trying to get it as far back as I could to get Liddy, that became December 30 1982.

The last time was after I posted comments on Julia Gillards facebook when she was PM, she sent Det Brevet Sgt Terry McCormack from the Sturt station to talk to me. He wrote nothing down, he recorded nothing, a few years later I submitted an FOI and Karen from SAPOL FOI division told me verbally on the phone that there was no statement from me on official record. She also told me that Terry had kept notes on what I had said but he keeps them at home in a notebook.

My association with Julian Assange in 1988/89 complicates things.
First post here.

I'm calling bullshit. This is the kind of unsubstantiated drivel that Adelaide idiots have been going on about since the 90s. Provide proof.

Everybody in Adelaide from those days knows people who knew people who were connected to these crimes. If ANY aspect of what you posted was true it would have been exposed 20 years ago.

PS - great forum. Been lurking for months and the discussions are, for the most part, excellent.
 

Rodney Lomax

Draftee
Dec 9, 2020
11
19
AFL Club
Adelaide
Its my understanding they lived in Salisbury


Alan died June 1979 , The State Election was September 1979 - Des Corcoran was the Premier who lost this one -

Can you name these officers and would they be similar names to 3 of the officers involved in the Duncan case?
Yes they did live in Salisbury but in earlier drug deal Alan was at the footy in southern suburbs and we met him at Atkinsons house after, Alan had a friend there, there was Atkinson and then 2 others with me. Alan was in a panic that we were there when the limo with Bannon was about to arrive, we were late and had no time to leave, he was afraid. I only knew one of the officers first name, it was Steve.
 

Rodney Lomax

Draftee
Dec 9, 2020
11
19
AFL Club
Adelaide
First post here.

I'm calling bullshit. This is the kind of unsubstantiated drivel that Adelaide idiots have been going on about since the 90s. Provide proof.

Everybody in Adelaide from those days knows people who knew people who were connected to these crimes. If ANY aspect of what you posted was true it would have been exposed 20 years ago.

PS - great forum. Been lurking for months and the discussions are, for the most part, excellent.
I am publicly accusing Julia Gillard, when she was PM, of conspiring with Det Brevet Sgt Terry McCormack of SAPOL to conceal evidence in this unsolved murder. SPREAD IT EVERYWHERE AND GET ME SUED THEN, you have my permission
 

Deni

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Aug 18, 2019
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in fact one of the drug deals with Alan was at his parents house at Plympton and there was a total of 6 people there at the time. The last time I saw Alan was in the car park of Kings Baptist College where a government registered limo delivered the drugs to Alan
May I ask, were the drugs for Alan to use, or for him to distribute, or both?
 

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