Unsolved The Family Murders

[Kurve]

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Out of Sight - The Untold Story of Adelaide's Gay Hate Murders

The Cases of Forensic Pathologist Colin Manock

Use this thread below to lodge media, maps and photos for quick reference.

Unsolved - The Family Murders - MEDIA

This thread may be used to post the Family Murders media related content. To include press and gathered photographs from various sources. Please feel free to post but as this is a no discussion thread, comments will be deleted or moved at discretion. WHO'S WHO VICTIMS AB - Alan Barnes 16yo...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Bits]

 

[Raisedeyebrow]

View attachment 1304677

What a dag. Doesn’t look Eastern suburbs type at all.

 

[Bits]

Ive encountered two of the family, purely by chance. Mr B at his work places over the years.
Clocker: I went looking to buy an old clock once, and presented to this locked-up shop. wasn't allowed entry, I guess i don't look like "clock type"
My B had worried eyes and slightly nervous disposition.

Hi, hope you don’t mind me asking, but how did you know it was Mr B?

 

[Dell43]

Police had 4 witnesses, 2 on Ward st. and others on Margaret st. Still unclear exactly where abduction was.

Further to my earlier post (2078) in either February or March 1993 a friend told me his partner was a police witness in the RK case. He told me she heard the abduction and also provided a description of the car used. He told me that police found the car which was sold after the abduction and the boot had been re-painted. Young Blood was published in 2002 and confirms the story about the car but I was expecting the author to expand on the information this witness provided however there was no new information. I assumed is was a case of police keeping information to themselves so they can check future witness statements. I'm still trying to find the address of this witness which I'm hoping will pin-point location of RK abduction.

Further to post No.2099 I have finally tracked down the address of the person who witnessed the car being driven away after the abduction of Richard Kelvin, the witness lived at 23 Margaret St. North Adelaide. This address is confusing as the front of the house is 54 Ward St. and the side 23 Margaret St. I'm assuming the house has been divided, you can see No.23 on the fence in the bin photo.




Police reported Richard being abducted near the intersection of Peppertree Lane and Margaret St. The question is how he ended up at this location as it's not the most direct or fastest route to his house. Image below shows the most direct route from the bus stop to Richard's house.



When Von Einem was presented with overwhelming evidence that Richard had been at his house Von Einem gave Detectives Kipling & O'Brien the alibi that he was driving along O'Connell St. turned left onto Ward St. and then left on Boulton St. At the intersection of Boulton and Marian St. he almost collided with Richard. He then claimed Richard approached the driver's side window and engaged in a conversation resting his arms and hands on the roof, Richard then voluntarily got into the car which continued to Archer St. and then turned right. Von Einem's alibi was most probably to cover his tracks in case he was seen in Boulton St. so we can assume this interaction happened (but not as he explained) and also to explain why Richards fingerprints may be found on the roof of his car when he was trying to stop himself being dragged in at a different location.

From the information we have my theory is the first abduction attempt was at the intersection of Boulton and Marian St. Richard managed to escape but his path to Ward St. was blocked so he ran into the flats knowing there is a path at the back which allows access to Peppertree Lane, then Margaret St. and then Ward St. Von Einem drives to the end of Boulton St. turns right onto Archer St. and then right onto Margaret St. The second abduction attempt is near the intersection of Peppertree Lane and Margaret St. where Richard is overpowered and dragged into the drivers side of Von Einem's car.

Image 1 - Richards movement in RED and Von Einem's in BLACK.
Image 2 - Intersection of Peppertree and Margaret St. 2007.
Image 3 - O'Brien & Kipling 1983, intersection of Peppertree & Margaret St. in the background







Most people seem to think Von Einem saw Richard walking to the bus stop or noticed him at the bus stop on O'Connell St. and the abduction was a spur of the moment decision, if that was the case consider the following;

- Von Einem's MO was to persuade victims into his car and then offer them a spiked drink. Why the sudden change of MO and escalation to abduction?
- If the abduction was a spur of the moment decision how did Von Einem convince the others in the car to participate in such a serious offence?
- After the failed abduction at Marian & Boulton St. why didn't Von Einem leave the area? How did he know Richard would be at the intersection of Peppertree and Margaret St?

Rather than the abduction being a spur of the moment decision maybe it was a planned event! Maybe Von Einem had noticed Richard earlier that day or on a previous occasion and was stalking him, remembering Von Einem was a frequent visitor to the area. Von Einem seemed to have knowledge of the area and the route Richard would take to get home. He had other willing participants in the car, maybe one to help him overpower Richard and the second as a driver. There was evidence Richard was struck over the head, was Von Einem deliberately carrying a weapon to assault Richard?

 

[ElizabethG]

View attachment 1304677

Thank you for sharing this, Bits.

 

[binanceSA]

SA court orders pedophile Robert William Symonds be placed under an extended supervision order but not electronically monitored

A paroled pedophile who claims he was framed by the so-called “Family” murderers will be strictly supervised for two more years – but has been spared electronic monitoring.

On Tuesday, the Supreme Court declared Robert William Symonds – known as “Mother Goose” due to his distinctive walk – liable to an extended supervision order.

Symonds has twice stood trial over child sex offending – once being acquitted, and once being convicted.

In both trials, Symonds claimed an accomplice of murderer Bevan Spencer von Einem had framed him for the alleged offending.

Between trials, he was named as a suspected child sex predator during the Mullighan Inquiry, prompting a state government bid to have him placed on an extended supervision order.

Despite Symonds having completed both his prison term and his non-parole period, the court on Tuesday ordered he be subject to parole-like conditions until December 2023.

Justice David Peek warned Symonds that any breach of the conditions could see him jailed, but noted he had not imposed every restriction sought by the State Government.

Notably, the government’s request that Symonds be subject to 24-hour electronic monitoring was not included in the conditions.

“You are not to contact, communicate with or associate with anyone under the age of 18 years (or) offer accommodation to them,” Justice Peek told Symonds.

“You are not to loiter, without reasonable excuse, at or within the vicinity of schools, public toilets or playgrounds.

“If a member of the Parole Board or a police officer suspects you have disobeyed your conditions … you may be brought back to this court and detained in custody.”

 

[Ivanovich]

Thanks for sharing this

 

[Ivanovich]

I told my story to Debi Marshall as I was pretty angry that Chief Justice John Bray recommended to my mother that Gino Gambardella was the chiropractor I should see for sore back only to be sexually assaulted by him one month before Alan Barnes was murdered. I was 22 at the time.

 

[Dell43]

(1) I agree with you as to the likely pre-meditation of the Richard Kelvin abduction, and wonder whether BSvE was 'fulfilling a pre-order' for Richard Kelvin, either for ********** purposes, or to get at Richard's father by traumatising him with the heinous murder of his son Richard, or for both reasons.
(2) I am curious as to these so-called 'witnesses'. Did any of them immediately dial 000 to report a violent altercation between a pedestrian teenage boy
*************************** which resulted in a violent abduction of the teenage boy? .... or did they become 'witnesses' after the cops did a neighbourhood doorknock campaign and they said something along the lines of "... oi yeah, now that you mention it, I did see/hear a violent altercation between a teenage boy and a carload of weirdoes who then violently abducted the teenage boy, but did'nt think anything of it and forgot all about it until the police came knocking on my door ....."

Steve
In response to your second point the attached article may provide more clarity. In relation to the person I spoke to I'm not sure if they contacted police but they were very traumatised about what they witnessed and that was 10 years after the event.

 

[Steve The Dude]

T

Steve
In response to your second point the attached article may provide more clarity. In relation to the person I spoke to I'm not sure if they contacted police but they were very traumatised about what they witnessed and that was 10 years after the event.

View attachment 1310415

Thanks for that. This newspaper article gives really good context to the 'earwitnesses'. It is still puzzling to me why nobody seems to have telephoned 000 straight away to report the incident. Do you know whether anybody actually 'eyewitnessed' von Einem's car? .... and, if so, what was the quality of the 'eyewitnessing'? I am suspicious that 'Mr B' simply told the cops whatever they wanted to hear to fill in the blanks, and get his reward money upon von Einem's conviction. ( I am in no way 'potentially disputing' the veracity of von Einem's conviction, but I am 'potentially disputing' Mr B's explanation of the sequence of events).

 

[Dell43]

T

Thanks for that. This newspaper article gives really good context to the 'earwitnesses'. It is still puzzling to me why nobody seems to have telephoned 000 straight away to report the incident. Do you know whether anybody actually 'eyewitnessed' von Einem's car? .... and, if so, what was the quality of the 'eyewitnessing'? I am suspicious that 'Mr B' simply told the cops whatever they wanted to hear to fill in the blanks, and get his reward money upon von Einem's conviction. ( I am in no way 'potentially disputing' the veracity of von Einem's conviction, but I am 'potentially disputing' Mr B's explanation of the sequence of events).

The story my friend told me was his wife gave police a description of the car used in abduction. Von Einem sold it shortly after and boot had been re-painted, surprised there was not mention in article above.

 

[Steve The Dude]

The story my friend told me was his wife gave police a description of the car used in abduction. Von Einem sold it shortly after and boot had been re-painted, surprised there was not mention in article above.

Thanks for that. Do you know if the cops subsequently seized the vehicle for forensic examination? Admittedly, BSvE would have probably used some sort of cleaning agent such as bleach or ammonia prior to re-spraying the boot, but I would have thought that perhaps the cops would have nonetheless forensically examined the vehicle hoping to find some corroborative trace evidence, even if they had to search underneath layers of paint. Also, you would expect that some traces of Richard Kelvin's hair or skin cells would be able to be found in the car interior from when he was initially abducted.

 

[Dell43]

Thanks for that. Do you know if the cops subsequently seized the vehicle for forensic examination? Admittedly, BSvE would have probably used some sort of cleaning agent such as bleach or ammonia prior to re-spraying the boot, but I would have thought that perhaps the cops would have nonetheless forensically examined the vehicle hoping to find some corroborative trace evidence, even if they had to search underneath layers of paint. Also, you would expect that some traces of Richard Kelvin's hair or skin cells would be able to be found in the car interior from when he was initially abducted.

I'm sure they went over the vehicle with a fine-tooth combe. My thinking is BVE and his crew were schooled in eliminating forensic evidence, the only information I have is in article below.

 

[Bits]

Given that it was forensic fibre evidence (carpet, bedspread and hair) that caught BvE, I’m not convinced there was a high degree of forensic knowledge going on. Much easier to get a new bedspread and do a bit of vacuuming than paint a car boot, yet he did none of those things.

 

[Dell43]

Given that it was forensic fibre evidence (carpet, bedspread and hair) that caught BvE, I’m not convinced there was a high degree of forensic knowledge going on. Much easier to get a new bedspread and do a bit of vacuuming than paint a car boot, yet he did none of those things.

That was the only slip-up I’m aware of (maybe he was rushed) I don’t recall any forensic evidence on other victims either deceased or released. I’m assuming that’s why bodies were washed, I’m sure I read about a lad being showered at the Alberton house by Von Einem and someone else. From memory Alan Barnes clothing may have been washed, not sure about the clothing of others.

 

[bth18]

• Von Einem's MO was to persuade victims into his car and then offer them a spiked drink. Why the sudden change of MO and escalation to abduction?
• If the abduction was a spur of the moment decision how did Von Einem convince the others in the car to participate in such a serious offence?

its the two big questions really - its a massive escalation

 

[Ivanovich]

I told my story to Debi Marshall as I was pretty angry that Chief Justice John Bray recommended to my mother that Gino Gambardella was the chiropractor I should see for sore back only to be sexually assaulted by him one month before Alan Barnes was murdered. I was 22 at the time.

Chief Justice John Jefferson Bray retired from the Bench in 1978. My mother, June Tanner, was the Swedish Consulate and lived on Brougham Place in North Adelaide. She was a socialite and had social events/cocktail parties on a regular basis. It was at one of the parties Bray recommended her 22 year son (me) should see Gino Gambardella (May 1979 ). Putting it all together it is interesting the recommendation happened after Bray retired from the bench. It is inconceivable that he would not have been aware of Gambardella's sexual assault convictions. Was it a numbers game on his part ? Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Send a blond, skinny, fit 22 year old to Gino and see what happens ?

 

[Steve The Dude]

Chief Justice John Jefferson Bray retired from the Bench in 1978. My mother, June Tanner, was the Swedish Consulate and lived on Brougham Place in North Adelaide. She was a socialite and had social events/cocktail parties on a regular basis. It was at one of the parties Bray recommended her 22 year son (me) should see Gino Gambardella (May 1979 ). Putting it all together it is interesting the recommendation happened after Bray retired from the bench. It is inconceivable that he would not have been aware of Gambardella's sexual assault convictions. Was it a numbers game on his part ? Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Send a blond, skinny, fit 22 year old to Gino and see what happens ?

I continue to be amazed how people such as John Bray and Peter Liddy (and their 'unique and special' SAPOL friends) somehow magically never seemed to have made it onto the 'persons of interest' list by SAPOL in respect of the 'Family murders', and other murders.

 

[nominal_port_supporter]

I continue to be amazed how people such as John Bray and Peter Liddy (and their 'unique and special' SAPOL friends) somehow magically never seemed to have made it onto the 'persons of interest' list by SAPOL in respect of the 'Family murders', and other murders.

If you read through this entire thread it really isn't that "amazing" at all to be honest. The most knowledgeable posters who have actually done the in-depth research have pretty clearly outlined who the suspects and associates are of The Family. Also, it has already been addressed as to why Liddy is unlikely to have been involved, namely due to his preference for boys rather than teenagers.

 

[Dell43]

Has anyone got any information about a guy by the name of Michael Andrew Gibbons? Gibbons was the guy who gave police information (1983) that Richard Kelvin had been picked up in a car (1963 EJ Holden) by Doug & Mark. Police eventually tracked him down and he was charged with providing false information. At the time Gibbons was 23, brown shoulder length hair, chubby build and employed as a car detailer.

 

[Bits]

Has anyone got any information about a guy by the name of Michael Andrew Gibbons? Gibbons was the guy who gave police information (1983) that Richard Kelvin had been picked up in a car (1963 EJ Holden) by Doug & Mark. Police eventually tracked him down and he was charged with providing false information. At the time Gibbons was 23, brown shoulder length hair, chubby build and employed as a car detailer.

Who did he work for? Wasn’t a guy called Ron by any chance?

 

[Dell43]

Who did he work for? Wasn’t a guy called Ron by any chance?

Not sure who he worked for Bits I don’t know much about him at this stage. Who is Ron and how does he fit in? He was probably just some random who for whatever reason wanted to get involved, but his body shape and occupation are interesting.

 

[Bits]

Ron was a mechanic/car enthusiast who was a friend of Gambardella & Derrance. He allegedly owned the car that Gamba was driving on the night of Derrance's murder. He also owned a shack that was allegedly used by Derrance & Gamba to make their horrible films and may have also been involved in the films. He later sold / transferred ownership of the shack to Gamba - unclear whether Gamba paid for it.

 

[nominal_port_supporter]

Trevor Peters was a friend of my parents for many years before he died in 2013. I met him on numerous occasions too and he was a likeable guy - outgoing and gregarious. So I was naturally pretty surprised in 2014 to see the Advertiser article about his diaries.

Anyway, it led me to ask my father if he ever met BVE (through his friendship with TP). It turns out he did - a few times at parties and around the place in the 70s. He said BVE came across as "a bit of a creep who would hit on you" but who otherwise seemed pretty nondescript. I guess the latter part fits with the cardigan wearing accountant image he liked to project, and is also similar to how you might describe numerous other serial killers throughout history. Again, through TP at parties, my father also met some of the trans women allegedly involved and DSD a few times - but doesn't really remember anything much about them.

As other posters have said on this thread, there really seemed to be only two degrees of separation in Adelaide when these murders took place - which makes sense considering the Adelaide population was only about 800,000 at the time.

 

[fortunatecrow]

He also owned a shack that was allegedly used by Derrance & Gamba to make their horrible films and may have also been involved in the films.

Apologies if this reflects inattention to the thread but I have not seen direct references to films before?