The Generational Malaise of South Australian Cricket.

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Drugs Are Bad Mackay? said:
The worry is that those not good enough to succeed at Shield level - Drew, Lehmann, Davis, Winter, Valente - absolutely carve up at Grade level.

They are better than the local alternatives

Means looking interstate is the only option
Click to expand...
I think Winter is good enough
 

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Surely they’re having a big crack at renshaw for next season, him either opening instead of weatherall with hunt or at 3 with head and Carey following is looking better.

Maybe someone like Sangha who’s in and out of the NSW team is another option.
 
hugecannon said:
Surely they’re having a big crack at renshaw for next season, him either opening instead of weatherall with hunt or at 3 with head and Carey following is looking better.

Maybe someone like Sangha who’s in and out of the NSW team is another option.
Click to expand...

Renshaw getting married soon and on a multi-year deal with Queensland still so I'd imagine highly unlikely to shift for 2021-22. But yes, fringe bats looking for a chance to play more will be looking to SA for sure.
 
Zach Package said:
Apparently they’re going to have a crack at a couple of Vic premier guns Stepien and Blake Thomson and maybe even Seymour as well
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Who's the Footscray bowler who has a bit of pace? Supposedly having a go at him
 
Jack Prestwidge wouldn't be a bad shout if they are after a quick with a bit more pace than their current lot. Not sure he would want to move after only just going to down to Vic fairly recently. 24 wickets at 10 from his handful of Vic Premier matches this season though begs the question as to why the Vics didn't at least give him a few games in the One Day Cup?
 
Drugs Are Bad Mackay? said:
Who's the Footscray bowler who has a bit of pace? Supposedly having a go at him
Click to expand...
Footscray? The only one that springs to mind is Buckingham. Don't know a lot about him though.

Blake Thomson would be smart. Same with Stepien.
 

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I didn't hear the interview so there maybe context around it but Tom is a bit dilusional if he didn't see this coming. I think after winless year change is all but guaranteed

TOM COOPER: It was a shock (cut from the Redbacks) to be honest as I believe I still have a lot of cricket left in me.

TOM COOPER: I guess they wanted to go younger. In their view there needed to be changes made to regenerate cricket in SA.
 
Drugs Are Bad Mackay? said:
The worry is that those not good enough to succeed at Shield level - Drew, Lehmann, Davis, Winter, Valente - absolutely carve up at Grade level.

They are better than the local alternatives

Means looking interstate is the only option
Click to expand...
Yep certainly a concern, and whilst it's not going to hurt to get a couple of interstater's to come into the fold, SA shouldn't allow for that to became their default mentality. Especially if they are just attracting other states discards, because that will do nothing to get them out this hole.

It's a tough situation though, because nothing they've tried has worked for a long time now.

IMO if they are going to go the interstate route, better to look at one, maybe two, big name signing's that are just outside the Australian set up. Kurtis Patterson, Jack Wildermuth, Michael Neser, Joel Paris sort of players. Especially guys have shown strong leadership attributes, which would give Travis Head some support. From there build a team around them comprised of locals (plus any imports who have already moved) and then try and grow from there.

If other states discards want to try and crack into FC cricket via SA, then they're going to have to do it on their own accord, and I'm sure some have in the past. I can't profess to knowing the circumstances around every move to SA from the likes of Aaron O'Brien, Tom Cooper, Henry Hunt or Joe Mennie (amongst others), whether it was them packing their bags and making it through grade cricket, or SA approached them first... But for now, that level of player I'd be put off signing for a couple of years at least.

The other thing, and it pains me to say this, but 13 clubs seems very excessive - Sydney has 20 and four times the population (not that population is a foolproof methodology in these circumstances). I'm hugely passionate about grade cricket, and I wouldn't want to see clubs just disbanded because each has their own history that is worth preserving, but there needs to be a serious thought as to whether any more than 8 teams is necessary? I'm not sure if there is a shires style competition in Adelaide as there is in Sydney?*. If there was, that could be a potential destination for under performing grade clubs. I'm also aware of the repercussions of those sort of decisions and it's very easy for an outsider to flippantly say "need to remove some clubs". There's a lot of pain that goes with this sort of move.

But when the guys you mention are dominating grade cricket (and online I've seen of the performances they put up) it suggests that the standard is just not good enough and the talent is spread too thin. Going back over a decade now, but we used to get guys from Perth and Adelaide grade cricket come to our Sydney club with good first and second grade records, and they thought they were going to dominate but they just got found out every single time, and ended up playing a grade (often two grades) lower than they were in their home city. I can't recall a single one becoming a permanent first grader.

But yeah, it's tough. As I said, nothing has really worked for a long time, and the hole is extremely deep. I do feel for those trying to fix it, and certainly for supporters of South Australian cricket because there just simply isn't any easy answers.

* Shires is essentially a step below Sydney grade cricket, but doesn't work that Fifth Grade in the grade competition is above Shires first grade. Shires first grade is probably equivalent to a hypothetical "second and a half grade" of the Grade competition, but - on average - each Shires team would field one or two guys that could easily play First Grade, and usually play Shires because they don't want the training load involved with playing grade cricket.
 
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The number of grade clubs has been a stumbling block for years. Everyone can see that there are too many teams and the talent is spread too thin.

However the 13 clubs themselves (Grade cricket committee) have the power over the number of clubs in the competition and structure. It's a constitutional thing.

SACA can't come in over the top and say clubs X and Y need to merge, or that there are only 10 licenses being given out for next season and clubs need to apply.

Their hands are tied.

A dozen or so years ago SACA tried to get the constitution changed at their AGM (SACA members vote) so that they had the power to get rid of clubs. Several clubs rallied hard to stack the meeting with SACA members who were sympathetic to their grade clubs and the proposal was defeated.

There is a shires cricket equivalent (Adelaide Turf CA) but grade clubs would see playing there as a death knell I'm sure.

Mergers are the way forward. At least three to get us to 10 teams.

Recently the Adelaide Cricket Club and Southern District Cricket Club boards voted to merge with each other. However it was shot down by their members and fell over.

SACA provides about $60k in funding to each grade club each season. They almost need to turn the tap off for a couple of years and force a few to die off.
 
Think I heard somewhere that they are getting a third party (perhaps a consulting firm?) to come in and assess and rank all clubs on a range of aspects (on field performance, development of state cricketers, finances, facilities.

Much fairer way of doing it imo. Previously they seemed to target clubs to merge while other clubs which should have been in the conversation got a free ride.

Anyone know if this is still happening?
 
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t_94 said:
Think Inheard somewhere that they are getting a third party (perhaps a consulting firm?) to come in and assess and rank all clubs on a range of aspects (on field performance, development of state cricketers, finances, facilities

Much fairer way of doing it imo. Previously they seemed to target clubs to merge while other clubs while clubs which should have been in the conversation got a free ride.

Anyone know if this is still happening?
Click to expand...
Yeah it is. Heard that Jill Duck (sp?) is the 3rd party facilitator but I have no idea who that is.

Club meetings are coming up
 
Redline said:
I didn't hear the interview so there maybe context around it but Tom is a bit dilusional if he didn't see this coming. I think after winless year change is all but guaranteed

TOM COOPER: It was a shock (cut from the Redbacks) to be honest as I believe I still have a lot of cricket left in me.

TOM COOPER: I guess they wanted to go younger. In their view there needed to be changes made to regenerate cricket in SA.
Click to expand...

Best option for Cooper is to go back and play with the Netherlands. Every chance of playing at another T20 World Cup
 
Drugs Are Bad Mackay? said:
The number of grade clubs has been a stumbling block for years. Everyone can see that there are too many teams and the talent is spread too thin.

However the 13 clubs themselves (Grade cricket committee) have the power over the number of clubs in the competition and structure. It's a constitutional thing.

SACA can't come in over the top and say clubs X and Y need to merge, or that there are only 10 licenses being given out for next season and clubs need to apply.

Their hands are tied.

A dozen or so years ago SACA tried to get the constitution changed at their AGM (SACA members vote) so that they had the power to get rid of clubs. Several clubs rallied hard to stack the meeting with SACA members who were sympathetic to their grade clubs and the proposal was defeated.

There is a shires cricket equivalent (Adelaide Turf CA) but grade clubs would see playing there as a death knell I'm sure.

Mergers are the way forward. At least three to get us to 10 teams.

Recently the Adelaide Cricket Club and Southern District Cricket Club boards voted to merge with each other. However it was shot down by their members and fell over.

SACA provides about $60k in funding to each grade club each season. They almost need to turn the tap off for a couple of years and force a few to die off.
Click to expand...

Killing off clubs never works.
They would be better off putting in a tier between 1st class and grade cricket.
Perhaps 4 teams ...North, South, East, West....play maybe once a month on top of grade cricket.

Not my idea, was a proposal that was considered when they reviewed the English cricket structure in the late 90's/early 00's.
 
Number37 said:
Killing off clubs never works.
They would be better off putting in a tier between 1st class and grade cricket.
Perhaps 4 teams ...North, South, East, West....play maybe once a month on top of grade cricket.

Not my idea, was a proposal that was considered when they reviewed the English cricket structure in the late 90's/early 00's.
Click to expand...
They did exactly this

Redbacks League

Four teams, ran for 5 or so years. Stopped this year due to Covid
 
As mentioned they wanted to merge South District with Adelaide

That would have left the South with no grade cricket representation

Teams need to merge, not sure if they were the right ones though
If not merge they a premier league/ div 2 league or similar
 
I can't see a Divisions model working or being accepted. Cricket Australia wants uniformity across all states eg hence everything being renamed Premier Grade Cricket.

These clubs are perennially weak: Port Adelaide, Prospect, Woodville, Northern Districts, Southern Districts, West Torrens.

Two of them are strategically important from a demographic point of view (Northern and Southern) so they survive. Need Port & Prospect to merge along the Port Adelaide Enfield council lines. And Woodville & West Torrens to merge like in football.

Adelaide Cricket Club merge with a neighbour (ideally Uni so all clubs have juniors) and we're at 10. Would be about right I reckon.
 
Drugs Are Bad Mackay? said:
They did exactly this

Redbacks League

Four teams, ran for 5 or so years. Stopped this year due to Covid
Click to expand...
How did this go? My reservations about this style of competition is whether the players are truly invested in winning matches for their club/team, or do they just treat it as an individual stepping stone to greater opportunity?

Your post earlier was a good insight to the structure of the Adelaide grade system, and it seems that any change is going to very hard to implement. I totally understand why clubs are so reticent to accept change, and it's a very traumatic experience for members of club's with long histories when their club goes under or gets merged.

The nature of the shield competition - small competition, fairly high fluctuation in performance from one season to the next, Australian availability can have a high bearing on one state's season - means issues can be masked after a good season or two. It's only half a decade ago South Australia played in back to back finals, finishing on top of the table in one of them. So there is a chance they could bounce up the table next season and things aren't looking so bad.

But when you look at the long term results, it's clear something isn't right and needs changing in the set up.
 
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