The Greens

[PJays]

All they have to do is be closer to right on labors left than the liberals are closer to the left on labors right. Do that and they can impact nearly every policy labor puts to the senate.

If you look at ABC's Vote compass, Labor and Liberal aren't far from the middle, and relatively speaking aren't far from each other.

The Greens on the other hand
...So far left if you zoom in 20% they'll disappear off to the side.

 

[windyhill]

Not overly political, couldn't be bothered actually, however Brandt out ?

 

[taurus]

Maintaining the balance of power in the Senate was the original goal of the Greens so objective completed.

But huge copium from the Greens about absolute shite show in the lower house and Bandt getting the flick.

Obstructionism, perceived identity politics and obsession over Gaza contributed to the stagnation of the votes.

It would be fascinating to see how the new leader position the party. Personally want Faruqi to see if the support for the Greens remain firm in 3 years given that she is likely to be similar to Bandt. Have a funny feeling that Libs probably want her too.

 

[Caesar]

their primary vote has stabilised at about 10% to 15% for the past 20 years

their goal has never been to stabilise at 10-15% of the vote

the major party PV has declined by almost 20% over the same period - spin all you like, that is an insane number of votes left on the table

 

[spinynorman]

If you look at ABC's Vote compass, Labor and Liberal aren't far from the middle, and relatively speaking aren't far from each other.

The Greens on the other hand
...So far left if you zoom in 20% they'll disappear off to the side.

ABC’s Vote Compass of course being the unimpeachable authority on where the political left, right and centre are.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Adam Bandt gone, good riddance.

The Greens wiped out is great news for the left or right.

Yep, great that we can get back to raping the environment, saying we’re taking action on climate change whilst approving massive new fossil fuel projects, and tabling an utter joke of a housing policy to deal with one of the most pressing issues facing the nation. Thank duck those pesky Greens are out of the way.

 

[Grin]

Adam Bandt gone, good riddance.

The Greens wiped out is great news for the left or right.

Nah. The Greens hold the balance of power in the senate. Labor will need the support of the Tories or the Greens to pass legislation.

Even you'd agree that it's a big win for the community that the Greens effectively hold the same power as the MAGAts. It means that Labor either sides with the party of the RWNJ culture warriors, or does the right thing and sides with the environment, affordable housing, wage growth, public health, education, racial tolerance etc. All of those things the Greens have campaigned for and the Liberals have shown they vigorously oppose.

So no. The Greens haven't been wiped out at all, unless you news feed is exclusively Sky After Dark.

 

[Forward Press]

their goal has never been to stabilise at 10-15% of the vote

the major party PV has declined by almost 20% over the same period - spin all you like, that is an insane number of votes left on the table

Well Clive Palmer's goal is to win seats and become the government but that never eventuated either.

Realistically, a left or right wing party will never form government in Australia as it stands until it captures the centre.

The decline has gone to other micro parties and independents, yes they have an issue in not capturing those disillusioned major party voters but it's not catastrophic.

 

[Gralin]

Neither Labor nor the coalition want to make sure abortion is accessible

 

[Saint]

View attachment 2308050
Neither Labor nor the coalition want to make sure abortion is accessible

After reading doubt about the Greens in earlier posts. I read this from Abbott and I'm reassured the Greens are needed now, as ever.

They are growing as a 3rd party force to the point that even though the ALP won a huge swing, they didn't get near a majority in the Senate.

I agree their main problem is that they're progressive on everything and don't really seem open to being very progressive on some things but not others. They seem too uncompromising.

For example, I'm a Greens voter/supporter and I love horse and dog racing, know lots of people in the industry who love animals and they and the animals would suffer if it was banned like the Greens want.

Maybe it's the trade-off between wanting them to be perfect for me, but others in the party want it to be perfect for them...

 

[Caesar]

yes they have an issue in not capturing those disillusioned major party voters

That’s all I was saying

Big opportunity gone begging last few elections, that’s all

 

[PJays]

ABC’s Vote Compass of course being the unimpeachable authority on where the political left, right and centre are.

Ok. Let's take some examples.

Tax policy

Labor and Liberal- no major announcements. No significant reforms.

Labor announced a tiny tax cut- 16% to 14% for the lowest bracket.

Liberal didn't match this (the party of low taxes!) instead offering a one-off $1,200 offset for low and middle incomes.

Labor has an extra tax on super balances over $3m which Liberal was planning to repeal, but this impacts very few people.

Greens went hard on tax. Billionaire tax. Extra corporate taxes ("1 in 3 corporations pay no tax"). Reducing negative gearing to one property.

So Labor and Liberal relatively close, Greens much further left.

Health and Medicare:

The majors played a cat and mouse game.

Labor ran a campaign suggesting Liberal would cut Medicare. Liberal promised otherwise.

Labor announced $8.5 million extra funding. Liberal matched it.

Labor from memory had another policy Liberal didn't match.

Meanwhile Greens want dental in medicare- a costly, structural change.

Again- Greens wanting big, structural changes. Further from Labor than Labor is to Liberal.

 

[Gralin]

After reading doubt about the Greens in earlier posts. I read this from Abbott and I'm reassured the Greens are needed now, as ever.

They are growing as a 3rd party force to the point that even though the ALP won a huge swing, they didn't get near a majority in the Senate.

I agree their main problem is that they're progressive on everything and don't really seem open to being very progressive on some things but not others. They seem too uncompromising.

For example, I'm a Greens voter/supporter and I love horse and dog racing, know lots of people in the industry who love animals and they and the animals would suffer if it was banned like the Greens want.

Maybe it's the trade-off between wanting them to be perfect for me, but others in the party want it to be perfect for them...

It's legislation to make abortion officially a public health responsibility

To improve access to it and to require medical practitioners that don't want to provide it to either transfer patients that do to someone else or provide them with information on who they can go see instead

The majors won't propose this because they've both got strong anti abortion groups due to the influence of religion in both parties, labor just keep much quieter about it

 

[Seeds]

Yep, great that we can get back to raping the environment, saying we’re taking action on climate change whilst approving massive new fossil fuel projects, and tabling an utter joke of a housing policy to deal with one of the most pressing issues facing the nation. Thank duck those pesky Greens are out of the way.

The greens have increased their power slightly. They havent lost anything. Seats in the house are pointless when labor has such a large majority. The teals are now completely pointless in the new parliament. The greens however could have massive power in the senate if they are willing to negotiate.

 

[Gralin]

The greens have increased their power slightoy. They havent lost anything. Seats in the house are pointless when labor has such a large majority. The teals are now completely pointless. The greens however could have massive power in the senate if they are willing to negotiate.

more like if labor is willing to negotiate

 

[Gralin]

Saint on the progressive on everything I think it's largely because they've been the only party on the left

They're trying to appeal to lots of different groups of progressive voters and we've certainly got enough pollies pushing the opposite positions already

 

[Seeds]

more like if labor is willing to negotiate

Well not as much, cos labor can just turn to the libs to get policy passed if greens arent flexible. Its the greens and libs who have to negotiate and outbid each other.

 

[Caesar]

Meanwhile Greens want dental in medicare- a costly, structural change.

Again- Greens wanting big, structural changes. Further from Labor than Labor is to Liberal.

It’s less about big structural changes and more about aligning with what people actually want

Labor opening urgent care centres is a big structural change but it helps address a problem that people are screaming about - i.e. overcrowded emergency departments and a lack of bulk billing doctors. Not surprising it got them a lot of traction.

Dental in Medicare has been a point of contention for decades, sure a lot of people would like it but if you talk to them about health policy it’s not what has their attention right now

There’s value in having a consistent platform but if voters feel you’re not responsive to their changing needs and priorities they won’t vote for you

 

[Gralin]

Well not as much, cos labor can just turn to the libs to get policy passed if greens arent flexible. Its the greens and libs who have to negotiate and outbid each other.

Labor has to negotiate with the senate to pass legislation

The greens have always been willing to negotiate, the issue has been labor not wanting to and acting like the greens not passing their legislation unchanged is undemocratic

 

[Carn The Berries]

Well not as much, cos labor can just turn to the libs to get policy passed if greens arent flexible. Its the greens and libs who have to negotiate and outbid each other.

If the LNP can actually get their shit together (which is highly unlikely given the make-up of the caucus) they can wedge the Greens and promote the obstructionist line. Be willing to support the ALP as much as possible and be the conduit for the government's policies to get through parliament. Obviously this won't be possible everywhere, but they need to move away from the right, and supporting the ALP wherever possible (particularly where the Greens are holding things up) would be viewed very positively by the electorate IMHO.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Yep, great that we can get back to raping the environment, saying we’re taking action on climate change whilst approving massive new fossil fuel projects, and tabling an utter joke of a housing policy to deal with one of the most pressing issues facing the nation. Thank duck those pesky Greens are out of the way.

First time i've ever agreed with you

 

[Forward Press]

If the LNP can actually get their shit together (which is highly unlikely given the make-up of the caucus) they can wedge the Greens and promote the obstructionist line. Be willing to support the ALP as much as possible and be the conduit for the government's policies to get through parliament. Obviously this won't be possible everywhere, but they need to move away from the right, and supporting the ALP wherever possible (particularly where the Greens are holding things up) would be viewed very positively by the electorate IMHO.

That's not going to be convincing voters to elect the LNP at the next election though.

"Hey we voted with the ALP for everything the past 3 years, but choose us instead because we have Angus/Sussan!"

 

[Forward Press]

That’s all I was saying

Big opportunity gone begging last few elections, that’s all

Fair.

I was just taking umbrage at those (like Julian Leeser this morning) saying this is a repudiation of antisemitism or other culture war style rubbish. It's not, it's just redistributions and a lack of appeal to the centre.

 

[Saint]

Saint on the progressive on everything I think it's largely because they've been the only party on the left

They're trying to appeal to lots of different groups of progressive voters and we've certainly got enough pollies pushing the opposite positions already

But it doesn't mean they have to take up every progressive issue with gusto. You can be against horse racing (won't lose votes) without calling for an outright ban (will lose votes).

We've got the Legalise Cannabis Party and Animal Justice Party.

Perhaps there's the need for a party between the ALP and the Greens. Economically progressive, but socially centrist. An inverse of the Teals. Probably not. But there's a bigger gap between the ALP and the Greens than there has ever been, I think. The ALP have gone so far right (centre).

Apart from more medicare spending and reducing student loans, it wasn't a very progressive campaign. And the last 3 years of Govt wasn't progressive at all.

Acknowledging this is from my vantage point further on the left.....

 

[Saint]

Fair.

I was just taking umbrage at those (like Julian Leeser this morning) saying this is a repudiation of antisemitism or other culture war style rubbish. It's not, it's just redistributions and a lack of appeal to the centre.

Muslim Indpendent in Blaxland got 20% of the vote.

The ALP had 5% swings against them in seats with large Muslim proportions like Watson and Blaxland. They're still safe ALP, but it certainly doesn't show being pro-genocide is a net vote-winner.