The Inevitable War - Keating goes bang

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Jun 30, 2009
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Deroesfromgero
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1) billions die with mushroom clouds
2) mushroom clouds fu** the developing world more than proxy wars
Between the french, the British, the russians and chinese, nk’s, pakistan, india, israel and anyone else ive forgotten theyve let off about 1030 test nukes and 2 for real funk yo city ones.

Might as well chuck in a chernobyl and a fukishima too while we are at it.

This includes the Tsar bomb - The explosion of which showed on the dial as about 57,000 kilotons of energy…..the bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki during World War II were equivalent to 15 and 21 kilotons.

The largest nuclear device tested by the United States was 15,000 kilotons so just over a quarter of the tsar bombe!

Most us nukes these days sit around the 100-1200 kt yield.


I guess it depends exactly how insane things get. You would really hope a petulant cowardly manbaby like trump want in charge - things could get really bad.

Or the might hit each other with a few and common sense breakout.

I dont see the chinese starting with nukes unless the americans hit chinese (mainland) soil.

And the americans have (at the moment) such a huge conventional advantage that they wouldnt need to start.

To badly paraphrase sting - i hope the chinese AND the americans love their children too.
 
We're already Xi's b*tch, if we decided to get on our knees and suck his appendage it'd be the same, nothin would change, he'll do as he pleases. That's obvious with the petulant behaviour from Xi and his admin, partly coz of the buffoon from marketing and his incompetence, spud heads rhetoric and has been wanna be abbott.

We know Joe won't push the button or send troops to ......... anywhere, even given his finger waving at Xi about 'bullying' other nations, (mainly talking about us)

We're already in a war, a cyber and trade war. the upping in arms and nuclear arms is all a dick measuring contest. Like our limp dick sub deal (would've been either way)

Not even Xi would be dumb enough hit the button, off the top of my head all of these nutjobs have been or are commander in chief of nuclear / superpower nations
  • Xi
  • Putin
  • Trump
  • Kim
  • Bojo (not so nutty)
Not one them has previously declared war on another nation, not one. Sure there's been plenty of 'baiting' like Kim or Xi in the SCS etc, but again it's a show of 'don't fk with us, you'll be sorry!' when it's all bluff.

I have no idea why everyone thinks the options are 1/ Suck Xi's dick and everything's ok or 2/ Boots on the ground / military war.

putin has annexed crimea from ukraine
trump took over syrian oil fields
johnson wants to turf the Good Friday agreement and resume the Troubles


and again, taiwan isnt a xi issue. its an issue of chinese national pride. giving up taiwan is equivalent to handing over HK to the english all over again. they will go to war over taiwan, no matter who is in charge
 
Jun 6, 2016
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putin has annexed crimea from ukraine
trump took over syrian oil fields
johnson wants to turf the Good Friday agreement and resume the Troubles


and again, taiwan isnt a xi issue. its an issue of chinese national pride. giving up taiwan is equivalent to handing over HK to the english all over again. they will go to war over taiwan, no matter who is in charge

Did any of them use nukes or send millions of boots on the ground?
 

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Between the french, the British, the russians and chinese, nk’s, pakistan, india, israel and anyone else ive forgotten theyve let off about 1030 test nukes and 2 for real funk yo city ones.

Might as well chuck in a chernobyl and a fukishima too while we are at it.

This includes the Tsar bomb - The explosion of which showed on the dial as about 57,000 kilotons of energy…..the bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki during World War II were equivalent to 15 and 21 kilotons.

The largest nuclear device tested by the United States was 15,000 kilotons so just over a quarter of the tsar bombe!

Most us nukes these days sit around the 100-1200 kt yield.


I guess it depends exactly how insane things get. You would really hope a petulant cowardly manbaby like trump want in charge - things could get really bad.

Or the might hit each other with a few and common sense breakout.

I dont see the chinese starting with nukes unless the americans hit chinese (mainland) soil.

And the americans have (at the moment) such a huge conventional advantage that they wouldnt need to start.

To badly paraphrase sting - i hope the chinese AND the americans love their children too.

we have been closer than people think

outside the obvious one of the cuban missile crisis, Macarthur wanted to invade China and nuke Beijing/Shanghai/etc because he thought with DPRK on the ropes and china recovering from the civil war, that was the time to strike (thankfully Truman and Congress disagreed)

more recently trump asked about deploying tactical nukes (most hilariously in hurricanes)
 
Did any of them use nukes or send millions of boots on the ground?

putin deployed tactical nukes to the ukrainian border, and currently has moved 100,000 troops to the border, with 40,000 in crimea

and no army in the world has 2m+ troops, so nice metric to use as your bar for s**t getting ugly
 
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putin deployed tactical nukes to the ukrainian border, and currently has moved 100,000 troops to the border, with 40,000 in crimea

and no army in the world has 2m+ troops, so nice metric to use as your bar for sh*t getting ugly

Fair enough, did he use any of those nukes? Do you think Xi will take Taiwan by force? If so do you think Joe will call all his allies to gang up on him? Military and arms style?

My whole point is none of these nutjobs are going to push the button and it's gonna be ww3.

But the hyperbole on these pages suggests that's exactly what's gonna happen, it probably aint.
 
Fair enough, did he use any of those nukes? Do you think Xi will take Taiwan by force? If so do you think Joe will call all his allies to gang up on him? Military and arms style?

My whole point is none of these nutjobs are going to push the button and it's gonna be ww3.

But the hyperbole on these pages suggests that's exactly what's gonna happen, it probably aint.

IMO:

1) any chinese leader will invade the second taiwan declares independence OR agrees to host US forces

2) the usa will dodge and weave until a gulf of tonkin occurs. they wont want it, but if a carrier gets hit in the straits, politically its suicide back home to not respond

3) both trump and biden have already said they expect australia will be boots on the ground in taiwan
 
Jun 6, 2016
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IMO:

1) any chinese leader will invade the second taiwan declares independence OR agrees to host US forces

2) the usa will dodge and weave until a gulf of tonkin occurs. they wont want it, but if a carrier gets hit in the straits, politically its suicide back home to not respond

3) both trump and biden have already said they expect australia will be boots on the ground in taiwan

The Taiwanese foreign minister has already publicly stated Taiwan is independent - no sign of Xi yet.

Don't forget we're already in a trade and cyber war, Xi KNOWS if he does go the path of military war with Taiwan he risks Joe bringing his mates and it'd be over before it began.

Just yesterday Xi was quite 'behaved' in his meeting with Biden, first time we've seen mature behaviour from him for some time - if ever.

For mine it's all bluff in a poker game, I seriously doubt either will engage in a full blown arms war.

If I'm wrong the world is dead.
 
Jun 30, 2009
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Deroesfromgero
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we have been closer than people think

outside the obvious one of the cuban missile crisis, Macarthur wanted to invade China and nuke Beijing/Shanghai/etc because he thought with DPRK on the ropes and china recovering from the civil war, that was the time to strike (thankfully Truman and Congress disagreed)

more recently trump asked about deploying tactical nukes (most hilariously in hurricanes)
Theres another one where (from memory) a soviet political officer stood up to a boomer captain and refused to release (could have been an engineering officer) anyway one of them was determined to launch and believed moscow had been taken out in a decapitation strike - the other counselled calm and to wait a bit and see if there are any communications etc.

very brave man who saved the world.
 
Jun 30, 2009
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Deroesfromgero
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putin deployed tactical nukes to the ukrainian border, and currently has moved 100,000 troops to the border, with 40,000 in crimea

and no army in the world has 2m+ troops, so nice metric to use as your bar for sh*t getting ugly

china :
2,185,000 (2021) (ranked 1st)
Reserve personnel1,170,000 (2020)
 
The Taiwanese foreign minister has already publicly stated Taiwan is independent - no sign of Xi yet.

Don't forget we're already in a trade and cyber war, Xi KNOWS if he does go the path of military war with Taiwan he risks Joe bringing his mates and it'd be over before it began.

Just yesterday Xi was quite 'behaved' in his meeting with Biden, first time we've seen mature behaviour from him for some time - if ever.

For mine it's all bluff in a poker game, I seriously doubt either will engage in a full blown arms war.

If I'm wrong the world is dead.

do you actually read anything people write? ive been saying for months we are in a cold war

the independence thing is kabuki, as dumb as it is saying you are independent is not the same as declaring independence. An example. China are happy for Taiwan to be in the TPP, ONLY if its after china is admitted. rationale, they are "chinese" so admitting them once china is in is just admitting more china into the agreement. Its garbage, but its how asia rolls

taiwan IMO will only declare if they think the USA has their back. FFS they didnt do it for the entire reign of the KMT, even though china was crippled, and they didnt even do it in the 90's when china was still on the early stages of the rebuild.

up until now taiwan has been happy to wait for china to get over this whole communist thing, and china was happy for the theatre to be maintained. The change has been the usa using taiwan for domestic consumption (which imo is idiotic because you're giving a loaded gun to two people in a mexican standoff)

china will bluff about SCS, the indian border, and the various islands contested between them and japan/korea/russia. taiwan is a red line (just like HK is)

and yep, the world is ****ed if people call this bluff (which is why I will be leaving australia is duttons wet dream happens)
 
china :
2,185,000 (2021) (ranked 1st)
Reserve personnel1,170,000 (2020)

most of that is equivalent to our coppers (slightly upgraded). the PLA have a much more active role in day to day life, and the majority are not what we consider fit for front line troops (its amazing how many are basically security guards at all the govt buildings around town)
 
Theres another one where (from memory) a soviet political officer stood up to a boomer captain and refused to release (could have been an engineering officer) anyway one of them was determined to launch and believed moscow had been taken out in a decapitation strike - the other counselled calm and to wait a bit and see if there are any communications etc.

very brave man who saved the world.

the accidental ones is freaky. I read a book years ago on these. both sides had heaps, everything from IT * ups to geese screwing radar up
 

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Jun 6, 2016
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do you actually read anything people write? ive been saying for months we are in a cold war

the independence thing is kabuki, as dumb as it is saying you are independent is not the same as declaring independence. An example. China are happy for Taiwan to be in the TPP, ONLY if its after china is admitted. rationale, they are "chinese" so admitting them once china is in is just admitting more china into the agreement. Its garbage, but its how asia rolls

taiwan IMO will only declare if they think the USA has their back. FFS they didnt do it for the entire reign of the KMT, even though china was crippled, and they didnt even do it in the 90's when china was still on the early stages of the rebuild.

up until now taiwan has been happy to wait for china to get over this whole communist thing, and china was happy for the theatre to be maintained. The change has been the usa using taiwan for domestic consumption (which imo is idiotic because you're giving a loaded gun to two people in a mexican standoff)

china will bluff about SCS, the indian border, and the various islands contested between them and japan/korea/russia. taiwan is a red line (just like HK is)

and yep, the world is f’ed if people call this bluff (which is why I will be leaving australia is duttons wet dream happens)

I'm not disagreeing with you , I'm disagreeing with the mantra around here we're headed for ww3 - as I did reply to you in previous posts.

I also don't subscribe to the mantra that if 'we' sucked Xi's dick instead of asking for an inquiry to covid etc. etc. things would be 'smoother' for us. Xi has form and is picking fights all around the world.
 
I'm not disagreeing with you , I'm disagreeing with the mantra around here we're headed for ww3 - as I did reply to you in previous posts.

I also don't subscribe to the mantra that if 'we' sucked Xi's dick instead of asking for an inquiry to covid etc. etc. things would be 'smoother' for us. Xi has form and is picking fights all around the world.

two things pinged us with china:

1) cancelling the huawei contracts

2) wanting nuclear inspector rules for the investigation

IMO the second was pointless, esp as the EU werent backing it (and their proposal was ultimately accepted). why we wanted to be front line on that fight was baffling. Let the usa and eu do that s**t.
 
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two things pinged us with china:

1) cancelling the huawei contracts

2) wanting nuclear inspector rules for the investigation

IMO the second was pointless, esp as the EU werent backing it (and their proposal was ultimately accepted). why we wanted to be front line on that fight was baffling. Let the usa and eu do that sh*t.

Agreed, I will however call out Xi and his admin losing their sh*t just by some calling and independent investigation into covid. Yeah the inspector rules was useless and at worst antagonistic.

That doesn't absolve nomo and his incompetence in the slightest, nor that it should've been left to someone else.

Still it's nowhere near as bad as the continual toy throwing by Xi - just coz someone called for an investigation.

Bit petulant for mine.

Surely we can agree on that.
 
Agreed, I will however call out Xi and his admin losing their sh*t just by some calling and independent investigation into covid. Yeah the inspector rules was useless and at worst antagonistic.

That doesn't absolve nomo and his incompetence in the slightest, nor that it should've been left to someone else.

Still it's nowhere near as bad as the continual toy throwing by Xi - just coz someone called for an investigation.

Bit petulant for mine.

Surely we can agree on that.

Let me underline this - it isn't xi

Speak to people in China, who have access to world media, and there is genuine hate for Australia right now

No matter who was in the seat, a nuclear grade investigation targeting china only, and a Huawei ban was never going to be smiled on.

Chinese people are incredibly proud of Huawei, and they see the ban as simply trying to block an apple rival (fair or not). The nuclear inspector s**t was just stupid, and as I said at the time, we would never have accepted this.

And again, my stance isn't pro.china. I want out of this fight, and for Australia to go down the non aligned path
 
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Let me underline this - it isn't xi

Speak to people in China, who have access to world media, and there is genuine hate for Australia right now

No matter who was in the seat, a nuclear grade investigation targeting china only, and a Huawei ban was never going to be smiled on.

Chinese people are incredibly proud of Huawei, and they see the ban as simply trying to block an apple rival (fair or not). The nuclear inspector sh*t was just stupid, and as I said at the time, we would never have accepted this.

And again, my stance isn't pro.china. I want out of this fight, and for Australia to go down the non aligned path

Again I'm not disagreeing with you.

I'll state my position again.

I'm opposed to the hyperbole, in this thread, that the world is going to an all out military and arms war.

EDIT: No one wants in this 'fight'.
 
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most of that is equivalent to our coppers (slightly upgraded). the PLA have a much more active role in day to day life, and the majority are not what we consider fit for front line troops (its amazing how many are basically security guards at all the govt buildings around town)
Mate a decent proportion of any army are practically civilians in uniform but they still know one end of a gat from the other and can be training up at home whilst the pointy end guys do pointy end s**t.

Takes 3 months to train a really basic soldier then at least another 3 months to train them in their first specialty. The guys you are talking about have them first bit done. They are 3 months closer than a civilian.

They have 2 million full timers and a million part timers.
 
Mate a decent proportion of any army are practically civilians in uniform but they still know one end of a gat from the other and can be training up at home whilst the pointy end guys do pointy end sh*t.

Takes 3 months to train a really basic soldier then at least another 3 months to train them in their first specialty. The guys you are talking about have them first bit done. They are 3 months closer than a civilian.

They have 2 million full timers and a million part timers.

Again, the pla is not akin to the adf. You're including people who's roles are here in civil policing. It goes back to how the pla needed to do pretty much everything post civil war (because the rest of the infrastructure was toast). It's kept that partly too in order to be an employment sink (joys of socialism)

If all were deployed in a war, youd have a WW1 Russian situation.
 

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Let me underline this - it isn't xi

Speak to people in China, who have access to world media, and there is genuine hate for Australia right now

Seems unhinged to me, and you're pandering to, to use kranky al phrase, steeply sloped foreheads who are not too dissimilar to bogans who would hate Iraq because of what they see on the news. And that's not really a fair comparison because Australia is actually a really good country where Chinese denizens want to migrate, and have, who have benefited to have a great quality of life. It's really, really unhinged.

I've spoken to many Chinses people who don't like the CCP and I've got no doubt there views would be schismatic to the picture you paint - which always suits your narrative/agenda and your own loathing of folks like Dutton. They are not all behind the CCP - many are leaving the country - and are not saying why.?

Just after the pandemic, the CCP were going door to door of of family members who reside in Australia - and I'm sure other foreign lands, to clarify if they have relatives in Australia, what they are doing there, when will they come back etc. Post pandemic - much of the Chinese people were shitting themselves. And things aren't getting better, because the society has regressed to be as paranoid as it was under Mao Zedong - and the number of purges also reflect that.

The tourists and the students will come back somewhat alas - the government goes out of it's way to put a blanket ban on it.
 
Seems unhinged to me, and you're pandering to, to use kranky al phrase, steeply sloped foreheads who are not too dissimilar to bogans who would hate Iraq because of what they see on the news. And that's not really a fair comparison because Australia is actually a really good country where Chinese denizens want to migrate, and have, who have benefited to have a great quality of life. It's really, really unhinged.

I've spoken to many Chinses people who don't like the CCP and I've got no doubt there views would be schismatic to the picture you paint - which always suits your narrative/agenda and your own loathing of folks like Dutton. They are not all behind the CCP - many are leaving the country - and are not saying why.?

Just after the pandemic, the CCP were going door to door of of family members who reside in Australia - and I'm sure other foreign lands, to clarify if they have relatives in Australia, what they are doing there, when will they come back etc. Post pandemic - much of the Chinese people were shitting themselves. And things aren't getting better, because the society has regressed to be as paranoid as it was under Mao Zedong - and the number of purges also reflect that.

The tourists and the students will come back somewhat alas - the government goes out of it's way to put a blanket ban on it.

1) my family over there and our friends are mostly middle and upper class (it's not cheap to pay to study in Australia or the USA, well out of reach of most Chinese)

2) the common man is what gives the party its power. Go into a county in inland china, and find out how much love for us is there.

3) my mil is still a PRC citizen and we received no door knock from the party. Stop making s**t up
 

ExcitementMachine

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1) my family over there and our friends are mostly middle and upper class (it's not cheap to pay to study in Australia or the USA, well out of reach of most Chinese)

2) the common man is what gives the party its power. Go into a county in inland china, and find out how much love for us is there.

3) my mil is still a PRC citizen and we received no door knock from the party. Stop making sh*t up

Many Chinese - the smart ones - see through the propaganda and will come back, tourism and the students. What's the alternative Ned, The USA - where they are rioting every second day?

The common man in China are simply brainwashed - some are so uneducated they see a foreigner they'll ask, Russian or American?

Point 3, that's a fact - not sure why the goons didn't hassle your wife's family, are they CCP members. I'm sure my, very very high ranking CCP family friends who were in China - weren't harassed for their son residing in Australia. However for your interest - that's a different story for mere mortal Chinese denizens and I can assure you their family members in China were questioned and harassed, and many were shitting themselves. It's a well known fact that harassing the family members of dissidents is how the CCP roll. You know this.
 
Many Chinese - the smart ones - see through the propaganda and will come back, tourism and the students. What's the alternative Ned, The USA - where they are rioting every second day?

The common man in China are simply brainwashed - some are so uneducated they see a foreigner they'll ask, Russian or American?

Point 3, that's a fact - not sure why the goons didn't hassle your wife's family, are they CCP members. I'm sure my, very very high ranking CCP family friends who were in China - weren't harassed for their son residing in Australia. However for your interest - that's a different story for mere mortal Chinese denizens and I can assure you their family members in China were questioned and harassed, and many were shitting themselves. It's a well known fact that harassing the family members of dissidents is how the CCP roll. You know this.

stop making s**t up, most of my friends in australia from from mainland china, and none have had this happen

china does enough ****ed up s**t without making up stuff like this
 

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