Autopsy The Luke Beveridges coaching idiocy throws away the game thread.

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Virgin Dog

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I think he still has some merit even if he has made a generalisation. Everyone I talk to who has no clue what this forum is nor do they talk on Facebook forums and they all share similar opinions regarding the match selection. Everyone with a brain can see it. The only people who can't are the blind loyalists.
The problem with that is the people you talk to are generally just people in your own circles, who are far more likely to share opinions with you on a wide range of topics. It's no more credible that the "blind loyalists" whose friends all agree with them that nothing is wrong. Anecdotal evidence doesn't mean much. I am by no means implying that everything is perfect, and I have my own gripes with match selection at times, but the suggestion from the other user is just ridiculous and not based on any actual evidence outside of anecdotes - "almost every Dogs' supporter is unhappy"
 

Dogs 13

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Ok, can you let me know where the majority of members have expressed that Bevo is losing them?
I was throwing that question out to anyone.

The rest was directed at your post suggesting that most fans are pissed off and have no reason to not be.
You both know that I can't. All I can go on is my discussions with my family and friends, the general mood on here and in that cesspit FB, comments in the media.

There are so many positives about the club, we've pushed many of the top sides, but can you tell me you're happy with pissing away a year of Dunkley's career, giving English no real support, not having a look at Lewis Young, Greene, Sweet, Schache (again) when another player in Gardner who obviously is not ready gets a game, selecting a clearly struggling Dickson in a crucial game, the treatment of Trengove, the baffling selection of Gowers, etc ?
 

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Virgin Dog

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You both know that I can't. All I can go on is my discussions with my family and friends, the general mood on here and in that cesspit FB, comments in the media.

There are so many positives about the club, we've pushed many of the top sides, but can you tell me you're happy with pissing away a year of Dunkley's career, giving English no real support, not having a look at Lewis Young, Greene, Sweet, Schache (again) when another player in Gardner who obviously is not ready gets a game, selecting a clearly struggling Dickson in a crucial game, the treatment of Trengove, the baffling selection of Gowers, etc ?
Those are all anecdotes though, and not based on actual evidence.

In no way am I saying I'm happy with everything so far. It's frustrating for me seeing Gowers get games ahead of testing guys like Greene, or English playing cooked ahead of testing Sweet, or Lewis Young not being given opportunity to develop in the seniors, or a whole range of other selection decisions. But that stems more from me not being fully invested in this season, and preferring to use it as a development year.

Ultimately, you can't say that most Dogs fans are unhappy, when it's just as valid for someone else to argue that everything is sunshine and rainbows because their friends and family agree with them.
 

Dogs 13

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Those are all anecdotes though, and not based on actual evidence.

In no way am I saying I'm happy with everything so far. It's frustrating for me seeing Gowers get games ahead of testing guys like Greene, or English playing cooked ahead of testing Sweet, or Lewis Young not being given opportunity to develop in the seniors, or a whole range of other selection decisions. But that stems more from me not being fully invested in this season, and preferring to use it as a development year.

Ultimately, you can't say that most Dogs fans are unhappy, when it's just as valid for someone else to argue that everything is sunshine and rainbows because their friends and family agree with them.
It's obvious to me that at least 51% of Dogs' supporters are unhappy ;)
 
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CarnTheScray

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On a different note I'd say probably the one significant way supporters can express their thoughts to the club is through memberships. We aren't doing a very good job, COVID or not, when you have plodders like St Kilda overtaking you in membership numbers, and we won the flag four years ago.
 

True Dog

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Just disregarding the fact that it's nowhere near a consensus on BF that it's dire times at the Dogs, even within in the group of users that are upset there's numerous different viewpoints. Just have a look at the ins/outs threads each week, there's never a consensus on anything.
We all have different views and see the game differently. To think a viewpoint is held by all (seemingly just because it's your viewpoint) is ridiculous.
Amen!! Well said, the ins/outs wanted each week varies like Melbournes weather amongst our BF brothers/sisters..... Everyone being dropped is the reason we lost and those in contention for selection is a star.. Sure I've been baffled at some of the selections but I've been more concerned with balance over personal. Bevo hates losing more than most and in the end will be responsible and accountable he either adapts and makes changes or falls and pays the price in the next year ot two. I truly hope we can make some assistant changes and add new voices/IP to our coaching panel but I fear like most it's not going to happen, not soon anyways...
 

Virgin Dog

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On a different note I'd say probably the one significant way supporters can express their thoughts to the club is through memberships. We aren't doing a very good job, COVID or not, when you have plodders like St Kilda overtaking you in membership numbers, and we won the flag four years ago.
I don't know exact statistics on this, but it could also come down to the demographic of our supporters. If an above average proportion of Bulldogs supporters are affected by COVID, they may be less inclined to buy a membership right now given it's basically just a donation.

But yes, the best way for supporters to speak their minds is through memberships - if we're confident in the direction of the club, then memberships would rise. If people are frustrated, membership growth suffers.
 

Mantis Toboggan

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You need to understand that the <50 users who post here regularly having melts over match selection do not represent the entire Dogs fan base. Just like the Facebook groups don't. Just like the Reddit pages don't. Just like WOOF doesn't.

The average footy fan doesn't use social media to actively discuss their team. Many fans are happy to go along and watch. Larry suggesting Bevo is "losing all Dogs fans very quickly" is just pure nuffy material
You’d have to be a pretty casual fan not to question the rucking situation at the moment. The way that is affecting Dunkley. The persistence with Gardner and the opportunities he has been afforded compared to others. The refusal to play Trengove when he appears a very plausible solution to a couple of issues - particularly confusing given he was brought in as a senior leader.

I’m not sure wh Larry was referring to, but Robbo could have had his pick. I think the truth is that Robbo hasn’t the foggiest what’s going on at the Dogs and therefore cannot give an answer.

If I met a Bulldogs fan who didn’t see this topic as, at least, an interesting subject to discuss I’d really have to question what they actually get out of the game.
 

Glaeken Oracle

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If Bevo left tomorrow (or today), who WOULD coach? King, Gia?! Chris Grant? Peter Gordon? The only answer is King. Why? He is a ruckman, and he would immediately rectify our ridiculous rucking situation by:
- no longer rucking Dunkley (or Macrae, or Bont)
- no longer rucking English
- bringing Sweet and Trengove in and swapping them between ruck and forward pocket like coaches did in the "good old days"

Stephen King for coach - make rucking great again.

1598940802377.png


Note to PA: Tatiana, not sure if this is ex-Cat Stephen King, check before posting, then take the afternoon off, I can take care of the rawhide and honey stains.
 

Doggies_13

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There are much better ways to rest English than the current strategy being used. To have English take centre bounces then sit forward whilst a midfielder rucks offers us no advantage. In both the cats game and the dees games after a quarter the opposition worked it out at their stoppages to get clearances. In the dees game we made an adjustment had our good quarter and won the game. The cats game we made no adjustments.

If English can’t ruck the game like he was early in the season then either:

1. He needs to be dropped and someone else brought in; or

2. Another ruckman needs to come in and play English as a ruck/forward; or

3. let him take the centre bounce then sit a kick behind the play and only take the defensive half stoppages. Let Bruce or even a mid take the forward half stoppages.

At some stages we had Bruce, naughton and English all the forward 50 whilst Dunkley took the ruck at a stoppage in the forward 50 it makes zero sense. If Beveridge wants to do that then English or Bruce need to drop out of the 50 to intercept or at least bring to ground any possible opposition hacked clearance
 

Optimistic Dog

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Ruck rhymes with a certain 4 letter word and in past tense ruck becomes rucked and our ruck situation is Fu??ed either that or the combination of our rucks sucks. :)
 

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Mattdougie

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On a different note I'd say probably the one significant way supporters can express their thoughts to the club is through memberships. We aren't doing a very good job, COVID or not, when you have plodders like St Kilda overtaking you in membership numbers, and we won the flag four years ago.
Stkildas membership numbers are a joke

How you can ask people for a $50 Downton and for every $50 you get a membership that gives you NOTHING other than a label that you are a member is pathetic

And then counting anyone that gives $100 as 2 memberships or 4 as 4 memberships makes it even worse

Watch those numbers crack back to earth next year when money will be even tighter
 

immortalmike

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So the few people you surround yourself with represent the wider supporter base?

That is akin to thinking that because your neighbours dislike tomatoes, all Australians must dislike tomatoes. There are hundreds of thousands of fans with individual thought patterns, who are in no way represented by the people here or the people who sit near you at a game.

If we're going to throw anecdotes out, I know a number of Dogs fans in real life who love every player being picked in our side - including a number of Gowers and Gardner fans. Why are their opinions worth less than yours, and why do they not represent the majority of Dogs supporters?
Dude you need to chill out.

The vast majority of bulldogs supporters are negative pricks. It's a stereotype at this stage. That you don't know this is truly shocking to me.
 

immortalmike

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Those are all anecdotes though, and not based on actual evidence.
Actually it seems he is more taking a rudimentary random sample.
Now if we could quantify the data from Bigfooty and other social media you'd probably have a decent basis for drawing a conclusion about the thoughts and feelings of a rather hard-core part of our fan base.
 

VogonProsthetnic

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You just have to compare 2019 and 2020 to see that this season has been a big fail.


We improved rapidly in the second half of 2019 and picked up Keats and Bruce. We were a premiership fancy at the start of the year.

As usual our start to the year was horrible. This has become a recurring theme.

Dont think it is unressonablee to ask what went wrong? Why isn’t the ruck farce resolved? Why are we beaten in the air every week still?
 

Virgin Dog

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You just have to compare 2019 and 2020 to see that this season has been a big fail.


We improved rapidly in the second half of 2019 and picked up Keats and Bruce. We were a premiership fancy at the start of the year.

As usual our start to the year was horrible. This has become a recurring theme.

Dont think it is unressonablee to ask what went wrong? Why isn’t the ruck farce resolved? Why are we beaten in the air every week still?
There's problems that won't be fixed overnight. By design, we have a chronically under-experienced team, leading to consistency issues. We play a high risk, high reward game style that often fails to fire when you introduce a weak link (whether it be a bad player or an inexperienced one). We have some pretty average assistant coaches. I have no doubt that Bevo is capable of delivering us another flag, but there is so much that needs to be addressed for that to happen
 

VogonProsthetnic

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There's problems that won't be fixed overnight. By design, we have a chronically under-experienced team, leading to consistency issues. We play a high risk, high reward game style that often fails to fire when you introduce a weak link (whether it be a bad player or an inexperienced one). We have some pretty average assistant coaches. I have no doubt that Bevo is capable of delivering us another flag, but there is so much that needs to be addressed for that to happen
The fact that we are inexperienced is not an accident. It’s a deliberate list management strategy.

Id be more happy if I could see active steps taken to resolve these issues. Do you feel the right moves are being made?

What is the alternative if English does not instantly metamorphose into Grundy or Gawn?
 

CarnTheScray

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Stkildas membership numbers are a joke

How you can ask people for a $50 Downton and for every $50 you get a membership that gives you NOTHING other than a label that you are a member is pathetic

And then counting anyone that gives $100 as 2 memberships or 4 as 4 memberships makes it even worse

Watch those numbers crack back to earth next year when money will be even tighter
I get that their numbers are a joke but it still shows that more people are willing to pledge their money to that club than our supporters are willing to pledge to us, even if they are incorrectly counted as members. As far as I know, we don't have any of those $50 BS options but I haven't checked in a while.
 

Dogs_r_barking

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The fact that we are inexperienced is not an accident. It’s a deliberate list management strategy.

Id be more happy if I could see active steps taken to resolve these issues. Do you feel the right moves are being made?

What is the alternative if English does not instantly metamorphose into Grundy or Gawn?
I don’t think Toyd retiring, Picken having to retire, Clay Smith knees gave away, Hamling wanted to go back to WA, Stringer played up and his personal issues effected the team, Dahlhaus not improving, Roughy stating he was stale, Libba went off the boil, Wally recovering from a horrendous broken leg, Biggs off the boil. How was any of this by design?
 

Mattdougie

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I get that their numbers are a joke but it still shows that more people are willing to pledge their money to that club than our supporters are willing to pledge to us, even if they are incorrectly counted as members. As far as I know, we don't have any of those $50 BS options but I haven't checked in a while.

It wasn’t a membership option

They asked anyone and everyone, members or non members to donate $50 and if they did they would get a membership with zero privileges just a number.

Not even sure how the AFL allow that to be counted as a member
 

Mattdougie

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I don’t think Toyd retiring, Picken having to retire, Clay Smith knees gave away, Hamling wanted to go back to WA, Stringer played up and his personal issues effected the team, Dahlhaus not improving, Roughy stating he was stale, Libba went off the boil, Wally recovering from a horrendous broken leg, Biggs off the boil. How was any of this by design?

Does it not worry you that we couldn’t creat an environment that players didn’t go stale or lose focus in

An environment that players Don’t have to retire due to mental health? Legitimately has any other player retired doe to that and that alone at 23?

An environment where a premiership player would rather go home to a sh!t team than stay with a flag team?

An environment where premiership players aren’t shuffled to the twos and made redundant while lesser players take their spots in an ordinary team?

None of that is by design but imo they are all controllables other clubs don’t allow to happen
 

VogonProsthetnic

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I don’t think Toyd retiring, Picken having to retire, Clay Smith knees gave away, Hamling wanted to go back to WA, Stringer played up and his personal issues effected the team, Dahlhaus not improving, Roughy stating he was stale, Libba went off the boil, Wally recovering from a horrendous broken leg, Biggs off the boil. How was any of this by design?
I’ll give you the first four mentioned, but please explain what forced us to give away the others for nothing?
 

Virgin Dog

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The fact that we are inexperienced is not an accident. It’s a deliberate list management strategy.

Id be more happy if I could see active steps taken to resolve these issues. Do you feel the right moves are being made?

What is the alternative if English does not instantly metamorphose into Grundy or Gawn?
Yeah I mentioned us being inexperienced by design, I think it's almost entirely our own fault (a few unfortunate circumstances, but largely our own choice).
I think we're mostly making the right moves, in terms of playing Gardner when he's not ready, giving English more time than most clubs would, playing kids early, etc. Can't say I agree with Dunkley in the ruck, Lewis Young getting thrown everywhere, Schache being dropped after a wet game, but I don't know what happens behind the scenes to drive these decisions
 

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