The Manager Merry-go-Round

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SM

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I think it's more to do with their recent form trending in one direction. They just lost to Sheff Weds mid-week which is a sackable offence in and of itself but I think that's the double over them that Wednesday have done now.
 

Art Vandelay_

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I think it's more to do with their recent form trending in one direction. They just lost to Sheff Weds mid-week which is a sackable offence in and of itself but I think that's the double over them that Wednesday have done now.
Personally think Wednesday will stay up, take out the points deduction from a previous season error and their points would be good enough for 16th so far.
 

TheGreatBarryB

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I think it's more to do with their recent form trending in one direction. They just lost to Sheff Weds mid-week which is a sackable offence in and of itself but I think that's the double over them that Wednesday have done now.
Yeah fair enough a bad month or so can be fatal when expectations are so high. Tough on Wednesday though they’ve got 13 points from last 6 Champ games.
 

hairy biker

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Interesting response from Emma Hayes;

Chelsea Women boss Emma Hayes has shut down rumours linking her to the AFC Wimbledon job and called the reports an "insult" to women's football.
..she insisted Wimbledon would not be able to afford her .....
"I don't know why anyone would think women's football is a step down [in comparison to men]"
All fine, but she then goes on to say;
...when the football world is ready to adhere to the diversity codes, so that BAME communities plus women get the opportunities in men's football, I will see that as a step forward.
So complains about opportunity, knocks back (potential) opportunity, because she is better than said (potential) opportunity.

Seems to me there are (realistically) two ways for women coaches to "get the opportunities in men's football".
Progress from the lowest rungs (eg start p/t at the U10s) or a high profile women's coach takes a head coaching/managerial post at a lower league club, achieves success and hopefully the bigger clubs come knocking.

Chance for Hayes to be a ground breaker and really open the door for women's coaches, but on the face of it her ego (or fear?) allows the moment to pass.
And given her reaction I'm not sure how many more clubs would come knocking.
 
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TheGreatBarryB

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Interesting response from Emma Hayes;





All fine, but she then goes on to say;


So complains about opportunity, knocks back (potential) opportunity, because she is better than said (potential) opportunity.

Seems to me there are (realistically) two ways for women coaches to "get the opportunities in men's football".
Progress from the lowest rungs (eg start p/t at the U10s) or a high profile women's coach takes a head coaching/managerial post at a lower league club, achieves success and hopefully the bigger clubs come knocking.

Chance for Hayes to be a ground breaker and really open the door for women's coaches, but on the face of it her ego (or fear?) allows the moment to pass.
And given her reaction I'm not sure how many more clubs would come knocking.
I suppose she’s suggesting she’s already coach of Chelsea womens in PL, why would she leave that and take over a team in third tier men’s.
 

SM

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I suppose she’s suggesting she’s already coach of Chelsea womens in PL, why would she leave that and take over a team in third tier men’s.
And I guess the point is it's just like former players, generally they have to cut their teeth in a lower division or league. Gerrard didn't puff out his chest and demand he be given a job in the PL to reflect his abilities as a former PL player, he acknowledged he would have to prove himself and went to Rangers. She's managing Chelsea in a different competition so it's not really comparable to the Chelsea in the PL.

Reading are in the women's PL, should their manager expect jobs in the men's PL?
 

TheGreatBarryB

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And I guess the point is it's just like former players, generally they have to cut their teeth in a lower division or league. Gerrard didn't puff out his chest and demand he be given a job in the PL to reflect his abilities as a former PL player, he acknowledged he would have to prove himself and went to Rangers. She's managing Chelsea in a different competition so it's not really comparable to the Chelsea in the PL.

Reading are in the women's PL, should their manager expect jobs in the men's PL?
I’m saying that she believes she’s already in an elite comp and doesn’t feel the need to prove herself in the men’s comp at any level.

I agree with you if she did have ambitions to coach men’s PL the only route would be to start in lower leagues. I thinks she’s suggesting that wouldn’t be the case when she says “we shouldn’t look at women’s football as a step down”.
 

SM

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I’m saying that she believes she’s already in an elite comp and doesn’t feel the need to prove herself in the men’s comp at any level.

I agree with you if she did have ambitions to coach men’s PL the only route would be to start in lower leagues. I thinks she’s suggesting that wouldn’t be the case when she says “we shouldn’t look at women’s football as a step down”.
Yeah that's clearly what she thinks, which I think is a bit short-sighted and proud of her.
 

RossFC

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And I guess the point is it's just like former players, generally they have to cut their teeth in a lower division or league. Gerrard didn't puff out his chest and demand he be given a job in the PL to reflect his abilities as a former PL player, he acknowledged he would have to prove himself and went to Rangers. She's managing Chelsea in a different competition so it's not really comparable to the Chelsea in the PL.

Reading are in the women's PL, should their manager expect jobs in the men's PL?
Gerrard was our U18s coach for a bit before Rangers also.
 

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Loonerty

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Yeah that's clearly what she thinks, which I think is a bit short-sighted and proud of her.
I feel like it's a bit different though... like yeah past players can go straight into management jobs in the second division with no prior experience. From her point of view, why should she, being an experienced manager of a successful team, consider a job in the tier below them a step up from where she is?

And if indeed she doesn't get offers from higher up then she's made clear she's happy to stay where she is regardless.
 

SM

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I feel like it's a bit different though... like yeah past players can go straight into management jobs in the second division with no prior experience. From her point of view, why should she, being an experienced manager of a successful team, consider a job in the tier below them a step up from where she is?

And if indeed she doesn't get offers from higher up then she's made clear she's happy to stay where she is regardless.
Well a good example I can think of (even though it didn't work out in either case) was Marco Silva and Leonid Slutsky, both with CL experience coming to Hull to prove themselves in the English game. They didn't move straight across to CL teams, and as it turned out, with good reason.

And that's fine, but I think the point being made here is it could have been a pioneering opportunity for female managers. Imagine she turned their form around and had them promoted to the Championship next season, and that prompted a PL club to pick her up?
 

jd2010

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At a much shitter club. Elite facilities at Chelsea are quite different to hostile men in League One.
There's elite facilities at some A-League clubs compared to those in League One, but I think there's a more proven path to the top tier starting from League One than from Australia's top division.
 

SM

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There's elite facilities at some A-League clubs compared to those in League One, but I think there's a more proven path to the top tier starting from League One than from Australia's top division.
Not quite sure what your point is lol.

She's at Chelsea at the moment, I wouldn't say A-League facilities are on par with Chelsea if that's what you're saying.
 

jd2010

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Not quite sure what your point is lol.

She's at Chelsea at the moment, I wouldn't say A-League facilities are on par with Chelsea if that's what you're saying.
Think you're selling short how good the new Wanderers centre are and City's planned centre will be in comparison to League One facilities.

Of course it's not Chelsea but there's still a mammoth gap between A-League facilities and League One but that wouldn't be a deciding factor in where a manager would choose to manage. There's a much clearer pathway to the top of the men's game from League One than there is the A-League or WSL.
 

SM

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Think you're selling short how good the new Wanderers centre are and City's planned centre will be in comparison to League One facilities.

Of course it's not Chelsea but there's still a mammoth gap between A-League facilities and League One but that wouldn't be a deciding factor in where a manager would choose to manage. There's a much clearer pathway to the top of the men's game from League One than there is the A-League or WSL.
I don't really care how good the A-League facilities are to be honest they're hardly relevant in a comparison between the elite clubs of the PL and League One.

I don't know how the A-League has come into this.

Who says she wants to get to the top of the men's game?
 

jd2010

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I don't really care how good the A-League facilities are to be honest they're hardly relevant in a comparison between the elite clubs of the PL and League One.

I don't know how the A-League has come into this.

Who says she wants to get to the top of the men's game?
If she doesn't want to manage in the PL then it's a completely redundant point to bring into the conversation.

But if she does, a "step down" to league one is a clearer pathway than straight from the WSL.
 

SM

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If she doesn't want to manage in the PL then it's a completely redundant point to bring into the conversation.

But if she does, a "step down" to league one is a clearer pathway than straight from the WSL.
What's a redundant point? The whole conversation is around her rejecting a League One club lol. Bostonian (arguably incorrectly) suggested she was turning down the chance to manage better players, so the counter point was she's doing so to stay at a club which is probably run much better.
 

jd2010

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What's a redundant point? The whole conversation is around her rejecting a League One club lol. Bostonian (arguably incorrectly) suggested she was turning down the chance to manage better players, so the counter point was she's doing so to stay at a club which is probably run much better.
Facilities don't matter is the point I'm making bringing the a league up.

Has she even said she wants to manage men's football?
 

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