Star Wars The Mandalorian

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Ryz

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I saw that meme. That's the whole point of Luke though.

The old Jedi of which Yoda and and Obi-Wan are a part of were failures by continuing the old way of the Jedi. Luke breaks the cycle of them thinking everyone is past the point of redemption.

All the character development Luke had in the OT is totally undone by the ST.

Even if everyone is happy with Luke's character going that way, it deserved more than litteral 5 second flashbacks.

Ironic thing is the same people calling the movie fresh are defending it by saying it's calling back to the originals.
 

General Giant

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I saw that meme. That's the whole point of Luke though.

The old Jedi of which Yoda and and Obi-Wan are a part of were failures by continuing the old way of the Jedi.

All the character development Luke had in the OT is totally undone by the ST.

Even if everyone is happy with Luke's character going that way, it deserved more than litteral 5 second flashbacks.

Ironic thing is the same people calling the movie fresh are defending it by saying it's calling back to the originals.
It wasn’t what I wanted his character to be.
But saying it’s undoing all the character work is silly.

Kenobi and Yoda weren’t ones to run and hide either in the PT but they did.

Your last sentence is rubbish. Haven’t defended it yet and wasn’t overly impressed at all. But saying the Star Wars hasn’t don’t this before with a character and probably will again is ridiculous.
 

Ryz

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It wasn’t what I wanted his character to be.
But saying it’s undoing all the character work is silly.


Your last sentence is rubbish. Haven’t defended it yet and wasn’t overly impressed at all. But saying the Star Wars hasn’t don’t this before with a character and probably will again is ridiculous.
Wasn't having a go at you regarding defending it.

In terms of undoing his character development, happy to hear alternative views, but you have to tell me why , not just say I'm wrong.
 

General Giant

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Wasn't having a go at you regarding defending it.

In terms of undoing his character development, happy to hear alternative views, but you have to tell me why , not just say I'm wrong.
Wasn’t just saying you were wrong. Was saying Star Wars has been doing 180s on character development long before the sequel trilogy came into being.

But playing devils advocate.

As you age you change.

He wasn’t a hot headed younger Jedi anymore that wanted to take on the galaxy. He had massive dad issues at the time and more hope.

As you get older you naturally get jaded. He was fearful of what might come again should he let him live. Let’s remember he actually only thought of it in a the blink of an eye. Which was when Ben noticed him.

Once again not defending the movie as it had a lot of wtf moments and it’s not that good in my opinion but, as much as I’m not a fan of hermit Luke, he wasn’t one of them character wise. Neither was Rey (at that point anyway).
 

SM

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It wasn’t what I wanted his character to be.
But saying it’s undoing all the character work is silly.

Kenobi and Yoda weren’t ones to run and hide either in the PT but they did.

Your last sentence is rubbish. Haven’t defended it yet and wasn’t overly impressed at all. But saying the Star Wars hasn’t don’t this before with a character and probably will again is ridiculous.
You're missing the point though. The original image of Luke saying he can't kill his own father is rejecting the call to action from Kenobi and Yoda. You're then using their behaviour to rationalise Luke when the entire point of ROTJ is he isn't like them.
 

General Giant

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You're missing the point though. The original image of Luke saying he can't kill his own father is rejecting the call to action from Kenobi and Yoda. You're then using their behaviour to rationalise Luke when the entire point of ROTJ is he isn't like them.
Not missing anything.

He isn’t like them, Yet.

Young Kenobi from TPM wasn’t like old man Kenobi either.

You seem to be rationalising that people in the teens/twenties are the same as when they are in 40s or older. We aren’t.
Despite the catchy saying Leopards do change their spots, just takes a while.
 

mike123

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Not entirely true.
Plenty of people like TLJ. I’m not saying I’m one of them though it’s not as bad as some on here make out.
Lots more love TFA.
Haven’t really met anyone who likes TROS.

But the ST is no worse that the PT. Am old enough to remember the outright rage that was put out there when the Prequels were released.

Will take a generation before you will have the kids who were fans grow up and then fondly remembering the ST like it took for the PT.
It will be interesting to see in the future but I don’t think the sequel trilogy will have the same endearment onto young fans that the prequels did and I think time will be less on the ST than the PT.

The sequels look like fine well acted well scripted movies on the surface but the problems appear once to analyse them slightly. Whether on the surface the prequels are cringeworthy but the overall story told wasn’t that poor. The kids ignored the cringeworthy elements and then grewup to appreciate the story. I don’t see the same happening with the sequels.
 
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SM

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Not missing anything.

He isn’t like them, Yet.

Young Kenobi from TPM wasn’t like old man Kenobi either.

You seem to be rationalising that people in the teens/twenties are the same as when they are in 40s or older. We aren’t.
Despite the catchy saying Leopards do change their spots, just takes a while.
You seem to be excusing it by hand waving 180 degree character changes as if that's not the exact complaint.
 

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GG.exe

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It will be interesting to see in the future but I don’t think the sequel trilogy will have the same endearment onto young fans the the prequels did and I think time will be less on the ST than the PT.

The sequels look like fine well acted well scripted movies on the surface but the problems appear once to analyse them slightly. Whether on the surface the prequels are cringeworthy but the overall story told wasn’t that poor. The kids ignored the cringeworthy elements and then grewup to appreciate the story. I don’t see the same happening with the sequels.
Despite the PTs flaws, the story itself was great and easy i guess. Just explaining how everything came to be in the OT. But the STs job was to come up with something new and original, telling a new story. They not only copy and pasted much from the OT, lack of ideas, but also a lack of vision in the story itself, each of the three parts and the overall arc. Was the worst thing out of millions of ideas they couldve tried. Just cant forgive the ST whatsoever for being so bereft of ideas, mocking lore, etc
 

edgie

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Obi didn't hide though. He went to watch over Luke til the time was right. That's clearly established. Obi Wan also kept in contact with Yoda. Princess Leia knew were Obi Wan was and was on her way to call for his aid, which his answered.

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General Giant

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Obi didn't hide though. He went to watch over Luke til the time was right. That's clearly established. Obi Wan also kept in contact with Yoda. Princess Leia knew were Obi Wan was and was on her way to call for his aid, which his answered.

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He hid. You are just making excuses. Hell Yoda says exactly that he must go into hiding.
 

GG.exe

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Meh.

The overwhelming reaction to TLJ was disappointment, a splintered fan base and LFL insulting and denigrating their fans.

The overwhelming response to Mandalorian is adults crying like babies and wholehearted appreciation and thanks to those who made it.
Perfectly put. Theres no way the ST ever in the future becomes better embraced by fans.....ESPECIALLY because The Mandalorian exists and about another 12 SW shows that will probably be as good as TM, so fans will have a ton of material to reaffirm their love of the Lucas-like SW which will only further build hate for the KK-like SW
 

SM

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20 years ago if you told me the PT would be beloved I would of laughed at you, as would many, yet here we are.
The thing with the PT though, as M123 pointed out, was that the underlying plot is actually good and works well over the three films, it's the surface level things people didn't like - the acting and the effects in parts. It's virtually the opposite with the ST, where the surface level things like the effects and acting are much better, but the plot is incredibly shallow and doesn't stand up. So over time the ST will actually be thought of less.

Plus it's come out in an era of super saturation with content. When the PT came out, it was THE SW material. We've had R1, Solo, The Mandalorian and a bunch of other shows to come for kids to latch onto and enjoy. There won't be the same nostalgic pull of the ST for the next generation.
 

edgie

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He hid. You are just making excuses. Hell Yoda says exactly that he must go into hiding.
'i have a message for you'
'ok... I'm getting a bit old for that sh*t though, you wanna come with and help?'

'i have your lightsaber, your sister sent me, we need you help'
'******* stick it up your arse I'm not doing anything for anyone'

They're very different. One was waiting. One was running.

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edgie

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The PT was universally derided by everyone and the company kept silent and didn't attack the fans.

The ST had this weird contrast between critics and fans and the company did attack the fans. That kind of approach isn't easily fixed.

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SM

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The PT was universally derided by everyone and the company kept silent and didn't attack the fans.

The ST had this weird contrast between critics and fans and the company did attack the fans. That kind of approach isn't easily fixed.

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Lucas pushed back a fair bit.
 

edgie

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Lucas pushed back a fair bit.
Other than wearing a Han shot first shirt and general comments about people never being happy with him telling his story, I don't recall anything derogatory and insinuating intolerance like we've seen in current era.

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