Solved The Manson Family Murders (1969) * Van Houten has been released

[childeric]

Charles Manson had spent most of his life in institutions where he learnt the skills of manipulating people to survive

In 1967 he went to San Francisco where he was able to use his abilities to recruit a gang of young people, mainly runaways, and trained them to kill

He believed that African Americans were about to rise up in revolt and overthrow white society, so he took his "family" to the desert from where they would re-emerge after the revolt and take over

The gang murdered a number of people including Sharon Tate (the wife of Roman Polanski) and some of her friends, as well as another wealthy couple in a seperate incident

The best book to read on the episode is "Helter Skelter" by Vincent Bugliosi (who prosecuted the case), in which it is stated that the gang could have been responsible for up to 200 other murders that remained undetected

Manson and several members of his "family" are still in jail

 

[Mr Reliable]

Manson claimed to have been inspired by hidden meanings in songs by the Beatles, including ''Helter Skelter'' and ''Piggies''.

Sharon Tate was heavily pregnant, IIRC.

I think some of the worst offenders are still trying to get paroled.

 

[childeric]

Manson was trying to make it as a musician and approached record producer Terry Melcher (son of the actress Doris Day), who gave a negative assessment of his music.

The house in which Sharon Tate and her friends were murdered had previously been occupied by Melcher and his GF Candice Bergen -it is thought that Manson could have sent his people there for revenge, not knowing Melcher no longer lived there

Also murdered at the Polanski house was celebrity hairdresser Jay Sebring.

One of his clients, Steve McQueen, rushed to Jay's apartment and flushed Jay's drug stash down the toilet before LAPD could find it

 

[Mr Reliable]

Manson was trying to make it as a musician and approached record producer Terry Melcher (son of the actress Doris Day), who gave a negative assessment of his music.

The house in which Sharon Tate and her friends were murdered had previously been occupied by Melcher and his GF Candice Bergen -it is thought that Manson could have sent his people there for revenge, not knowing Melcher no longer lived there

Also murdered at the Polanski house was celebrity hairdresser Jay Sebring.

One of his clients, Steve McQueen, rushed to Jay's apartment and flushed Jay's drug stash down the toilet before LAPD could find it

Yes, reminds me of the times when the police raid unit 14 and destroy everything in sight looking for the stash or the hitman kills the bloke at 27 Smith Street only to find the real targets were unit 14A and 27 Smith Road.

It seems that poor woman who was shot by the fat guy in front of her children several years back in her driveway in Niddrie or Keilor (still unsolved) was a case of mistaken identity.

 

[SE_Blue]

Read somewhere that he tried to control people when he was imprisoned after the murders and instead became a virtual sex slave to some gang leader

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I'll have to read that Bugliosi book - his book on the JFK hit is brilliant. Staggering amount of detail.

 

[rocker_oz33]

What was the Manson beachboys connection? pretty sure he knew one of them.

 

[Mr Reliable]

What was the Manson beachboys connection? pretty sure he knew one of them.

Read something about this recently. All a bit of a fog. Something like a connection to Brian Wilson through Brian's brother Dennis. Both Brian and Dennis were Beachboys. Manson may have recorded some music at Brian's studio.

 

[childeric]

Read something about this recently. All a bit of a fog. Something like a connection to Brian Wilson through Brian's brother Dennis. Both Brian and Dennis were Beachboys. Manson may have recorded some music at Brian's studio.

Manson met Dennis Wilson somewhere while trying to push his own music career

I think he did help Manson record a single

Dennis returned to his house one night and found the whole Manson family in residence after having broken in.

Dennis let them stay for quite a while (or was too scared to kick them out) and he even picked up an STD from them

 

[Mr Reliable]

Manson met Dennis Wilson somewhere while trying to push his own music career

I think he did help Manson record a single

Dennis returned to his house one night and found the whole Manson family in residence after having broken in.

Dennis let them stay for quite a while (or was too scared to kick them out) and he even picked up an STD from them

It could have been worse, MUCH worse.

 

[lewigie]

Didn't Manson and Brian Wilson live together? I thought I saw a quote from Brian about that.

 

[PVF]

The beach boys covered one of Manson's songs IIRC.

 

[childeric]

It could have been worse, MUCH worse.

There are many chilling things about the way they operated

Before they went out on the real murder raids they did dry-runs which involved breaking into houses while the occupants were asleep, crawling through the house and leaving without disturbing anything

A witness stated that one day one of the young girls who followed Manson confided in her that she had reached the stage where she could kill her own parents

 

[Dr Dolphin]

There are many chilling things about the way they operated

Before they went out on the real murder raids they did dry-runs which involved breaking into houses while the occupants were asleep, crawling through the house and leaving without disturbing anything

A witness stated that one day one of the young girls who followed Manson confided in her that she had reached the stage where she could kill her own parents

Definitely could have been much worse, although it is still terrible. I read that Manson's orders to Tex Watson was to go house-to-house killing people as they went. The Tate etc murders didn't go as easily as they planned as Watson didn't think the girls were up to doing it again that night so took them back to the ranch.

There was also someone left alive in the gatekeepers residence on the property. He was arrested over the murders the next day, but let go pretty quickly (the first victim was killed in the driveway, and had been there to visit him). At the time he said he didn't see or hear anything, but in later years he has claimed to have seen/heard some of it but so high on dope he didn't really understand what was going on.

Anyone interested should read the book 'Helter Skelter'. Brilliant book, but absolutely terrifying. Still cant imagine how anyone could convince these young, (generally) well bought up girls to commit such horrendous crimes.

 

[childeric]

The gang murdered the wealthy Lo Bianco couple around the same time as Tate

At both scenes similar words were written in blood on the walls e.g. "piggies"

Because the killings happened in different geographical areas they were investigated by two seperate bodies, LAPD & LASO (LA Sheriff's Office) and they did not communicate with each other

The similarities in MO were therefore not picked up and both organisations went off on different tangents

 

[mark73]

Manson was trying to make it as a musician and approached record producer Terry Melcher (son of the actress Doris Day), who gave a negative assessment of his music.

The house in which Sharon Tate and her friends were murdered had previously been occupied by Melcher and his GF Candice Bergen -it is thought that Manson could have sent his people there for revenge, not knowing Melcher no longer lived there

Also murdered at the Polanski house was celebrity hairdresser Jay Sebring.

One of his clients, Steve McQueen, rushed to Jay's apartment and flushed Jay's drug stash down the toilet before LAPD could find it

This is pretty much the size of what happened. Did you actually know that Dennis Wilson actually moved out of his own house and allowed them to stay because he was that freaked out by them. The funny thing is, he was the biggest loose cannon in The Beach Boys, which is funny because they all were.

 

[nicky]

He moved out then manson gave his maid a bullet wrapped up in tissue paper as a threat.

 

[Dr Dolphin]

The gang murdered the wealthy Lo Bianco couple around the same time as Tate

At both scenes similar words were written in blood on the walls e.g. "piggies"

Because the killings happened in different geographical areas they were investigated by two seperate bodies, LAPD & LASO (LA Sheriff's Office) and they did not communicate with each other

The similarities in MO were therefore not picked up and both organisations went off on different tangents

The La Bianca murders were the next night I believe. The police believed the Tate murders were a result of a drug deal gone bad, so didn't really look too deeply into it early on. I've seen footage of a police press conference at the time, and they are asked about the similarities btween the two murders and catergoricallyu deny they are linked.

In the end, the arrests were a fluke. Many of the gang were in prisons for auto theft, and one of the girls talked to her cellmate about the murders. Up until then, the police didn't have them as a suspect

 

[mark73]

The La Bianca murders were the next night I believe. The police believed the Tate murders were a result of a drug deal gone bad, so didn't really look too deeply into it early on. I've seen footage of a police press conference at the time, and they are asked about the similarities btween the two murders and catergoricallyu deny they are linked.

In the end, the arrests were a fluke. Many of the gang were in prisons for auto theft, and one of the girls talked to her cellmate about the murders. Up until then, the police didn't have them as a suspect

They were after Terry Melcher but he wasn't there, so they went beserk on who was there.

 

[mark73]

He moved out then manson gave his maid a bullet wrapped up in tissue paper as a threat.

Maid?

 

[nicky]

Maid?

He gave a 'bullet' to wilson's housekeeper (maid, same thing)

 

[mark73]

He gave a 'bullet' to wilson's housekeeper (maid, same thing)

Oh.

 

[Dr Dolphin]

They were after Terry Melcher but he wasn't there, so they went beserk on who was there.

Manson actually knew Terry Melcher had moved out, but since he knew the house he sent them there anyway. Apparantly he'd gone there a few months before looking for Melcher and was told by the housekeeper that he'd moved away. The story goes that Sharon Tate saw Manson in the driveway and thought he looked scary and asked the housekeeper who he was, why was he there, and wanted him gone (I have a feeling this is a scene in one of the Helter Skelter movies). Months later he organised her murder

 

[mark73]

Manson actually knew Terry Melcher had moved out, but since he knew the house he sent them there anyway. Apparantly he'd gone there a few months before looking for Melcher and was told by the housekeeper that he'd moved away. The story goes that Sharon Tate saw Manson in the driveway and thought he looked scary and asked the housekeeper who he was, why was he there, and wanted him gone (I have a feeling this is a scene in one of the Helter Skelter movies). Months later he organised her murder

Anyone who thought they were just a bunch of hippies gone stupid were often in for a bit of a surprise. Look at poor old Dennis Wilson. He ended up having to move out of his own house to get rid of them. Unfortunately Dennis's love of booze, drugs and ladies (a standard Beach Boys thing as we all found out later) overtook his mind. He should never have picked them up.

 

[childeric]

for people with a natural inclination for the 'big picture' or perhaps a desire to view events set within a historical - cultural framework. you will be richly rewarded. i promise that for some of you this will be a epiphany. be warned it's a long read, but once you start you won't stop.

The Strange but Mostly True Story of Laurel Canyon and the Birth of the Hippie Generation

http://www.davesweb.cnchost.com/

I've looked at some of this stuff - I love a good conspiracy

Seems like a great holiday read

The Black Dahlia pix were a bit full-on -they would be the official police photos I guess

A real sick p***k must have done that