No Oppo Supporters The Melt Thread

[meima]

We didn't get those ex Hawks in and basically let them take pre season for nothing.

I though rocky work under Lyon in st kinda, sumich and Roger Hayden also in charge of pre season. To said that Hale and Guerra come in and take charge of the boy straight away is a bit strange.

 

[meima]

He also is a little bit inflexible once his mind is made up, the rule changes has caught us out as well.

Rodney I don't think the ex Hawks had no said about game plan, just look at our nab cup line up, compare to other team . Team like cat ,Melbourne and other play rookie and see what they can do , only freo ignore playing Smith,nyuis ,Uber ,deluca .

 

[salim malik]

I though rocky work under Lyon in st kinda, sumich and Roger Hayden also in charge of pre season. To said that Hale and Guerra come in and take charge of the boy straight away is a bit strange.

Sumich and Roger in the background.

 

[Scham]

Sumich and Roger in the background.

What is Pryor doing in all of this? He's the defensive coach isn't he.

 

[salim malik]

What is Pryor doing in all of this? He's the defensive coach isn't he.

Not much

 

[meima]

Not much

Are you saying that Ross give Hale, guerra and rocky the permission to change the whole game plan during pre season without checking on it and go for holiday and his stock market.

 

[salim malik]

Are you saying that Ross give Hale, guerra and rocky the permission to change the whole game plan during pre season without checking on it and go for holiday and his stock market.

No .Now you're being just plain silly.

 

[meima]

No .Now you're being just plain silly.

Then getting hale and guerra is good or bad idea. Before season start there is no complaints from you also regarding ex haw in for coaching.

 

[salim malik]

Then getting hale and guerra is good or bad idea.

If results at the minute come into play what do you think?

 

[meima]

If results at the minute come into play what do you think?

I think Ross trust foot soldier improve rapidly in their kicking and decision making in pre season therefore trying them out in all pre season match at the expense trying kid out apart from mt banker match.

 

[Fat Nyfe]

If you were going to poach two Hawks to add to the coaching staff, surely Hale and Guerra would be close to bottom of the list.

I mean who knows they might be good, we're not in the inner sanctum, but I would hardly call David Hale an inspirational character. Even at the time that coaching appointment seemed a bit desperate, anything to get some inside info on Hawthorn.

 

[Reginald Perrin]

A clarification before my melt.

Ken Withers (Club Doctor) and Jeff Boyle (Club Physio) have been with the Club since its inception. They're local and I'd imagine they have input if not make the decision to refer players to specialists like Julian Feller who does many of the knee reconstructions throughout the AFL. Being critical of the coach for not building depth is one thing but to suggest he is a tyrant that hates all things local is ridiculous especially as he has chosen to extend his contract though to 2020.

To the melt....You opened your post by letting the players off the hook and I don't. I'm in the camp that thinks at 9-0 last year, we were playing well above ourselves and while it was not sustained at those levels until season's end, we remained competitive.

Conversely, at 0-9 this year, we are playing well below ourselves. We've never been a team of champions but with buy-in from the entire group, we have risen to be a very good team in the last few years that has fallen frustratingly short of being a champion team.

I feel that several factors have conspired to undermine and shake our team ethos including:
- the loss of Brett Kirk and Simon Lloyd,
- the decision by Ross to take a back seat and let inexperienced coaches take the preseason,
- the decision by Pav to stand down resulting in a divided vote amongst players and club,
- the changes to the game and by reaction, changes to our game plan which have triggered uncertainty amongst the group. We lack confidence and are constantly second guessing ourselves out there. Certainly not playing on any instinct and sadly on the weekend, it deteriorated to a lack of effort which I have not seen in Lyon's time and from his reaction at the opening of his presser, nor has he.

Beyond that, one can also not understate the negative impact from the retirement of McPharlin, injuries to Sandilands, Fyfe, Mundy, Johnson, Bennell and now Hill and the continued falling out of favour of Barlow. They are not only our best players but many are our leaders too.

It's sad that this group has worked so hard in the last few years to win respect for the Club but in such a short time it feels like we've reverted to what it felt like during the formulative years.

To pick up just a couple of points:

1. If the players are under performing that sheets home to the coach.
2. Why do people keep taking about Bennell being injured like it has made a difference when he's never played a game for us?
3. By the end, McPharlin was already at the point where he was only an average contributor.
4. None of those players you have listed were injured at the start of the season, yet we were still awful.

 

[Reginald Perrin]

Rodney I don't think the ex Hawks had no said about game plan, just look at our nab cup line up, compare to other team . Team like cat ,Melbourne and other play rookie and see what they can do , only freo ignore playing Smith,nyuis ,Uber ,deluca .

It's interesting that you mention the NAB cup, where we won every game. I watched some of those games again and our skills were much higher than they were once we started playing the real game.

 

[meima]

It's interesting that you mention the NAB cup, where we won every game. I watched some of those games again and our skills were much higher than they were once we started playing the real game.

But other team testing their potential rising star or rookie upgrade during Nab , Ross not giving a game to our rookie (deluca , Nyhuis , uber, smith) in nab , in addition he drop all the kids after mt banker game against Geelong and play Weller like sub rule exists.

 

[rodney hoo]

Rodney I don't think the ex Hawks had no said about game plan, just look at our nab cup line up, compare to other team . Team like cat ,Melbourne and other play rookie and see what they can do , only freo ignore playing Smith,nyuis ,Uber ,deluca .

That's the way it's been since the RTB reign, I've never been a fan of it but I beleive it was to get as much continuity into the team to make sure don't drop early games.

 

[free tara brown]

It's interesting that you mention the NAB cup, where we won every game. I watched some of those games again and our skills were much higher than they were once we started playing the real game.

We fielded one of the more experienced and older sides of the NAB. While the other teams were trialling potential debutants and youth, we went in with full preparation for the regular season. We ended up looking much better than we actually were.

It's quite concerning that the coaching staff had no idea how bad we were going to be. I remember some posters criticising Mark Harvey for misreading the state of the list at the beginning of 2008. What has happened this year is worse.

 

[salim malik]

Weller,

But other team testing their potential rising star or rookie upgrade during Nab , Ross not giving a game to our rookie (deluca , Nyhuis , uber, smith) in nab , in addition he drop all the kids after mt banker game against Geelong and play Weller like sub rule exists.

Weller, Tucker, Grey ,Blakley, Langdon,Hughes,Collins all played NAB cup. Its a furphy the youth weren't played.

 

[Reginald Perrin]

We fielded one of the more experienced and older sides of the NAB. While the other teams were trialling potential debutants and youth, we went in with full preparation for the regular season. We ended up looking much better than we actually were.

Maybe, but playing against full strength sides shouldn't make you forget how to kick, mark and handball.

 

[rodney hoo]

It's interesting that you mention the NAB cup, where we won every game. I watched some of those games again and our skills were much higher than they were once we started playing the real game.

Most sides take it as training run, less pressure on defending the man with the ball easier to hit targets. Sydney are known to not win any games then always do well during the season, Carlton and Brisbane won it in the last 5 seasons I think and both ended up last or near last.

 

[free tara brown]

Maybe, but playing against full strength sides shouldn't make you forget how to kick, mark and handball.

The pressure we've been subjected to is greater than what we experienced in the NAB.

Plus I think the thrashing we suffered at the hands of the Dogs broke all confidence of the team.

 

[meima]

Weller,


Weller, Tucker, Grey ,Blakley, Langdon,Hughes,Collins all played NAB cup. Its a furphy the youth weren't played.

Compare their game time with other team salim in nab cup especially Collins, Hughes,grey,tucker, Langdon.

 

[salim malik]

Compare their game time with other team salim in nab cup

Suck it up Meima. You're grasping at straws they all played . Against Geelong the second half was all kids. Sandi was rested for the last two.
This notion of no youth by us in the Nab is just plain wrong.

 

[free tara brown]

FTR, I don't think the fall will be as prolonged as he's suggesting, IF Neale stays, Bennell gets fit, Fyfe, Pearce and Sandi return in decent nick and we can ace the first pick and get McCarthy.
Could easily see us 8-12 next year...

If a lot of those things don't happen, we could be in for an extended run at the bottom

I agree, if everything goes our way, we might end up mid table next year, improving into finals.

But then does Sandilands go on in 2018 (as a 35 year old!)? Meanwhile Mundy turns 33, while Dawson and Griffin turn 32. Those latter two aren't superstars, but they're the next best in key positions of defender and ruck (after Pearce and Sandi).

All this goes on while we still haven't solved the key forward issue.

No sane analysis of where our list is at suggests we're in good shape. Yes, we have Fyfe, but it is worth bearing in mind that after the Brisbane Lions premiership era, Simon Black was the same age as Stephen Hill and Jonathan Brown was 23 (!). And in spite of the enormous residual talent they had there, they muddled through to make finals once since then.

We're in a lot of trouble.

 

[meima]

Suck it up Meima. You're grasping at straws they all played . Against Geelong the second half was all kids. Sandi was rested for the last two.
This notion of no youth by us in the Nab is just plain wrong.

Then what go wrong, the new kids on the block coach hale and Guerra . Everybody know what going on , only you keep blaming few month pre season screw us up with ex haw in.

 

[free tara brown]

Suck it up Meima. You're grasping at straws they all played . Against Geelong the second half was all kids. Sandi was rested for the last two.
This notion of no youth by us in the Nab is just plain wrong.

Which kids? The only player that was drafted in the past three drafts that played against Geelong was Weller.

Your position as Minister of Information for the club, where they never do anything wrong, must pay well.