The Olympic Thread

[jd2010]

So the excuse we like to go with for our Olympic drop off is the rise of bigger countries in our area of specialty with all their money compared to ours....

Aus v NZ since 2000

50 v 5 in Athens
46 v 9 in Beijing
35 v 13 in London
27 v 16* in Rio

* not sure about our chances of adding to the 27 but the kiwis are a decent chance for 2 more

Those damn Kiwis and all their money right?

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

Aussies will soon start winning about 10 medals all up at the olypmics.

On a downward spiral.

 

[Jatz]

Multiple disciplines inflate Phelps figures. It's not like there is different versions of running 100 and 200m (hurdles is a completely different sport)

Also all able bodied people can run. Not all have the opportunity to swim.

Then throw in that Bolt went 9/9 compared to 23/30. Throw in that 10/23 were relays compared to 3/9.

It's a no contest

No contest? Yes, the most successful olympian of all time loses out, no contest

Michael Phelps has won the 200IM in 4 consectutive olympics. He won the 100m Fly in 3 consecutive olympics.

Multiple disciplines are something that count against him? Ha, what! He's more successful at a larger range of disciplines.

Phelps has done several things that Bolt hasn't. You may disagree but to say it's no contest is absolutely laughable.

 

[chef]

It was always going to happen when we've only got a population in the low 20 million.

Other countries were always going to catch up.

 

[jd2010]

It was always going to happen when we've only got a population in the low 20 million.

Other countries were always going to catch up.

Like one with 4.5m?

It's a cop out. We've lost medals yet a country 1/5 the size has got a s**t load more

 

[jd2010]

No contest? Yes, the most successful olympian of all time loses out, no contest

Michael Phelps has won the 200IM in 4 consectutive olympics. He won the 100m Fly in 3 consecutive olympics.

Multiple disciplines are something that count against him? Ha, what! He's more successful at a larger range of disciplines.

Phelps has done several things that Bolt hasn't. You may disagree but to say it's no contest is absolutely laughable.

Multiple disciplines is something Bolt can't achieve in running. Bolt has gone 9 from 9 across all the disciplines he can contest in. If there was a 100m sprint for moonwalking or egg and spoon race he'd probably have got those too

 

[chef]

Like one with 4.5m?

It's a cop out. We've lost medals yet a country 1/5 the size has got a s**t load more

Which smaller country has more?

 

[chef]

We are sitting 8th on the tally. Maybe expectations need to be lowered.

 

[jd2010]

Which smaller country has more?

I'm saying a smaller country hasn't seen their tally drop since the "money" but has gone up quite a bit.

In my lifetime we've never finished lower than 8th so why lower the expectation. Unless we just aren't that good anymore which I find hard to believe. If we were expected to just meet 8-9 gold and 10-13 silver then fair enough. But we expected to do better and failed. It's ok to say we failed

 

[chef]

I'm saying a smaller country hasn't seen their tally drop since the "money" but has gone up quite a bit.

In my lifetime we've never finished lower than 8th so why lower the expectation. Unless we just aren't that good anymore which I find hard to believe. If we were expected to just meet 8-9 gold and 10-13 silver then fair enough. But we expected to do better and failed. It's ok to say we failed

Yeah i just think that the bigger countries have finally caught up and we arent batting above our average anymore. There was only so long it was going to last.

 

[Jatz]

Multiple disciplines is something Bolt can't achieve in running. Bolt has gone 9 from 9 across all the disciplines he can contest in. If there was a 100m sprint for moonwalking or egg and spoon race he'd probably have got those too

Right but somehow that counts against Phelps.

Sorry mate, one is the greatest Olympian of all time, the other one isn't. It's not because he isn't amazing, he just hasn't achieved the same.

 

[jd2010]

Right but somehow that counts against Phelps.

Sorry mate, one is the greatest Olympian of all time, the other one isn't. It's not because he isn't amazing, he just hasn't achieved the same.

You really are deluded if you think Phelps is the greatest because he won the most. Such an American simple way of thinking

Bolt can only win 9 gold medals across 3 Olympics. And he did exactly that.

Phelps didn't win every race he entered. Take out the sheer volume of events (4 styles + medleys + medley relays) that swimming has over sprinting and it's simply that. The world never saw Bolt lose at the Olympics. Can that be said about Phelps?

 

[WealstoneRaider]

To me you can't split Phelps and Bolt - and why should you? They are the two greatest Olympians of all time. Bolt will get slightly more kudos than phelps as athletics is a bigger sport than swimming. Plus being the fastest man of all time is a better tag than the greatest swimmer of all time

 

[jd2010]

To me you can't split Phelps and Bolt - and why should you? They are the two greatest Olympians of all time. Bolt will get slightly more kudos than phelps as athletics is a bigger sport than swimming. Plus being the fastest man of all time is a better tag than the greatest swimmer of all time

And he never lost

 

[WealstoneRaider]

And he never lost

Apparently Jamaica are going to be stripped of their relay gold in Beijing because one of the team was a doper. Does that count as a loss?

 

[jd2010]

Apparently Jamaica are going to be stripped of their relay gold in Beijing because one of the team was a doper. Does that count as a loss?

Good chance the silver and bronze winner doped too.

If it ever came out that bolt was on stuff it'd kill the Olympics for me. In the same way cycling died a bit when Armstrong got done

 

[WealstoneRaider]

So the excuse we like to go with for our Olympic drop off is the rise of bigger countries in our area of specialty with all their money compared to ours....

Aus v NZ since 2000

50 v 5 in Athens
46 v 9 in Beijing
35 v 13 in London
27 v 16* in Rio

* not sure about our chances of adding to the 27 but the kiwis are a decent chance for 2 more

Those damn Kiwis and all their money right?

Apart from GB, what other bigger countries have seen a large rise in recent Olympics? France, Germany, Japan are all seeing similar tallies as they have for years. In fact Russia and now China are dropping. Australia have dropped significantly since Beijing, but I just think it's more down to a poor cycle you are having. Although you could argue that GB have taken some of your medals because we both target similar events

 

[jd2010]

Apart from GB, what other bigger countries have seen a large rise in recent Olympics? France, Germany, Japan are all seeing similar tallies as they have for years. In fact Russia and now China are dropping. Australia have dropped significantly since Beijing, but I just think it's more down to a poor cycle you are having. Although you could argue that GB have taken some of your medals because we both target similar events

It seriously does look like its GB and NZ where we have lost medals too. Especially in rowing and hockey. Others that have probably had an effect are obviously China and Russia too. Along with France and Italy.

Countries like Japan have risen up but a lot of their increase medals came from weight division sports like Judo, Taekwando etc. (a whole other bug bear of mine)

 

[WealstoneRaider]

It seriously does look like its GB and NZ where we have lost medals too. Especially in rowing and hockey. Others that have probably had an effect are obviously China and Russia too. Along with France and Italy.

Countries like Japan have risen up but a lot of their increase medals came from weight division sports like Judo, Taekwando etc. (a whole other bug bear of mine)

I think one of Australia's strengths was targeting sports where there was a good chance of medaling - ie sports that the US, China and Russua didn't excel at (swimming aside where you've always gone head to head with the US in). I think now other teams have stepped up in those events (notably GB) so it's harder to pick up these easier medals.

I hope we start targeting events like weightlifting and wrestling because those are perhaps the last events where you don't have an Olympic superpower targeting them.

Regarding Taekwanda, it's a bit naff isn't it. Would much rather karate or Kun-fu if you are going to include martial arts. Or better still mixed-martial arts! Also Thai boxing should be included

 

[jd2010]

I think one of Australia's strengths was targeting sports where there was a good chance of medaling - ie sports that the US, China and Russua didn't excel at (swimming aside where you've always gone head to head with the US in). I think now other teams have stepped up in those events (notably GB) so it's harder to pick up these easier medals.

I hope we start targeting events like weightlifting and wrestling because those are perhaps the last events where you don't have an Olympic superpower targeting them.

Regarding Taekwanda, it's a bit naff isn't it. Would much rather karate or Kun-fu if you are going to include martial arts. Or better still mixed-martial arts! Also Thai boxing should be included

I just hate sports having weight divisions at the Olympics. Weightlifting should be whoever can lift the heaviest weight in the world. Not whoever lifts the most weight who weighs less than 65kg. Same goes for wrestling and judo. If you're small tough luck. Learn to be better or find a new sport

 

[Jatz]

You really are deluded if you think Phelps is the greatest because he won the most. Such an American simple way of thinking

Bolt can only win 9 gold medals across 3 Olympics. And he did exactly that.

Phelps didn't win every race he entered. Take out the sheer volume of events (4 styles + medleys + medley relays) that swimming has over sprinting and it's simply that. The world never saw Bolt lose at the Olympics. Can that be said about Phelps?

Bolt won every race because he entered far less. For some reason in your mind, that makes it a greater achievement. It's not (nor is it worse).

No it can't be said about Phelps. Has Bolt competed at 5 Olympics, winning gold medals in 4 of them? Has Bolt won gold medals at 31 years of age?

I can go on with the list of things Phelps did that Bolt hasn't.

 

[jd2010]

Bolt won every race because he entered far less. For some reason in your mind, that makes it a greater achievement. It's not (nor is it worse).

No it can't be said about Phelps. Has Bolt competed at 5 Olympics, winning gold medals in 4 of them? Has Bolt won gold medals at 31 years of age?

I can go on with the list of things Phelps did that Bolt hasn't.

Does that list include losing?

What else can bolt enter? He is a 100m 200m competitor just like Phelps. Not his fault he can't do it in three different ways each Olympics. Not saying phelps isn't great but he doesn't come close to Bolt. He won some relay golds than the US have won at every Olympics bar 2-3

 

[jd2010]

Have found a sport where the drop off from male to female power/skill hasn't effected it's viewing. Golf. Hard not to still marvel at what they're able to do! Some fantastic stuff from the Korean today

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Bolts 8 > Phelps 23

Ask me again in 10 years.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Have found a sport where the drop off from male to female power/skill hasn't effected it's viewing. Golf. Hard not to still marvel at what they're able to do! Some fantastic stuff from the Korean today

The LPGA is enjoyable to watch.
They are quite talented.