The on topic thread

[moomba]

Apparently the U21 premier league is going to be an U23 premier league, still have up to 4 over age players in the squad (don't worry United). Could be another reason why clubs aren't keen on the Football League Trophy, U23 is effectively mans football.

Not sure what it means for us, we'll be extremely young for U21's let alone older than that.

 

[Fryer Tuck]

Format of the Johnston's Paint Trophy for this season

http://www.efl.com/news/article/201...d-for-201617-3170687.aspx#2t05dBdMeQXcummm.99



The invited clubs are:



So, the groups will be one academy/U21 team, one League 1 team, one league 2 team and one from either League 1 or 2.

Controversial. Could possibly be used as 'justification' to introduce youth teams into the English Pyramid.

I hope for the sake of the proper League Clubs, they go out and teach the youth teams a serious lesson. Lots of good talent in the lower divisions, and part of the reason why the English lower tiers have some credibility and respectability about them.

 

[Jatz]

Did you see Hull v Leicester is the first game of the season SM ?

I just know this will end badly for me...

 

[SM]

Did you see Hull v Leicester is the first game of the season SM ?

I just know this will end badly for me...

Yep, early game will be nice.

Not expecting anything from our first 6-7 games, any points will be a bonus.

 

[Jatz]

Yep, early game will be nice.

Not expecting anything from our first 6-7 games, any points will be a bonus.

Surely you'll be up for that one sided rivalry your mob enjoys against us?

 

[SM]

Surely you'll be up for that one sided rivalry your mob enjoys against us?

What rivalry?

Are you still referring to my comments regarding Hull supporters not liking Nigel Pearson?

Did I miss something and he's back in charge?

 

[Jatz]

What rivalry?

Are you still referring to my comments regarding Hull supporters not liking Nigel Pearson?

Did I miss something and he's back in charge?

Oh right. So you have a rivalry with Derby now?

 

[SM]

Oh right. So you have a rivalry with Derby now?

Did Derby pinch him from us while under contract when we didn't want him to leave?

 

[Jatz]

Did Derby pinch him from us while under contract when we didn't want him to leave?

SO do you still not like him? Or has it changed now he's just not with us?

 

[SM]

SO do you still not like him? Or has it changed now he's just not with us?

I don't like him as an individual because of the way he left us.

I also don't like him because he was a sulky idiot with you guys when you were unable to win a game.

Nothing has changed my opinion of him.

Leicester is full of diving cheats though so if we can clean up a few of them I won't mind.

 

[jd2010]

Typical FA. Come up with a decent idea by putting the academies into the football league trophy. Schedule the fixtures around internationals. Genius. They must think that the work their U19 & U21 sides do is not worth it

 

[Jatz]

I don't like him as an individual because of the way he left us.

I also don't like him because he was a sulky idiot with you guys when you were unable to win a game.

Nothing has changed my opinion of him.

Leicester is full of diving cheats though so if we can clean up a few of them I won't mind.

Full of diving cheats? Who else apart from Vardy?

There there minnow (I just know we'll lose this game haha)

 

[Jatz]

Typical FA. Come up with a decent idea by putting the academies into the football league trophy. Schedule the fixtures around internationals. Genius. They must think that the work their U19 & U21 sides do is not worth it

Don't think that's right at all. The JPT is a trophy for lower league clubs. They shouldn't have to work around the academy teams because there's internationals on.

 

[SM]

Full of diving cheats? Who else apart from Vardy?

There there minnow (I just know we'll lose this game haha)

He's definitely the worst.

No we'll get smashed probably 3-0 in front of a half empty stadium.

 

[Jatz]

He's definitely the worst.

No we'll get smashed probably 3-0 in front of a half empty stadium.

Will they still be protesting? How long is that going on for?

 

[jd2010]

Don't think that's right at all. The JPT is a trophy for lower league clubs. They shouldn't have to work around the academy teams because there's internationals on.

Well dont include the academy sides in it then. Our 21 squad would have at least 9-10 off on internationals and I'd say most top academies would be in the same boat.

Serious question. Do league one & two sides take it as serious as they do the league, league cup & FA Cup?

 

[SM]

Will they still be protesting? How long is that going on for?

Most won't be able to afford to go.

Generally protests continue until the thing you're protesting is changed.

 

[kangaspurs]

Controversial. Could possibly be used as 'justification' to introduce youth teams into the English Pyramid.

I might be wrong but aren't most Premier league clubs in favour of a 'B' side type setup like they have in a few mainland European leagues but the Football League strongly oppose that type of set up? I thought the U21 sides joining the JPT was supposed to be used as some sort of compromise in that situation.

 

[Jatz]

Well dont include the academy sides in it then. Our 21 squad would have at least 9-10 off on internationals and I'd say most top academies would be in the same boat.

Serious question. Do league one & two sides take it as serious as they do the league, league cup & FA Cup?

I agree, they shouldn't include them.

I think so - mostly because it's a decent chance at sliverware I think.

 

[Fryer Tuck]

I might be wrong but aren't most Premier league clubs in favour of a 'B' side type setup like they have in a few mainland European leagues but the Football League strongly oppose that type of set up? I thought the U21 sides joining the JPT was supposed to be used as some sort of compromise in that situation.

Of course the big ones will be, because it gives them a better quality league to test out their players, as well as giving them more of an ability to get quality players into the club and give them regular game time.

Of course, most fans are absolutely against this. It also cheapens what these smaller clubs are fighting for. Its bad enough that the other leagues don't really give a toss of the leagues below. England's lower leagues are quite special in their own right, and to introduce B teams pretty much reduces it to other leagues.

Sure, you might claim that league teams could claim a stake by showing their superiority by defeating these B teams, but again, they're in a losing battle as those players could've easily joined these clubs on loan and get practical experience in a team environment, learning something about traditions and clubs with proper fans behind you (whereas who will actually give their full support and time to a B team side in the lower divisions?) Its also questionable if this will improve the England side just based on recent evidence (which is why people have been proposing this change.) I also heard it will be U23 as well for the B teams should it go ahead.

The John Stones' Paint Trophy is now going to be used as a legit reason as to why there should be B teams in the lower divisions, and with The FA, they could very well allow it. It's just inviting disaster for the lower teams.

Well dont include the academy sides in it then. Our 21 squad would have at least 9-10 off on internationals and I'd say most top academies would be in the same boat.

Serious question. Do league one & two sides take it as serious as they do the league, league cup & FA Cup?

Funnily enough, for the most part, not as much as you think. There are some that do need the finances that will go for it, but it does also provide a unique opportunity to not only get some fringe players a go (hey, they have reserves too, you know), but to give some teams a legit shot at silverware (since the League and FA cup are dominated by PL and Champ teams.)

It would be the number 4 competition for most L1 and L2 teams.

 

[moomba]

One consequence of the academy teams in the comp is a pretty big increase in prize money. Reckon a tie against a premier league academy could also get decent attendances too not to mention the possibility of tv coverage fown the track.

So it's not all bad. My gut feeling is that it won't stop league 1 and 2 sides winning silverware either.

Seems to have been badly planned though. Surely you get the commitment from the academy teams before announcing. What happens with the draw now?

 

[Fryer Tuck]

One consequence of the academy teams in the comp is a pretty big increase in prize money. Reckon a tie against a premier league academy could also get decent attendances too not to mention the possibility of tv coverage fown the track.

So it's not all bad. My gut feeling is that it won't stop league 1 and 2 sides winning silverware either.

Seems to have been badly planned though. Surely you get the commitment from the academy teams before announcing. What happens with the draw now?

That is were you'd be correct on the prize money. Last year: 40k. This year... 1 million pounds.

To put that in perspective, the League Cup is 500k (last year), and the FA Cup is 1.8m (this year),

Please note that this is just the prize for winning the cup, and is not inclusive of winnings in the previous rounds (and of course the ticket money).

Now I can't find any extra details on the League Cup, but it should paint a clear picture of what is going on with these cup comps. John Stones is high on paint, and he's giving the winner a lot of moola.

Now attendances on the other hand... I don't think it would be that much. How many people would be up to see the U21s against a smaller division? I mean, granted, 3000 is about the average for a L2 side (and that's lower tier for a L1 side)... but would the attendance increases be that much?

As for the academy sides... there's more from where that came from. Newcastle were the worst of the Tier 1s, and yet they got invited. I just think they'll be replaced with another academy side until the full lot has been allocated.

 

[moomba]

John Stones not involved this year. No sponsor for the comp. Not sure where the extra money is coming from.

I could see some good crowds, particularly local matches. Average attendance last year was over 4k but that was boosted by the final and a couple of other really good crowds. I could see the academy teams matching that depending on the opponent and fixturing.

Not sure if it was a straight knockout but with the groups there should be an extra game at least.

 

[Fryer Tuck]

John Stones not involved this year. No sponsor for the comp. Not sure where the extra money is coming from.

I could see some good crowds, particularly local matches. Average attendance last year was over 4k but that was boosted by the final and a couple of other really good crowds. I could see the academy teams matching that depending on the opponent and fixturing.

Not sure if it was a straight knockout but with the groups there should be an extra game at least.

I know, part of the whole 'Clean' image, I just like calling it that, because it's been like that since forever, and when you say 'John Stones' Paint,' everyone knows what you're talking about.

But the extra money is coming from the PL themselves (confirmed), which is a bit weird, but then again makes sense why John Stones is worth 25 times more his normal tag.

Well, I hope that the fans of the bigger clubs will get behind the competition and ensure that the proceeds go towards the smaller clubs at home games. It would be disappointing if they chose to sit them out like they do with normal U21 fare. It looks like it will be 45% to the home, 45% to the away, and 10% to a ticket pool.

The 64 teams will be put into 16 groups (3 league sides and 1 academy team), with the top 2 from each group moving to the knock out stages, which is one game each. Each team will play the other group teams twice (one home and one away). The teams will go into a straight knockout, Group Winners playing a different Group Runner Ups. It will be a free-for-all draw after the first knockout round.

All League teams will have at least 6 games of John Stones, 6 games too many for some.

 

[jd2010]

So basically the JPT is their version of the league cup