The on topic thread

[jod23]

Two of Liverpools wins in the mini-league came against a hugely depleted arsenal side in the opening match and a shit Chelsea before the formation switch. The games came at the right time for Liverpool, but they got the job done

Still gotta win them and they were at Emirates and Stamford Bridge, tough places to go and get a win whatever the circumstances.

 

[chef]

Kane is going to end up with a truckload of goals. Cracking striker.

Will be interesting to see where DC ends up on this list, currently has 46 goals from 69 games. If he keeps tracking like he is 2nd on that list isn't out of the question. Needs to start taking pens to give him that extra boost too.

 

[Cruyff14]

Two of Liverpools wins in the mini-league came against a hugely depleted arsenal side in the opening match and a shit Chelsea before the formation switch. The games came at the right time for Liverpool, but they got the job done

Still gotta win them and they were at Emirates and Stamford Bridge, tough places to go and get a win whatever the circumstances.

Both of these are true. I think if we had a full side from day one, we'd not have lost. And as WR points out, it was when Chelsea were shit (we also beat them at this point - their last loss IIRC).

Liverpool have been lucky with things like that, but as Jod says, they still won, and that's what matters.

 

[moomba]

hilariously that's i think 4 points better off than last season against the top 6.

We just werent competitive against the better sides under Pellegrini. Spurs probs the only game against a top 6 side we've been totally outplayed.

 

[ADL9798]

Both of these are true. I think if we had a full side from day one, we'd not have lost. And as WR points out, it was when Chelsea were shit (we also beat them at this point - their last loss IIRC).

Liverpool have been lucky with things like that, but as Jod says, they still won, and that's what matters.

To be fair, we've had Coutinho (our best player), Matip (our best defender) and Sturridge (arguably our most talented forward) out for the best part of a month during the busy November/December period, while Can missed a month at the start of the season.

We've had our fair share of injuries and I wouldn't say we've been particularly lucky in that regard, but we've been able to mitigate it because we planned well in the summer. We secured adequate depth for those 3, their replacements stepped up, and we've continued to pick up results (at times against quality opposition) in their absence.

The position Arsenal found themselves in during the first month of the season where they had 0 fit senior CBs listed in their squad was part bad luck, part poor planning by Wenger, who Koscielny & Mertesacker would be unavailable several weeks before matchday 1.

 

[kangaspurs]

Kane is going to end up with a truckload of goals. Cracking striker.

Will be interesting to see where DC ends up on this list, currently has 46 goals from 69 games. If he keeps tracking like he is 2nd on that list isn't out of the question. Needs to start taking pens to give him that extra boost too.

Interesting to point out too that most of those guys were established professionals before coming to the PL, they didn't play those games between the ages of 20 and 23. It's a decent record. He's now on track for 3 consecutive 20+ goal seasons which is quite impressive.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Interesting to point out to that most of those guys were established professionals before coming to the PL, they didn't play those games between the ages of 20 and 23. It's a decent record. He's now on track for 3 consecutive 20+ goal seasons which is quite impressive.

What? over half of them started in the prem in their early 20s.

 

[kangaspurs]

What? over half of them started in the prem in their early 20s.

But they were established professionals, not just starting their careers in those games. Suarez, Henry, RVN, Torres and Aguero had already established themselves as top players in other Leagues before coming to the PL, while Shearer had already played ~100 games in the old first division with a less than impressive scoring record.

With the exception of a handful of games in a few average loan spells in the lower leagues this is pretty much Kane's first 100 games as a professional, really only comparable to Fowler and Cole in that list.

 

[Cruyff14]

Interesting to point out too that most of those guys were established professionals before coming to the PL, they didn't play those games between the ages of 20 and 23. It's a decent record. He's now on track for 3 consecutive 20+ goal seasons which is quite impressive.

Yeah, er, Henry was 22 when he joined Arsenal.

 

[kangaspurs]

Yeah, er, Henry was 22 when he joined Arsenal.

As posted above, he'd already played 100+ games in France and Italy before transferring to Arsenal, he was already established professional. My point was that this is the period in which Kane has established himself, it's effectively his first 100 games as a pro.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

But they were established professionals, not just starting their careers in those games. Suarez, Henry, RVN, Torres and Aguero had already established themselves as top players in other Leagues before coming to the PL, while Shearer had already played ~100 games in the old first division with a less than impressive scoring record.

With the exception of a handful of games in a few average loan spells in the lower leagues this is pretty much Kane's first 100 games as a professional, really only comparable to Fowler and Cole in that list.

i thought you were saying that they hadn't played between 20 and 23 in the prem when half of them were. RVN had only really had 1 big year before coming to England.

Can't discount shearer as he started at 18 whilst kane was playing in league 1.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

As posted above, he'd already played 100+ games in France and Italy before transferring to Arsenal, he was already established professional. My point was that this is the period in which Kane has established himself, it's effectively his first 100 games as a pro.

kane played 56 games in minnow leagues before playing for spurs

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Kane is going to end up with a truckload of goals. Cracking striker.

Will be interesting to see where DC ends up on this list, currently has 46 goals from 69 games. If he keeps tracking like he is 2nd on that list isn't out of the question. Needs to start taking pens to give him that extra boost too.

So yeah, where's my tag to acknowledge that graphic. Bloody thief!
I had to turn my PC on to get that. On the app Optus EPL screenshots come out as black screen.

 

[ADL9798]

i thought you were saying that they hadn't played between 20 and 23 in the prem when half of them were. RVN had only really had 1 big year before coming to England.

Can't discount shearer as he started at 18 whilst kane was playing in league 1.

I'm guessing this is only counting Shearer's Premier League goals. He scored 23 goals in his first 108 games over 5 seasons in the top flight when it was branded as the First Division, prior to making his first "Premier League" start.

It'd be nice if these statisticians weren't so lazy and bothered to look back further through the records to include 'top flight' figures for these sorts of comparisons. At the risk of rehashing an old argument, it's the same bloody comp.

 

[kangaspurs]

i thought you were saying that they hadn't played between 20 and 23 in the prem when half of them were. RVN had only really had 1 big year before coming to England.

Can't discount shearer as he started at 18 whilst kane was playing in league 1.

kane played 56 games in minnow leagues before playing for spurs

Yeah, that was my fault for not expressing myself properly.

Yep he did, but in lower leagues for the most part. He hadn't established himself as a professional until these 100 games. Comparable perhaps RVN's 50-odd games in the Dutch second division, but then he went on to establish himself at Hereenveen then PSV in the top flight. This 100 is effectively Kane's equivalent to that, if that makes sense.

This 100 games for Kane is comparable to Torres' and Aguero's time at Atleti, Suarez at Ajax etc. They came to the PL as established professionals in top flight leagues, whereas this 100 is Kane establishing himself.

 

[SM]

But they were established professionals, not just starting their careers in those games. Suarez, Henry, RVN, Torres and Aguero had already established themselves as top players in other Leagues before coming to the PL, while Shearer had already played ~100 games in the old first division with a less than impressive scoring record.

With the exception of a handful of games in a few average loan spells in the lower leagues this is pretty much Kane's first 100 games as a professional, really only comparable to Fowler and Cole in that list.

Lol what, Kane played for a bunch of clubs in lower leagues.

 

[kangaspurs]

Lol what, Kane played for a bunch of clubs in lower leagues.

Yep, 50 odd games, and poor ones apparently at that.

I keep repeating myself, but my point was that in this 100 games Kane has been establishing himself as a pro, top flight footballer, yet many of those other guys in this list came to teh PL as already established, having performed to a high level in other top flight leagues. That's all. I think I'm suffering from not making myself clear enough in the OP's.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Yep, 50 odd games, and poor ones apparently at that.

I keep repeating myself, but my point was that in this 100 games Kane has been establishing himself as a pro, top flight footballer, yet many of those other guys in this list came to teh PL as already established, having performed to a high level in other top flight leagues. That's all. I think I'm suffering from not making myself clear enough in the OP's.

one could argue that kane was a late developer and the other guys on the list were better and playing at a higher level at a younger age. I get what you're saying but I'm not sure why you are saying it haha

 

[kangaspurs]

one could argue that kane was a late developer and the other guys on the list were better and playing at a higher level at a younger age. I get what you're saying but I'm not sure why you are saying it haha

Yeah maybe.

Haha it was nothing more than an observation. I wasn't trying to devalue the other guys in the list or elevate Kane above them. I just thought that some context makes it more interesting and that it's impressive that this is his first 100 games of top flight football, whereas most of the others had varying degrees of top flight experience before coming to the PL.

 

[SM]

Yeah maybe.

Haha it was nothing more than an observation. I wasn't trying to devalue the other guys in the list or elevate Kane above them. I just thought that some context makes it more interesting and that it's impressive that this is his first 100 games of top flight football, whereas most of the others had varying degrees of top flight experience before coming to the PL.

It was inaccurate context though which is what's weird. It just seems like you're trying to twist the stats as far as possible to make Kane seem even better when he doesn't need it.

 

[kangaspurs]

It was inaccurate context though which is what's weird. It just seems like you're trying to twist the stats as far as possible to make Kane seem even better when he doesn't need it.

Nah. It's not inaccurate to say that this is Kane's first 100 games as a top flight footballer, whereas 4-5 of the others had already done that, or close to it, in other leagues and came to the PL as established footballers.

 

[SM]

Nah. It's not inaccurate to say that this is Kane's first 100 games as a top flight footballer, whereas 4-5 of the others had already done that, or close to it, in other leagues and came to the PL as established footballers.

See you keep changing what you're saying. From, "Not many on that list played those games between 20-23" to "Oh I mean not many played those games as the first of their professional career" to "Oh, I mean these are Kane's first 100 top flight games" lol. That's all I mean. It's good enough that he's on that list, you don't have to strain for ways to make it even better.

 

[kangaspurs]

See you keep changing what you're saying. From, "Not many on that list played those games between 20-23" to "Oh I mean not many played those games as the first of their professional career" to "Oh, I mean these are Kane's first 100 top flight games" lol. That's all I mean. It's good enough that he's on that list, you don't have to strain for ways to make it even better.

Yeah, I've already pointed out that I didn't really express what I meant properly in those first few posts. That was my fault.

 

[kangaspurs]

Actually, SM how's the prediction's going at the halfway point? Do you still keep records of that?

 

[Zidane98]

Both of these are true. I think if we had a full side from day one, we'd not have lost. And as WR points out, it was when Chelsea were shit (we also beat them at this point - their last loss IIRC).

Liverpool have been lucky with things like that, but as Jod says, they still won, and that's what matters.

We also had a depleted side in round 1 vs Arsenal so it was hardly lucky.