List Mgmt. The possibility of needing to bottom out

[4THAWN]

My POV:
What we have on our list currently to build around
Sicily, Hardwick, Impey, Scrimshaw, TOB
Mitchell, O'Meara, Worpel, Cousins, Howe
Breust, Gunston, Wingard, Scully, Lewis
Moore, Cegs, Pitto, Morrison, Nash, Glass
Brand, Walker, Kosi, Miles, Ross

On potential/at best
A: Sicily, Hardwick, Impey, Scrimshaw, Mitchell, O'Meara, Breust, Gunston, Wingard, Scully
Now that right there is a decent enough core of potential A graders, the oldest of which is Breust turning 29 in november.

The worpels, cousins, miles, glasses, nashes, TOBs, Brand, Morrison, Howe are players with limited experience and players who have shown flashes of being something.

Worpel and cousins are trying hard, but have too much asked of them on a regular basis. I hope these guys become the B or A grade players they can be, just look at SPS from Carlton this year. Has played 50 odd games at an ordinary to bad standard and is now breaking out and looking like a perfect compliment to cripps in the midfield. Hopefully one of these blokes breaks out in next few years.

The rest im not sure, but we could sure do with some of them finding their feet and locking down a role. See some big potential in guys like Glass, Nash, TOB and Brand, but will it come to fruition?

We have not seen anything from the young players like Ross, Kosi, Walker, Jones, Hanrahan, Jiath, Golds, Greaves so they are at this point not coming into list building calculations for mine.

Now add in the salary cap space. We already have most key components locked down for next year i.e. Sicily, O'Meara, Gunston, Breust, Hardwick, Impey

We should clear room as Birch, Rough, Burgers, Langford, Schoey, Mohr are likely going to be gone.
Not sure what the go will be with Dave Mirra and Darren Minch. Can't say I feel confident they'll be given contracts.
Then we will hopefully resign Frawley on smallish $ due to injuries, Jiath, Glass, Moore, Jones, Ross, Cousins, Cegs and/or pitto, Poppy, Hendo, Mitchell, O'Brien at end of year.

We are going to get some free agents with this money, no one knows who yet.
Bottom line is we have a good enough core right now, that with additions from trading/free agency/drafting we shouldn't need to bottom out at all.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

With pick 6 in the 2019 draft Hawthorn select a key forward.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

Poppy

Done for me.

 

[4THAWN]

Done for me.

just because he can't take a contested mark against the oppositions #1 key defender doesn't mean he's done. He's still up there with the best pressure forwards in the game in terms of running, chasing, harassing opposition defenders.

 

[OnTheRocks]

If rough stayed healthy we win 2016 too or at worst make GF.

Cegs knee crippled us

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

just because he can't take a contested mark against the oppositions #1 key defender doesn't mean he's done. He's still up there with the best pressure forwards in the game in terms of running, chasing, harassing opposition defenders.

You think?

He is slow and barely does any of the stuff you said anymore.

 

[4THAWN]

You think?

He is slow and barely does any of the stuff you said anymore.

well it's clear to see who doesn't watch the hawthorn games anymore

 

[KermitJagger]

You think?

He is slow and barely does any of the stuff you said anymore.

4th amongst Forwards for Pressure Acts
1st for Tackles I50
8th for Tackles

 

[RiverRiver]

Time to recruit Noah Anderson’s dad at the mid season draft and sit him on the bench for a couple of games

 

[4THAWN]

Time to recruit Noah Anderson’s dad at the mid season draft and sit him on the bench for a couple of games

seriously underrated strategy right here.

 

[Flag08]

The thread title is a bit misleading. It’s not so much needing to bottom out. It’s whether we will be using high draft picks when we have them. Without trying to be down the bottom this year there is every chance we will be down the bottom and we need to go to the draft to inject youth and talent into the list.
If we go to bye at 3-8 the current trade in guns strategy will be abandoned. Should have been last year.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

4th amongst Forwards for Pressure Acts
1st for Tackles I50
8th for Tackles

Not hard when we have so many stoppages in there.

How many times does he chase someone down anymore? Barely.

I love him but he's close to the end

 

[dcutter]

A fair question considering Saturdays debacle.

I've pondered it a lot over the past few days but keep looking at this list of players and can't help but think it is severely under achieving. The side simply isn't as bad as its output.

I'm more in the mindset a few things need changing as opposed to the more dramatic call of an entire rebuild.

Changes\needs:

- A key position forward is an absolute necessity
- Another midfield A grader
- An almost overhaul or significant change to our forward line method.
- Delist Brand at seasons end and banish him to the VFL for the remainder of the season.

potential mid season changes.
- Consider putting Sicily forward or at least more often during games
- Mcevoy to full forward and Ceglar to ruck most of the time?
- Try wingard in the midfield, is currently lost in an ineffective forward line

A look at Richmond without Rance, Cotchin and Riewolt perhaps gives us an insight into where we're at. They are not nearly as dangerous without midfield depth and bookends at either end. A good mid table team perhaps.

Geelong possessed one glaring deficiency last year which was forward line pressure. Ablett, Dalhaus, Meirs, Constable, Rohan and bang they're back in contention which perhaps gives us hope that if we fix a few holes in our list, our current drafting/trading methodology could yet be more on track that it seems at the moment.

I don't think we're that far off it but clearly are short of players to execute a premiership outfit.

In short, we're not tanking and nor should we. I don't mind us giving up a draft pick if we can land a KPF. Grab coniglio on top of that and by geez I reckon were getting close.

If this season is a bust throw games to Walker, Moore, and the host of youngsters that have shown a bit.

 

[thejockey]

If we aren’t totally sure about where we sit we will know in the next few weeks . GWS and Richmond too come both potentially with some outs.
If we can’t be super competitive in these games we are looking bottom 6 IMO

We are playing and inter grating enough youngsters into our side as is without going full clean out , which would be a massive mistake .
We need the older wiser heads around to guide these kids through .

Always pick your best side to win the game , the natural evolution of the side will dictate the age . Don’t just pick the player based the birth certificate .

We need patience . We will be ok next season but this season isn’t our year.

 

[Hookster]

Let's have a garage sale at the end of the season.

I think we have a garage sale at the end of every year but no one buys junk.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

I think we have a garage sale at the end of every year but no one buys junk.

Tyrone Vickery says hi

 

[Hookster]

Let's have a garage sale at the end of the season.

Tyrone Vickery says hi

Just cannot remember who we gave him to.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

Just cannot remember who we gave him to.

WE ARE THE SCAMMED

 

[Pessimistic]

Agree with all that. The Wingard trade is going to set our rebuild back a couple of years. Oh well, they will realise that and change tactics soon.

Last year the O’Meara trade was being described thus

 

[lethalselbow]

I wish there was a thumbs down we could click for posts. There are some serious glass nearly empty chicken little types in this thread. Maybe have a spring cleaning and throw them out cheap... but not many clubs would want their type.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Agree with all that. The Wingard trade is going to set our rebuild back a couple of years. Oh well, they will realise that and change tactics soon.

Im getting a bit sick of hawks fans calling the wingard trade a bust this week. Smacks of sour grapes and needong a scapegoat for the demons loss.

Hes played for a month and he is 25.

Ridiculous.

 

[4THAWN]

Correct, there will most likely be times in the future when these same posters ridiculing wingard and the trade will be praising wingard for his genius/heroics.

We've seen it before with Jaeger O'Meara, and this time the player doesn't have an injury problem blocking his road to success.

 

[Bugs1977]

Time to recruit Noah Anderson’s dad at the mid season draft and sit him on the bench for a couple of games

Even though Dean Anderson is in his 50s it would probably be a better strategy than bombing it into the forward line with Poppy under it like we’ve been doing.

 

[Davo-27]

With pick 6 in the 2019 draft Hawthorn select a key forward.

if his name is Thorpe Dowler im gonna be pissed

 

[lethalselbow]

if his name is Thorpe Dowler im gonna be pissed

Perfect. 100% agree. You've just destroyed the premise of this whole thread in one sentence.

The side could bottom out and then the top draft pick might not be up to it OR may get a chronic injury, etc. By finishing lower on the ladder all you are doing is maybe increasing your odds of getting a better player, but it isn't necessarily so. Melbourne & Carlton have both deliberately tanked, like gutless pathetically sad embarrassing jokes, and they have nothing (zero, zip, zilch, nada, etc) to show for it. #tanking #sad #failures #etc

Instilling a culture of failure tends to lead to it self repeating.