Discussion The Random Discussion Thread

[plugger66]

There's an old superannuation rule of thumb called the 12 times rule.

Basically is says that when you retire, you need 12 times the amount of money you intend to spend each year in your super fund. Thats in your super fund - doesn't include your other assets like your house or your car boat etc.

So if the cut off is $5M then means someone who is going to be drawing a tax free retirement income of $400,000+ a year is getting a leg up from the govt.

No f***ing wonder we are struggling to provide health services and decent schools.

I see jealousy. I also think some have earnt the idea of retiring at 55. Why shouldn’t they. By the way is it actually tax free for that amount? I thought it wasn’t. And as hard as it is head for us average people to get their head around it those people do have a different lifestyle to us. Why should they have to change. America must have an even better system for super if you are blaming that on health services. We are such a lucky country in that regard.

 

[gringo2011]

Well I don’t think people who have money and have deserved it should have to be careful with their life style. Let’s face it it will all come back to who you support and think like. I love people having heaps of money. I am completely middle class so it’s nothing about me but even I don’t want to be careful with money and I’m used to having just enough all my life. I don’t want people with 50 million getting concessions but I’m happy with those who have earnt enough to have some.

It was a policy designed to get people to put money away so that they weren't living off an aged pension. It wasn't designed to give tax breaks to the wealthy. These kinds of badly thought out or blatantl welfare for the wealthy policies are not sustainable. It costs everyone else so that a person with $5 million in super can have a bit more which isn't for their retirement. It's a tax loophole. No-one wants to pay tax but we need to pay for things that we expect.

 

[plugger66]

It was a policy designed to get people to put money away so that they weren't living off an aged pension. It wasn't designed to give tax breaks to the wealthy. These kinds of badly thought out or blatantl welfare for the wealthy policies are not sustainable. It costs everyone else so that a person with $5 million in super can have a bit more which isn't for their retirement. It's a tax loophole. No-one wants to pay tax but we need to pay for things that we expect.

Yep so we decide as probably at best middle class what’s enough. I’m sure completely lower class think anything above 200k should be taxed. I don’t put mysel in this conversation. I just think if you have been successful then good luck. I’m not suggesting start taxing at 50 million. By the way I bet there is no way labour are changing the tax rules for under 5 million

 

[Sun Ra]

Yep so we decide as probably at best middle class what’s enough. I’m sure completely lower class think anything above 200k should be taxed. I don’t put mysel in this conversation. I just think if you have been successful then good luck. I’m not suggesting start taxing at 50 million. By the way I bet there is no way labour are changing the tax rules for under 5 million

$3 million.

 

[jwikked]

Quit my job of 16 years last month, been pretty miserable the last few years at work, which has kept me miserable out of work.
Spent the last week working for a bloke doing window washing.
Love it. Barely feels like work at all.
Time flies and it's grouse to get to work in different spots every day. Feels great to put in a hard days work and have people appreciate the effort.

 

[Mowman]

Quit my job of 16 years last month, been pretty miserable the last few years at work, which has kept me miserable out of work.
Spent the last week working for a bloke doing window washing.
Love it. Barely feels like work at all.
Time flies and it's grouse to get to work in different spots every day. Feels great to put in a hard days work and have people appreciate the effort.

Great stuff Mate, you won't regret it
Did the same thing 14 years ago, thought I would go mow a few lawns LOL

 

[pebblesofsand]

I see jealousy. I also think some have earnt the idea of retiring at 55. Why shouldn’t they. By the way is it actually tax free for that amount? I thought it wasn’t. And as hard as it is head for us average people to get their head around it those people do have a different lifestyle to us. Why should they have to change. America must have an even better system for super if you are blaming that on health services. We are such a lucky country in that regard.

No jealousy from me. I retired 17 years ago at the ripe old age of 53.

Went back for a couple of years in my 60's and topped up my super.

Best life lesson I've learnt? That at some point, all more money does for you is to allow you to buy more expensive verions of pretty much the same thing.

I decided early on that owning a $100K car or a big house or caravan simply wasn't enough reward for working another 10 or 15 years.

As you said early on, you might keel over tomorrow.

So people can choose to retire whenever they like - just don't think they should be getting a leg up from the govt when they clearly don't need it.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Quit my job of 16 years last month, been pretty miserable the last few years at work, which has kept me miserable out of work.
Spent the last week working for a bloke doing window washing.
Love it. Barely feels like work at all.
Time flies and it's grouse to get to work in different spots every day. Feels great to put in a hard days work and have people appreciate the effort.

Respect mate, takes some guts to leave the “comfort” of the known, even if it is causing you grief.

There’s a heap of people feeling the same as you, I’ve certainly been one. Breaking the circuit is the first step!

The alternative can be very ugly. We found out yesterday that my uncle had taken his own life on the eve of his 50th birthday. He was never good at looking after his mental health with work and life in general, and now leaves behind an 8 year old son.

I feel there’s a mental health disaster on the horizon with the impending doom of the inevitable economic crash, look after yourselves y’all

 

[gringo2011]

Respect mate, takes some guts to leave the “comfort” of the known, even if it is causing you grief.

There’s a heap of people feeling the same as you, I’ve certainly been one. Breaking the circuit is the first step!

The alternative can be very ugly. We found out yesterday that my uncle had taken his own life on the eve of his 50th birthday. He was never good at looking after his mental health with work and life in general, and now leaves behind an 8 year old son.

I feel there’s a mental health disaster on the horizon with the impending doom of the inevitable economic crash, look after yourselves y’all

That's shithouse Dard, hope you're holding up okay.

 

[plugger66]

No jealousy from me. I retired 17 years ago at the ripe old age of 53.

Went back for a couple of years in my 60's and topped up my super.

Best life lesson I've learnt? That at some point, all more money does for you is to allow you to buy more expensive verions of pretty much the same thing.

I decided early on that owning a $100K car or a big house or caravan simply wasn't enough reward for working another 10 or 15 years.

As you said early on, you might keel over tomorrow.

So people can choose to retire whenever they like - just don't think they should be getting a leg up from the govt when they clearly don't need it.

But at what figure don’t they need it. As I said someone with no super could easily think 200k is to much without tax. And I’m not working to do anything more than I do now. That would go for many people. I have no idea what it’s like to be rich or poor but I’m guessing I waste a hell of a lot more than poor people. And I’m sure rich people waste a hell of a lot more than me. As I said I’m happy for the rich to pay the full tax rate. The problem is I have no idea what the rich need to live how they want to live and I believe the ideal retirement is living exactly the same as when you worked. The question is what is this rich amount. I would do cartwheels if I was taxed at 43% of 5 million but I will never know that lifestyle. I’m not classing my parents as close to poor but they sold their house in east Bentleigh to move to Mornington for the money difference and even worse 37% of their Mornington house for a pathetic 60k because neither had super. All they had to do is ask us for the money. They had a great life but it would have been a hell of a lot better had they been able to live as they lived before retiring. The point of that is I’m not guessing what an any person needs to live their lifestyle.

 

[Mowman]

Respect mate, takes some guts to leave the “comfort” of the known, even if it is causing you grief.

There’s a heap of people feeling the same as you, I’ve certainly been one. Breaking the circuit is the first step!

The alternative can be very ugly. We found out yesterday that my uncle had taken his own life on the eve of his 50th birthday. He was never good at looking after his mental health with work and life in general, and now leaves behind an 8 year old son.

I feel there’s a mental health disaster on the horizon with the impending doom of the inevitable economic crash, look after yourselves y’all

Shocking news Mate
Hope you’re doing ok bud

 

[Joffaboy]

But at what figure don’t they need it. As I said someone with no super could easily think 200k is to much without tax. And I’m not working to do anything more than I do now. That would go for many people. I have no idea what it’s like to be rich or poor but I’m guessing I waste a hell of a lot more than poor people. And I’m sure rich people waste a hell of a lot more than me. As I said I’m happy for the rich to pay the full tax rate. The problem is I have no idea what the rich need to live how they want to live and I believe the ideal retirement is living exactly the same as when you worked. The question is what is this rich amount. I would do cartwheels if I was taxed at 43% of 5 million but I will never know that lifestyle. I’m not classing my parents as close to poor but they sold their house in east Bentleigh to move to Mornington for the money difference and even worse 37% of their Mornington house for a pathetic 60k because neither had super. All they had to do is ask us for the money. They had a great life but it would have been a hell of a lot better had they been able to live as they lived before retiring. The point of that is I’m not guessing what an any person needs to live their lifestyle.

Sorry Plugger, I don't understand any of your arguments, but I will give you an example of how the spending on pensions and tax breaks could be spent.

Soon the tax concessions will cost the country 52 billion a year, that is a lot of money that can go into other services, hospitals, schools, women's health, and a million other services.
My niece has three kids. Her husband got into roids and suffered roid rage, used to bash her. She got out, DVO's, breaking them, arrests, more rage. Was going to end up in something you see on the evening news with a dead family.
Thankfully he was found dead at his home. The problem is that because the cause of death can't be properly established, because the services are so underfunded, it could take up to two years to get through the system.
She has three kids, two mortgages, and can't get access to any of their assets until the coroner's report. Social Services are helping, but because of underfunding they can't do much
She has been subjected to domestic violence, trying to protect her children, her kids father dead, and now after all that psychological trauma has to endure years of being financially destitute.
There are real consequences to people like us and richer not paying their fair share.

All the tax breaks, negative gearing on multiple investments, double dipping on franking credits on dividends, concessions on super contributions.
I outlined early where I took advantage of the tax breaks to not pay CGT. There is no problem with using the current tax laws to minimise your tax, it is just that they favour people with money, if you don't have assets to sell like we do, how do you minimise your CGT, if you don't have large investments how do you double dip on franking credits?
The changes aren't designed to tax people more, just to target the concessions to people who need it. Meaning more cash for services to help people in need. Like my niece at the moment.
BTW, once retired none of your super including returns on your fund are taxed.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[gringo2011]

Sorry Plugger, I don't understand any of your arguments, but I will give you an example of how the spending on pensions and tax breaks could be spent.

Soon the tax concessions will cost the country 52 billion a year, that is a lot of money that can go into other services, hospitals, schools, women's health, and a million other services.
My niece has three kids. Her husband got into roids and suffered roid rage, used to bash her. She got out, DVO's, breaking them, arrests, more rage. Was going to end up in something you see on the evening news with a dead family.
Thankfully he was found dead at his home. The problem is that because the cause of death can't be properly established, because the services are so underfunded, it could take up to two years to get through the system.
She has three kids, two mortgages, and can't get access to any of their assets until the coroner's report. Social Services are helping, but because of underfunding they can't do much
She has been subjected to domestic violence, trying to protect her children, her kids father dead, and now after all that psychological trauma has to endure years of being financially destitute.
There are real consequences to people like us and richer not paying their fair share.

All the tax breaks, negative gearing on multiple investments, double dipping on franking credits on dividends, concessions on super contributions.
I outlined early where I took advantage of the tax breaks to not pay CGT. There is no problem with using the current tax laws to minimise your tax, it is just that they favour people with money, if you don't have assets to sell like we do, how do you minimise your CGT, if you don't have large investments how do you double dip on franking credits?
The changes aren't designed to tax people more, just to target the concessions to people who need it. Meaning more cash for services to help people in need. Like my niece at the moment.
BTW, once retired none of your super including returns on your fund are taxed.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

Jesus, that's like a movie script. Sounds like she's had a terrible run and it's not improving any time soon. The coroner moves super slowly unfortunately, they have staffing issues too.

 

[StFly]

So, I was ending my shower this morning, opened the door and came face to face with a bee flying right at me. As you do on a wet floor, I fell on my arse, it flew to the window behind me, I ran to my towel and closed the door. If that bee didn't just want to say hi and give me a kiss it'd be fine, but christ, why get pissy about a screen door opening.

I hope everyone else had a great morning this morning.

 

[Joffaboy]

Jesus, that's like a movie script. Sounds like she's had a terrible run and it's not improving any time soon. The coroner moves super slowly unfortunately, they have staffing issues too.

Yeah, it's pretty effed up. My brother told me he would lie in bed thinking on how he would literally kill this bloke. Couldn't work out how to do it without even traumatising the grand kids.
What a situation.
Lesser of two evils was this bloke died. Don't wish death on anyone but if it was him or my niece and her three kids, well it's no argument.
The Detective who was on her case trying to protective her, got a message to her through a third party saying ' you are free now'. He was as worried for her as anyone but he is constrained by the laws, must be hard for the copper as well.
I hope my girls are never in that situation, but as I told my brother, I would be plotting the exact same thing as he was.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The Rise and Rise of Australia’s Population - McCrindle

Australia has increased its population by one third in the last 20 years, from 18.5 million in 1997 to 24.7 million people currently. But more remarkable is

mccrindle.com.au

The people supposedly running this place have totally stuffed up the population.
Sure there are reasons for increasing population, but we've done it more than anywhere else, and if someone had bothered to plan it there wouldn't be a bloody housing shortage.

If there wasn't a bloody housing shortage prices wouldn't be so high.
Gold: Constant shortage = Expensive.
Grass : No shortage = its free.

People who invested in property coming into the huge population boost are happy happy happy. They aren't smart, just lucky, but they think they are smart.
Unless they predicted that our population would increase above all projections , then they are actually smarter than the people who do the projections and should have their jobs.

 

[plugger66]

Sorry Plugger, I don't understand any of your arguments, but I will give you an example of how the spending on pensions and tax breaks could be spent.

Soon the tax concessions will cost the country 52 billion a year, that is a lot of money that can go into other services, hospitals, schools, women's health, and a million other services.
My niece has three kids. Her husband got into roids and suffered roid rage, used to bash her. She got out, DVO's, breaking them, arrests, more rage. Was going to end up in something you see on the evening news with a dead family.
Thankfully he was found dead at his home. The problem is that because the cause of death can't be properly established, because the services are so underfunded, it could take up to two years to get through the system.
She has three kids, two mortgages, and can't get access to any of their assets until the coroner's report. Social Services are helping, but because of underfunding they can't do much
She has been subjected to domestic violence, trying to protect her children, her kids father dead, and now after all that psychological trauma has to endure years of being financially destitute.
There are real consequences to people like us and richer not paying their fair share.

All the tax breaks, negative gearing on multiple investments, double dipping on franking credits on dividends, concessions on super contributions.
I outlined early where I took advantage of the tax breaks to not pay CGT. There is no problem with using the current tax laws to minimise your tax, it is just that they favour people with money, if you don't have assets to sell like we do, how do you minimise your CGT, if you don't have large investments how do you double dip on franking credits?
The changes aren't designed to tax people more, just to target the concessions to people who need it. Meaning more cash for services to help people in need. Like my niece at the moment.
BTW, once retired none of your super including returns on your fund are taxed.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

I haven’t said don’t tax super at the normal level of tax. I’m discussing what is this magical number. As I said poor people may suggest we tax at 200k. Others with money may say 20 million. Middle of the road people may say 1.5 to 3 million. You can bet not many of us will want our super taxed at a normal rate because we all have self interest at heart. And if you are under 60 I thought you were taxed on withdrawals. And of course money can be better spent on other things but again I’m discussing who decides this fair amount. I have no doubt the labor government isn’t going to tax lump sums under 5 million. How do I have no doubt? I’m good at guessing. Just out of interest if you didn’t use the tax breaks do you think you would have enough to retire on without a pension? Those tax breaks could be stopping you taking a pension. Surely that’s a great thing for everyone. Unfortunately the poor just can’t use tax breaks. As hard as that is well that’s life. Unfortunately I can’t buy 10 racehorses which I would love to do. Life just isn’t level.

 

[gringo2011]

The Rise and Rise of Australia’s Population - McCrindle

Australia has increased its population by one third in the last 20 years, from 18.5 million in 1997 to 24.7 million people currently. But more remarkable is

mccrindle.com.au

The people supposedly running this place have totally stuffed up the population.
Sure there are reasons for increasing population, but we've done it more than anywhere else, and if someone had bothered to plan it there wouldn't be a bloody housing shortage.

If there wasn't a bloody housing shortage prices wouldn't be so high.
Gold: Constant shortage = Expensive.
Grass : No shortage = its free.

People who invested in property coming into the huge population boost are happy happy happy. They aren't smart, just lucky, but they think they are smart.
Unless they predicted that our population would increase above all projections , then they are actually smarter than the people who do the projections and should have their jobs.

That's why we have perpetual growth. We then got greedy and sold it all to overseas developers who maximised it while a few idiots sold the farm for loose change. Same with our gas and minerals. We are a very dumb greedy nation with no eye on how to service the growth. Places like Kalkallo are struggling with traffic and services because we've built a huge suburb with no infrastructure behind it.

 

[gringo2011]

I haven’t said don’t tax super at the normal level of tax. I’m discussing what is this magical number. As I said poor people may suggest we tax at 200k. Others with money may say 20 million. Middle of the road people may say 1.5 to 3 million. You can bet not many of us will want our super taxed at a normal rate because we all have self interest at heart. And if you are under 60 I thought you were taxed on withdrawals. And of course money can be better spent on other things but again I’m discussing who decides this fair amount. I have no doubt the labor government isn’t going to tax lump sums under 5 million. How do I have no doubt? I’m good at guessing. Just out of interest if you didn’t use the tax breaks do you think you would have enough to retire on without a pension? Those tax breaks could be stopping you taking a pension. Surely that’s a great thing for everyone. Unfortunately the poor just can’t use tax breaks. As hard as that is well that’s life. Unfortunately I can’t buy 10 racehorses which I would love to do. Life just isn’t level.

Rich people still get pensions.

 

[plugger66]

Rich people still get pensions.

Really? How is that if we are talking about super. Sounds like a myth to me. And what is rich anyway. I think that’s the point of what should be the cut off point for super.

 

[Joffaboy]

I haven’t said don’t tax super at the normal level of tax. I’m discussing what is this magical number. As I said poor people may suggest we tax at 200k. Others with money may say 20 million. Middle of the road people may say 1.5 to 3 million. You can bet not many of us will want our super taxed at a normal rate because we all have self interest at heart. And if you are under 60 I thought you were taxed on withdrawals. And of course money can be better spent on other things but again I’m discussing who decides this fair amount. I have no doubt the labor government isn’t going to tax lump sums under 5 million. How do I have no doubt? I’m good at guessing. Just out of interest if you didn’t use the tax breaks do you think you would have enough to retire on without a pension? Those tax breaks could be stopping you taking a pension. Surely that’s a great thing for everyone. Unfortunately the poor just can’t use tax breaks. As hard as that is well that’s life. Unfortunately I can’t buy 10 racehorses which I would love to do. Life just isn’t level.

I won't retire without a pension, just not the full pension, full pension kicks in when your combined assets are less than 410k, part from about 700k.


On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Joffaboy]

Really? How is that if we are talking about super. Sounds like a myth to me. And what is rich anyway. I think that’s the point of what should be the cut off point for super.

Really you should do a bit of research on how people retire. The only myth is your thinking you only have super or a pension. You think a couple can live on 40k a year and not be almost in poverty? We subsidied my in laws for 20 years with monthly money because they only have the pension.
You can't get the pension until 67. If I retired today, it is 4 years before I can get it, meaning if we wanted to live on 90k a year (50k less than we spend currently), we would use 360k of our super without any pension. Once our super gets to about 700k we start getting a small pension, continuing to use our super until we are down to 410k when we get the full pension.
As you get older, you expenses get less, less socialising, less holidays etc so your income can start to get less.
What most do is TTR, transition to retirement, say 4 days a week and draw down the extra from the pension, tax effective as well.
BTW don't have to retire at 67, that is when the pension kicks in is all.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[George]

Respect mate, takes some guts to leave the “comfort” of the known, even if it is causing you grief.

There’s a heap of people feeling the same as you, I’ve certainly been one. Breaking the circuit is the first step!

The alternative can be very ugly. We found out yesterday that my uncle had taken his own life on the eve of his 50th birthday. He was never good at looking after his mental health with work and life in general, and now leaves behind an 8 year old son.

I feel there’s a mental health disaster on the horizon with the impending doom of the inevitable economic crash, look after yourselves y’all

Hope you're doing well mate

 

[Mowman]

Who's watched Mr. Mercedes

 

[gringo2011]

Who's watched Mr. Mercedes

Yeah, kind of liked it. The first season was better than the second.