Opinion The Rebuild Thread

[PP34]

Well at least Mad Men returns Monday

 

[Salty Walrus]

Haven't troweled through the whole thread so I hope this hasn't been said, but I think giving Fevola the ass was long overdue and should have happened 3 years earlier......however for the life of me I can't understand how they didn't seem to bother trying to replace him with an actual full forward at any stage in the last 4 or so seasons.

Staggers me that Carlton didn't at least gets a smart, elite state level full forward, to at least straighten them up (instead of rotating 3 or 4 ruckmen who aren't forwards through there).

 

[invinciBlues]

Haven't troweled through the whole thread so I hope this hasn't been said, but I think giving Fevola the ass was long overdue and should have happened 3 years earlier......however for the life of me I can't understand how they didn't seem to bother trying to replace him with an actual full forward at any stage in the last 4 or so seasons.

Staggers me that Carlton didn't at least gets a smart, elite state level full forward, to at least straighten them up (instead of rotating 3 or 4 ruckmen who aren't forwards through there).

You can go away now.

 

[Cringle]

Haven't troweled through the whole thread so I hope this hasn't been said, but I think giving Fevola the ass was long overdue and should have happened 3 years earlier......however for the life of me I can't understand how they didn't seem to bother trying to replace him with an actual full forward at any stage in the last 4 or so seasons.

Staggers me that Carlton didn't at least gets a smart, elite state level full forward, to at least straighten them up (instead of rotating 3 or 4 ruckmen who aren't forwards through there).

Well. We got Henderson... no offence...
Then we tried Rowe..

 

[SBYM]

The House has gone all liking lurker - good luck to the drunken fool

The House in this thread…Suzuki Swift in the other…

I'm honestly stumped. What is the attraction?

You're not pissing me off guys, I just think you're massive dickheads.

 

[Koutafidamidis]

All I can say is that I hope the players are more stoic than some of our supporter base.

**** off, its been since 2001

i still pay close to 3 grand memebership money every ****ing year, but its time to ****en sort this team out once and for all

 

[In Judd we trust]

This is how I see the current list.

Red is not apart of our next premiership
Green is apart of our next Premiership
Blue is uncertain or to hard to call
Black is to early to tell



1.Andrew Walker. Great player and essential to any sort of future success must keep. He may be 28 soon but his shoulders are sound now so can't see any reason as to why he can't play another 4 -possibly 6 years

2.Troy Menzel. Obviously I don't need to say much about Troy. we all love him and he has more heart and pride then most of our plays which says alot considering he has only worn the jumper 11 times.

3. Marc Murphy. I love the man. his 2011 and most of his 2012 form was AA he has been hit hard with injuries the past 18 months but now looks to be over that. Is fundamental to future success.Maybe handed the captaincy to soon.

4.Bryce Gibbs. My Favourite Current Carlton player. but the one i am most uncertain about . IF he stays and lives up to his potential it would be great. BUT he has put the club in a bad position of recent weeks with questioning of our future plans. If he where to go I would be upset but it would probably be the best thing to come of the situation. We would get a first round pick and Gibbs would get his money. And a first round pick in a draft full of KPP is just what we need.

5.Chris Judd. The great man will probably not be around to see success at Carlton. his body seems to be letting him down these days. Probably still our best player when fit.

6.Kade Simpson. Should be the captain in hind sight but can't help that. He is older then Walker so he may not get a chance to see a premiership all though he is the most durable player I have seen at Carlton. even if he does not see a premiership he is crucial in restoring a winning culture and teaching the kids what it means to wear the navy blue.

7.Dylan Buckley. He needed to step up this year otherwise it was looking grim. He has done that and looks to be as important to future success as Menzel. Love his pride and heart reminds me of Simmo which is always a good thing.

8.Mathew Kreuzer. Kreuze is another one that I love but is troubling me. His body is not letting him be the player we all know he can be . That game against Sydney when he was coming back from his first knee was amazing. But do we need to bite the bullet here and see what we can get for him or persevere? i would like to think we would reward his loyalty of knocking back BIG money from the expansion clubs with giving him all the time he needs. but just not sure what direction the club will take

9. Kane Lucas. I truly believe he has what it takes. Was so promising and exciting when we drafted him and was hampered by injuries and possibly a lack of confidence? either way he is young enough and talented enough to be around in the next window of success.

10.Mathew Watson. Need to get games into him. his left boot is lethal and he is improving as a player. seeing as we don't have an actual permanent CHB this guy needs to be it. I would really love to see him and Henderson as ultimate swing mans going between CHB and CHF and confusing the crap out of teams . but that is more a dream ATM.

11.Robert Warnock. I believe our midfield played at its best when he was rucking but in todays game you need to be able to do more then that. Robbie simply can't do it around the track. and considering he had his best pre season since being at the club and he is dishing up what he has so far , he probably isn't going to do any better

12.Mitch Robinson. Mitch is another personal favourite of mine but his disposal is horrendous. has been for a long time. I read a post only the other day stating that if Mitch actually had clean hands and picked up everything he fumbles he would get 40 plus disposals a game. and it is so true. unfortunately I don't see him cleaning it up. Bloody hope I am wrong and he is there to hold up a cup for us one day

13. Chris Yarran. Chris has the potential to be our best and most damaging player. He is slowly but surely getting there . This year his efforts have been great. Still going missing but so is the whole team. Unless he wants to go home to Perth he should be apart of the next success

14.Brock McLean. He seems to be down ATM but his best is good and he can be a barometer of work rate for the team. But in saying that he is limited with speed and any great skill. may make way for a younger future player before seeing any real success.

15.Sam Docherty. As it stand right now he is in our plans. I personally have not seen much of the kid but what I have seen looks composed and highly skill full. Would lock him in.

16.Patrick Cripps. Potentially our best first year recruit in a long time. He has shown to be a contested machine in the lower level and looks to be able to bring that up to the next level. could be our bigger better Jobe Watson.

17.Sam Rowe. Sam has a great story that we all know about and is good at some things like taking a grab. but just is left wanting in way to many areas . and considering he is the same age as Murphy, Thomas and older then quite a few you would think he is beyond developing into a good player. would rather have a young 18-20 year old Defender on the list.

18. Tom Temay. It is to early to tell what he will become. if his game last week in the NB is anything to go by you would lock him in but will just have to wait and see more.

19.Cameron Giles. Seems to be a good solid defender who played forward most of his junior career which could potentially develop into becoming another good swing man for us. just to soon to tell.

20.Nick Holman. I simply don't know enough about him to comment. Have heard he is a younger Mitch Robinson. So if he can prove to have better skills then Robbo he could be our next bulldozer.

21.Josh Bootsma. Not sure what to make of him. he looks to be a Dustin Fletcher type but just doesn't seem to know where he is half the time when out on the field. Not sure what the relation ship is like with the club after being shopped around last year either. maybe he just needs time.

23.Lachie Henderson. Is awesome. weather he plays up forward or down back he is a superstar for us. I think he is a better defender than forward but ATM we need him up forward. or really we just need two or three or four of him.

26.Andrew McInnies. McInnes is a good foot soldier. He gets his job done and usually keeps his opponent to a respectable record.All premiership sides have similar players. can't all be match winners. If something better where to come up I could see McInnes being pushed out.

27.Dennis Armfield. Another favourite of mine. Is probably our oldest "Foot Solider" Has incredible pace and can have moments of brilliance. but just not super consistent. He may be one that finds him self out the door soon. i hope not.

28. I really want to lock Tommy in as a certainty to be around when we push for number 17 BUT he is another with pretty horrible disposal.I cant have one set of rules for Bell and Another for Mitch and Holman. To be a successful side we need to have clean disposal and we can't afford to keep people around based of potential if they don't show signs of cleaning up there acts.

29.Heath Scotland. This man DESERVES a premiership. Will unfortunately not get one, as a player at least. I hope he sticks around the club and is a part of number 17 in some sort of way because he really has been a superstar for us in our darkest times.

30.Jarrad Waite. Again another favourite of mine. He is the best option we have right now but that will most likely change in the coming 2 years. I know he has been on record to say that he feels young because he has missed so much football but I don't think that is the issue here. I think the club will give him the tap on the shoulder.

31.Luke Reynolds. Again have not seen anything of the kid so I can not comment.

32.Nick Graham. A younger, better and more professional McLean. lock him in . the kid looks to be the goods.

33.Andrejs Everitt. Is still young and shows more then every KPP sized player on the list bar Henderson. Mick recruited him for a reason and as of right now we can only assume Mick will be around rebuilding the club.

35.Ed Curnow. Some people may put him down as a list clogger but for me he is a vital part of our future midfield. He is improving every year and becoming one of the better stoppers in the league. hopefully he becomes our future Carrazzo/Ling

36. Cameron wood. Isn't overly young and is behind two ruckmen at this stage. was recruited for security and that is about all he is. I have read good reports from the NB but just think he is a bit to old to be around for number 17. unless we turn things around within 24 months.

37.Jaryd Cachia. I Like Jaryd. Right now I feel like he is Behind quite a few of our young mids. We do need good depth going forward and he is a serviceable young player .

38.Jeff Garlett. I am so very close to making this a red one. He has gone backwards over the past 2 years and just looks so lazy out on the field. If he turns things around quickly he can be apart of our next push for a flag but damn he is close to being red.

39.Dale Thomas. If his body doesn't fail him he will be a great player for us. Yes he has had a slower start but other players have had slower. When up and running Ii expect Murphy Himself and Possibly Gibbs to be a force to reckoned with.

40.Michael Jamison. He has been a great player for us but he is not getting any younger and always seem to have some sort of niggling injury that has me worried. We may look to free agency to find a more reliant fix for FB.

41.Levi Casboult. Love the man .Probably the only reason I don't have him as a red ATM. He is still young and has time to fix his kicking technique. If he can do that within 1-2 years he will be a good strong forward and should be around for an assault on #17.

42.Zach Tuohy. Is currently in his worst form slump. He is another good foot soldier. I would almost put him above the likes of Armfield and McInnes. because he has shown to be able to win a game or at least lift the team. His 3 goals against Fremantle last year was one of my favourite moments of the entire season. If something better where to come along in the next 2 or so years i could see him missing out.

43.Simon White. This is hard for me. His first 2 season where very promising. But since then things have gone down hill and whit younger options in Bootsma, McInnes and Docherty he is a long way off being best 22

44.Andrew Carrazzo. Another favourite. I just think he may be a bit to old now and that his body is going to let him down. He has had that troublesome calf injury that set him back this year. Unless we turn it around within 2 years he won't be there for number 17.

45.Blaine Johnson. Again i have not seen enough of him to make comment. Have read here and there that he is the best of the rookies which we recruited. Hopefully he is a Star in the making

46.David Ellard. The foot soldier of all foot soldiers. I like Ellard and with his new found lease on life in the forward line him self and Menzel could Etch out Garlett. But with Temay being used up forward in the NB he could put pressure on an older Ellard.

47.Ciaran Sheehan. Another i have not seen anything of so can not comment.

48.Ciaran Byrne. In the same boat as the rest of the new recruits. Looked to have an impressive first game Kicking 3 goals.

So in summary I have 14 Players in the current list who i think are good enough to be around For our next assault. The rest I am either not sure about, are to old or have not been around long enough to gauge.

Football is a strange game and for all we know we could be back up and challenging within 18 months. We can hope anyway.

Opinions? What do you guys and girls think of some of the people i am unsure of?

 

[LouderNowBlue]

I'm sorry but enough is enough. I was happy when we got Juddy, happy when we signed Mick but its time to accept that the people running our club have no idea about modern football.

We live in the brown paper bag mentality and have been trying to fix our list with cash every year.

I was born in 1986, 1995 was the only premiership year we have had in my lifetime and that was delivered with the brown paper bag mentality (which hurt us for years to come).

NEWSFLASH....times have changed.

I am sick of people describing us as 'one of the top four clubs' because in my lifetime we have been anything but. FACT.

People talking about 17 flags are living in the past, that was the VFL this is the AFL. If we describe Port Adelaide as having one premiership, then we only have one too.

It's time to get people into our club that understand the modern world (not the Pratts who cheated within their own industry to make money, not Sticks because he kicked a heap of goals back in the day, not Mathieson because he prays on the weak and uneducated with his pokie machines).

I say piss them all off. Get people to run the club that understand that it is hard word, dedication, a vision, teamwork, flexibility and knowledge that will get our club to a competitive state....NOT MONEY!

It's time to make some tough decisions. I say trade anyone with value.

Waite to Geelong because they could use a forward/back swingman that would give them a shot at a premiership in the next two years.
Gibbs to whoever, take the compo pick (which currently looks like we will have 1 & 2 or 2 & 3 next year)
Murphy to North/GWS/Gold Coast/ Freo for some slik to add to their inside players
Walker
Carazzo (doubtful)
Yarran


We MUST play Buckley, Graham, Cripps, Menzel

Keep Judd, Scotland, Henderson, Jamison, Simpson, Thomas, Kruezer because they play with heart.

Have a defensive game plan because defence is the best offence. (Ratten's game plan looked good when we won, but left us open to massive defeats, you can't run one way)

Sack Robinson, Curnow, Ellard, Rowe, Warnock (rucks mean less and less these days) because they are dumb or not skillfull enough.

The fact that Carazzo came straight into our side after about 18 months of on and off injury says a lot about our list.

The fact that the club uploads photos of Juddy resting between sets saying "he is almost back' is even worse.

Can't rely on 30 year olds and don't have anyone to replace them. SAD, SAD, SAD.

It's time to admit we need to start again, because what we've got isn't great and what we're doing is even worse.

 

[Monkey King]

**** off, its been since 2001

I bet you were as pleased as me after the Elimination Final last year. So, yeah nah ... it's not been since 2001; that's just your emotions getting in the way. And if you want to be like that, then for me it's been since 1996, as every season without a flag is somewhere I don't want the club to be.

But no. It's round 4 is what it is. And already supporters want to throw in the towel. This makes me almost as sad as the player's performance. What's happened to my once great club. We should all want the club to pull back on track at this point, not pull itself to pieces.

 

[sherb]

But no. It's round 4 is what it is. And already supporters want to throw in the towel. This makes me almost as sad as the player's performance. What's happened to my once great club. We should all want the club to pull back on track at this point, not pull itself to pieces.

I am surprised you can't have some understanding of where people are coming from.

We get flogged by 80 points by Essendon and then, instead of showing a bit of grunt and passion in response, we get done by Melbourne. Melbourne!!

From my point of view, even though I don't post here a lot, I've had concerns about the club for quite a while, nicely encapsulated by much of what LouderNowBlue posted above.

It is clear to me that the problem starts with the top, pretty much flowing all the way down to the bloody lunatics (the players) running the asylum to far too great an extent.

Maybe we need a major cluster**** for the club to start waking up to itself and behaving like a club competing in the AFL, 2014 version, not the VFL, circa 1981.

The first thing I would like to see is the influence of those with too much money (we know who they are) greatly reduced, if not eliminated altogether.

 

[I AM CARLTON]

Yep we must embrace a complete rebuild we are nowhere near a flag.

Kids must be played for remainder of the year.

 

[AB_Blue]

Thing is you can't get rid of all the oldies at once. The Dees are the example here. Also it's not like we have 6, 20-23 yr olds ready to take the spots of Judd. Waite. Carrots, simmo.............
It needs to happen over 2-3 yrs. bulldogs are a perfect example.

Cross played until he was shoved out of the way by there young brigade.
Gia is the sub, almost an on filed coach. Had the passion to teach the kids and wants to be an assistant down the track. Can't see anyone wanting that job at our club (scotto??)

 

[LanceRomance]

Practically speaking we had zero chance of a premiership win this year, so why not plant for following years?

Because it is easier to blame Malthouse's press conferences then it is to accept that we aren't a challenger.

 

[T2B_]

35.Ed Curnow. Some people may put him down as a list clogger but for me he is a vital part of our future midfield. He is improving every year and becoming one of the better stoppers in the league. hopefully he becomes our future Carrazzo/Ling

Agree with this. Some will see him as list clogger but I'd have him in nearly any side and I think he's pretty much completely replaced Carrazzo now, at least as far as his playing abilities goes.

Ed is a beast who will run all day, tackles, stops his man and is really improving his offensive game. Disposal will never be amazing but far from worst. Put him in a better side than our current one and we will truly appreciate the best of Ed Curnow.

 

[LanceRomance]

This is my attitude towards a rebuild


We all know that decision by Arnie paid off

 

[Azul]

Malthouse's press conferences have been dull and uninspiring.

Has anyone finished watching one of them all year and thought "boy, we're on the right track, we might actually win next week"?

Me neither, there's a quiet resignation from Mick that although we're still mathematically possible to make the 8, he's powerless to turn things around any time soon.

 

[The Blue Baggers]

This is how I see the current list.

Red is not apart of our next premiership
Green is apart of our next Premiership
Blue is uncertain or to hard to call
Black is to early to tell



1.Andrew Walker. Great player and essential to any sort of future success must keep. He may be 28 soon but his shoulders are sound now so can't see any reason as to why he can't play another 4 -possibly 6 years

2.Troy Menzel. Obviously I don't need to say much about Troy. we all love him and he has more heart and pride then most of our plays which says alot considering he has only worn the jumper 11 times.

3. Marc Murphy. I love the man. his 2011 and most of his 2012 form was AA he has been hit hard with injuries the past 18 months but now looks to be over that. Is fundamental to future success.Maybe handed the captaincy to soon.

4.Bryce Gibbs. My Favourite Current Carlton player. but the one i am most uncertain about . IF he stays and lives up to his potential it would be great. BUT he has put the club in a bad position of recent weeks with questioning of our future plans. If he where to go I would be upset but it would probably be the best thing to come of the situation. We would get a first round pick and Gibbs would get his money. And a first round pick in a draft full of KPP is just what we need.

5.Chris Judd. The great man will probably not be around to see success at Carlton. his body seems to be letting him down these days. Probably still our best player when fit.
6.Kade Simpson. Should be the captain in hind sight but can't help that. He is older then Walker so he may not get a chance to see a premiership all though he is the most durable player I have seen at Carlton. even if he does not see a premiership he is crucial in restoring a winning culture and teaching the kids what it means to wear the navy blue.
7.Dylan Buckley. He needed to step up this year otherwise it was looking grim. He has done that and looks to be as important to future success as Menzel. Love his pride and heart reminds me of Simmo which is always a good thing.

8.Mathew Kreuzer. Kreuze is another one that I love but is troubling me. His body is not letting him be the player we all know he can be . That game against Sydney when he was coming back from his first knee was amazing. But do we need to bite the bullet here and see what we can get for him or persevere? i would like to think we would reward his loyalty of knocking back BIG money from the expansion clubs with giving him all the time he needs. but just not sure what direction the club will take
9. Kane Lucas. I truly believe he has what it takes. Was so promising and exciting when we drafted him and was hampered by injuries and possibly a lack of confidence? either way he is young enough and talented enough to be around in the next window of success.

10.Mathew Watson. Need to get games into him. his left boot is lethal and he is improving as a player. seeing as we don't have an actual permanent CHB this guy needs to be it. I would really love to see him and Henderson as ultimate swing mans going between CHB and CHF and confusing the crap out of teams . but that is more a dream ATM.

11.Robert Warnock. I believe our midfield played at its best when he was rucking but in todays game you need to be able to do more then that. Robbie simply can't do it around the track. and considering he had his best pre season since being at the club and he is dishing up what he has so far , he probably isn't going to do any better

12.Mitch Robinson. Mitch is another personal favourite of mine but his disposal is horrendous. has been for a long time. I read a post only the other day stating that if Mitch actually had clean hands and picked up everything he fumbles he would get 40 plus disposals a game. and it is so true. unfortunately I don't see him cleaning it up. Bloody hope I am wrong and he is there to hold up a cup for us one day
13. Chris Yarran. Chris has the potential to be our best and most damaging player. He is slowly but surely getting there . This year his efforts have been great. Still going missing but so is the whole team. Unless he wants to go home to Perth he should be apart of the next success

14.Brock McLean. He seems to be down ATM but his best is good and he can be a barometer of work rate for the team. But in saying that he is limited with speed and any great skill. may make way for a younger future player before seeing any real success.
15.Sam Docherty. As it stand right now he is in our plans. I personally have not seen much of the kid but what I have seen looks composed and highly skill full. Would lock him in.

16.Patrick Cripps. Potentially our best first year recruit in a long time. He has shown to be a contested machine in the lower level and looks to be able to bring that up to the next level. could be our bigger better Jobe Watson.

17.Sam Rowe. Sam has a great story that we all know about and is good at some things like taking a grab. but just is left wanting in way to many areas . and considering he is the same age as Murphy, Thomas and older then quite a few you would think he is beyond developing into a good player. would rather have a young 18-20 year old Defender on the list.

18. Tom Temay. It is to early to tell what he will become. if his game last week in the NB is anything to go by you would lock him in but will just have to wait and see more.

19.Cameron Giles. Seems to be a good solid defender who played forward most of his junior career which could potentially develop into becoming another good swing man for us. just to soon to tell.

20.Nick Holman. I simply don't know enough about him to comment. Have heard he is a younger Mitch Robinson. So if he can prove to have better skills then Robbo he could be our next bulldozer.
21.Josh Bootsma. Not sure what to make of him. he looks to be a Dustin Fletcher type but just doesn't seem to know where he is half the time when out on the field. Not sure what the relation ship is like with the club after being shopped around last year either. maybe he just needs time.

23.Lachie Henderson. Is awesome. weather he plays up forward or down back he is a superstar for us. I think he is a better defender than forward but ATM we need him up forward. or really we just need two or three or four of him.

26.Andrew McInnies. McInnes is a good foot soldier. He gets his job done and usually keeps his opponent to a respectable record.All premiership sides have similar players. can't all be match winners. If something better where to come up I could see McInnes being pushed out.

27.Dennis Armfield. Another favourite of mine. Is probably our oldest "Foot Solider" Has incredible pace and can have moments of brilliance. but just not super consistent. He may be one that finds him self out the door soon. i hope not.

28. I really want to lock Tommy in as a certainty to be around when we push for number 17 BUT he is another with pretty horrible disposal.I cant have one set of rules for Bell and Another for Mitch and Holman. To be a successful side we need to have clean disposal and we can't afford to keep people around based of potential if they don't show signs of cleaning up there acts.

29.Heath Scotland. This man DESERVES a premiership. Will unfortunately not get one, as a player at least. I hope he sticks around the club and is a part of number 17 in some sort of way because he really has been a superstar for us in our darkest times.

30.Jarrad Waite. Again another favourite of mine. He is the best option we have right now but that will most likely change in the coming 2 years. I know he has been on record to say that he feels young because he has missed so much football but I don't think that is the issue here. I think the club will give him the tap on the shoulder.

31.Luke Reynolds. Again have not seen anything of the kid so I can not comment.

32.Nick Graham. A younger, better and more professional McLean. lock him in . the kid looks to be the goods.

33.Andrejs Everitt. Is still young and shows more then every KPP sized player on the list bar Henderson. Mick recruited him for a reason and as of right now we can only assume Mick will be around rebuilding the club.

35.Ed Curnow. Some people may put him down as a list clogger but for me he is a vital part of our future midfield. He is improving every year and becoming one of the better stoppers in the league. hopefully he becomes our future Carrazzo/Ling

36. Cameron wood. Isn't overly young and is behind two ruckmen at this stage. was recruited for security and that is about all he is. I have read good reports from the NB but just think he is a bit to old to be around for number 17. unless we turn things around within 24 months.

37.Jaryd Cachia. I Like Jaryd. Right now I feel like he is Behind quite a few of our young mids. We do need good depth going forward and he is a serviceable young player .

38.Jeff Garlett. I am so very close to making this a red one. He has gone backwards over the past 2 years and just looks so lazy out on the field. If he turns things around quickly he can be apart of our next push for a flag but damn he is close to being red.

39.Dale Thomas. If his body doesn't fail him he will be a great player for us. Yes he has had a slower start but other players have had slower. When up and running Ii expect Murphy Himself and Possibly Gibbs to be a force to reckoned with.

40.Michael Jamison. He has been a great player for us but he is not getting any younger and always seem to have some sort of niggling injury that has me worried. We may look to free agency to find a more reliant fix for FB.

41.Levi Casboult. Love the man .Probably the only reason I don't have him as a red ATM. He is still young and has time to fix his kicking technique. If he can do that within 1-2 years he will be a good strong forward and should be around for an assault on #17.

42.Zach Tuohy. Is currently in his worst form slump. He is another good foot soldier. I would almost put him above the likes of Armfield and McInnes. because he has shown to be able to win a game or at least lift the team. His 3 goals against Fremantle last year was one of my favourite moments of the entire season. If something better where to come along in the next 2 or so years i could see him missing out.

43.Simon White. This is hard for me. His first 2 season where very promising. But since then things have gone down hill and whit younger options in Bootsma, McInnes and Docherty he is a long way off being best 22

44.Andrew Carrazzo. Another favourite. I just think he may be a bit to old now and that his body is going to let him down. He has had that troublesome calf injury that set him back this year. Unless we turn it around within 2 years he won't be there for number 17.

45.Blaine Johnson. Again i have not seen enough of him to make comment. Have read here and there that he is the best of the rookies which we recruited. Hopefully he is a Star in the making

46.David Ellard. The foot soldier of all foot soldiers. I like Ellard and with his new found lease on life in the forward line him self and Menzel could Etch out Garlett. But with Temay being used up forward in the NB he could put pressure on an older Ellard.

47.Ciaran Sheehan. Another i have not seen anything of so can not comment.

48.Ciaran Byrne. In the same boat as the rest of the new recruits. Looked to have an impressive first game Kicking 3 goals.

So in summary I have 14 Players in the current list who i think are good enough to be around For our next assault. The rest I am either not sure about, are to old or have not been around long enough to gauge.

Football is a strange game and for all we know we could be back up and challenging within 18 months. We can hope anyway.

Opinions? What do you guys and girls think of some of the people i am unsure of?

mate, you have obviously put alot of time into the post .... if gibbs, murphy & thomas can not dominate melbourne its time to move on

before yesterday my opinion of gibbs was keep him @ a reasonable price, let him go if adelaide give him eddie betts money ... after yesterday he can go and get the compo pick

murphy harder because he has been a good player ... but he was embarrassed by Nathan Jones yesterday

really want and need kreuzer back so we can drop warnock ... until then warnock plays

I only have one real disagreement with your assessment .... lucas needs to go .... brings nothing to the table ... avoids a contest and pathetic disposal

 

[Red Bull]

Leadership is everything

We have one real leader in the club ... MM

Kernahan ... is leaving and long overdue

Swann ... get your feet of the desk and pack your bags

McKay ... about as inspiring as a dead fish

Recruiting/development ... see Melbourne fc

Murphy ... everything a captain isnt

We MUST find the RIGHT president , not the president the factions install
From that starting point the new CFC will be born , a progressive CFC that we can all once again be proud of !!

 

[LordLucifer]

Agree with this. Some will see him as list clogger but I'd have him in nearly any side and I think he's pretty much completely replaced Carrazzo now, at least as far as his playing abilities goes.

Ed is a beast who will run all day, tackles, stops his man and is really improving his offensive game. Disposal will never be amazing but far from worst. Put him in a better side than our current one and we will truly appreciate the best of Ed Curnow.

Once you start compromising on the minimum standards you will allow in the club then the list will end up full of mediocre players like we have right now.

He has to go - end of story !!

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

We have some solid players who, if we rediscover pride, passion and work rate, can lift us right back up the ladder after a year of bottoming out as West Coast did in 2010.

This is not a 2002-2007 list. This is a self serving, confused, lazy list with a few glaring holes in it. We have the nucleus of a pretty good 18 if they are unified. We need some brutal honesty. Identify the fractures and move them on, and maybe the others will talk and work together again.

 

[The Blue Baggers]

Thing is you can't get rid of all the oldies at once. The Dees are the example here. Also it's not like we have 6, 20-23 yr olds ready to take the spots of Judd. Waite. Carrots, simmo.............
It needs to happen over 2-3 yrs. bulldogs are a perfect example.

Cross played until he was shoved out of the way by there young brigade.
Gia is the sub, almost an on filed coach. Had the passion to teach the kids and wants to be an assistant down the track. Can't see anyone wanting that job at our club (scotto??)

mate your hard on simpson ... the older player setting an example

judd can make his own call

agree on carrazzo, who looked v slow yesterday ... ellard & curnow are similar types

not sure on waite ... we are so weak down the spine think we need to keep him until some younger KP players develop ... rowe is not the answer

 

[I AM CARLTON]

The way we are playing we will easily be bottom 4 we need to keep this pick and try to stockpile a few more early picks at the same time. Does this mean letting Gibbs go? Trade some established players?

 

[LordLucifer]

This is how I see the current list.

Red is not apart of our next premiership
Green is apart of our next Premiership
Blue is uncertain or to hard to call
Black is to early to tell



1.Andrew Walker. Great player and essential to any sort of future success must keep. He may be 28 soon but his shoulders are sound now so can't see any reason as to why he can't play another 4 -possibly 6 years

2.Troy Menzel. Obviously I don't need to say much about Troy. we all love him and he has more heart and pride then most of our plays which says alot considering he has only worn the jumper 11 times.

3. Marc Murphy. I love the man. his 2011 and most of his 2012 form was AA he has been hit hard with injuries the past 18 months but now looks to be over that. Is fundamental to future success.Maybe handed the captaincy to soon.

4.Bryce Gibbs. My Favourite Current Carlton player. but the one i am most uncertain about . IF he stays and lives up to his potential it would be great. BUT he has put the club in a bad position of recent weeks with questioning of our future plans. If he where to go I would be upset but it would probably be the best thing to come of the situation. We would get a first round pick and Gibbs would get his money. And a first round pick in a draft full of KPP is just what we need.

5.Chris Judd. The great man will probably not be around to see success at Carlton. his body seems to be letting him down these days. Probably still our best player when fit.
6.Kade Simpson. Should be the captain in hind sight but can't help that. He is older then Walker so he may not get a chance to see a premiership all though he is the most durable player I have seen at Carlton. even if he does not see a premiership he is crucial in restoring a winning culture and teaching the kids what it means to wear the navy blue.
7.Dylan Buckley. He needed to step up this year otherwise it was looking grim. He has done that and looks to be as important to future success as Menzel. Love his pride and heart reminds me of Simmo which is always a good thing.

8.Mathew Kreuzer. Kreuze is another one that I love but is troubling me. His body is not letting him be the player we all know he can be . That game against Sydney when he was coming back from his first knee was amazing. But do we need to bite the bullet here and see what we can get for him or persevere? i would like to think we would reward his loyalty of knocking back BIG money from the expansion clubs with giving him all the time he needs. but just not sure what direction the club will take
9. Kane Lucas. I truly believe he has what it takes. Was so promising and exciting when we drafted him and was hampered by injuries and possibly a lack of confidence? either way he is young enough and talented enough to be around in the next window of success.

10.Mathew Watson. Need to get games into him. his left boot is lethal and he is improving as a player. seeing as we don't have an actual permanent CHB this guy needs to be it. I would really love to see him and Henderson as ultimate swing mans going between CHB and CHF and confusing the crap out of teams . but that is more a dream ATM.

11.Robert Warnock. I believe our midfield played at its best when he was rucking but in todays game you need to be able to do more then that. Robbie simply can't do it around the track. and considering he had his best pre season since being at the club and he is dishing up what he has so far , he probably isn't going to do any better

12.Mitch Robinson. Mitch is another personal favourite of mine but his disposal is horrendous. has been for a long time. I read a post only the other day stating that if Mitch actually had clean hands and picked up everything he fumbles he would get 40 plus disposals a game. and it is so true. unfortunately I don't see him cleaning it up. Bloody hope I am wrong and he is there to hold up a cup for us one day
13. Chris Yarran. Chris has the potential to be our best and most damaging player. He is slowly but surely getting there . This year his efforts have been great. Still going missing but so is the whole team. Unless he wants to go home to Perth he should be apart of the next success

14.Brock McLean. He seems to be down ATM but his best is good and he can be a barometer of work rate for the team. But in saying that he is limited with speed and any great skill. may make way for a younger future player before seeing any real success.
15.Sam Docherty. As it stand right now he is in our plans. I personally have not seen much of the kid but what I have seen looks composed and highly skill full. Would lock him in.

16.Patrick Cripps. Potentially our best first year recruit in a long time. He has shown to be a contested machine in the lower level and looks to be able to bring that up to the next level. could be our bigger better Jobe Watson.

17.Sam Rowe. Sam has a great story that we all know about and is good at some things like taking a grab. but just is left wanting in way to many areas . and considering he is the same age as Murphy, Thomas and older then quite a few you would think he is beyond developing into a good player. would rather have a young 18-20 year old Defender on the list.

18. Tom Temay. It is to early to tell what he will become. if his game last week in the NB is anything to go by you would lock him in but will just have to wait and see more.

19.Cameron Giles. Seems to be a good solid defender who played forward most of his junior career which could potentially develop into becoming another good swing man for us. just to soon to tell.

20.Nick Holman. I simply don't know enough about him to comment. Have heard he is a younger Mitch Robinson. So if he can prove to have better skills then Robbo he could be our next bulldozer.
21.Josh Bootsma. Not sure what to make of him. he looks to be a Dustin Fletcher type but just doesn't seem to know where he is half the time when out on the field. Not sure what the relation ship is like with the club after being shopped around last year either. maybe he just needs time.

23.Lachie Henderson. Is awesome. weather he plays up forward or down back he is a superstar for us. I think he is a better defender than forward but ATM we need him up forward. or really we just need two or three or four of him.

26.Andrew McInnies. McInnes is a good foot soldier. He gets his job done and usually keeps his opponent to a respectable record.All premiership sides have similar players. can't all be match winners. If something better where to come up I could see McInnes being pushed out.

27.Dennis Armfield. Another favourite of mine. Is probably our oldest "Foot Solider" Has incredible pace and can have moments of brilliance. but just not super consistent. He may be one that finds him self out the door soon. i hope not.

28. I really want to lock Tommy in as a certainty to be around when we push for number 17 BUT he is another with pretty horrible disposal.I cant have one set of rules for Bell and Another for Mitch and Holman. To be a successful side we need to have clean disposal and we can't afford to keep people around based of potential if they don't show signs of cleaning up there acts.

29.Heath Scotland. This man DESERVES a premiership. Will unfortunately not get one, as a player at least. I hope he sticks around the club and is a part of number 17 in some sort of way because he really has been a superstar for us in our darkest times.

30.Jarrad Waite. Again another favourite of mine. He is the best option we have right now but that will most likely change in the coming 2 years. I know he has been on record to say that he feels young because he has missed so much football but I don't think that is the issue here. I think the club will give him the tap on the shoulder.

31.Luke Reynolds. Again have not seen anything of the kid so I can not comment.

32.Nick Graham. A younger, better and more professional McLean. lock him in . the kid looks to be the goods.

33.Andrejs Everitt. Is still young and shows more then every KPP sized player on the list bar Henderson. Mick recruited him for a reason and as of right now we can only assume Mick will be around rebuilding the club.

35.Ed Curnow. Some people may put him down as a list clogger but for me he is a vital part of our future midfield. He is improving every year and becoming one of the better stoppers in the league. hopefully he becomes our future Carrazzo/Ling

36. Cameron wood. Isn't overly young and is behind two ruckmen at this stage. was recruited for security and that is about all he is. I have read good reports from the NB but just think he is a bit to old to be around for number 17. unless we turn things around within 24 months.

37.Jaryd Cachia. I Like Jaryd. Right now I feel like he is Behind quite a few of our young mids. We do need good depth going forward and he is a serviceable young player .

38.Jeff Garlett. I am so very close to making this a red one. He has gone backwards over the past 2 years and just looks so lazy out on the field. If he turns things around quickly he can be apart of our next push for a flag but damn he is close to being red.

39.Dale Thomas. If his body doesn't fail him he will be a great player for us. Yes he has had a slower start but other players have had slower. When up and running Ii expect Murphy Himself and Possibly Gibbs to be a force to reckoned with.

40.Michael Jamison. He has been a great player for us but he is not getting any younger and always seem to have some sort of niggling injury that has me worried. We may look to free agency to find a more reliant fix for FB.

41.Levi Casboult. Love the man .Probably the only reason I don't have him as a red ATM. He is still young and has time to fix his kicking technique. If he can do that within 1-2 years he will be a good strong forward and should be around for an assault on #17.

42.Zach Tuohy. Is currently in his worst form slump. He is another good foot soldier. I would almost put him above the likes of Armfield and McInnes. because he has shown to be able to win a game or at least lift the team. His 3 goals against Fremantle last year was one of my favourite moments of the entire season. If something better where to come along in the next 2 or so years i could see him missing out.

43.Simon White. This is hard for me. His first 2 season where very promising. But since then things have gone down hill and whit younger options in Bootsma, McInnes and Docherty he is a long way off being best 22

44.Andrew Carrazzo. Another favourite. I just think he may be a bit to old now and that his body is going to let him down. He has had that troublesome calf injury that set him back this year. Unless we turn it around within 2 years he won't be there for number 17.

45.Blaine Johnson. Again i have not seen enough of him to make comment. Have read here and there that he is the best of the rookies which we recruited. Hopefully he is a Star in the making

46.David Ellard. The foot soldier of all foot soldiers. I like Ellard and with his new found lease on life in the forward line him self and Menzel could Etch out Garlett. But with Temay being used up forward in the NB he could put pressure on an older Ellard.

47.Ciaran Sheehan. Another i have not seen anything of so can not comment.

48.Ciaran Byrne. In the same boat as the rest of the new recruits. Looked to have an impressive first game Kicking 3 goals.

So in summary I have 14 Players in the current list who i think are good enough to be around For our next assault. The rest I am either not sure about, are to old or have not been around long enough to gauge.

Football is a strange game and for all we know we could be back up and challenging within 18 months. We can hope anyway.

Opinions? What do you guys and girls think of some of the people i am unsure of?

Lucas & Watson are part of the future ??
I admire your support & loyalty but it's time to take off your navy-blue glasses.

 

[invinciBlues]

This is my attitude towards a rebuild


We all know that decision by Arnie paid off

 

[thylacine60]

Agree with this. Some will see him as list clogger but I'd have him in nearly any side and I think he's pretty much completely replaced Carrazzo now, at least as far as his playing abilities goes.

Ed is a beast who will run all day, tackles, stops his man and is really improving his offensive game. Disposal will never be amazing but far from worst. Put him in a better side than our current one and we will truly appreciate the best of Ed Curnow.

Ed's disposal is as bad as anyone at the club.