Game Day The Rot In The Middle

[sey666]

This is Shuey's



Hutchings'



I think the coaches have changed the roles of some of the players this year. Shuey seem to play in the defensive half majority of the time this year; this is probably why his inside 50's and goals are down this year as opposed to last year while the rebound 50's are up - don't know why they would want our most damaging midfielder to play in the defensive half for the majority of the game. This certainly wasn't the case last year and results this year suggest we should revert back to the set up we had last year. In any case, we seem to play a lot more defensively this year. Hutchins is playing more in the forward half this year resulting in him kicking more goals.

 

[avishka5]

Would be nice if simmo sets some tough goals for the second tier mids as well guys who rotate through there on occasions. I have given redden the benefit of the doubt for way too long but for guy who spends a large chunk of time in the middle he has been overwhelmingly bad. I know he has been used as a guy who blocked for boots and priddis but 17 disposals is way too low. Now that NN is not there hopefully he doesnt need to block as much and he starts getting more of the ball on the inside. I would like to see him winning more contested footy that shuey and releasing shuey to inflict some pain on the outside. Its time for him start averaging 20-25 touches and and a handful of clearances. That also goes to Hutch as well. I assume one of them will make way for Sheed in the next month or so, so a bit of internal competition wont hurt. Also duggan has to lift as well. He plays some good games and then goes missing in others. Its good to see nelson pushing for selection so hopefully duggan becomes more consistent and start accumulating the footy a bit more.

 

[sey666]

Would be nice if simmo sets some tough goals for the second tier mids as well guys who rotate through there on occasions. I have given redden the benefit of the doubt for way too long but for guy who spends a large chunk of time in the middle he has been overwhelmingly bad. I know he has been used as a guy who blocked for boots and priddis but 17 disposals is way too low. Now that NN is not there hopefully he doesnt need to block as much and he starts getting more of the ball on the inside. I would like to see him winning more contested footy that shuey and releasing shuey to inflict some pain on the outside. Its time for him start averaging 20-25 touches and and a handful of clearances. That also goes to Hutch as well. I assume one of them will make way for Sheed in the next month or so, so a bit of internal competition wont hurt. Also duggan has to lift as well. He plays some good games and then goes missing in others. Its good to see nelson pushing for selection so hopefully duggan becomes more consistent and start accumulating the footy a bit more.

I thought we got Redden in because we knew Selwood was going to Geelong. Selwood was not a regular in 2015 (and neither was Hutchings), so how come Redden is an automatic choice this year? Don't think we had all three of Selwood, Priddis and Hutchings in the same team too often last year.

 

[avishka5]

I thought we got Redden in because we knew Selwood was going to Geelong. Selwood was not a regular in 2015 (and neither was Hutchings), so how come Redden is an automatic choice this year? Don't think we had all three of Selwood, Priddis and Hutchings in the same team too often last year.

the fact that we handed our first round pick for him, i doubt it. He was brought into replace priddis in a few years time as well. Redden in theory is a best 22 player and hutchings is a fringe player. Hutchings has got games purely because midfield our sucks this year and because sheed is injured.

 

[sey666]

the fact that we handed our first round pick for him, i doubt it. He was brought into replace priddis in a few years time as well. Redden in theory is a best 22 player and hutchings is a fringe player. Hutchings has got games purely because midfield our sucks this year and because sheed is injured.

No argument there. But if we had to cut one of them when Sheed comes back we might as well flip a coin.

 

[avishka5]

No argument there. But if we had to cut one of them when Sheed comes back we might as well flip a coin.

it will be but i still reckon they will select redden over hutchings. redden is much cleaner and a better player inside. Sheed will take hutchings spot. But if redden keeps on dissapointing, hutch would be brought in.

 

[RookiePick]

This is Shuey's

View attachment 257084

Hutchings'

View attachment 257087

I think the coaches have changed the roles of some of the players this year. Shuey seem to play in the defensive half majority of the time this year; this is probably why his inside 50's and goals are down this year as opposed to last year while the rebound 50's are up - don't know why they would want our most damaging midfielder to play in the defensive half for the majority of the game. This certainly wasn't the case last year and results this year suggest we should revert back to the set up we had last year. In any case, we seem to play a lot more defensively this year. Hutchins is playing more in the forward half this year resulting in him kicking more goals.

What is the comparative time in forward half per game compared to last year? Id suggest we are just getti g belted out of the guts against good sides and our press is not holding the ball in our forward half like last year.

Certainly the eyeball test says the ball is spending a lot more time in the opposition half...

 

[QS]

Sheed must have heavy shoulders right about now

 

[QS]

Sheed must have heavy shoulders right about now

Shred*

 

[sey666]

What is the comparative time in forward half per game compared to last year? Id suggest we are just getti g belted out of the guts against good sides and our press is not holding the ball in our forward half like last year.

Certainly the eyeball test says the ball is spending a lot more time in the opposition half...

Although this is what one would expect, it is certainly not the case. Have a look at the two heatmaps below





Now you would think that these 2 are from games where we got belted but the top one is from the St Kilda game and the bottom one is from the Gold Coast game; these were our 2 biggest wins this year and Shuey was BOG on both of these. The ball must have been in our forward half about 60-70% of the time in these games.

Contrast these with the following heatmap from the qualifying final which was undoubtedly our best win last year.




Last year in Shuey's case it seemed to be 50% Defence and Forward 50%.

 

[SpaceClef]

Interesting stuff

 

[RookiePick]

Cheers sey666 interesting analysis for sure

Have you got a shuey heatmap from a more comparable win last year, say Gold Coast again?

There is a fair bit of difference in the quality of opposition so we may well structure up differently vs Hawks.

 

[sey666]

Cheers sey666 interesting analysis for sure

Have you got a shuey heatmap from a more comparable win last year, say Gold Coast again?

There is a fair bit of difference in the quality of opposition so we may well structure up differently vs Hawks.

Good point. Percentages are identical in the round 23 game against St Kilda, however they are exactly the opposite in the round 7 game against Gold Coast at Domain.

St Kilda round 23, 2015



Gold Coast round 7, 2015



Only game this year where Shuey spent more than 50% of the game up forward is the Richmond game in round 4 (34% Defence - 66% Forward) - notice anything in common to the way we played this game with that qualifying final last year?

 

[RookiePick]

Interesting. I wonder what shep/wellinghams heat maps look like too?

Our rebound off half back really seems down so I wonder if that is pulling guys like Shuey further down the field to help and/or trying to win the damn pill.

Shuey has already had as many r50 this year as all of last season. Conversely he is about 20% down on i50. It's hard not to think between form and structure changes we are screwing the pooch massively.

 

[avishka5]

gaffs r50's are up as well and his inside 50's are down as well. its probably also to do with masto not being in form as well. masten was the link out of defence last season.

 

[Matele]

Good point. Percentages are identical in the round 23 game against St Kilda, however they are exactly the opposite in the round 7 game against Gold Coast at Domain.

St Kilda round 23, 2015

View attachment 257145

Gold Coast round 7, 2015

View attachment 257147

Only game this year where Shuey spent more 50% of the game up forward is the Richmond game in round 4 (34% Defence - 66% Forward) - notice anything in common to the way we played this game with that qualifying final last year?

I'd say the Richmond game in R4 is arguably the best we've been all season too. Interesting stuff.

So what's changed? Is our output down? Structures changed? What's happened?

 

[sey666]

When Priddis is not playing, Shuey plays more forward of the centre and we become a more dynamic team - can't be just coincidence, can it? Some are saying that we should drop Priddis so that we play more like we did against Hawks in the QF and Richmond in round 4; perhaps the problem is not with playing Priddis, may be the problem is with the role that Shuey plays when Priddis is in the team. I think we should let Shuey play the same way (as he did against Haw and Rich) regardless of whether Priddis is in the team or not. We are a better team with Shuey having more inside 50s than rebound 50s.

There is no point in having all our good ball users (like Shuey, Hill..) in the defensive half because that would only leave spuds further up the field and they will certainly undo all the good work.

 

[avishka5]

In the nab game against the bombers, simpson experimented with darling in the middle and playing as the "spitta" from bounce downs. It actually worked and JD was some what successful. So far JD has barely gone into the middle. This week with mcinnis in and lions not having a great tall forwards. I would like to see gov spend more time forward and jack going into the middle at times and playing as a HFF.

 

[kranky al]

This is Shuey's

View attachment 257084

Hutchings'

View attachment 257087

I think the coaches have changed the roles of some of the players this year. Shuey seem to play in the defensive half majority of the time this year; this is probably why his inside 50's and goals are down this year as opposed to last year while the rebound 50's are up - don't know why they would want our most damaging midfielder to play in the defensive half for the majority of the game. This certainly wasn't the case last year and results this year suggest we should revert back to the set up we had last year. In any case, we seem to play a lot more defensively this year. Hutchins is playing more in the forward half this year resulting in him kicking more goals.

Can you post yeos please - where are you getting them from?

 

[ziad]

In the nab game against the bombers, simpson experimented with darling in the middle and playing as the "spitta" from bounce downs. It actually worked and JD was some what successful. So far JD has barely gone into the middle. This week with mcinnis in and lions not having a great tall forwards. I would like to see gov spend more time forward and jack going into the middle at times and playing as a HFF.

Lions have good mids & fast smaller high forwards - they destroy us.

The gabba is not a happy hunting ground to I am a little anxious

 

[Biggie]

The gabba is not a happy hunting ground to I am a little anxious

Played 19, won 11 lost 8

Last 3




Probably not all doom and gloom.

Brisbane are a rabble.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Lions have good mids & fast smaller high forwards - they destroy us.

The gabba is not a happy hunting ground to I am a little anxious

We've won our last three there. In fact since 2003 we've won 8 out of 12, the only losses coming in 2008, 2009 and 2010 (when we were shizen) and 2012 when Darling was robbed of a goal.

It's probably the closest thing to a happy hunting ground we have the other side of the rabbit-proof fence.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

No coach we have has acknowledged the rot in the middle, this is why the same guys will be there again tomorrow. Our midfield is fine just ask Woosha and Simmo

 

[frenchconnection]

No coach we have has acknowledged the rot in the middle, this is why the same guys will be there again tomorrow. Our midfield is fine just ask Woosha and Simmo

Just because it hasn't been acknowledged in the public arena doesn't mean it's not being discussed behind closed doors though.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Just because it hasn't been acknowledged in the public arena doesn't mean it's not being discussed behind closed doors though.

Agree but a 5 year discussion is pretty long without any action.