2nds The SANFL Thread

[Elite Crow]

It's so simple. Port get the Magpies as their reserves. Crows reserves becomes 10th team. Wave farewell to the bye. Win for everyone. Everyone knows it, the SANFL clubs are just holding out and making up BS excuses for more money.

Some of the issues I can see:

They would be worried about both teams becoming too strong. If they are full of AFL seconds they will clean up, well ours will. Ports seconds would still be shit. To alleviate this both sides should have recruiting restrictions. They have to top up their lists with kids. However this will also weaken the remaining SANFL sides because those kids won't make it to them.

The other issue is what to do with SANFL recruited players that switch to either the Crows or Port as a result of being drafted. What happens if they are delisted? Do they stay with the Crows and Port?

Salary cap issues. Currently the SANFL clubs get a free kick in their caps for afl listed players don't they?

Finals and the integrity of the premiership. Say Crows are playing finals in both comps, the afl crows lose players to injury, they raid the SANFL crows and they field a weakened team.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

You know every other club has one now right? Is everyone stupid except us? Why aren't we rolling in wins, flags plus all the $$$ we are saving

so if everyone has a reserves team ...has everyone won a flag, or do the same teams fight it out each year in the 8 ?

One team raids Ireland .....so all teams follow ....then one stops, so they all stop.

One team has success with mature rookie (Barlow) ....so all teams get a mature rookie

The industry is fashion ......follow the leader .....lemmings

We're going to follow Victorian teams who have the tremendous reputation of finding new ways to get into debt!!!!

 

[*PAF]

Some of the issues I can see:

They would be worried about both teams becoming too strong. If they are full of AFL seconds they will clean up, well ours will. Ports seconds would still be shit. To alleviate this both sides should have recruiting restrictions. They have to top up their lists with kids. However this will also weaken the remaining SANFL sides because those kids won't make it to them.

The other issue is what to do with SANFL recruited players that switch to either the Crows or Port as a result of being drafted. What happens if they are delisted? Do they stay with the Crows and Port?

Salary cap issues. Currently the SANFL clubs get a free kick in their caps for afl listed players don't they?

Finals and the integrity of the premiership. Say Crows are playing finals in both comps, the afl crows lose players to injury, they raid the SANFL crows and they field a weakened team.

Listing all possible issues is easy, what we need to do is find solutions.
You cannot have a player recruited as a KPF being played as a ruckman. We cannot have a player recruited as a FB being played as a midfielder.
We need solutions not a list of all possible issues, minor, major or otherwise.

 

[glengowan]

If the Crows want a Reserves team they should be able to have one. Provided they can fund it and play in a competition outside of the SANFL. I think they should join the VFL. The SANFL league is all about winning the premiership and there is no place for development teams.

The only win-win scenario is an 8 team independent SANFL competition and an independent Adelaide and Port Power with Reserves in any of the other compromised State Leagues around the country.

The only reason the Adelaide Crows have been so successful in this State is because they were borne from the SANFL. Yes, it is time to part ways, but do it with humility.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Some of the issues I can see:

They would be worried about both teams becoming too strong. If they are full of AFL seconds they will clean up, well ours will. Ports seconds would still be shit. To alleviate this both sides should have recruiting restrictions. They have to top up their lists with kids. However this will also weaken the remaining SANFL sides because those kids won't make it to them.

The other issue is what to do with SANFL recruited players that switch to either the Crows or Port as a result of being drafted. What happens if they are delisted? Do they stay with the Crows and Port?

Salary cap issues. Currently the SANFL clubs get a free kick in their caps for afl listed players don't they?

Finals and the integrity of the premiership. Say Crows are playing finals in both comps, the afl crows lose players to injury, they raid the SANFL crows and they field a weakened team.

The second point is the MAJOR ISSUE ....hence why Port raised not resting players during finals (it wouldd have to be in black & white b4 i believe that statement)

No the concern would not the Crows being too strong ....far from it, we would get our asses kicked by the Norwood's, and Centrals.

If we have no injuries ....where do our surplus players play ....next level down is U19?
If we have lots injuries ....we're really uncompetitive
Do we run an U19 comp as well so we have reserves available and for talent identification

 

[scaryness]

I know he has been injured for a bit now, but how close was Johnston from playing for you guys?

I had high hopes for him at Sydney but things didn't turn out obviously.

 

[Elite Crow]

Listing all possible issues is easy, what we need to do is find solutions.
You cannot have a player recruited as a KPF being played as a ruckman. We cannot have a player recruited as a FB being played as a midfielder.
We need solutions not a list of all possible issues, minor, major or otherwise.

And your solutions are?

 

[Cleric]

Johnston has moments where you think he is going to take the next step but he either gets injured or his form slows. He has massive talent but hasnt decided to get the most of it.

 

[betterthanu]

I know he has been injured for a bit now, but how close was Johnston from playing for you guys?

I had high hopes for him at Sydney but things didn't turn out obviously.

Well after Walker went down, he would have been playing a similar role to Tom Lynch and hes going pretty well.

 

[*PAF]

And your solutions are?

Other than the obvious reserves IIRC I posted a possible "type of solution" a few weeks back. May have been in this thread. There are many possible solutions, one just has to try and find them rather than impede them as the SANFL are currently doing.
I'll do a search and link it, then instead of criticising it you too can post some possible solutions rather than just the same ol same ol negative ones.

EDIT: Found it. It was in a totally different thread.
Independance from the SANFL within a week??

 

[Apsaalooke]

Positives to joining the SANFL

We won't be too strong - our best will be in the AFL unless coming back from injury and top ups will be from juniors or ammos. Some of our squad are in the ressies/fringe SANFL/projects as it is.

We won't be too weak/won't try - players are trying to break into the A team or impress AFL/SANFL scouts

Crowds and therefore income will probably be up which is a win for all - there'll be a "Crows" game in Adelaide each week and bring out some non-SANFL affiliated supporters.

There will be incentive for SANFL players to play well against AFL listed players and advance their case for being drafted - think Lee Spurr

Crows retired icons like Doughty may be able to go back and act as mentors playing alongside our juniors when their AFL career is over and they don't want to back to an SANFL club they haven't seen for 10 years

It's a good breeding ground for assistant coaches

Negatives

The competition is "compromised". What does that even mean?

 

[Elder van Berlo]

I know he has been injured for a bit now, but how close was Johnston from playing for you guys?

I had high hopes for him at Sydney but things didn't turn out obviously.

When Walker went down, most were surprised that McKernan came in instead of Johnston. LJ broke his leg in the SANFL that weekend... Sliding doors

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Some of the issues I can see:

They would be worried about both teams becoming too strong. If they are full of AFL seconds they will clean up, well ours will. Ports seconds would still be shit. To alleviate this both sides should have recruiting restrictions. They have to top up their lists with kids. However this will also weaken the remaining SANFL sides because those kids won't make it to them.

They won't be too strong. Here is our team from last week:

B Siggins Hartigan Joyce
HB Tambling L Thompson Ellis-Yeomans
C Grigg Riley Atkins
HF Jaensch Henderson McIntyre
F McKernan Callinan Orval
1R Graham Wright Crouch
INT Dowdell Klaosen Osborn

And this is with a very limited injury situation. Add some U18's when we've got injuries and it gets weaker still. Plus I think the depth of our squad at the moment is as good as it's ever been. And Port's is worse.

The other issue is what to do with SANFL recruited players that switch to either the Crows or Port as a result of being drafted. What happens if they are delisted? Do they stay with the Crows and Port?

Minor issue.

Salary cap issues. Currently the SANFL clubs get a free kick in their caps for afl listed players don't they?

They do but it doesn't matter. The VFL deals with this.

Finals and the integrity of the premiership. Say Crows are playing finals in both comps, the afl crows lose players to injury, they raid the SANFL crows and they field a weakened team.

Then the SANFL club beats them. And if the Crows aren't playing finals then they'll have a stronger list to choose from.

We're worried that they'll be too strong and too weak. It's just a nothing argument from the SANFL clubs.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

I just find it strange Rucci is saying the SANFL reserves is the only option that will work. If we didn't win each game by 20 goals, I'd be disappointed.

The standard has to be better than that.

I go to the occasional Glenelg game, and TBH, the skill level is extremely poor. If we go another level below that, its just going to be uncompetitive IMO.

Because once Rooch has a bee in his bonnet, he does not provide an open discussion on all the options.

There is already a significant gap between the AFL & SANFL - so there would be a ridiculous gap between the AFL & SANFL reserves, which would make it difficult for our fringe players to get AFL ready. Can you imagine Crouch, Wright, Jaensch, Callinan & Stiffy playing SANFL reserves now. It would not be helping them much at all! They would go backwards in their development.

The Crows/Port would not dominate the SANFL competition as they would need to top up the side with juniors.

There would be bigger crowds to the SANFL as more Crows supporters would go to games to watch our developing players. I always looked forward to our pre-season trial games at Norwood Oval more for the earlier game than our seniors.

SANFL would be less compromised as there would be less conflicts of having to play AFL players out of position.

 

[Mego Red]

Its hilarious when Wayne's-World posts in this thread - literally not a single professional involved with an AFL club agrees with him, but he keeps plowing on ...

 

[*PAF]

The second point is the MAJOR ISSUE ....hence why Port raised not resting players during finals (it wouldd have to be in black & white b4 i believe that statement)

No the concern would not the Crows being too strong ....far from it, we would get our asses kicked by the Norwood's, and Centrals.

If we have no injuries ....where do our surplus players play ....next level down is U19?
If we have lots injuries ....we're really uncompetitive
Do we run an U19 comp as well so we have reserves available and for talent identification

Let the SANFL top up their list and then give the AFL clubs one week to pick 10 or so players each out of the leftovers.
See? There is always a simple solution to every problem if people want to find them.

 

[glengowan]

Negatives

The competition is "compromised". What does that even mean?

1) It's not a level playing field. Salaries, recruiting, facilities, priorities.
2) The premiership comes 2nd to development.

An example would be Ian Callinan. Best player in the league, integral to Central for several years, Jack Oatey Medallist in 2010. Gets rookied by Adelaide and spends 2011 playing against Central. How is that fair?

What interest is there in a compromised competition? How is it exciting for an SANFL club to beat a Reserves team when their main aim isn't even to win. The SANFL is more than a Reserves competition.

What happens in a bad injury year. There may only be half a dozen Crows players playing, dragging down the standard of the competition.

Like I said earlier, I'm all for the Crows getting a Reserves side, just don't ruin the SANFL competition with it.

 

[*PAF]

1) It's not a level playing field. Salaries, recruiting, facilities, priorities.
2) The premiership comes 2nd to development.

An example would be Ian Callinan. Best player in the league, integral to Central for several years, Jack Oatey Medallist in 2010. Gets rookied by Adelaide and spends 2011 playing against Central. How is that fair?

What interest is there in a compromised competition? How is it exciting for an SANFL club to beat a Reserves team when their main aim isn't even to win. The SANFL is more than a Reserves competition.

What happens in a bad injury year. There may only be half a dozen Crows players playing, dragging down the standard of the competition.

Like I said earlier, I'm all for the Crows getting a Reserves side, just don't ruin the SANFL competition with it.

One stupid bullshit argument is to be the reason for canning the idea. Good one.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

1) It's not a level playing field. Salaries, recruiting, facilities, priorities.
2) The premiership comes 2nd to development.

An example would be Ian Callinan. Best player in the league, integral to Central for several years, Jack Oatey Medallist in 2010. Gets rookied by Adelaide and spends 2011 playing against Central. How is that fair?

How is it fair now?

Callinan is playing for Centrals in 2013 because he was drafted by the Crows.

Norwood get Sam Rowe drafted. He won't play any games for them.

Pot luck which club happens to draft your players.

Plus in the example above, Centrals still get to have a mini draft selection, the same as Norwood, even though they haven't lost a player interstate and Norwood have.

 

[glengowan]

One stupid bullshit argument is to be the reason for canning the idea. Good one.

Huh? I guess it depends on how much you value integrity as to how much of a bullshit argument it might be. Why is it such an issue for the Crows or Port to have a Reserves team outside of the SANFL league competition? If you don't have the means to be able to do it, that is not the SANFL's problem.

 

[glengowan]

How is it fair now?

Callinan is playing for Centrals in 2013 because he was drafted by the Crows.

Norwood get Sam Rowe drafted. He won't play any games for them.

Pot luck which club happens to draft your players.

Plus in the example above, Centrals still get to have a mini draft selection, the same as Norwood, even though they haven't lost a player interstate and Norwood have.

Which is why it will be best to split completely and the Crows and Port have their own Reserves and the 8 SANFL clubs have their own competition.

 

[*PAF]

Huh? I guess it depends on how much you value integrity as to how much of a bullshit argument it might be. Why is it such an issue for the Crows or Port to have a Reserves team outside of the SANFL league competition? If you don't have the means to be able to do it, that is not the SANFL's problem.

Remove the condition that the AFL clubs must play all of their games in an oval controlled by the SANFL and then you can do whatever you want.
If instead you want to make money from the AFL clubs then there must be some quid pro quo.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

How is it fair now?

Callinan is playing for Centrals in 2013 because he was drafted by the Crows.

Norwood get Sam Rowe drafted. He won't play any games for them.

Pot luck which club happens to draft your players.

Plus in the example above, Centrals still get to have a mini draft selection, the same as Norwood, even though they haven't lost a player interstate and Norwood have.

There are more inequities at the moment than there would be with the Crows reserves being the 10th team in the SANFL.

Some people just don't like change.

Why don't the SANFL trial it for 2 years, with a right to revert to what it is, in case the SANFL "falls apart" with the Crows entering a reserves team.

 

[Cap]

put them into the VFL.

put out a request to anyone who wants to play for an AFL reserves team and see what kind of response you get, make a note to invite anyone who doesn't get drafted every year

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

put them into the VFL.

put out a request to anyone who wants to play for an AFL reserves team and see what kind of response you get, make a note to invite anyone who doesn't get drafted every year

Agreed. If the SANFL clubs truly make idiots of themselves then this is what we should do.

The SANFL will find that not a single ex-AFL player or player seeking to be a mature age recruit will play in their competition. They'll all gravitate to the VFL, where they'll at least have AFL club eyes on them.

The gap between the SANFL and SAAFL will narrow. The only difference being that the SAAFL clubs have more money. Competition merger in a few years?

Crows/Power will find every reason they can to prevent the dollars they create from flowing to the SANFL. Sure, they try to do that now to a degree, but that's to a competition they currently have a vested interest in. Take that interest away...