2nds The SANFL Thread

[StonesThrow]

Riley may well get his wish. Good (very good) SANFL player. Lacks the weapons required to survive at the higher level.

Lyons should play against GC.

Lyons doesn't have any 'weapons'.

I don't know how anyone could say he didn't have what it takes at AFL level as he hasn't been given enough opportunity. How many games has he played? 3?

How many games did Symes get before the club realised he was just a good sanfl player?

I've got no idea if Riley would make it but he needs to be given a chance based on his clearance/contested work and strong tackling, especially at the moment.

 

[chazwazza]

Sorry to any anti crows reserves side people but I can not wait until next season and we have all of our players in one team.

This going from one game to other to check player stats is just crap. Over it and just waiting for the announcement.

Must be traumatising for you.

 

[chazwazza]

Which part if my post didn't you understand?

Revenue? Value? Parasitic?

Which part of mine didn't you understand? I used as few words as possible to accommodate you.

 

[JP Sauce]

I think we might need two SANFL threads. One for player talk and one for Crows Reserves talk.

 

[chazwazza]

Riley looking to make a statement

He does this nearly every week. Very strong in breaking tackles and giving them.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Must be traumatising for you.

It is - if only I can get that 5 minutes back each Sunday.

 

[spenze]

Riley may well get his wish. Good (very good) SANFL player. Lacks the weapons required to survive at the higher level.

What weapons do you think he lacks?

Honestly haven't seen enough of Riley to form an opinion on him

 

[Cap]

Lyons doesn't have any 'weapons'.

I don't know how anyone could say he didn't have what it takes at AFL level as he hasn't been given enough opportunity. How many games has he played? 3?

How many games did Symes get before the club realised he was just a good sanfl player?

I've got no idea if Riley would make it but he needs to be given a chance based on his clearance/contested work and strong tackling, especially at the moment.

what is this weapons stuff?

He has a weapon, its called ball accumulation - something he can actually use and use well

I'd rather his weapon than Mackays "weapon" which we see once every 4 matches.

 

[chazwazza]

What weapons do you think he lacks?

Honestly haven't seen enough of Riley to form an opinion on him

He's not a hugely long kick, not overly tall either, speed is average. Seems to run out a game really well, second efforts are outstanding and great at 1%'ers. Today he found great patches of time and space infront of goal but chose to dish off instead of backing himself in for kicking the goal....ball eventually got turned over.

 

[Cap]

what happened to Graham ? didn't appear to play for sturt?

Also, anyone got an update on Lewis Johnston? injury says 6-8 weeks but didn't he do the injury a month or so ago?

 

[StonesThrow]

what is this weapons stuff?

He has a weapon, its called ball accumulation - something he can actually use and use well

I'd rather his weapon than Mackays "weapon" which we see once every 4 matches.

You didn't get my point.

 

[Cap]

You didn't get my point.

yeah sorry, I should have responded to Vader sorry.

 

[Crow-eater]

what happened to Graham ? didn't appear to play for sturt?

Also, anyone got an update on Lewis Johnston? injury says 6-8 weeks but didn't he do the injury a month or so ago?

From memory, LJ got injured the week after Tex, so round 6. We're heading into round 13, so 6-ish weeks ago.

Should be back in a week or two then.

 

[Vader]

Rubbish! Vader .......they said the same things about Sam Mitchell, Sewell, Brock Mclean, Tuck ect

Agreed not naturally talented ......but willpower and determination often surpasses talent (Sloane)

You're not seriously trying to compare Riley with the likes of Sewell, Mitchell, McLean and Tuck ? Now you're just embarrassing yourself.

Riley is currently 21yrs 6mths old and has been lucky to play 10 AFL games, mostly during periods when Adelaide had a very long injury list.

To the same age, Mitchell had played 40 AFL games and was an established member of Hawthorn's best 22; Sewell had played around 18 games and would go on to play all 22 the following year; McLean had played 61 games and was well entrenched in Melbourne's best 22 from the age of 19; Tuck was a late bloomer, who hadn't even been drafted at Riley's age - but who would play more games in his 2nd season on Richmond's list than Riley has in 4 years on Adelaide's.

For every Mitchell, there are 100 Rileys who don't have the guns to make it.

 

[Vader]

Lyons doesn't have any 'weapons'.

I don't know how anyone could say he didn't have what it takes at AFL level as he hasn't been given enough opportunity. How many games has he played? 3?

How many games did Symes get before the club realised he was just a good sanfl player?

I've got no idea if Riley would make it but he needs to be given a chance based on his clearance/contested work and strong tackling, especially at the moment.

Lyons has weapons.. he just lacks pace. Whether his other weapons can make up for that deficiency, particularly in the high paced AFL competition, remains to be seen. Could go either way, but I do like what I saw of him when he was given an opportunity earlier in the year.

Symes played far too many games.

Riley has been on our list for 4 years and has never even been remotely close to becoming a best 22 player. The games he's played have mainly come when we've had double digit injury lists, indicating just how far down the pecking order he really is. Not every player who gets drafted goes on to have a successful AFL career. Some players will make it, some won't - I believe that Riley is very much in the latter group.

 

[Vader]

What weapons do you think he lacks?

Honestly haven't seen enough of Riley to form an opinion on him

Pace, skills, disposal... His weapons are tackling and a willingness to throw himself directly into harms way, under the bottom of the pack.

Right now we suck at tackling.. but we have plenty of in & under players who are considerably better all-rounders than him. What we lack are quality outside runners. At least Martin could fill a need.. he's definitely an "outside runner".. pity about the "quality".

 

[Cap]

You're not seriously trying to compare Riley with the likes of Sewell, Mitchell, McLean and Tuck ? Now you're just embarrassing yourself.

Riley is currently 21yrs 6mths old and has been lucky to play 10 AFL games, mostly during periods when Adelaide had a very long injury list.

To the same age, Mitchell had played 40 AFL games and was an established member of Hawthorn's best 22; Sewell had played around 18 games and would go on to play all 22 the following year; McLean had played 61 games and was well entrenched in Melbourne's best 22 from the age of 19; Tuck was a late bloomer, who hadn't even been drafted at Riley's age - but who would play more games in his 2nd season on Richmond's list than Riley has in 4 years on Adelaide's.

For every Mitchell, there are 100 Rileys who don't have the guns to make it.

So I guess the fact that the Hawks were shithouse in his first three years has nothing to do with the fact he got game time...

Riley may or may not have won/earned a nomination in the RS awards if he'd been given the same opportunity.

Now I realise that you are going to say he didn't earn it, but that is another argument.

The question you have to ask, is why the clubs needs to wait until a player is nearly 22 before deciding he isn't good enough, that is four seasons of footy - you would have thought a professional team would have had is sorted out well before then.

I'd also add, players are only as good as the opportunities they are provided (earnt or not).

You mentioned Martin, another player at 22 we haven't worked out - wtf is going on at AFC

 

[Vader]

So I guess the fact that the Hawks were shithouse in his first three years has nothing to do with the fact he got game time...

Riley may or may not have won/earned a nomination in the RS awards if he'd been given the same opportunity.

Now I realise that you are going to say he didn't earn it, but that is another argument.

The question you have to ask, is why the clubs needs to wait until a player is nearly 22 before deciding he isn't good enough, that is four seasons of footy - you would have thought a professional team would have had is sorted out well before then.

I'd also add, players are only as good as the opportunities they are provided (earnt or not).

You mentioned Martin, another player at 22 we haven't worked out - wtf is going on at AFC

Have you stopped to ask yourself why he hasn't had the same opportunities? Could it just be that he's not actually all that good a player?

The fact that almost all of his games have come when Adelaide has had double digit injury lists is a telling statistic. It says just how far down the pecking order he is. Translated another way.. there are an awful lot of players on Adelaide's list who are better than he is. And if there are that many on Adelaide's list who are better, what on earth makes you think he'd be good enough to win a RS nomination?

As for Hawthorn being shithouse in Mitchell's first 3 seasons.. have you had a long hard look at Adelaide's performances in 3 of the last 4 years? Adelaide have sucked very nearly as badly as Hawthorn did back then.. yet Riley still hasn't been able to break into the team.

I agree that you've asked a very good question there though. Why does it take so long for Adelaide to cull players who aren't up to scratch? I think Riley (and Martin) would have been gone a while ago were it not for the serial draft dodging that Adelaide have done over the last 4 years, which has resulted in a build-up of dead wood due to an unwillingness to participate in those drafts.

Adelaide has a bad habit of hanging onto players for far too long if they perform well in the SANFL, even if their chances of making it at the AFL level are remote at best. The club needs to be far more ruthless in culling these players.

 

[glengowan]

I have been surprised Riley hasn't been given a go earlier in the season. He is tenacious and extremely hard at it. Wins the ball in close as well as than any other player I've seen in the SANFL this year. Deserves a chance. If someone like Puopolo can become effective at AFL level, Riley certainly can.

 

[Cap]

Have you stopped to ask yourself why he hasn't had the same opportunities? Could it just be that he's not actually all that good a player?

The fact that almost all of his games have come when Adelaide has had double digit injury lists is a telling statistic. It says just how far down the pecking order he is. Translated another way.. there are an awful lot of players on Adelaide's list who are better than he is. And if there are that many on Adelaide's list who are better, what on earth makes you think he'd be good enough to win a RS nomination?

As for Hawthorn being shithouse in Mitchell's first 3 seasons.. have you had a long hard look at Adelaide's performances in 3 of the last 4 years? Adelaide have sucked very nearly as badly as Hawthorn did back then.. yet Riley still hasn't been able to break into the team.

I agree that you've asked a very good question there though. Why does it take so long for Adelaide to cull players who aren't up to scratch? I think Riley (and Martin) would have been gone a while ago were it not for the serial draft dodging that Adelaide have done over the last 4 years, which has resulted in a build-up of dead wood due to an unwillingness to participate in those drafts.

Adelaide has a bad habit of hanging onto players for far too long if they perform well in the SANFL, even if their chances of making it at the AFL level are remote at best. The club needs to be far more ruthless in culling these players.

Personally I think it is the mindset of the club, which I believe to be you must earn a game you are not gifted games*

Now I agree with the philosophy of the stance, gifting games isn't fair on anyone on the team, however it does remove the ability of the club to take a punt on a player - much like other teams do (generally against us).

I believe Riley hasn't got match time because the AFC believe that unlike other clubs, they want to bring in "perfect" players - you only have to look at the way we treat our younger players (many like yo'yos) who, whilst they have deficiencies, they are AFL deficiencies something they aren't going to get better at playing SANFL.

the philosophy then leads us to pick the best possible team for Rd x in year x, not the best team for the end of the year or for following year.

I'm not suggesting playing the kids at all cost, I',m suggesting that sometimes it is better to play the younger player over the mid tier player.

You mention that Lyons has no "weapon", I'd be interested, do you think players develop a "weapon" or a simply gifted one at birth?

*Tippet and Dangerfield the clear exceptions here.

 

[cmndstab]

Tippett counts as an exception, although in his case it really was a case of "best available" since our tall forward options were terrible at that point. He certainly didn't do enough to retain his spot for as long as he did in 08, however.

Dangerfield is a bit of a harsh call. He dominated the TAC Cup for a year, and performed very well in the SANFL in the few matches there. His only issue was not being fit enough in the preseason beforehand (which turned out to be due to injury anyway).

 

[Cap]

Tippett counts as an exception, although in his case it really was a case of "best available" since our tall forward options were terrible at that point. He certainly didn't do enough to retain his spot for as long as he did in 08, however.
Dangerfield is a bit of a harsh call. He dominated the TAC Cup for a year, and performed very well in the SANFL in the few matches there. His only issue was not being fit enough in the preseason beforehand (which turned out to be due to injury anyway).

perhaps.

But I still believe that young players at the Crows don't get the same opportunity as those at other clubs.Which results in us hanging onto players longer.

that being said, I don't have any statistical information to back that up, it is a proverbial " I feel it in my waters comment"

 

[chazwazza]

what happened to Graham ? didn't appear to play for sturt?

Also, anyone got an update on Lewis Johnston? injury says 6-8 weeks but didn't he do the injury a month or so ago?

Graham finished last weeks game on the bench with an ice pack on his leg so I'm guessing that Adelaide decided to rest him. Kurtze did a magnificent job as a lone ruckman for Sturt today.
Graham is showing signs of improvement.

 

[Mego Red]

Sam Mitchell was a good VFL player until his breakthrough 2003 season, when he was 21.

 

[NTRabbit]

Accumulates a lot of the ball, isn't very tall, isn't very fast, doesn't have a precise or penetrating kick, works very hard at the contested ball for a lot of tackles and 1%ers

Am I talking about Riley or Symes?