The scapegoat for this year?

[McCartney5]

Who will it be this year??

There has been so many of the years.. McCartney was one..

I have only put Porter in, in case he doesn't live up to expectations

 

[Byron'sShoulder]

Leigh Colbert the scapegoat in 2002.

it seems to be the case that the season after serious knee injuries, blokes are not quite at the top of their game. i hear that it can be a confidence thing, learning to trust that the knee will hold up under physical pressure - i don't know if this is true or not.

anyway, i reckon that both colbert and stevo will not be at their best (barring injury) until mid way through the season. by then, i reckon colbert will cop it. great bloke, has played some good games for us but i reckon he is perceived as not having earned his money since crossing from the cats.

given that colbert often gets roles down the middle of the field, i reckon any errors he does make have more potential to damage us and stick in the mind more readily than those that clayton may make out on his lonesome on the wing. (how vividly do you remember micky down on his haunches after ablett kicked that goal?)

colbert could shore up a bit of support for himself by bringing ms lewis to functions - surely that could appease a few people around the club

 

[McCartney5]

yes bring Tamsyn to watch training Leigh, the crowd would be that of a Grand Final training session

 

[DarkRider]

I think you need to get your eyes tested.

 

[Darky]

Shane Clayton - still haven't heard anyone say he can play football.

David Bourke - same, but we expect him to remain a *******, so he will disappoint no-one (except Pagan maybe)

Improvement will definitely be expected of Colbert. 2002 will be his third season since his knee reconstruction, and it's niggling minor injuries that have restricted him since. Another injury-interrupted year will have some people wondering if he was worth the reputed $350k a year he was signed for. Most people agree he CAN play, but the player's output might not match the club's input if it relates to 8-10 games a year several years in a row.

 

[Byron'sShoulder]

Darky

Darky - wasn't the knee injury Colbert sustained this year pretty serious? I was under the impression that it was. if not, please change the words "under the impression" to under the influence.

 

[Darky]

Wasn't a full reco job, was it?

I'm not downplaying the seriousness of (say) a 6-10 week knee injury, but unless it's a full reco I don't see why his preparation for 2002 would be too severely affected.

 

[DarkRider]

Originally posted by Darky

Improvement will definitely be expected of Colbert. ........... Most people agree he CAN play, but the player's output might not match the club's input if it relates to 8-10 games a year several years in a row.

McKernan got by on less for the last 5 years without too many people complaining!

 

[Yianni]

Well I don't know that the scapegoat can be Winnie...

He will either be delisted (in which case it would be a harsh man to blame him for our troubles!), or he will miss next season with injuries...

So it's probably not fair to include him on that list.

For me, I think Clayton. We're all familiar with bagging him already, so when season 2002 starts, we'll all settle back in without much trouble. Like when an old friend comes back from an extended holiday!

 

[The Hippie]

DR, you've actually grown a sense of humour since 'The' trade!!

 

[Shermanator]

So long as that weak gutted NTTAWWT Clayton is in a Royal Blue and White gurnsey he will get bagged week in week out!

I hope he reads some of the comments from BF and grows some balls over the summer, MAYBE then (and only then) will he get some credit from me.....

At least D. Bourke puts his toothpick body on the line!

 

[Briedis]

The only answer can be Colbert in that list and I think that is unfair.

Winnie, Clayton and Cochrane will probably be delisted and won't play. Porter is a quality player and will do his job. No expects Bourke to do anything anyway... so that just leaves Colbert.

 

[roowatch]

Briedis
What makes you (and many others) think that Clayton and Cochrane will be delisted? (other than wishful thinking?)

Both played nearly every game available in 2000. the match committee obviously have certain roles to be done by these players, and presumably they get close enough to filling this role to get a game every week.

My opinion is that Clayton gets treated more harshly by the fans than he deserves. Agreed, he does not display the same level of courage shown by most players, but he does run well up and down the wing, and manages to position himself well in dangerous positions (OK...the opposition just leave him alone thinking he won't do any damage). In fact there were many times last season when he ran into strong attacking positions and was ignored by team mates (Does that tell me something?) I would persevere.

Cochrane I am even less sure about. Quickish, surprisingly, and not scared, but waits for things to happen. Seems to lack any belief in his ability to play AFL... and maybe right!

Whatever. I seriously doubt either will be delisted.

 

[Darky]

Re : Cochrane and Clayton

20+ games, and the lack of rumours about them being trade bait, suggests they will stay on the senior list next year.

 

[great]

I find it hard to HONESTLY bag , criticise or make a scape goat out of persons who have done what I have never achieved.

I never had the chance to play VFL/AFL footy..Would have loved to do it.....

It is pretty easy to have a crack at certain players , it is pretty easy to say that so and so doesn't deserve a break.

I won't have a go at Shane Clayton , Cochrane , Colby , McKernan ,(Sorry couldn't resist with Calthorpe) ....

But they all have played the game at the highest level . An achievement that probably most of us envy. They have bragging rights , not us.

 

[66MunsterT]

Originally posted by Cororoo
I find it hard to HONESTLY bag , criticise or make a scape goat out of persons who have done what I have never achieved.

I never had the chance to play VFL/AFL footy..Would have loved to do it.....

It is pretty easy to have a crack at certain players , it is pretty easy to say that so and so doesn't deserve a break.

I won't have a go at Shane Clayton , Cochrane , Colby , McKernan ,(Sorry couldn't resist with Calthorpe) ....

But they all have played the game at the highest level . An achievement that probably most of us envy. They have bragging rights , not us.

DEAD RIGHT.

 

[Rooboy 96]

Originally posted by 66MunsterT



DEAD RIGHT.

I concur.........

 

[66MunsterT]

Originally posted by Rooboy 96


I concur.........

Thank you Rooboy 96.
This is the first time one of my posts has been agreed with.

 

[Briedis]

Originally posted by roowatch
Briedis
What makes you (and many others) think that Clayton and Cochrane will be delisted? (other than wishful thinking?)

Both played nearly every game available in 2000. the match committee obviously have certain roles to be done by these players, and presumably they get close enough to filling this role to get a game every week.

My opinion is that Clayton gets treated more harshly by the fans than he deserves. Agreed, he does not display the same level of courage shown by most players, but he does run well up and down the wing, and manages to position himself well in dangerous positions (OK...the opposition just leave him alone thinking he won't do any damage). In fact there were many times last season when he ran into strong attacking positions and was ignored by team mates (Does that tell me something?) I would persevere.

Cochrane I am even less sure about. Quickish, surprisingly, and not scared, but waits for things to happen. Seems to lack any belief in his ability to play AFL... and maybe right!

Whatever. I seriously doubt either will be delisted.

You are probably right actually. But I just get the feeling that both were given their chances last year to prove their worth to the club and failed. THat is the reason why I think they will be delisted, just a gut feeling I have about those two.

Personally, I am dissapointed with Clayton. He had a great year in 1999, but has not prodcued anything since. Pagan will probably persist with him for one more year.

Cochrane has had plenty of time and has NEVER shown the goods and would have to be in the running to get delisted.....

 

[King Corey]

Re Clayton - one of the things that stood out for mine was when Grant was interviewed after the 2nd Geelong game. He commented that players did their 'jobs' and singled out Shane Clayton as fulfilling his own role... Is his part something that would make more sense if Pagan explained to us what he was there to do?

Cochrane himself has said his lack of confidence his is biggest weakness. Talent aside, if he played like he thought he belongs - things might really look better for him. Hope so.

 

[Stucey]

colbert

 

[schimma_20]

Originally posted by King Corey
Re Clayton - one of the things that stood out for mine was when Grant was interviewed after the 2nd Geelong game. He commented that players did their 'jobs' and singled out Shane Clayton as fulfilling his own role... Is his part something that would make more sense if Pagan explained to us what he was there to do?

Cochrane himself has said his lack of confidence his is biggest weakness. Talent aside, if he played like he thought he belongs - things might really look better for him. Hope so.

l was talking to David King near the end of the year and he said that Clayton is a very important part of our team.Which part i'm not sure of.

 

[DarkRider]

Originally posted by Cororoo
I find it hard to HONESTLY bag , criticise or make a scape goat out of persons who have done what I have never achieved.

I never had the chance to play VFL/AFL footy..Would have loved to do it.....

It is pretty easy to have a crack at certain players , it is pretty easy to say that so and so doesn't deserve a break.

I won't have a go at Shane Clayton , Cochrane , Colby , McKernan ,(Sorry couldn't resist with Calthorpe) ....

But they all have played the game at the highest level . An achievement that probably most of us envy. They have bragging rights , not us.

So if I'm unhappy with the job the painter did on my house, I can't say anything because I haven't done it myself ?
And a judge cannot possibly pass judgement on a criminal if he hasn't been one himself ?
And we can expect all journalists and commentators who haven't played senior football to resign next week ?
What kind of 'logic' is that ?

The only area where we should temper our criticisms is in the comments on courage. In my opinion, anyone who takes the field in AFL has courage. Some more than others, but all have courage.

 

[great]

Originally posted by DarkRider


So if I'm unhappy with the job the painter did on my house, I can't say anything because I haven't done it myself ?
And a judge cannot possibly pass judgement on a criminal if he hasn't been one himself ?
And we can expect all journalists and commentators who haven't played senior football to resign next week ?
What kind of 'logic' is that ?



Didn't think you would understand.
In simple terms , bagging players is easy.
No skill is required.
You are correct that playing AFL footy takes courage.It also takes a high degree of skill ,fitness and dedication.

The players that are bagged constantly or scapegoated did not get where they are out of luck.

They have put in the hard yards and deserve a bit of respect as a result.

I think some of us expect North Melbourne to field a side of 20 All Australian standard players week in week out .

 

[Briedis]

Originally posted by Cororoo

I think some of us expect North Melbourne to field a side of 20 All Australian standard players week in week out .

A bit of an overstatement, but I do expect that the Roos put out a competitive side and I do get frustrated when they continue to put under-achievers into the side.

A bloke like Cochrane has been at the club a long time and has never stepped up to the level required to play AFL. Perhaps he is good enough etc, but it is not happening for him at North. It is time for him to move on to another environment IMO.

I believe that supporters have every right to scrutinize the team they follow if they wish. We put so much time and passion into supporting that it would not be natural if we were not dissapointed by players who continually make mistakes.