The Teague Delay

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therubbernub

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Mar 1, 2005
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Good thread.
Best example is Marc Pittonet.
You can visually see an increase in aggression and effort from him in the 2nd quarter onwards. And that is incredibly frustrating.
Why the f**k do our players not bring that determination from the first bounce of the game. It’s got to be mental and it’s a worry as it tells me these players go in with a mindset that they’ll simply “warm into it”.
Let’s not fool ourselves. The comeback was flattering. Imagine if it was a top 4 team we were playing.
Melbourne is a very very good football team
 

therubbernub

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Obviously our slow starts are a major concern, but the match day coaching, players buying into the coaches message seem to get through.......eventually. Hence our continued comebacks.
I’m more concerned about the development of our young players.
With all the high draft picks we’ve had we should be doing much better.
Look at Kangaroos, Shaw has them playing competitive tough footy from day one without the luxury of all the high picks.
Shits me to tears that we’ve had no spike in improvement like other clubs have.
Even GC.......ffs
Oh but we have......
 

__Bobcat__

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Sep 28, 2013
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__Bobcat__ said:
Okay, pull the players out and put the coaches in then.

its not a marathon are you run against yourself,
your playing against another team.
@happydude
That's some stupid logic To put the coaches on the field.

If you don't think conditioning and mental preparation for games isn't responsiblity of the coaching staff you know 0 about professional sports.

Not much anyone can do to help you understand that besides tell you to research sports psychology. For this even a Google search will help you.

My reply to you. happydude
It looks you and your lurking likers, Have been living under a rock for the last 3 months.
Have you heard about the New Afl soft cap. There is no money anymore for Sports Psychology.
Plenty of People have lost there jobs in the football industry. even the poor old Boot studders, or property stewards.

You say i no 0 about professional sports, you could be right.
How ever i do know how to get up for a contest.
When a team gets a run on like that Put some bloody physical pressure on FFS, Start a Rumble do something.

And by the way to save you typing in AFL Soft cap rules into your favoured search engine, I've included link below.
 
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ESKIE

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Feb 28, 2009
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I know everybody is scoffing at the two comebacks from the first two rounds, but they have to be taken into account. Last years premiers gave up a 52 point lead, and if JSOS and Paddy had converted their shots we would have been a goal down with momentum. Last night the over rated D's gave up a 42 point lead, and had Cripps kicked one more, Jack didn't hit the post and Eddie converted the soda (And McGov had scored ANYTHING) we would be all very chuffed and happily sitting in the mix undefeated!
In Any Given Sunday Al Pacino described his game as a game of inches, and the analogy holds in our game too. If you are prepared to fight and scrap for that inch, you win games, if you don't, you loose the close winnable ones. We currently are scrambling for those inches, and getting closer.
Teague continues to "back the boys" and so he should, they are obviously the fittest team going around as they continue coming, but as everyone (and I reckon it is THE conversation at the club right Now) has identified the first quarters must be fixed. We don't have to win, just not be too far off the opposition at quarter time because our fitness alone should see us home.
Next week in Geelong throw the pace onto the wings, the narrow ground should play the wings like the middle of Flemington, a fast corridor either side. Williamson and Jack Martin. We can afford to go a little slower in the guts as Selwood, Dangerfield and Duncan/Guthrie are not quick. Cripps, Ed, JSOS, Samo, Gibbo would fight for those inches. I'd play both Murphy and Walsh as high forwards, Geelong wouldn't be expecting that.
Next week is eminently winnable, as long as the whole team are prepared to fight for those inches from the get go and the coaching staff go on the offensive straight away and are willing to react immediately to any Geelong counter move.
It's one of those games where it's more likely that an upset occurs, simply because it's considered to be a foregone conclusion.
:thumbsu::thumbsu:
 

Yubby

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Dec 20, 2008
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48% of our total points against have come in the 2 first quarters. 44 and 32 points of our 159 against. Definitely agree that there is a problem with our starts. The positive is that across the other 6 quarters we average 13.8 points against. That's a pretty awesome second stat that showcases our improvement.
 

Michael Jezz

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Jan 30, 2007
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I think you will find if Carlton Starts well, the lack of midfield depth will mean it gets over run.
I think the starting problem is a mix of being switched on and personnel.
The criticism in the coaching staff is it is hard to identify a mitigation strategy to provide midfield depth like
running SPS, Kennedy, Silvagni, Gibbons, Cunningham, Docherty, Setterfield in their for longer periods
IT may even be 30 minute game time each but that gives us an extra player and half of game time in the middle
Who knows with rotating them through there, we might unearth a permanent midfielder
 

Beast__Mode

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Anything to do with team performance which forms a pattern over time is a coaching issue to address.

Teague and co need to look at the links of the chain and divine where it’s going wrong. Do they need to change up some element of the Immediate pregame prep? Are they getting something wrong in the initial lineup? Is there something happening earlier in the week’s preparation which isn’t priming the players adequately. Is Teague & co themselves just getting it wrong with how they set the week’s game plan?

This club has exhausted me beyond the point of engaging in a weekly coaching evaluation but since the first game Teague has been in charge this has been a glaring issue and we simply don’t have the talent to bridge the gap poor preparation routinely places in front of us.

I’ve got no idea about the preparation side, but I think it might be time to pick the Starting midfield lineup based on intensity rather than experience. Murphy and Curnow are getting overwhelmed and provide little physical pressure. Gibbons should be given a run in there. I wouldn’t mind Martin getting in there as well. Even JSOS would offer some physical presence and smarts. The opposition essentially do whatever they like the first 45 minutes of any game we play and it’s on Teague to find out the solution.
 

Bluebag13

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Jul 30, 2017
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Anything to do with team performance which forms a pattern over time is a coaching issue to address.

Teague and co need to look at the links of the chain and divine where it’s going wrong. Do they need to change up some element of the Immediate pregame prep? Are they getting something wrong in the initial lineup? Is there something happening earlier in the week’s preparation which isn’t priming the players adequately. Is Teague & co themselves just getting it wrong with how they set the week’s game plan?

This club has exhausted me beyond the point of engaging in a weekly coaching evaluation but since the first game Teague has been in charge this has been a glaring issue and we simply don’t have the talent to bridge the gap poor preparation routinely places in front of us.

I’ve got no idea about the preparation side, but I think it might be time to pick the Starting midfield lineup based on intensity rather than experience. Murphy and Curnow are getting overwhelmed and provide little physical pressure. Gibbons should be given a run in there. I wouldn’t mind Martin getting in there as well. Even JSOS would offer some physical presence and smarts. The opposition essentially do whatever they like the first 45 minutes of any game we play and it’s on Teague to find out the solution.
I really wouldnt be opposed to a starting centre group for next weeks game of Pittonet, Cripps, JSOS, Martin. Say the first 10mins. There is certainly enough class, power and intensity in that group. Then once tone has been set go to our normal midfield rotations.
 

dumb

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Jul 12, 2008
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slow starts have been around for a lot longer than teague. we seem to be able to come back into the game at least. even under bolton we could come back, but it would be a grind whereas now there seems to be a lot more momentum behind us.

hard enough trying to win from 6 goals down even without our historically poor kicking for goal. we have been poor shots at goal for what seems like a decade.
everyone busts their gut getting it forward while the kicker treats a shot on goal like a luxury. i kicked for goal, i missed, i tried. i did my bit. no.
 

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teagueyubeauty

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I think Teague is a bit too chilled at times, great asset to have when the game is going as it allows your brain to think logically and efficiently.
I have a feeling the lack of visual intensity is his modus operandi and the way he rolls normally, I don’t know as I don’t see him pregame but if that’s how he is pregame then I think he needs to bring intensity in spades.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 

F_therest

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Oct 3, 2013
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48% of our total points against have come in the 2 first quarters. 44 and 32 points of our 159 against. Definitely agree that there is a problem with our starts. The positive is that across the other 6 quarters we average 13.8 points against. That's a pretty awesome second stat that showcases our improvement.
I guess we are starting from so far back it's almost a case of one thing at a time.

To fight back like we have this year and a number of games last year shows great resilience and shows that best is good enough...we were the better team on the weekend for 3 quarters.

Now, if we can just solve this first quarter issue we could actually be a pretty good footy team.
 

F_therest

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Oct 3, 2013
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Anything to do with team performance which forms a pattern over time is a coaching issue to address.

Teague and co need to look at the links of the chain and divine where it’s going wrong. Do they need to change up some element of the Immediate pregame prep? Are they getting something wrong in the initial lineup? Is there something happening earlier in the week’s preparation which isn’t priming the players adequately. Is Teague & co themselves just getting it wrong with how they set the week’s game plan?

This club has exhausted me beyond the point of engaging in a weekly coaching evaluation but since the first game Teague has been in charge this has been a glaring issue and we simply don’t have the talent to bridge the gap poor preparation routinely places in front of us.

I’ve got no idea about the preparation side, but I think it might be time to pick the Starting midfield lineup based on intensity rather than experience. Murphy and Curnow are getting overwhelmed and provide little physical pressure. Gibbons should be given a run in there. I wouldn’t mind Martin getting in there as well. Even JSOS would offer some physical presence and smarts. The opposition essentially do whatever they like the first 45 minutes of any game we play and it’s on Teague to find out the solution.
I'd also be keen to see Gibbons and Martin in the centre stoppages a little more...these two are both tenacious. However if they haven't trained there much in the pre-season it's a tough ask to expect that combination to be successful straight up...centre square stoppage combinations take time and should be developed in the pre-season. You'd think Teague has trialed different combos.

Not sure i'd agree Curnow provides little physical pressure...he's a big bodied mid and is known for his workrate and physicality...though i'd say he was a bit down vs Melbourne. But then so was Cripps who didn't do anything particularly aggressive either and was part of that centre square demolition in the 1st. Murphy on the other hand i think should be on the wing...he's still got the running ability and skills so he'd kill it starting out there. Thing is seems the MC doesn't have much confidence in anyone else.

Having said that, that same combination of Cripps/Curnow/Murphy got on top over the last 3 quarters of the game so...they have the ability.
 

Yubby

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I'd also be keen to see Gibbons and Martin in the centre stoppages a little more...these two are both tenacious. However if they haven't trained there much in the pre-season it's a tough ask to expect that combination to be successful straight up...centre square stoppage combinations take time and should be developed in the pre-season. You'd think Teague has trialed different combos.

Not sure i'd agree Curnow provides little physical pressure...he's a big bodied mid and is known for his workrate and physicality...though i'd say he was a bit down vs Melbourne. But then so was Cripps who didn't do anything particularly aggressive either and was part of that centre square demolition in the 1st. Murphy on the other hand i think should be on the wing...he's still got the running ability and skills so he'd kill it starting out there. Thing is seems the MC doesn't have much confidence in anyone else.

Having said that, that same combination of Cripps/Curnow/Murphy got on top over the last 3 quarters of the game so...they have the ability.
The 3rd and 4th actually featured Setterfield quite a bit and then Cuningham a few times as well. I think Cripps was struggling so they left him forward and rotated others in there with Ed.
 

TheCoach16

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I’ve always been of the belief that coaches get way too much credit, and way too much blame.
I’ve coached premiership sides and wooden spooners. My ability to coach, good, bad, or otherwise never changed. I think teams make coaches, not the other way around (with some notable exceptions).

But when a team develops a bad habit, when a pattern of behaviour/performance becomes glaringly obvious, it is a coach/coaching issue.

But what can they do? How does the coach/coaches rectify this issue? Across the AFL, and even at local level to some degree, the big rev up, the ra ra ra, the emotional inspirational pregame address has been replaced by process, tactics, set up, transition, method, and so on.
Bringing back the big pregame speech might work for a game or two, but it’s not sustainable. So that’s not the answer.

Then what is? What can Teague and his team do?...
I’d put it back on the players. Ask them. Involve them. Include them in finding the answer.
I’d be asking what they think will work. What do they need/want to fix this.

Earlier arrival time? Later arrival time? More/less physical warm up? A greater focus on group, or more autonomous approach? Get them to figure it out.

It’s the players who are starting slowly. Ask them what they need to NOT start slowly.
 
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J-dog

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Good thread.
Best example is Marc Pittonet.
You can visually see an increase in aggression and effort from him in the 2nd quarter onwards. And that is incredibly frustrating.
Why the f**k do our players not bring that determination from the first bounce of the game. It’s got to be mental and it’s a worry as it tells me these players go in with a mindset that they’ll simply “warm into it”.
Let’s not fool ourselves. The comeback was flattering. Imagine if it was a top 4 team we were playing.
Agree, but imagine if we had our crowds from last year cheering us on...
Wouldn't that be massive!
 

J-dog

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We play like we’re scared to lose until the game is lost, then we get within striking distance and do it all over again.

It’s so predictable that I picked it before the first bounce.
This.
When we have nothing to lose we settle, then out work and dominate our opponents.
Seems we need composure and a killer instinct.
Don't think we would see this negative trend then
 

J-dog

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It's all excuses mate. Every ******* year, every ******* game.

Even when the game is there to be won we fluff gimme shots at goal or make dumb decisions.
.
Made those bad decisions and poor shots on goal all game.
Just watched it again, we burned forwards alone in space on at least 7 occasions by my count from the start of the game all the way through, and most entries were very poor anyway.
Our coach is barely 10 games in.
Let's see what he can get them to do over the whole season without further interruption.
 

J-dog

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Anything to do with team performance which forms a pattern over time is a coaching issue to address.

Teague and co need to look at the links of the chain and divine where it’s going wrong. Do they need to change up some element of the Immediate pregame prep? Are they getting something wrong in the initial lineup? Is there something happening earlier in the week’s preparation which isn’t priming the players adequately. Is Teague & co themselves just getting it wrong with how they set the week’s game plan?

This club has exhausted me beyond the point of engaging in a weekly coaching evaluation but since the first game Teague has been in charge this has been a glaring issue and we simply don’t have the talent to bridge the gap poor preparation routinely places in front of us.

I’ve got no idea about the preparation side, but I think it might be time to pick the Starting midfield lineup based on intensity rather than experience. Murphy and Curnow are getting overwhelmed and provide little physical pressure. Gibbons should be given a run in there. I wouldn’t mind Martin getting in there as well. Even JSOS would offer some physical presence and smarts. The opposition essentially do whatever they like the first 45 minutes of any game we play and it’s on Teague to find out the solution.
The Dees came to play.
Let's see what happens when the best ruckman in the game isn't giving some of the best mids in the game silver service.
 

Beast__Mode

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The Dees came to play.
Let's see what happens when the best ruckman in the game isn't giving some of the best mids in the game silver service.
and the Brisbane game last year, and the Bulldogs game last year, and Richmond this year? You can pluck an excuse for all of them or accept there’s a clear pattern of the team not being prepared to perform from the first bounce.

Anyway this not the year to get worked up over football. Let’s just hope they switch on earlier next week.
 

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