Current The Western Australian Current Trials Thread

[Kurve]

It's alright I found it. meh

The error was found last year but the wrongly convicted man was only told last week. Outrageous would be an understatement.

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/dna-debacle-ng-b88456639z

 

[GreyCrow]

So many things wrong with that. While I dont think it will impact any trial in relation to the Claremont murders it does put doubt into the public mind.

My biggest concern is the person being 'convinced' to plead guilty. That he got a suspended sentence suggests there may have been some initial doubts as well.

 

[sprockets]

It's alright I found it. meh

The error was found last year but the wrongly convicted man was only told last week. Outrageous would be an understatement.

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/dna-debacle-ng-b88456639z

"The West Australian revealed last month that PathWest had been forced to sack one of its leading scientists, Laurance Webb, after an investigation uncovered several issues with his work, including evidence that he had fabricated quality assurance test results."

DNA evidence isn't infallible, therefore someone shouldn't be convicted on DNA alone. Something else has gone on here. Having said that, if my DNA was supposedly found somewhere that I'd never been I certainly wouldn't be pleading guilty.

 

[Bunnie]

Victimology
All of a type : blonde mid 20s
Timeline/Opportunity
Public Holidays means more people out and about letting their hair down as they have the extra day to recover, which gives cover to stalker

Public holidays also means a telecom/telstra tech saying he was oncall for work on long weekend would not raise any suspicions at all. Good cover.

 

[sprockets]

So many things wrong with that. While I dont think it will impact any trial in relation to the Claremont murders it does put doubt into the public mind.

My biggest concern is the person being 'convinced' to plead guilty. That he got a suspended sentence suggests there may have been some initial doubts as well.

Or the crime wasn't as serious as the newspaper is making out.

 

[GreyCrow]

Or the crime wasn't as serious as the newspaper is making out.

Says Home Invasion. He must have had some form somewhere as his DNA was in the system. I wonder if he had DV convictions leading the court officers to assume a high likelihood of guilt etc.

All speculation but you would think if your DNA was on file for ie common assault (street fight) you would argue you lost your temper one time but doesn't mean you do Home Invasions.

There are also many alibis etc. I was elsewhere , I was there earlier, etc. I would have asked for another test

 

[Bunnie]

Says Home Invasion. He must have had some form somewhere as his DNA was in the system. I wonder if he had DV convictions leading the court officers to assume a high likelihood of guilt etc.

All speculation but you would think if your DNA was on file for ie common assault (street fight) you would argue you lost your temper one time but doesn't mean you do Home Invasions.

There are also many alibis etc. I was elsewhere , I was there earlier, etc. I would have asked for another test

Maybe this person was someone who indulged in substances and honestly could not remember if it was him or not, with the possibility it could have been him given a prior history of naughty things.

 

[Dan Baker]

A man and a woman were seen not long after Julie Cutler left. They were asked to come forward but they didn't.

Julie was stalked along Stirling highway 7 kilometres prior. He car ran off the road. Julie did not recognise car or driver as an ex boyfriend etc. Julies flat was broken into.

Wasn't Julies event a staff party for the Parmelia hotel? Would the hotel staff not know that these two were not staff at a staff party?

Who could these two, male and female be? Could there be a woman involved in CSK we don't know about?

 

[GreyCrow]

No, because Julie Cutler is not a victim of the CSK

 

[Power Raid]

I'd prefer to stick to the known links to CSK

 

[Dan Baker]

It will be interesting to see what description was given to police by hotel staff to police about the couple that left behind Julie.

It will be interesting to see what description/information Julie Cutler gave to police and to Julies father.

 

[Dan Baker]

I'd prefer to stick to the known links to CSK

It has been said in the media before that Julie may have been the first victim to CSK. For reasons we probably haven't been informed of yet. We have been given the information about the account of the vehicle, or the person driving. We haven't been given the account of the people seen leaving the hotel by Parmelia staff that obviously didn't know the two at the staff party that left behind Julie.

No, because Julie Cutler is not a victim of the CSK

Do you have a source for that? Or is that wild speculation?

 

[Power Raid]

It has been said in the media before that Julie may have been the first victim to CSK. For reasons we probably haven't been informed of yet. We have been given the information about the account of the vehicle, or the person driving. We haven't been given the account of the people seen leaving the hotel by Parmelia staff that obviously didn't know the two at the staff party that left behind Julie.



Do you have a source for that? Or is that wild speculation?

I hear you but this is a WA's current trials thread not a CSK thread. Thus prefer to err on the side of caution to not have the thread closed or invite the Sleuth angle which mods are very sensitive to.

 

[Dan Baker]

There is no reason to have a thread closed about a woman who was regarded as the first victim in a current investigation that is in the throws of trial.

Julie was stalked down Stirling highway, the abduction point of other alleged victims. Julie has given both description of the incident. Julies father and police are privie to the information and articles have stated that the family want questions answered.

If the Parmelia couple matches the description. If the vehicle report matches description. Police must have a pretty good idea now. Julie Cutler lived in Freo. Julie Cutler went tot he same school as two of the victims. There is more than one school on Stirling highway and none the victims are from them.

Julies family said they will revisit the case once the current trial is squared away.

Police don't have a body, as they don't Sarah, so the police wont be including these cases in the current trial. Police are just focused on a conviction.

After that, pending a conviction, police will build another case with the chance of finding bodies in ready for the possibility of someone getting out.

If we exclude, Julie, we can exclude Sarah. But then there is Kerry too... Police have a body, but one stage at a time.

This all pertains to a current trial.

 

[Power Raid]

There is no reason to have a thread closed about a woman who was regarded as the first victim in a current investigation that is in the throws of trial.

Julie was stalked down Stirling highway, the abduction point of other alleged victims. Julie has given both description of the incident. Julies father and police are privie to the information and articles have stated that the family want questions answered.

If the Parmelia couple matches the description. If the vehicle report matches description. Police must have a pretty good idea now. Julie Cutler lived in Freo. Julie Cutler went tot he same school as two of the victims. There is more than one school on Stirling highway and none the victims are from them.

Julies family said they will revisit the case once the current trial is squared away.

Police don't have a body, as they don't Sarah, so the police wont be including these cases in the current trial. Police are just focused on a conviction.

After that, pending a conviction, police will build another case with the chance of finding bodies in ready for the possibility of someone getting out.

If we exclude, Julie, we can exclude Sarah. But then there is Kerry too... Police have a body, but one stage at a time.

This all pertains to a current trial.

oh and the school thing is easy to consider many links...........you bang one private school girl and because of the clicky nature of the western suburbs you meet loads more. Not only do you have a source of roots but in the case of CSK a source of victims.

His first wife owned a restaurant in mosman and perhaps met her through his activities out that way.

This suggests to me he had a reason to be in the western suburbs like his apprenticeship/ job with Telstra or even a relative working out that way. Maybe even part time work at a computer store or similar.

 

[GreyCrow]

I have excluded Julie Cutler for a few reasons. I understand that the police did initially link Julie to the current case but I am allowed to disagree

Timeline , 1988. Yes I am excluding the current charged based on age and offending profile. I am also excluding based on gap between known offending , recognizing the possibility if it was of others.

Methodology. In the 3 known and recognized instances , and also including the Karakatta assault, each victim was taken from the street or targeted in clubs. As far as I am aware none had vehicles. Julie Cutler and Sarah McMahon both had and were abducted from their vehicles or the vehicles were used.

Link: I am going to suggest the police originally linked Julie Cutler as a victim when the previous HIGHLY surveilled suspect was the target. ie his age profile fit.

I am happy to be proven wrong and for someone to be charged and for the bodies to be found but I cant think of a good reason to include Julie Cutler to the current charged person.

 

[Kurve]

I have excluded Julie Cutler for a few reasons. I understand that the police did initially link Julie to the current case but I am allowed to disagree

Timeline , 1988. Yes I am excluding the current charged based on age and offending profile. I am also excluding based on gap between known offending , recognizing the possibility if it was of others.

Methodology. In the 3 known and recognized instances , and also including the Karakatta assault, each victim was taken from the street or targeted in clubs. As far as I am aware none had vehicles. Julie Cutler and Sarah McMahon both had and were abducted from their vehicles or the vehicles were used.

Link: I am going to suggest the police originally linked Julie Cutler as a victim when the previous HIGHLY surveilled suspect was the target. ie his age profile fit.

I am happy to be proven wrong and for someone to be charged and for the bodies to be found but I cant think of a good reason to include Julie Cutler to the current charged person.

Happy to prove a link between LW and BRE early days, I think that might solve a couple of cross over issues I have and relax my frown lines somewhat.

 

[GreyCrow]

Happy to prove a link between LW and BRE early days, I think that might solve a couple of cross over issues I have and relax my frown lines somewhat.

Are you willing to expand on this?

 

[Kurve]

Says Home Invasion. He must have had some form somewhere as his DNA was in the system. I wonder if he had DV convictions leading the court officers to assume a high likelihood of guilt etc.

I don't think he had priors because this wrongful conviction is reported as limiting his employment opportunities.

 

[GreyCrow]

I don't think he had priors because this wrongful conviction is reported as limiting his employment opportunities.

Then how did they have his DNA on file?

 

[Kurve]

Then how did they have his DNA on file?

Very good question because his DNA is only supposed to be on file if he's convicted of a serious crime. Could they have said they used DNA collected in the CSK case for example or elsewhere? Or is it possible his DNA wasn't actually anywhere in their files?

Quote:
He received a suspended jail sentence and had a criminal conviction recorded against his name, which has since affected his ability to apply for certain jobs such as mine work.
Attorney-General John Quigley yesterday said he was first notified of the bungle on Friday and immediately asked the corruption watchdog to investigate the case.

Implying no criminal conviction.

 

[Kurve]

Then how did they have his DNA on file?

Maybe we should find out the name of the lawyer who threw his hands up in the air and told him to plead guilty? He might need a savage reprimand and a suspension from practice.

 

[Dan Baker]

I don't think he had priors because this wrongful conviction is reported as limiting his employment opportunities.

Did I read Quigley say mining?

LW was stalking the Bayview block in his car with precision.

 

[Dan Baker]

oh and the school thing is easy to consider many links...........you bang one private school girl and because of the clicky nature of the western suburbs you meet loads more. Not only do you have a source of roots but in the case of CSK a source of victims.

His first wife owned a restaurant in mosman and perhaps met her through his activities out that way.

This suggests to me he had a reason to be in the western suburbs like his apprenticeship/ job with Telstra or even a relative working out that way. Maybe even part time work at a computer store or similar.

That has to be established. But considering the amount of schools the number is there. I think he met Jane around the daycare a time before.
The building iwith electric plans in newspaper was same street.

I think Jane knew him maybe not entirely personally. There appears a relationship with Claremont.

At this point his relationship was in the throws of collapse 1997? The French restaurant was in Mosman park. He may have worked there.
Cutler was down that end in Freo.
Maybe he has them at a place like

The cable guy would have been everywhere daily. We are yet to hear of a second job or Kareakatta reltionship at trial.
French eatery so they know his face.

He may have met them before. He would have done say 500 businesses a year.
Hes just picked them out along the way.

 

[Kurve]

That has to be established. But considering the amount of schools the number is there. I think he met Jane around the daycare a time before.
The building iwith electric plans in newspaper was same street.

I think Jane knew him maybe not entirely personally. There appears a relationship with Claremont.

At this point his relationship was in the throws of collapse 1997? The restaurant was in ***********. He may have worked there.
Cutler was down that end in Freo.
Maybe he has them at a place like

The cable guy would have been everywhere daily. We are yet to hear of a second job or Kareakatta reltionship at trial.
eatery so they know his face.

He may have met them before. He would have done say 500 businesses a year.
Hes just picked them out along the way.

So many coincidences around this thing it's difficult to know where they stop and something else begins towards a solid understanding.