Secondary Thinking about becoming a teacher

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What mum tells me about the workplace culture amongst the staff at her school kind of puts me off ever wanting to work at one.

It sounds like sucking up to superiors, snitching on each other for the smallest things, bullying and talking about others behind their backs is a regular occurrence.
 
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Kram said:
What mum tells me about the workplace culture amongst the staff at her school kind of puts me off ever wanting to work at one.

It sounds like sucking up to superiors, snitching on each other for the smallest things, bullying and talking about others behind their backs is a regular occurrence.
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Lol thats any workplace not just schools.

Having said that my school is pretty good. Alot good actually
 
Shell said:
But how? In your own house i dont understand sorry.
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They are under guardianship of the minister. Taken away from unfit parents/foster parents.
No doubt every state is different but essentially there are given a house in the community or placed in a facility with other young people and have carers 24/7. Cooking, cleaning, teaching life skills etc.
 
Shell said:
Nah i doubt it. Not in maths anyway thats for sure.

Nope no dip ed. Have 13 years experience as an integration aide, and have certs there. And completed some uni in another area but didnt actually complete my degree. Which will hurt me i know.
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Sorry to interject, may I ask what certs you have that are relevant/helpful to being an aide? :)
 
Jack Richards said:
Yep. Our school has the "Yes" people like most. They tend to be given more work amd roles which are great but often unpaid additionals.
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The best tip i can give re. working in a school. Is just keep your head down, do your job and keep quiet. The quiet ones get away with anything anyway :)


And dont gossip. Like I dont mean "argh the fking principal wtf was he banging on about in the GSM" thats just venting. I mean really nasty, gossip. I avoid that stuff.
 
Jack Richards said:
Yep. Our school has the "Yes" people like most. They tend to be given more work amd roles which are great but often unpaid additionals.
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I've found the opposite in the schools I've worked at. The ones that put their hand up for extra work do a lot of unpaid work but are far, far more proficient and more capable than those that sit back and dont take extra on. They are generally lazy, less committed to the job and blockers to successful change and improvement. The cancer of a school. Maybe primary is different.
 

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Hard Ball Get said:
I've found the opposite in the schools I've worked at. The ones that put their hand up for extra work do a lot of unpaid work but are far, far more proficient and more capable than those that sit back and dont take extra on. They are generally lazy, less committed to the job and blockers to successful change and improvement. The cancer of a school. Maybe primary is different.
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Agree to an extent that some are lazy. But in my school many are parents who cant afford that extra time on work. I know if the role I took next year was in the classroom with a full classroom load, I would be more reluctant as I have a young family.
 
Jack Richards said:
Agree to an extent that some are lazy. But in my school many are parents who cant afford that extra time on work. I know if the role I took next year was in the classroom with a full classroom load, I would be more reluctant as I have a young family.
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I get the family argument but it's not really valid. It is no different to any other industry with a high workload. I myself have a 1 and 3 year old. I just chose to work through my lunch and try and work 7.30-5.30. It means I dont spend any time in the staff room and the kids know where to find me if needed during recess/lunch. When I go home I don't open my laptop. I spend a few hours with the kids and go from there. I do a few hours every couple of weekends to catch up on any planning I don't get to through the week. Nothing is more infuriating to me than a handballer at work or someone who has been teaching for 10+ years and hasn't taken on any extra roles - almost all I've come across aren't that great in the classroom and are there for a pay check and holidays. The kind resistant to being observed or giving students a voice. The good prins call them out or at the least givet them a shitty role to get them applying out.
 
I've done a lot of extra duties in the past but have cut back a lot this year due to doing my PhD.
 
Hard Ball Get said:
I've found the opposite in the schools I've worked at. The ones that put their hand up for extra work do a lot of unpaid work but are far, far more proficient and more capable than those that sit back and dont take extra on. They are generally lazy, less committed to the job and blockers to successful change and improvement. The cancer of a school. Maybe primary is different.
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I've seen it the opposite. The ones taking on the extra roles are usually self-motivated by career building. They are the refugees of the classroom. Looking for promotions and time release to get away from the classroom as much as possible. In the meantime their career boosting "programs of change" are usually nothing more than reinventing the wheel. Which of course creates change blockers, because it's all change that experienced teachers have seen before and just adds layers of admin to an already busy schedule. No one wants to have to document their worth as a teacher to help boost someone else's career. It's becoming less collegiate and more adversarial. No wonder so many are leaving the profession.
 
Deliverance said:
I've seen it the opposite. The ones taking on the extra roles are usually self-motivated by career building. They are the refugees of the classroom. Looking for promotions and time release to get away from the classroom as much as possible. In the meantime their career boosting "programs of change" are usually nothing more than reinventing the wheel. Which of course creates change blockers, because it's all change that experienced teachers have seen before and just adds layers of admin to an already busy schedule. No one wants to have to document their worth as a teacher to help boost someone else's career. It's becoming less collegiate and more adversarial. No wonder so many are leaving the profession.
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There are those looking for time out of the classroom, but we are talking about additional roles to a full teaching load.

Not sure what system you're in but the secondary system is in drastic need of an overhaul, you dont need to document your worth as a teacher, you just have to show it.
 
Kram said:
What mum tells me about the workplace culture amongst the staff at her school kind of puts me off ever wanting to work at one.

It sounds like sucking up to superiors, snitching on each other for the smallest things, bullying and talking about others behind their backs is a regular occurrence.
Click to expand...
Currently finishing a contract working as a teacher at a school with a polarising reputation for staff treatment I have actually experienced that.
 
I'm a high school teacher, hitting 5-6 years in the job, retraining after bouncing around from job to job. I started a term into 2014 and spent terms 2-4 as casual. Got a 12 month temp gig the next year, then a permanent position the next year. Surprised I got permanency that fast, but there you go.

First of all, if you want a better chance of becoming a permanent teacher quicker, they are crying out for anyone trained in maths, science and my area, TAS. If you're in NSW and want to work in the public system, there are scholarships available in those areas to get qualifications in those areas.

However, you will be required to go to a school that they send you to. IIRC, you don't get a choice, and more than likely, you could be sent out west. The country isn't so bad though. Western Sydney on the other hand......well, here's my little tale of self-inflicted pain.

The school I was at before transferring to my current school wasn't too bad, but there were people higher up that were giving me the shits, plus the goalposts kept on changing - basically, they thought we should be outdoing a nearby specialist CAPA school in CAPA by giving more resources to CAPA. Plus, being a country kid, I wanted out of Sydney (but not too far out), so when I became eligible for a transfer, I put in for one. BIG MISTAKE.

I made a mistake on the transfer form, and accidentally put western Sydney higher up the list than it should have. The way the transfer form works, it's fairly easy to make that mistake as you jump back and forward between pages. Sure enough, because there are bugger all TAS teachers out anywhere, I get transferred to a fairly redneck part of western Sydney. I can't reject the transfer, you lose your job.

BIG MISTAKE - as much as my previous school had its issues, this one is much worse. Kids think they can just get up and leave to meet their mates in the middle of their class. The uniform is shocking and I've never seen so much flesh in my life (outside of a pool or beach). And here's the kicker - every second word is a swear word, when I try to pull them into line and nothing is done. However, I get accused of swearing at kids and get reported for it! Now, I don't swear that much, never at a footy match. I try to explain myself and the smarmy deputy principal keeps taking the kids side. The kids who complain are the ones I tried to make do work.

I think I'll be lucky if I make it to the end of this year at this school. I'm planning to spend no more than 2 full years here, just to help them transition from being a 7-10 to 7-12 and then all bets are off. No more transfers though if I can avoid it. Unless the principal and the deputies are sent packing, I'm not staying at my current school long term.

The takeaway from all this?
Teaching can be a rewarding profession. Pay could be improved, 2.5% per year is an insult, but that's Gladys The Ungroovy Mule for you.
Unless you get into a decent school where the kids show some respect and you have a competent executive who take all sides into account, it'll be a struggle. Be prepared.
 
HulkSmash said:
I'm a high school teacher, hitting 5-6 years in the job, retraining after bouncing around from job to job. I started a term into 2014 and spent terms 2-4 as casual. Got a 12 month temp gig the next year, then a permanent position the next year. Surprised I got permanency that fast, but there you go.

First of all, if you want a better chance of becoming a permanent teacher quicker, they are crying out for anyone trained in maths, science and my area, TAS. If you're in NSW and want to work in the public system, there are scholarships available in those areas to get qualifications in those areas.

However, you will be required to go to a school that they send you to. IIRC, you don't get a choice, and more than likely, you could be sent out west. The country isn't so bad though. Western Sydney on the other hand......well, here's my little tale of self-inflicted pain.

The school I was at before transferring to my current school wasn't too bad, but there were people higher up that were giving me the shits, plus the goalposts kept on changing - basically, they thought we should be outdoing a nearby specialist CAPA school in CAPA by giving more resources to CAPA. Plus, being a country kid, I wanted out of Sydney (but not too far out), so when I became eligible for a transfer, I put in for one. BIG MISTAKE.

I made a mistake on the transfer form, and accidentally put western Sydney higher up the list than it should have. The way the transfer form works, it's fairly easy to make that mistake as you jump back and forward between pages. Sure enough, because there are bugger all TAS teachers out anywhere, I get transferred to a fairly redneck part of western Sydney. I can't reject the transfer, you lose your job.

BIG MISTAKE - as much as my previous school had its issues, this one is much worse. Kids think they can just get up and leave to meet their mates in the middle of their class. The uniform is shocking and I've never seen so much flesh in my life (outside of a pool or beach). And here's the kicker - every second word is a swear word, when I try to pull them into line and nothing is done. However, I get accused of swearing at kids and get reported for it! Now, I don't swear that much, never at a footy match. I try to explain myself and the smarmy deputy principal keeps taking the kids side. The kids who complain are the ones I tried to make do work.

I think I'll be lucky if I make it to the end of this year at this school. I'm planning to spend no more than 2 full years here, just to help them transition from being a 7-10 to 7-12 and then all bets are off. No more transfers though if I can avoid it. Unless the principal and the deputies are sent packing, I'm not staying at my current school long term.

The takeaway from all this?
Teaching can be a rewarding profession. Pay could be improved, 2.5% per year is an insult, but that's Gladys The Ungroovy Mule for you.
Unless you get into a decent school where the kids show some respect and you have a competent executive who take all sides into account, it'll be a struggle. Be prepared.
Click to expand...
So you graduated uni, worked professionally for a few years, but your future is determined by how you fill out a form that is processed and actioned by some mystery bureaucrat?
Then you have no right of appeal?

I work in a state school in Victoria. We have nothing like that system at all (thank goodness).
Jobs are placed onto a portal - Recruitment on Line. You apply with your CV, Responses to Selection Criteria & References.
I’ve run heaps of panels to sift through, select, interview and appoint applicants. The thought of just having someone allocated to my school without us having any say would greatly concern me.
Yeah I’ve appointed some applicants who perhaps didn’t work out as we had hoped. But on the whole we have a quality staff.
It’s mine (and other colleagues) job to appoint staff, so we take it VERY seriously as you would well imagine. We also put a good deal of resources into mentoring our new staff.
Nothing and I really mean nothing beats having good people.
 
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HulkSmash said:
BIG MISTAKE - as much as my previous school had its issues, this one is much worse. Kids think they can just get up and leave to meet their mates in the middle of their class. The uniform is shocking and I've never seen so much flesh in my life (outside of a pool or beach). And here's the kicker - every second word is a swear word, when I try to pull them into line and nothing is done. However, I get accused of swearing at kids and get reported for it! Now, I don't swear that much, never at a footy match. I try to explain myself and the smarmy deputy principal keeps taking the kids side. The kids who complain are the ones I tried to make do work.

I think I'll be lucky if I make it to the end of this year at this school. I'm planning to spend no more than 2 full years here, just to help them transition from being a 7-10 to 7-12 and then all bets are off. No more transfers though if I can avoid it. Unless the principal and the deputies are sent packing, I'm not staying at my current school long term.
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And therein lies the problem- it comes from the top and not much you can really do about it unfortunately.

Would love to see those kids try get away with that rubbish with our Principal, he'd tear them to shreds. And i've witnessed it first hand, he's quite "visible" around the school, in the yard, sometimes wanders into classrooms at random during the day.

Again, just good luck, hope you can tough it out ok.
 
Occidental said:
So you graduated uni, worked professionally for a few years, but your future is determined by how you fill out a form that is processed and actioned by some mystery bureaucrat?
Then you have no right of appeal?
Click to expand...

Depends on the type of transfer, but usually you don't get a say in where you are posted. I have had family issues in the area where I was being transferred to (as in there are members of the family we do not associate with as they have gotten fairly violent in the past), and tried to get it cancelled because of said issues, but I may as well spoke to a brick wall. Fortunately, for the DoE, it resolved itself when they moved out further west (as in Western Australia), therefore no issues.

IF you want some control over where you go, you're better off applying for jobs on merit and doing the interviews. That's how I got my first permanent job. And hopefully, how I'll get my next job.

Shell said:
I will never, ever complain about my school ever again after reading that post.

All the best HulkSmash
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Not all schools and kids are bad, and things are slowly turning around in terms of kids realising they can't get rid of me that easily (my position was apparently hard to fill), so they have to like me or lump me. But yes, not my ideal school. I don't see myself being around there too long.

Shell said:
And therein lies the problem- it comes from the top and not much you can really do about it unfortunately.

Would love to see those kids try get away with that rubbish with our Principal, he'd tear them to shreds. And i've witnessed it first hand, he's quite "visible" around the school, in the yard, sometimes wanders into classrooms at random during the day.

Again, just good luck, hope you can tough it out ok.
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Exactly. The exec have some weird ideas in terms of priorities. Like this passion project where we spend the last two periods of Friday doing something the kids wanted to do from a list of projects. Apparently, it's to make sure kids come to school of a Friday. And already, I'm being screwed around - I've been made a lead teacher of something I know nothing about, and for the first two weeks, running someone else's project. In addition to rewriting 4 subject programs, and preparing for 2021 when years 11 and 12 are being offered, I didn't need this crap.

If I had some of mystical power to hire and fire, they'd be fired - both figuratively, and literally, out of a cannon. I've had better bosses and they made Nathan Tinkler look like a decent businessman.
 
Any tips on starting the new year with year 7s? Or just teaching them in general?
I've pretty much only ever taught year 10 upwards, but this year I have a bunch of Year 7 classes.
Any input would be appreciated!
 
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