Expansion Third WA-Based AFL Club ??

[Illinois Nazi]

Why would you pay to be on a membership waiting list for West Coast then chuck in the towel to join a new club?

If you've been on the waiting list for years and there's still no light at the end of the tunnel, you might. I don't know how fast the list is moving but I know people who have been waiting 5-6 years and are still nowhere near the top.

If you were dedicated enough to be on the waiting list then I doubt you'd jump off to join a new team given you could do that now and join Freo.

They won't join Fremantle, no, but I can see people going to a new club just to get to go and see a game. Perhaps not all as members but at least going to games and supporting two teams. Over time the new team becomes their #1 team as they are the ones they actually see all the time.

 

[Dunks27]

There were plenty of people who supported the WA state team (WCE) in the first era of VFL/AFL expansion, who then followed their WAFL allegience to become Freo supporters when the dockers came into the AFL.

I hope Joondalup can get into the comp relatively soon, or at least be announced as being in the AFL's plans so that they can also capitalise on their WAFL links. Those of us who remember when WAFL was the biggest sport in town are now 35+, a lot would be dads, who would like to take their kids to an AFL game and if they arent members of the current clubs, will be waiting for either a new team or our short arms, long pockets govt to build a new stadium.

In this weekends West Australian West Perth have said they want to go alone, but if you have a look at Freo's membership versus Port's, I reckon linking up with East Perth is probably the better option.

Good Luck to them.

 

[Dormammu]

There are, but I am not being club specific, just wondering if WA parochialism would stymie such a move.

I'll tell you this much, if my beloved North had to go under I would sooner see her go to the footy loving public of WA rather than a bunch of corporate pimps on the Gold Coast or Western Sydney.

Hear what you say. If the decision were to be made though, it would need to be made sooner rather than later. For though there's a real hardcore supporter base here (approx. 5,000 according to Eugene iirc), I reckon most were converts from the 70's and early 80's when so many WA stars played in the blue and white (Glendenning, Krakoeurs, Cable etc etc).

They're not getting any younger.

 

[McCrann]

Get the Perth teams together for this new team.

East Perth (Royals) (Black & Blue)
West Perth (Falcons) (Red & Blue)
Perth (Demons) (Black & Red)

Call them the Royal Falcons - with the Black & Red of the Demons. Which also takes a colour each from the Royals & Falcons.

A three-way joint bid for the new license and voila you have the even split. They will play at the new stadium, and someone from Perth can tell me where the best place to put their new training oval would be.

But that's what it should be - a brand new training facility.

Fremantle get East Fremantle, South Fremantle & Peel.
West Coast get Subiaco, Claremont & Swan Districts.

Ends up in a perfect split of teams for the WAFL.

 

[Dormammu]

Call them the Royal Falcons - with the Black & Red of the Demons. Which also takes a colour each from the Royals & Falcons.

Better still, the Garlic-Eating Devil Kings

 

[Pessimistic]

6 derbies would appeal to the WAFL and the AFL IF a 20 team comp is noot pared down to 19 rounds.
Should underpin the case for a 60+ k stadium.

If the AFL is moderately successful with the 18 teams - and to do that they will have to solve the "2-speed comp" (by that I mean some clubs with huge crowds and some more moderate sized) thenthey will be only too keen to go to 20 clubs. WA and Tassie would be a good mix, with soem victorian teams continuing to adopt development areas (NT, NZ etc - I'm assuming GWS will adopt canberra)

 

[FootyJunkie]

East Perth (Royals) (Black & Blue)
West Perth (Falcons) (Red & Blue)
Perth (Demons) (Black & Red)

Perth United (very soccer i know, but the name would need something to distinguish themselves from the Perth FC Demons... which was why the Eagles were called West Coast in the first place)

I don't think West Perth going at it alone will be accepted by the AFL.

The league seems to have learned its lesson from Port Adelaide, putting a 'powerhouse' suburban club in the big league, only to then realise that no one but their supporters care about them, hence the low crowds to their games. Which is why Southport aren't being promoted to the AFL to represent Gold Coast.

A 2 or 3 way combined WAFL bid might be an interesting compromise, yet it only further tarnishes the status of the WAFL as being merely a farm league for the West... rival clubs locally, but working together nationally.

 

[WoGiTaLiA]

Hey why the hell not... Joondalup Arena isn't anymore third world as a "stadium" than Subi is...

That would leave Perth, Peel and Swans as the teams with no real affiliation to an AFL club in the WAFL as I imagine that WP and EP would still want WAFL sides as a reserves of sort.

There is certainly the "support" in Perth but you would have to wrestle away fans from WC in particular for those two clubs and the WAFL is becoming less and less relevant to the younger people so attracting them would be a vital part to success.

Also... on a serious note with the stadium, you would absolutely need to build a new one for a 3rd team. Perhaps the City of Joondalup may want it as a real selling point, the infrastructure up there is better for a stadium than anywhere inside Perth and may be a truly viable option and I say that as a SoR resident...

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Perth United (very soccer i know, but the name would need something to distinguish themselves from the Perth FC Demons... which was why the Eagles were called West Coast in the first place)

I don't think West Perth going at it alone will be accepted by the AFL.

The league seems to have learned its lesson from Port Adelaide, putting a 'powerhouse' suburban club in the big league, only to then realise that no one but their supporters care about them, hence the low crowds to their games. Which is why Southport aren't being promoted to the AFL to represent Gold Coast.

A 2 or 3 way combined WAFL bid might be an interesting compromise, yet it only further tarnishes the status of the WAFL as being merely a farm league for the West... rival clubs locally, but working together nationally.

I agree with this but 10 Victorian suburban clubs are in the league?? Ok different because they started there but it is still factual.

I say Good on West Perth, why should a great club like them have to sit in second tier football? Go for it I say. If the AFL say no then so be it.

You might be suprised how many West Perth supporters there are. The question is would there be enough and you probably are right that there won't be.

I would change to West Perth tomorrow if they were in the AFL, especially if they took their history and their colours with them. I grew up watching, playing and supporting them. How many others would I don't know??

Anyway its 20 years away so not that relevant right now.

 

[FootyJunkie]

I agree with this but 10 Victorian suburban clubs are in the league?? Ok different because they started there but it is still factual.

The VFL clubs, particularly the Big 4 clubs, benefitted greatly from the VFL's ambition to be "the" league in the 70s, maybe not necessarily financially, but in terms of support/recognition nation wide, to some degree. Through the expensive recruitment drive at the time and its growing presence in media, its safe to say that by the 80s, most footy fans in SA, WA and TAS also had a club in the VFL they followed semi-regularly atleast, in addition to a side in the local comp. The national support/recognition only increased once the WAFL and SANFL put their own sides in. Collingwood going as far as to put the Australian flag on their logo.

It's hard to make the argument now, knowing how well off clubs like Carlton, Collingwood and Essendon are, that they would struggle had they joined a SANFL competition that decided to be "the" league, while clubs like Norwood, Sturt and Glenelg would get nation wide recognition/support, but I guess it could have been possible.

 

[Copernicus]

Is there really the demand for this? Are there people in Perth crying out for another team to follow?

I'd be surprised if there was much of a void to fill between West Coast and Freo.

 

[Rob]

Is there really the demand for this? Are there people in Perth crying out for another team to follow?

I'd be surprised if there was much of a void to fill between West Coast and Freo.

I don't know whether you'd necessarily equate it with another team, but there is certainly excess demand for football here. West Coast has a huge waiting list, Freo probably will next year if their form holds up, and corporate backing is massive. Despite Subiaco being a third world shithole.

If football was a retailer, they would without doubt open more stores.

 

[Eastern Rangers]

Is there really the demand for this? Are there people in Perth crying out for another team to follow?

I'd be surprised if there was much of a void to fill between West Coast and Freo.

There are plenty of Fans who don't really like Westcoast and simply couldn't bring themselves to support Fremantle.

Kids support whatever team they want and after a little while with some AFL support a third WA team would gain intrest and viability. You simply need good players and good football and that will attract people to the games.

This is a Footy state after all.

 

[chardonnay]

6 derbies would appeal to the WAFL and the AFL IF a 20 team comp is noot pared down to 19 rounds.
Should underpin the case for a 60+ k stadium.

If the AFL is moderately successful with the 18 teams - and to do that they will have to solve the "2-speed comp" (by that I mean some clubs with huge crowds and some more moderate sized) thenthey will be only too keen to go to 20 clubs. WA and Tassie would be a good mix, with soem victorian teams continuing to adopt development areas (NT, NZ etc - I'm assuming GWS will adopt canberra)

20 teams ... where do the extra players come from? This is a recipe to weak,weak,weaken the standard.
Spin it as you will NO ONE needs another Melbourne/Richmond/North/Dogs scenario.
Yes, WA contributes more players to the AFL playing pool than they need BUT surely two (2) development sides is enough for the next ten (10) years UNLESS teams get ripped out of Melbourne.

 

[chardonnay]

Hey why the hell not... Joondalup Arena isn't anymore third world as a "stadium" than Subi is...


Also... on a serious note with the stadium, you would absolutely need to build a new one for a 3rd team. Perhaps the City of Joondalup may want it as a real selling point, the infrastructure up there is better for a stadium than anywhere inside Perth and may be a truly viable option and I say that as a SoR resident...

A 3rd stadium, you goose!

To develop a NEW stadium in WA , it will need more bums on seats, more revenue & it needs to be under WAFC control.
ONE stadium only .. three (3)

 

[DrJon]

Is there really the demand for this? Are there people in Perth crying out for another team to follow?

I'd be surprised if there was much of a void to fill between West Coast and Freo.

I don't see one either. People talking about their being excess support 'because of huge waiting lists for Eagles memberships' are forgetting that it's artificially caused by a completely inadequate stadium. If we get the promised 60k then that waiting list will completely evaporate.

There has always been a rivalry between Perth (represented by West Coast) and Fremantle. There is no such rivalry existing between Joondalup and anyone. It's a suburb 30 minutes from the CBD; sure it's got a lot of people, but if there is so much clamour for a side why aren't there more people going to WAFL games?

 

[DizzyHB]

I'm fine with Fremantle and West Coast being the only two sides in Perth, but I'd still be pretty happy with a 3rd side as WA really is underrated when compared to Vic and SA in terms of state football.

So, if we were to go for a 20 team competition:

19th team - Tassie Devils. Green and maroon, possibly yellow.
20th team - Perth Royal Falcons. Black, red and blue. Representing Perth, West Perth and East Perth. All three clubs get their colours and history represented.

Perth Royal Falcons representing those three teams, training at Arena Joondalup.
Fremantle Dockers respresenting East Fremantle, South Fremantle and one of Swan Districts or Peel Thunder, training at Fremantle Oval.
West Coast Eagles representing Subiaco, Claremont and one of Swan Districts or Peel Thunder, training at Subiaco Oval.

All three teams get an even representation in Perth/WA, all get decent training facilities in their respective areas and we then have a new stadium shared by all three clubs with none allowed training rights over any other.

 

[FootyJunkie]

All three teams get an even representation in Perth/WA, all get decent training facilities in their respective areas and we then have a new stadium shared by all three clubs with none allowed training rights over any other.

another plus would be to have Friday Night double headers every other week or so, with the second game live from Perth on those rounds where there would be 2 games in Perth for that round.

 

[LifeSpan-Void]

Can we really handle an extra 4 teams in the competition over the next decade?

Would only result in a lower quality game as we'll have an extra 88 players each weekend.

I disagree with this quality dilution argument. What it will mean is that recruiters will be less inclined to go for 17-18 year olds exclusively each draft, and more Podsiadlys/Barlows/Sewells/M.Stokes/H.Taylors will be considered as viable choices. There are at least 100 AFL-ready players hiding out in the 2nd tier leagues right now, not drafted at age 18 and have all but abandoned their dream of getting a callup - and all they need is a chance.

 

[DrJon]

I'm fine with Fremantle and West Coast being the only two sides in Perth, but I'd still be pretty happy with a 3rd side as WA really is underrated when compared to Vic and SA in terms of state football.

So, if we were to go for a 20 team competition:

19th team - Tassie Devils. Green and maroon, possibly yellow.
20th team - Perth Royal Falcons. Black, red and blue. Representing Perth, West Perth and East Perth. All three clubs get their colours and history represented.

Perth Royal Falcons representing those three teams, training at Arena Joondalup.
Fremantle Dockers respresenting East Fremantle, South Fremantle and one of Swan Districts or Peel Thunder, training at Fremantle Oval.
West Coast Eagles representing Subiaco, Claremont and one of Swan Districts or Peel Thunder, training at Subiaco Oval.

All three teams get an even representation in Perth/WA, all get decent training facilities in their respective areas and we then have a new stadium shared by all three clubs with none allowed training rights over any other.

Nice theory, but the respective supporters of these WAFL clubs won't suddenly change their allegiance because a 3rd team is introduced.

I'm a Perth supporter; but support Freo. I have no affinity whatsoever with Joondalup. I'm not suddenly going to start supporting the Perth "Royal Falcons' and I'd suggest the vast majority of people in Joondalup (who would most likely support West Coast, with a % of Freo supporters) wouldn't either.

If there is a clamour for a 3rd team then you would expect to see significant crowds at West Perth home games. I just don't see how it could work.

 

[chardonnay]

I disagree with this quality dilution argument. What it will mean is that recruiters will be less inclined to go for 17-18 year olds exclusively each draft, and more Podsiadlys/Barlows/Sewells/M.Stokes/H.Taylors will be considered as viable choices. There are at least 100 AFL-ready players hiding out in the 2nd tier leagues right now, not drafted at age 18 and have all but abandoned their dream of getting a callup - and all they need is a chance.

It'd be like having 18 Sheffield Shield teams & claiming the standard of Aus 1st class cricket wouldnt be lower.

You appear to have a low opinion of AFL recruiters, 100 players not identified.

 

[DizzyHB]

Nice theory, but the respective supporters of these WAFL clubs won't suddenly change their allegiance because a 3rd team is introduced.

I'm a Perth supporter; but support Freo. I have no affinity whatsoever with Joondalup. I'm not suddenly going to start supporting the Perth "Royal Falcons' and I'd suggest the vast majority of people in Joondalup (who would most likely support West Coast, with a % of Freo supporters) wouldn't either.

If there is a clamour for a 3rd team then you would expect to see significant crowds at West Perth home games. I just don't see how it could work.

Not immediately, no.

There'd be a few hardcore Falcons/Royals/Demons supporters that would make the switch though. We all know there are a lot of Fremantle supporters who supported West Coast previously because there was simply no other option. Some supporters of Easts and South switch to Fremantle, some stayed with West Coast. The same would happen in this scenario, not everybody would switch but some would. Then ofcourse there'll be young'uns who want to go for the new team.

There's easily the numbers for it.

 

[Fire]

You appear to have a low opinion of AFL recruiters, 100 players not identified.

The AFL recruiters would know they are there, they jsut wouldn't select them because they woudl rather a promising 18 yo.

doesn;t mean the players can't play. It woudl definatley reverse the youth at all costs trend, and you could even argue that it will increase the fielded playing talent of teams.

 

[invinciBlues]

The problem I would have is it hurts other sports. With a limited number of sponsors we have seen it difficult to get $$ into other sports eg basketball, motor racing etc
Footy esp AFL is the big monster that is really putting the screws on other sports financially. A 3rd team would really hurt an already struggling market.

I'm all for it then. Australian Football's dominance would all but be complete

Would prefer Subiaco though myself. Great guernsey

 

[West123]

Living in a non-AFL region I can tell you that a 3rd AFL team in Perth would run far smoothly than a NSW/QLD/NT team.

It'll happen when Tassie come on and we'll either go to 20 teams (my expectation) or we'll lose a Vic club.

The fact that such a high number of WAFL players are being plucked as "mature aged" would suggest that the talent pool isn't as shallow as some are debating on here. It also gives a chance for alot of kids who are currently missing the draft to still turn pro and develop their skills.